04 GTO Love it or Hate it?

OK my two cents.

I'm an Aussie. Hated the GTO, I thought they raped the Monaro to please the American Market.

When I saw pictures of it on the web, I thought FUGLY.

That was until two weeks ago. I work near the Holden factory where the GTO's are made. I guess one of the engineers was taking on of the 05' GTO's for a test drive and parked it out front of my office. Well I wish I had a camera, cause seeing an 05' Black GTO with the hood scoops, huge dual exhaust pipes and the 6litre badge on the back, I was certainly impressed.

When the guy got back into the GTO then fired it up it sounded fantastic, and its speed from a standing start was also incredible, the guy was not holding back.

For you guys that are negative about the car, maybe you haven't seen it in the flesh, or driven it.

But after a few minutes I was converted. I don't know when the 05 GTO's start coming over, but I think they well be worth the wait.

The car stands for the Raping of America.
Part of the outsourcing problem with and added misuse of a trademark and icon.

That is why the Chrysler 300C has the same problem.

Americans make the best muscle cars because they are the ones buying them.

Do they really think a guy in his middle ages will buy one of these and have to deal with everyone telling him they lost his job because of it?
I cant make any sense from your comments

Why is it a misuse of trademark? GTO was dead, gathering cobwebs. GM itself owns the (long defunct) trademark, and chose to revive it. How can GM's revival of a 30-year-dead badge which it - not you - owns, be termed "misuse"?

If, as you claim, Americans make the best muscle cars, then GM would obviously elect to build them there. Such is apparently not the case

And praytell how has any American "lost his job" (?) when in reality previous F-Bodys were manufactured and exported from Canada! As were the engines. As were some previous GTOs

Nostalgia can be a fickle thing - especially when it comes to remembering past glories. Reality is king, imo. Here is the final sad reality of past GTOs - a tarted up Nova

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/data/503/2976Pontiac_GTO_1974-thumb.jpg

Ummmm, huh? Last I checked, Fischer Body right here in the US of A still designed all the Pontiac unibodies, and the drivetrain is clearly not foreign, either, so where's the outsourcing? And not to mention, the 300C is a Chrysler, designed by Chrysler, built by Chrysler. It may in fact be inspired by Damlier, but that's totally a GOOD THING. It was clear once they introduced the K cars that they needed a little kick in the pants if they were going to build a reliable car that was classy but priced right. It's a pity GM didn't do the same thing with the GTO, considering all that Saab technology they own yet seem to be ignoring.

There's nobody to blame but marketing here, really. The new GTO is an eyebrow raiser, but a true GTO should be a "what the hell was that and where can I buy one?) kinda car, and for me it just doesn't do it. It's no more then a overpowered Grand Prix GTP with a flashy interior. Tempest or Lemans I would've accepted, but to call it a GTO is practically the same as pushing John DeLorean in the mud and urinating on his face.

I'll admit a good point was made, they shouldn't have called that lifeless anti-smog pile of scrap 74 a GTO either. That makes 2 times some genius in a suit ruined the good name the designers of the original 3 generations of GTO worked so hard for.

LS1s (and LS2) are manufactured in Canada, clearly foreign to USA. Manual trans are sourced from Tremec in Mexico, also a sovereign nation. Why then is drivetrain "clearly not foreign"?

How is '04 GTO "no more than an overpriced Grand Prix GTP" .. when it is built on an entirely different platform .. is a rear-wheel-drive vehicle not FWD/traverse engine as (all?) other Pontiacs .. and shock-horror offers something called a manual transmission ..?

Fact is, GM had to turn to Holden to revive GTO and (non-Corvette) GM-RWD performance, simply because GM-NA didnt and still dont make a mid-priced RWD V8 platform of their own

I never said it was an overpriced Grand Prix, I said it was an overpowered one. Rear drive or not, it still looks like a Grand Prix/Bonneville/Grand Am and now G6. W,H,N or Z platform, while the handling and comfort varies, when it comes to looks, they're all the same and the GTO is, too. Could be worse, I suppose, they could have made it look like a Vibe....

