Whats Up With GM?

I just want you guys opinion about wwhats up with GM, because right now...their cars Suck! I mean chevy has the c6 corvette and SSR then what........a v6 fwd monte carlo or its 4 door twin the impala......and after that...nothing worth your money! Pontiac has the grand am and the GTO, after that...nothing worth your money! Hummer, im fine with, and cadillac, im fine with the escalade, xlr, and cts, as for saturn...saab....geo...and the rest, there is nothing worth your money!.
The SS concept is ok....not the greatest.

I hate to say it, but ford is producing some nice cars for 04 and 05, i mean the jags have new ones, the rx8, volvos have always been good, the retro mustang 40th ann., the return of the shelby cobra, the gt40, the bronco concept.....it seems like ford is making all of the right moves while gm is not!

Dont get me wrong, i hate ford as much as the next gm guy, i think they make the better product but right now, the product isnt being made so ford is getting all of the credit, what is up with them!!!!!!

I'm Agree with you about they fucking up with the camaro and else but not the corvette. Man have you seen the new Corvette 2005. Man that shit is tight, nice, awesome, cool, great, tight, nice, awesome, cool, great. Did I meantioned tight, nice, awesome, cool, great.
Besides yes the ss is very nice. But these motherfukers would have done better if they would have keep the camaro.

i haven't been too impressed with GM's cars lately either. although i do kinda like what they did with the front ends on there pontiac line, they've been having a lot of problems with intake gaskets and a few other things. I just changed the intake gasket on my sister's pontiac, cause it was a poor gasket design, and then they came out with a new design which featured buttons at each end of the gasket to keep from over torquing, and better material to keep from deteriorating. but it's only available through GM and cost's over $100. They've also had a lot of recalls on there chevy line with the Trailblazer's and a few monte carlo's. I use to work at a chevy dealership, and i wasn't too impressed with there duramax diesel's. for as much torque as those things make, there pretty pooch. i think they've also had a few problems with transmissions. i think GM has focused it's attention on looks and cut spending and engine and drivetrain. What ever happened to the rear wheel drive car with a V8? about all that's left are the firebirds and TA's. Those car's are on the sport compact line, and who the hell can afford those. And has anyone noticed that V8's keep gettin smaller and smaller. pretty soon they'll have a 2L V8

awww geeze not another one of these threads lol ;) but yeah weve all noticed, although for ford, i was disgusted by the cobra concept, not at all as nice as the one from 1966-1967,you can quote numbers all you want, as far as performance, but just looking at the car, i dont get the same hardon from the new one. its ugly. the bronco, is a fully independent susupention, not for off roading, for highway cruising, the old bronco, (my bro has a 1973) will drive up a vertical cliff stop to piss on a jeep stuck on a rock, and then move on down the other side, without taking a break. the new one is gonna give the old one a bad name, although the stock NO2 option is pretty fucking cool, hope that catches on. but lets give Lutz a little time, hes doing the best he can with GM, has to bring them back to the light. GMs turning point was when woment took over the board. performance died, and the birth of an ENTIRE line of automobiles solely built on FWD V6 platforms was created. (well except for trucks and the vette) now im not sexist, but you have to notice the corrolation there. i mean, when i say GM dosnt have any balls anymore, i mean it. ;)

damn straight

I disagree with you about Pontiac they are moving right along very well. The Bonneville's top model now uses the Northstar 4.6l V8 rather then the supercharged V6. It's around 300 hp now. Still fwd but hopefully that will change later. The Grand Prix has also been much improved, and features a 260hp supercharged V6. GTO of course already mentioned, basically a rwd 350hp Grand Am. The Grand Am is being done away with for a much more bland car called the G6. Why they couldn't just call it the next generation Grand Am beats me its the same thing. Anyways thats going to have a GTP or GXP version with 240 hp.

