ReGenesis vs. 20B

Alright,
got a question for you guys. all things considered, and by all things i mean everything, installation, aftermarket support, mantaining the engine, hp/torque, tunability, street drivablity etc, etc, etc., do you think that the ReGenesis engine will be able to compare with a 20B in an FD? This is assuming that you swapped both engines into identical FD's.

-the two major points that i've been thinking about are the power gains (duh), and the weight (is the difference going to affect handling).

opps, i ment RENESIS

The Rennie cant compare to the 20b in performance...

lets look at this the REN is a 2 rotor NA motor. The 20B 3 rotor twin turbo motor. Hummm.. which ahs more performance potential???

If you do an engine swap go for a 20B, only engine that will improve the car.

i know that the 20b will blow the socks off of the REN, but that swap can cost over 30k. and what about the weight. wouldn't the extra weight through off the balance.

if i remember correctly, the REN has 5-10 less hp than the 13b tt. so what's going to happen when they build a turbo REN?

And is the 20b swap really very streetable? i mean how many daily 20b drivers have you seen? i often wonder about the reliability of the 20b swap, what's the point of having an awesome car if you have to tear it down after every other run?

There are other important part to ther performance of the car. is the 20B going to win hands down, or is anybody going to stick up for the REN?

The REN does not take well to being turboed. The engine is not built for it.

The 20B is not common because it is costly. And the reason you dont seethe REN being used is because it is much easier to get power out of the 13b than the REN

well if the REN was ported and rebuilt to fit a turbo I think it would be way better than the 13B, just my thoughts though

personally I think they should just make a 2rotor but make the rotors like 1.5 times bigger, I think that'll give you more down low and a full power range, what do you all think?

EDIT: by bigger I mean in width say go from |____| to |______| not that this is any kind of measurement but its an example of 1.5 times wider :)

... or you can run the friggin thing on a liquid oxygen/hydrogen mix.


;) j/k

Well I've read that the rotary already suffers a bit on V.E. because of the combustion chambers beening to big. That is also why the engine has two spark plugs per rotor. The flame front loses momentum as it has to fill the chamber before even pushing the rotor to gain power. Another spark plug may help a little in that situation, but I'd like to see a direct injection ceramic rotary engine. Now that would take the cake

Comparing a Renesis to a 20b is like comparing a v12 to a v8.

The person who said the Renesis doesn't respond well to turbocharging, you are dead wrong.

The person who said "i often wonder about the reliability of the 20b swap, what's the point of having an awesome car if you have to tear it down after every other run?"If you know someone who tears down their 20b after every other run, they are making WAY over 1000hp, or tuned/had the car tuned by a complete putz.

Go to zeroyon.com and e-mail Chris. He's had a 20b in his FD for a while now. Good luck.

nopistons.com
rx7club.com

Monster7 please tell me why the REN is good for turbocharging. Provide me with info proving this wrong.

It has been proved time and time again that turbochraging a NA rotarie engine with stock internals will lead to its enevitable death.

I have seen a couple REN's that have been turboed in Vancouver and they have some serious issues. So i may be wrong but from what i have seen the car is not very well suited to turbocharging.

Dont worrie all Mazda is making a new RX7, but no one knows when.

It wasn't a big deal to me that people were turbocharging the RX8 with success, therefor I'll have to dig up the people/articles.

ANY NA vehicle will have a short lifespan on boost if the tuning involved is poor or mediocre.

The "new RX-7" was supposed to make an appearence at this years Tokyo Auto Salon. Did it? No.

I've had a long day, sorry for the bluntness.

Comparing a Renesis to a 20b is like comparing a v12 to a v8.

comparing the REN to the 20B IS like comparing a v-8 to a v-12. the 12 will weigh an insane amount more, destroying your handling ability and throwing your balance way outta wack. the 12 will suck down so much gas you'll have to fill up at every stop light. so ya, i agree completly. when i said taking everything into account, i ment everything. not just hp.

how long will the 20B last in comparison to a lightly/moderatly modded REN? any ideas?

how much more does the 20B weigh than the REN?

With all the hp that the 20B is pushing out, is there any way to keep your 7 attached the ground, or are you just going to spin until 4th gear after every stoplight? you know, and i hate to say this, there is such a thing as too much horsepower. if you can't corner, or keep your tires from breaking loose every time you look at the pedal, then you've just wasted your money. having a 3 rotor rx7 would be awesome, but i would much rather have "practical" power, something that i can drag AND track race with.