What I mean by non-foreign drivetrain is, basically they don't get the whole thing assembled in a crate from Korea, drop the body on and go. Americans do get to put the puzzle together in the end.

Apologies for incorrect price/power quotation

I havent seen the Vibe yet, probably fortunate from your description. But its ironic isnt it that vaunted brands (like BMW & Mercedes for example) can produce a range of vehicles, from plebian to exotic, which share their same generic 'family tree' style theme and not be criticized/crucified for it, yet other marques cannot

^^^ what he said, pluss anyone ever see an old grand prix, It looks just like a GTO.

Older Grand Prix? Like 69ish? They aren't really that similar, BUT that was the era when multi purpose platforms first came about: you had a choice of several cars, all framed out the same but each unique. The Tempest, a basic "excuse me Mr blue collar man here's a nice car you can afford" kind of car, then the LeMans, a step up with bigger engines, better options, eye catching trim and more of a sport feel. From there you went to the GTO, with trim, wheels, sport suspension and huge powerplants that didn't come with the rest of the line. Plymouth did it to: Satellite, Road Runner, GTX. Ford is guilty as well with The Galaxy 500, LTD and XL. The whole muti purpose platform idea is a good thing, it keeps cost down yet allows for a wide range of consumer options. My beef is just that they seem to try less and less every year. Compare my 92 Regal to a 92 Grand Prix, identical W body cars under the sheet metal and plastic, and you'll spot some familiar features like the door handle on the pillar, but it's easy to tell one's a Buick and the other a Pontiac. There used to be no mistaking a Grand Prix for a Grand Am or a Sunfire. Now I have to actually walk up to the car and read the name on the decklid to be sure.

so what is the story with the skid plate? I mean, I have one on my jeep, but my street car? What got me thinking about this, is lingenfelter has a aluminum one for sale. Wouldnt be better just to remove it?

Well, they both have the true 66 Pontiac grill, but those body lines are nothing alike, with the GTO being smoother sided. The GP bumper wraps all the way back to the wheel well, the GTO's doesn't. The GTO has flared wheel wells, and the GP rear end looks much taller then the GTO. From the pictures it appears the GP hood has a bigger front point in the center, and if I'm not mistaken the GTO has hideaway windshield wipers. They both boast "I'm a Pontiac" when you see that grill, but as far as telling them apart from down the street, it's an easy task.

Love it or hate it? I wish the GTO had front wheel drive. I've had my share of rear wheel drive spin-outs and being stuck in snow drifts in the 70's and 80's. I love front-wheel drive! But then, I'm just a girl so what do I know.

What the heck is a snow? Have you ever noticed, people who live in snowy european countries have rear drive and manage fine? Front drive has good points, but many bad points also. The true good reason is to save manufactures money on assembly. Thank god we have many auto manufactures are giving us our superior rear drive back!! :smile:

i think they are pretty tight, mainly because of the ls1 but then again i smoked one last week and i have an lt1, all in all though im just glad pontiac came out with a real wheel drive car at all.

I didn't like them till my wife got one. It's a great driver. Sure it looks like a lot of other Pontiacs on the road but I think that can be said about most automakers lineups. I actually kind of like that it isn't all together different looking. The driver next to you doesn't realize that you're "grand am/grand prix" looking car is about to be looking at them from the rear view mirror as they squint to see the small unassuming GTO logo on the deck lid.

i like the new GTO. i love the interior. i have'nt drove one yet but i plan to. yes it is a heavy car but with 350hp and 365ft-bl stock and 400hp and 395ft-bl for the 05 i think you can live it being a little bit heavy. all in all its a nice car. if you think about it ppl who dont know what a GTO is will be gasping when the thing blows right past them...