well, imo, the 4.8 should be dropped from every line EXCEPT cadillac for the 5.7 LS1 or 6 (or just bring back the LT's). Those would be great in the bonneville, sort of bringing back the days of the impala SS's of the mid 90's (The last respectable impalas imo). also, GM should have a line of cars that directly, competes with the lincoln&mercury sytle of all luxury/sporty v8's (even though mercury is falling off),They should do it with olds or buick, i mean they have cadillac to do it, but evenyone knows that caddy's are in their own class and definitely cannot be topped by any american efforts, they are in more comp with bmw and benz than anyone else. One last thing, DITCH SATURN COMPLETELY!!
Thats my 2 cents for Feb. 14th

what is wrong with the northstar engine????? id take a northstar over a LT engine anyday. (well cept the LT5) the problem with going to all LS1 based engines is cost. the current production line is all fwd, the northstar is already designed for that application, the LS1 is not, meaning they would have to redesign the LS1 engines, or the cars to put them in. very cost prohibitive. i look at the northstar option as a step in the right direction, things have to move in stages, cant expect the entire gm line to change course all at once. although i do agree with the 1994-1996 imps being the last impalla worthy of the name. and that caddy is in a leaug of their own, can we say CTS Vspec???? that thing is AWESOME!!! i want one bad. even if it is four doors ;)

I think this is what does it for me:

"AVEO: AN AMERICAN REVOLUTION"

LMAO!!!!!! yeah, that is a sad sad no excuses accepted from GM on that one.

dont get me wrong, i agree with you totally 89iroc, the northstar is a good engine and it would be very costly to change the ls1 or the drivetrians, but why have a v8 and fwd, imo v8 and fwd are total opposites, even the northstar would be better with rwd i think, i dont know, mabye im just old school. also there's alot of people that i know that are waiting anxiously for a LS or LT powered GM car (Besides the GTO). ex: I know the bonneville already sells well, but drop in a LT or LS and rwd, and i bet you'll see alot more on the road.

yeah i would have to agree on alot of those points, and in fact, the northstar is being put through the R&D paces for rwd. so you can hope for that. but then again, my dad has a 1996 tarus SHO, its got a tiny little V8 and fwd, and it will toast my RS without breaking a sweat. havent run it against the IROC, but id bet its a close one, (IROC winning of course) i mean yeah im old school too, i totaly preferr V8 rwd, but hey, ill take a V8 anyway i can get it :) i give em props for that northstar transplant.

but hey, ill take a V8 anyway i can get it :)

great point, seeing how many cars actally have one these days!

Have you not seen the new saturns? those are worth every penny.

as far as the saturn, the only one i would look at is the Ion Red, with the 220hp ecotec, but its still ugly.

to me, saturn is nothing more than a poor excuse for a line of 4 banger daily drivers that aren't very appealing, sort of like a GM-honda, thats why I think they should scrap the whole thing, If they're desperate, they can transfer the prodiction to olds or buick, but that would destroy their name (more) also.

(or they could just drop a LS1 in everything) :)

Rember though, all car manufactures have to meet an avrage gas mileage. it seems that the copany with the higher avreage makes fore money

I just want you guys opinion about wwhats up with GM, because right now...their cars Suck! I mean chevy has the c6 corvette and SSR then what........a v6 fwd monte carlo or its 4 door twin the impala......and after that...nothing worth your money! Pontiac has the grand am and the GTO, after that...nothing worth your money! Hummer, im fine with, and cadillac, im fine with the escalade, xlr, and cts, as for saturn...saab....geo...and the rest, there is nothing worth your money!.
The SS concept is ok....not the greatest.

I hate to say it, but ford is producing some nice cars for 04 and 05, i mean the jags have new ones, the rx8, volvos have always been good, the retro mustang 40th ann., the return of the shelby cobra, the gt40, the bronco concept.....it seems like ford is making all of the right moves while gm is not!

Dont get me wrong, i hate ford as much as the next gm guy, i think they make the better product but right now, the product isnt being made so ford is getting all of the credit, what is up with them!!!!!!

I have to disagree a little. Namely in your comparison of cars made...
Not that these cars are exact comparisons, but just to represent the number of models, here is a listing...

GM -----------------------------------> Ford
--- -----------------------------------> -----
2005(6) Z06 ???hp ----------------------> GT
2005 Base Vette 400hp ------------------> Mustang Cobra 390hp
GTO 350hp -----------------------------> Mustang Mach1
SSR 300hp -----------------------------> Mustang GT 302hp
Soltice ???hp ----------------------------> Cobra ??? hp
Monte Carlo SS 260hp -------------------> ???
Impala SS 260hp ------------------------> ???