(just a side note, what is the FD's lateral g rating??)

Everything you said is baseless.

Do you have any idea how much weight a 20b adds to the FD chassis? Not nearly as much as you think.

If you have a reputable shop install the 20b does it "throw off your handling ability?" NO

What does the FD pull on a 600ft s.p? Depending on what magazine you get your information from, mid .90's.

Anything else?

Before you jump on me so hard about being baseless you might wanna find something to base your info on. but before you start giving me numbers and websites i think 89Turbo944 asked you to back up your comments a several posts ago.

Back up? I wouldn't be replying to your post if you, like him, would take the time to search a ROTARY FORUM and READ before making the comments you have.

If you know nothing about the topic, DON'T POST. As far as me "jumping on you". With the type of post's you make, you should get used to people "jumping on you hard". :nono:

I've had a long day, sorry for the bluntness.

the point of a message board like this is to learn and to see what other people's opinions are about different subject. that's why i posted this thread, to learn. you aren't really helping me learn a freakin thing, sorry you had a bad day. why don't you post again when you're more help to everyone?

Monster7 look kid. My job is to rebuild and build performance rotary engines. Thats what i get payed to do. The shop i work at specializes in rotary engines.

You still have not proved a thing. I was never arguing that the REN was not capable of handling boost. Rather that it is not very well suited for it. For instance, the coolant o-rings in the ren are not very well suited to high temperatures such as ones created by a turbo. It will make then very brittle and you will end up with a coolant leak. Second the apex seals need to be upgraded. Otherwise the first ping you have will shatter them and send pits through your exhaust.

Now if you replaced those parts with betterones, and also re-machined the rotors(for lower cylinder pressure) then the engine would work great.

Like i said before a STOCK internal REN engine is not very well suited to forced induction.

O and with the cradels that are available for the 20B you do end up losing some of the manuverability of the 7 but not alot unless you are use to taking the car to the track.

If you have a shop make you a custom cradel and move the engine back then you will retain the handling charistics of the 7.

comparing the REN to the 20B IS like comparing a v-8 to a v-12. the 12 will weigh an insane amount more, destroying your handling ability and throwing your balance way outta wack. the 12 will suck down so much gas you'll have to fill up at every stop light. so ya, i agree completly. when i said taking everything into account, i ment everything. not just hp.
You're right, how could I misunderstand your post... :rolleyes:

This is in fact a message board for people to learn, so I suggest you do that.

Monster7 look kid. My job is to rebuild and build performance rotary engines. Thats what i get payed to do. The shop i work at specializes in rotary engines.

You still have not proved a thing. I was never arguing that the REN was not capable of handling boost. Rather that it is not very well suited for it. For instance, the coolant o-rings in the ren are not very well suited to high temperatures such as ones created by a turbo. It will make then very brittle and you will end up with a coolant leak. Second the apex seals need to be upgraded. Otherwise the first ping you have will shatter them and send pits through your exhaust.

Now if you replaced those parts with betterones, and also re-machined the rotors(for lower cylinder pressure) then the engine would work great.

Like i said before a STOCK internal REN engine is not very well suited to forced induction.
Where are you located?

One ping will kill almost any rotary motor. (Depending on the apex seals used)

This is in fact a message board for people to learn, so I suggest you do that.

what the hell is your problem man? i didn't come here to fight with anybody, but for some reason you've singled me out. if you have a problem with the thread THEN STOP READING IT.

Monster7, you have a personal messege (PM) in your inbox.

Please check it.


Thank you.

OK people, cool down a bit.

AeroE: You seem to be just waiting for someone to say the RENESIS is the better choice...people have given their opinion that the 20B in an FD works better. You're allowed to like the RENESIS better, but that's your opinion and there's no need to try convincing them otherwise.

with all due respect, i'm not trying to get anyone to agree that the REN is better, i know that the 20B will out power the REN any day of the week. i was trying to steer the thread more towards the handling issues. which 89Turbo944 answered for me.

what the hell is your problem man? i didn't come here to fight with anybody, but for some reason you've singled me out. if you have a problem with the thread THEN STOP READING IT.
My problem is with people like you who would rather give others your assumption rather than first hand knowledge, or credible second hand knowledge.

I would normally handle this in a different way, but seeing as you're the type of person that tells on people, you have no respect from me. Put me on your Ignore list, and I will do the same.

i was trying to steer the thread more towards the handling issues. which 89Turbo944 answered for me.

Then you have your answer from what seems to be a knowledgable source. Thread closed.