Alot of people under estimate the performance of the GTO based on its luxury sport sedan styling but I don't think anyone can say its not a true sports car after they seen the Corvette drivetrain push this luxury style coupe to tripple digits in no time at all. I happen to love the GTO, its a all around good car for a person seeking a practical car with balls.

I got my goat back in June and I love it more than any car I've owned. And at 39yrs old, I've owned a few. As always, it all comes down to opinion and everyone's entitled. Yes, the styling of the new GTO is rather generic... I for one like to refer to it as a Cavalier on steroids. :lol2: But that is precisely why I bought it. I did a lot of research before buying my goat... mainly looking at the '05 Mustang, the RX8 and the Bonneville SSEi. The RX8 was just too flashy without same power, the Bonneville was a little too far outta my price range, and quite frankly, I just don't care for Mustangs. They are just far too common. I like the stealthiness of the GTO. I can fly under the radar when I want to, knowing the power is there when I NEED to. Granted, the Cobra and the SVT would have me beat hands down when it comes to a stoplight to stoplight race. That's fine. I don't even go there. But when it comes to head-turning appeal and "Hey... what's that?" reactions, my goat's got almost everything else beat. For being so 'plain', I sure do get a load of double-takes and people coming out of the woodwork to get a closer look at it. It's a sleeper, no doubt. Again though, being a 39yr old Mom to three... I didn't want a 'boy-racer'. Even with that being said, my 19yr old who considers himself a 'tuner' with a rice burning CRX, begs me to let him drive my car anytime he's at the house. Oh... and by the way... I can easily fit $170 worth of groceries, an umbrella stroller, my fishing rod and tackle box all in my smallish trunk at one time, without problem. :lol:

Jeez guys where to start on this one.First of all, if we stole a design of anybodys,then why does the gto look so familiar.Well the answer is they look like every other Pontiac ive seen for years.Did they make all the Pontiacs,for like the past 12 years or so?Beacause you can watch Pontiacs appearance evolve over a long period of time.Thats an American design.

Next that motor is based on a design i use.A 5665 cid gm 5.7 litre . mine was made in 1970,and not one metric bolt.So who has been up to stealing designs?Thats an american design.


And to ford and dodge enthusiasts i say*Were Baaaaack........

Dont forget Pontiac is Chevys excitement division,so get excited.

Oh...I'm excited. I've been excited since June. :evillol:

I really like it. I think that the 05' model will pick up the less-than-spectacular sales of the 04' model. Because the hood scoops on the 05' will give it a more agressive apperence, and the very modest price of approx. $30,000, it should do fairly well. If the sales improve, would they add a cabrio like they did during the original GTO? If so, it might attract new buyers. I wouldn't buy one, i'm strictly a coupe guy (when available). But it might pick up the slow sales.

I think its going to be funny when a few of these trickle down the line,and get fully modded out.Quite a few non-believers will soon get a renewed faith in GM.Most people will never get the honor of racing one of them.And those who do have a real live chance of getting spanked.

Hotrodchevyz, as a matter of fact, there are stories of shops in SoCal getting the street legal cars to run in the 11s, without blowers. LS1 is a GREAT engine. I hate to burst your bubble, but it's nothing similar to the small block Chevy design. It was made with a clean sheet of paper. In fact, there are but two part numbers, common between them. The rod bearing and the lifter. Nothing else fits. Even the rods themselves, are completely different. Nice ones, too! The heads are an absolute work of art! The valve train is much more modern in nature. It has a front-mounted oil pump, driven off the crankshaft. No provision for a distributor anywhere (has a crank trigger built in). And to top it all off, it weighs just a little more than 1/2 the weight of a 350 (Chevy) from the '70s.
Nope, not a Chevy. A true "corporate" engine. And it sticks in the craw of those OHC crowds, with it's antique pushrods... Argh! Argh! Humor... Wait 'til you get allode of LS2 and LS6!!!!