Not to mention the non performance market:

GM
---

Aveo
Malibu
Malibu Maxx
Cobalt
Equinox
Colorado


It doesn't look to me like they are slacking off. Rather they are conforming to a marketplace that believe it or not, is not worried about the high performance market. Even people claim to be in the high performance market are buying economy cars and trying to make them fast like many of the import cars on here (no offense intended). As much as many of us like the "muscle car" thing, it just isn't making money in todays society of high gas prices and insurance rates.

BTW, is Ford ever going to think of a new name for a car? Or are they going to simply call every damn performance car they produce a Mustang... They have like 3-4 cars with different power plants/suspension/drivetrains, and yet they are all called Mustangs?... What gives?

i'm gettin real tired of seein white impala's. the rear end's are ugly. it looks like they ran out of ideas when they got to the back of the car, so they just slapped some round tail lights on it. I know there just sticking with the traditional tail lights, but it looks gay. all of the sherrif's cars in my county are white impala's, and most are unmarked. so everytime i see a white impala, my instinct is to hit the brakes. throw those in with the 10,000 other white impala's cruising around, and it makes it a bitch to speed. and what is the deal with big fat people driving little chevy metro's? why dont they just buy a lasabre, that's what there made for.

word...

GM -----------------------------------> Ford
--- -----------------------------------> -----
2005(6) Z06 ???hp ----------------------> GT
2005 Base Vette 400hp ------------------> Mustang Cobra 390hp
GTO 350hp -----------------------------> Mustang Mach1
SSR 300hp -----------------------------> Mustang GT 302hp
Soltice ???hp ----------------------------> Cobra ??? hp
Monte Carlo SS 260hp -------------------> ???
Impala SS 260hp ------------------------> ???


I agree with you z28 about the market not thinking about performance vehicles so much, and yes, I do think just chevy has and edge over just ford, but ford as a whole has more performance vehicles ( im talkin mostly v8's) than GM and dodge, either ford is very slow to react or being smart about the balance of performance, luxury, and 4 bangers but right now, i think they have the upper hand.
ONCE AGAIN I REPEAT, I DON'T LIKE FORD AND NEVER WILL AND WILL NEVER OWN ONE!(for any of you starting to get ideas), but I saw that new concept from pontiac on their website, the little roadster and I thought WOW! I bet that thing has some heat under the hood and the damn thing has a .005 liter inline four!!!!!!!!! I swear the thing is screaming put an ls1 in me!, or at least the supercharged 3800! And it is funny that every ford sports car is a mustang, but hey, if they produced another version of the 02 f-body and called it a corvette part 2 i'd get one!

good point about the solstice. I got my new automobile mag bout a month ago and it was on the cover. I was like, damn, that looks sweet.. roll it open and find that it has less than 200 ponies under the hood. pretty gay IMO...

really though.....:(
very disappointing powerplant

lol, your upset about the imps??? what about all those old people everywhere who think its funny to drive a dark color crown vic with tinted windows and a CB antenna on it. i see those all the time. slam on the brakes, cruze by, look over and see some old fart hooked to his dialisis machine laughing his ass off.... old fuckers

hey 89iroc&rs did u every get a response from chevy about those letters u wrote

OI dude, wayyyy to much on my plate, never even wrote em. i might do it this weekend. ive been trying to get my IROC done and sell the RS as quick as possible. so i totally forgot about the letters. whoops :)

lol, your upset about the imps??? what about all those old people everywhere who think its funny to drive a dark color crown vic with tinted windows and a CB antenna on it. i see those all the time. slam on the brakes, cruze by, look over and see some old fart hooked to his dialisis machine laughing his ass off.... old fuckers

LMFAO!!!!!!
WOW, THAT SUCKS!

how much u want for ur rs?

Sorry guys... I'm not on dialisis, and I understand where you're coming from. I used to hate white Impala's and Crown's too, but it's real easy to get where I'm going now:) And people are exteremely courteous... until they see a long haired punk in his 20's driving.:)