i am aware of the compatability differences between the generations of the 5.7's.They have added a few horses,worked on the gas mileage,and improved flow characteristics over the years.Thats just a start.. no parts will directly interchange,but fact is,its an updated version of what former Chevrolet general manager and chief engineer Ed Cole's team came up with years ago.It was a work of art in mid fifties when it was originally put to pencil.They may have drilled a bunch of sensor holes in it,and turned it into some metric aluminum joke,but face the facts.Its wonderful that after almost 50 years,the SBC is still as popular as it is,and still capable of showing up a little competition.

they need to put the new gto's on a diet.they weigh like 3700 pounds or more,with the driver.Yikes

They weigh about the same as all the old Goats...
I'm interested in this design they dusted off from the '50s. Do you have specifics where I can read about it? Having built a few LS1s now, I see zero similarities (but perhaps the bellhousing flange) between Gen 1 and 2 small blocks and the LSx line.

I personally like both. The 2003 cobra is an awsome car but I know a few ppl have had problems with them. The styling has changed on the 2005 GTO which makes it look more agressive and it has 400HP LS2. To those doging the GTO. Give it another year or two to come out with something that will really be impressive. Maybe they will come out with something worthy of the name "JUDGE". If they do watch out. There are some after market parts for the GTO already to make it stand out. Like I said give it a year and there will some more appeal to it. I like them both but I see tons of GT's and Cobra's all over the place and very few GTO's. That there is my appeal to the car alone. I'm getting the GTO and am going to personalize it to me liking. As far as the comparison for performance goes, I'm not a young lead foot anymore and I don't plan on taking it to the track but I sure both are a thrill to drive. If the GTO runs a 14 that would just fine with me. Of course there will be a few Mods planned in the near future.

I would like to get an opinion from a real GTO owner. Obviously looks aren't the selling point. Does the car perform and feel like a sports car. Or is it a quick family car like some of the crown vics with the roller 4.6.

Does the car perform and feel like a sports car. Or is it a quick family car like some of the crown vics with the roller 4.6.

It is neither. 'Gentleman's Express' comes to mind. Not insane fast, not family car. Luxury with power.

I agree with the discussion starter. It's a rebadged grand prix with a V8. Not a good thing. They should have went all out and did a total new designed body with double vertical head lights a long tail and other characteristics of the classic goat. And yeah, the fact that it is based off an Australian machine makes it more worthless in the U.S. market. Pretty freakin un-original altogether.

Pretty freakin un-original altogether.

So was the original GTO. Late 60's the GTO followed what was in Pontiac's line, nothing really set it apart. Same now.

Gotcha, that makes sense. Still kinda doesn't make sense though because with all the cash GM has, they could have did a little better than this.

That I can agree with. The new 2005 GTO is going to be much better looking, more aggressive.

Holden is a GM branch.just like it has been for years.The new gto looks like pontiac has for years.the old gto's look like other old pontiacs from the same year.GM isnt going to take the name GTO,and turn it into somthing thats not GM lookin.It looks like a pontiac,nuff said.They arent going to hand the design to some other company on an alien planet,and redesign it to fit every mans dreams.its just a car,that looks like other cars with the same brand name.its a little nicer,and a little faster than other pontiacs,wich is par for gto.I think they did a good job.The old gto's are ugly too,if that makes any difference

Like many when I heard their would be a new GTO I was excited. But after seeing pictures of it and learn'n more about it I could'nt have been more disapointed. It's not that I think its a ugly car, it's just......plain. I mean take off the GTO and what do you have. A V-8 powered Grand Prix. The fact that its a auzzie car dosen't help. What happened to the GTO concept of a few years ago? I guess after the aftermarket gear's up and makes all kinds of cool GTO parts it will look mean. If I had one I'd jerk out the LS-1 drive train and sell the body. They discontinued the Firebird for this? This is only my opinion, I'm shure the'll be plenty of ppl that will buy it, and love it. What do you guys think?I felt the same way when GM turned the Nova into a Toyota Corolla (or is that the other way around). Same for the LeMans. Ford did it with the Mustang when they made the Mustang II.

I feel for you. I've owned several cars that were true muscle cars and "dumbed down," like my 1968 GTO 400cid, 4spd. I cannot believe what GM is trying to call a GTO nowadays.

But hey, look at it this way... even my 1965 Mustang Fastback 2+2 was reinvented in 2005. Maybe you'll only have to wait 30 years like I did for something to remotely resemble its former self. :mad:

A bunch of aluminum parts and plastic molding is hardly reinventing.The new mustang and the new GTO's are pretty quick.The new GTO is the fastest gto ever made when it comes with stock ET on a 1/4 mile track.I would like to say the same for the new mustang,but i dont think any of the 05' mustangs *stock*have gotten into the 13's yet,maybe once or twice but not consistently.

IMO chevy did a better job with the GTO than ford did the mustang.Why not give up the old style and let it remain a treasure and work of art,instead of fagging it out with a bunch of plastic and buttons.Not all cars look the same,its called variety.and the past is gone,so has the inventory.They made some cool cars long ago.But that dont mean toss a classic car into a blender with a bunch of plastic and recycled pop and soup cans,and selling what comes out the other end.Cause IMO,what came out the other end was pure SH&T.Whoever designed the original mustangs put a lot of hard work and pride into them,and was probably proud that they created such a masterpiece.Now some yuppy corporate punks decided to do a mustang remix and you might as well fling crap into the face of the designer of the 65 mustang.

You're saying the new GTO looks better than the new mustang?

I love pontiac but I'm not impressed with the looks of the GTO. The new mustang looks like a sports car. The new gto looks like a family sedan. And thats that! Say what you will the GTO is not getting any prettier. I hate mustangs just as much as the other pontiac guy but looking good is looking good. And the new mustang (plastic or not) looks better than the new GTO.

didnt read the entire post, but dont know if anyone has mentioned this, but the interior is hot. One of the best on a domestic not named caddy.

and oh, i would buy it if the price is rite?

IMO chevy did a better job with the GTO than ford did the mustang


hey sport the GTO is a Pontiac not chevy.

the engine and trans is chevy.I look at it for what parts it has.The exterior is holden and the motor is chevy.I heard Canada played part in pressing out some parts used to build the GTO's but i havent researched any of the parts on the list.The 04 GTO has 350hp stock,the 05 GTO is 400hp.Thats all i was talking about.the New tangs have 300hp and a 5 speed.I wouldnt mind picking some parts off a new mustang for my 97 crown vic.

IT SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not even close to the criterea of the classics, even ford made the new mustangs with a retro look and it looks good too (and I hate fords!!) the New GTJoke is a disgrace and a slap in the face to the GM world if they were going to being back a legend they should have at least made a similarity to a classic instead of putting into a rejected Grand Prix. It has no style no nastalga and no class thus it will get no respect.

IT SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not even close to the criterea of the classics, even ford made the new mustangs with a retro look and it looks good too (and I hate fords!!) the New GTJoke is a disgrace and a slap in the face to the GM world if they were going to being back a legend they should have at least made a similarity to a classic instead of putting into a rejected Grand Prix. It has no style no nastalga and no class thus it will get no respect.
RIGHT ON BRO!!!!!!!!! Modern high performance GT cars sure aren't what they used to be. Connoisseurs like me demand more. I need your respect! I want nastalga

:icon16:

.

The problem with the old GTO and trying to make new ones look like it is it's not practical. Aerodynamics on the old GTO was for the most part nonexistant. The lines on the old GTO are just not useable on newer models. The older mustangs on the otherhand were easy to morph to something that is new and old at the same time. I don't see the new GTO ever looking like the old one. Same goes with the old Chevelle and the like. These cars are too large and awkward by todays standards. I'm not sure I would want to own a new GTO that looked like an older one anyway. If you want an old GTO then buy an old GTO.

the engine and trans is chevy.I look at it for what parts it has.The exterior is holden and the motor is chevy.I heard Canada played part in pressing out some parts used to build the GTO's but i havent researched any of the parts on the list.The 04 GTO has 350hp stock,the 05 GTO is 400hp.Thats all i was talking about.the New tangs have 300hp and a 5 speed.I wouldnt mind picking some parts off a new mustang for my 97 crown vic.


hey sport you are banned. I checked out the 05s and all I can say is they are sweet!

The problem with the old GTO and trying to make new ones look like it is it's not practical. Aerodynamics on the old GTO was for the most part nonexistant. The lines on the old GTO are just not useable on newer models. The older mustangs on the otherhand were easy to morph to something that is new and old at the same time. I don't see the new GTO ever looking like the old one. Same goes with the old Chevelle and the like. These cars are too large and awkward by todays standards. I'm not sure I would want to own a new GTO that looked like an older one anyway. If you want an old GTO then buy an old GTO.

Thus the reason they should have left it alone dont F**k with a legend and thus is why I own a 69 GTO (becuase of its nastalgic looks and the respect it commands.) The Idea was nothing about aerodymnaymics. Its nastalga. Hell Ford did it maybe GM should go to HOTWHEELS designers and asked them to design it I am sure they would have done a better job of it rather than a simple design over a cup of coffee. Just think what you would be saying if they re-vamped the Chevelle from a Lumina body. I own a GTO an Original not a repro (anything after 1974 is just imitation). And yes I know this will tick off some you that have a new one, but if you dont own an original (64-74) you will never know.

Pontiac needed three things
1). A design that commanded respect (and that it does not) :disappoin
2). A motor of its own like maybe a Pontiac not a Chevy (theres a new concept, but that will never happen) :shakehead
3). A class all its own (and well its not kinda falls into the class of a Rejected GP body) :iceslolan
4). And if they couldnt come up with items 1-3.......well then they should have left well enough alone and let it be known as classic muscle car

69GTO, your stating your opinion as fact. Its your right to dislike the new GTO's you can say it does not do justice to the classic GTO's but other are allowed to have there opinion as well. I personally don't care if my car's engine comes from Corporate or my specific make as long as its got balls and you can give your opinion but there is no mistaking performance and the new gto's got plenty of power and run plenty quick, Infact put it up against the GTO's of back in the day and watch what happens. Now you can't please everyone with cosmetics, some people are going to like it,some are going to love and some are going to hate it such as yourself.

Whoever styled the 2006 Pontiac Solstice should work on the 2007-2008 GTO which will be built here instead of Australia.

http://www.fast-autos.net/pontiac/solstice11.jpg

The 2004 Pontiac GTO Ram Air 6 concept is a step in the right direction as far as styling goes.

http://seriouswheels.com/top-2004-Pontiac-GTO-Ram-Air-6.htm

Let's face it, move over Mustang, there's a new kid on the block. Your 300 horse motor, well let's just say that 4.6 will compete with the Sentra.
Unless you have Cobra stamped on your rear end, you can pick up your doors at the next exit.

69GTO, your stating your opinion as fact. Its your right to dislike the new GTO's you can say it does not do justice to the classic GTO's but other are allowed to have there opinion as well. I personally don't care if my car's engine comes from Corporate or my specific make as long as its got balls and you can give your opinion but there is no mistaking performance and the new gto's got plenty of power and run plenty quick, Infact put it up against the GTO's of back in the day and watch what happens. Now you can't please everyone with cosmetics, some people are going to like it,some are going to love and some are going to hate it such as yourself.

Like I said before if you dont own one you won't know and yes everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but you were not old enough nor were you around when a Pontiac came out with a Pontiac motor Buick was a Buick etc. I guess that is what will seperate you from me you new school me old school. Performance is ok But I do believe that they could have done a hell of a lot better case in point the Firehawk is still faster than the new GTO with out any mods being done. IMO (sorry for the confusion on facts) my :2cents:

So what cause of your 12-13 years on me you know all and I don't know a thing. Well sorry to burst your bubble but I have driven my uncles 389 66 GTO more times than I can count and I still feel the same way. I love old school muscle cars and you should feel free to share your "opinion" but don't give me that I don't know anything cause your older than me and own one stuff cause I have been a car enthusiast for as long as I can remember and feel I know enough to share my opinion so please don't dismiss it as someone who doesn't know anything cause of my age or the fact I don't own one.

dont you guys just love it when someone comes in outta nowhere with an attitude.. i think some time on the forum will humble his attitude and he will come to understand Formula that you are in fact a knowledgeable member and a GLOBAL MODERATOR... lol

Like I said before if you dont own one you won't know and yes everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but you were not old enough nor were you around when a Pontiac came out with a Pontiac motor Buick was a Buick etc. I guess that is what will seperate you from me you new school me old school. Performance is ok But I do believe that they could have done a hell of a lot better case in point the Firehawk is still faster than the new GTO with out any mods being done. IMO (sorry for the confusion on facts) my :2cents:



Just because people were not alive when a car came out, does not mean that they don't know about it. It's called research and stuff like that. I can dig up all the specs on any old muscle car and tell you about it. The only thing we "New school" guys lack is the memories of growing up with a old muscle car.

As far as performance... How can you say that the performace is weak??? 400 HP, will run with the older GTO's all day long, out handle it by a long shot. Also on top of this,the damn thing gets 25+MPG and will last alot longer... Yup I have to agree, they don't make them like they used to. :rolleyes:

:owned:

who said i dont have memories of growing up with an old muscle car.. my grandpa had a 68 Camaro Conv. with a 327, 2 speed powerglide.. he used to take me for rides at night with the top down just so i would go to sleep.. ahh memories..

the new GTO looks like a cavalier... crap. i agree with everything 69GTO said. and that concept car that is pictured... that thing is really ugly, what the hell is wrong with pontiac. and Autobanaurora... move over mustang... :loser: whats sad is that the new GTO has 400 hp and it still BARELY beats the new stang.... and the new stang beats the 350 hp GTO. Thats not saying a whole lot for the engineers down at GM. it doesnt look real good when a 4.6 is beating a 5.7...

What are you talking about?.
First you say it barely BEATS the stang then you say the 4.6 beats it?:screwy:
And no one made you the good design police so ITS YOUR OPINION THAT THE GTO DESIGN sucks, others feel different. If you think 400 "Net horsepower" is weak out of a LS2 then you wouldn't really think much of the 60's then either.

John

got news for ya... the 400 hp motor is a 7.0 ls2 is it not? the 4.6 did beat the 5.7, thats the 350hp motor. u just misunderstood what i wrote. so yes the 4.6 is beating a 5.7 and barely losing to a 7.0... thats my whole point. and yes the looks is i guess opinion but im just sayin that i think it looks like a cavalier... and I dont like that concept.

got news for ya... the 400 hp motor is a 7.0 ls2 is it not? the 4.6 did beat the 5.7, thats the 350hp motor. u just misunderstood what i wrote. so yes the 4.6 is beating a 5.7 and barely losing to a 7.0... thats my whole point. and yes the looks is i guess opinion but im just sayin that i think it looks like a cavalier... and I dont like that concept.

News flash for you smart guy, the LS2 is a 6.0 :screwy:, Look it up http://www.pontiac.com/specs/specs_content_files/specs_performance.jsp?brand=gto and you didn't explain yourself before very well. Do some research before you talk. It just makes you look foolish otherswise.

John