new gto!?!

holy crap!!! i just saw a commercial for the new gto and my god this thing sounds like a beast, aluminium block, im not sure what its called but i think its something like power connected push rods??? :uhoh: its puttin out 350 horse with 365 ft-lbs torque, 0-60 in 5.3 seconds and it runs the 1/4 in the low 14's. sounds nice :naughty:

what broadcast? did u c it at

Yeah, it's called a Holden Manaro. The Aussies have had it for years. Ah... freedom.

But yeah, nice to see rear wheel drive coming back to MUSCLE CARS. Holy crap, we've been living a lie for twenty-five years.

its just the ls1 from the camaro or TA...nothing new except that is in a touring car

nothing new other than it can handle well but it's poo they had it on top gear it didn't make a good impression on the lap times as it was well down the list. NSX type R was higher !!!!!! by a large amount

nothing new other than it can handle well but it's poo they had it on top gear it didn't make a good impression on the lap times as it was well down the list. NSX type R was higher !!!!!! by a large amount


well its normal for the nsx r to be way faster on a track....the GTO is just a fast luxury coupe

nothing new other than it can handle well but it's poo they had it on top gear it didn't make a good impression on the lap times as it was well down the list. NSX type R was higher !!!!!! by a large amount
They had the Manaro on Top Gear when did they use the GTO?

Again with the nsx, why the hell do you feel you must defend that car when no one is even talking about it? You sound paranoid for no reason at all.

well its normal for the nsx r to be way faster on a track....the GTO is just a fast luxury coupe

No it's not....The car has no advanced options except for a CD player, it's not meant to be a "luxury coupe". The car is amazing however, even though it's being seen as a long cavalier. It's a production car that noone can bitch about not having enough room to see out the rear window, or to uncomfortable and squished interior room(like the camaro and T/A....RIP). We just got one on the showroom where i work, and it is very impressive up close, we got 3 of them and 2 were already sold before they arrived.

I saw that commercial they were talking about, that was a damn good commercial, short and to the point.

No it's not....The car has no advanced options except for a CD player, it's not meant to be a "luxury coupe". The car is amazing however, even though it's being seen as a long cavalier. It's a production car that noone can bitch about not having enough room to see out the rear window, or to uncomfortable and squished interior room(like the camaro and T/A....RIP). We just got one on the showroom where i work, and it is very impressive up close, we got 3 of them and 2 were already sold before they arrived.

I saw that commercial they were talking about, that was a damn good commercial, short and to the point.


i said "fast luxury coupe" and if its not meant to be that can you tell me what segment of the market represents?

I can understand the comparison to the Grand Am and the Grand Prix, but I don't see where it looks like a Cavalier they are quite a bit different.

Speaking of new cars....where the hell did this come from? I never heard about any car called the Cobalt? Seems like its getting ready for production as well. It's like a mixture of an Impala and Malibu.
http://www.chevrolet.com/cobalt/images/gallery/wall1_800x600.jpg
http://www.chevrolet.com/cobalt/images/gallery/wall2_800x600.jpg

I like the Pontiac GTO for no other reason other than the fact that it handily wins the under-$40,000 near luxury sport coupe category comparison. Let's take a look at its competitors.

(now, this is just off the top of my head, so feel free to post specs that contradict my statements)

BMW 330ci
Infiniti G35 Sport Coupe
Chrysler Crossfire
Volvo C70
Mazda RX-8
Ford Mustang GT
Audi TT coupe
Acura CL
Honda Accord coupe
Nissan 350Z
Mercedes CLK320

Well, the next best accelerator is either the Mustang GT or the 350Z. And in the handling department I'd bet on the 350Z or RX-8 to beat it out, but there's a lot of dusted machinery there and certainly a great many more cars not in the category that should look over their shoulders. The GTO is a lot of car for the money, and there's a lot more potential in it as the HRT427 concept proved. Personally, I can't wait for the GTO to become this beast.

http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/large/1488-2.jpg

It's ok, but I don't thing it beats the under 40k crowd hands down.
It's nice though, but nothing revolutionary.

Everything,bar the Mustang and ancient Volvo will wipe the floor with the Monaro, handling wise, from that above list. I've taken most of them for a spin (And even own one of them) bar the G35, which I have read as being as on par, if not more than the 3 series, neither have I driven the US Hondas, but Honda have always been pretty good with inspiring FWD cars. Oh and I'll be checking out the Crossfire asap.

The Beemer, G35, Crossfire, RX8, TT and Z will at least. It'd be more on par with the Hondas and CLK in that department.

You've got to remember that the GTO is a Monaro, which is a Commodore with the back doors welded shut, which is based off the Opel V Body Omega, which was introduced back in 1993. I'm pretty sure the US Pontiac GTO is the Series 2 Monaro, which is a VX SII Commodore, later models (and maybe the GTO) had refinements made to the suspension by V8 Supercars champ Mark Skaife and the HRT team. I'm pretty sure that it was handling among other things, that saw the Monaro with an early exit from the Australian Wheels COTY 2001 awards.

I myself was always disappointed by the Series I Monaro

However in terms of simple power and brawn, few can beat the Monaro, especially in 300Kw form, you guys are just lucky you aren't getting the CV6 model with the Buick 3.8 :apuke: I'd be interested to see how it goes in a straight line against the Mustang GT. If only Holden would put that 427 in the Monaro :( I'd love to see that :D

Well, at the least it's a tight race between them all. And it isn't because I'm anti-the other cars. Quite frankly, the only ones in that list that I wouldn't want in my driveway are the two Hondas, the Volvo, and the Mercedes CLK320.

I'm just big on the GTO and really despise all of its pundits because it's such a good all around car. The old muscle cars guys are all up in arms because it's not just for them (aka; it's refined and poised, ready to take on the world since there's no more muscle cars of its breed to fight in the states) and the import guys still seem to look down on it because it's a big American coupe with a big OHV V8, and we all know that's not the way to make power. :rolleyes:

This is a good car and one that's ready to play with some big boys from beyond Woodward Avenue. Whether or not it's an Australian transplant doesn't matter. It's a good car.

Well, at the least it's a tight race between them all. And it isn't because I'm anti-the other cars. Quite frankly, the only ones in that list that I wouldn't want in my driveway are the two Hondas, the Volvo, and the Mercedes CLK320.

I'm just big on the GTO and really despise all of its pundits because it's such a good all around car. The old muscle cars guys are all up in arms because it's not just for them (aka; it's refined and poised, ready to take on the world since there's no more muscle cars of its breed to fight in the states) and the import guys still seem to look down on it because it's a big American coupe with a big OHV V8, and we all know that's not the way to make power. :rolleyes:

This is a good car and one that's ready to play with some big boys from beyond Woodward Avenue. Whether or not it's an Australian transplant doesn't matter. It's a good car.
:cheers:


Struth mate!

Well, at the least it's a tight race between them all. And it isn't because I'm anti-the other cars. Quite frankly, the only ones in that list that I wouldn't want in my driveway are the two Hondas, the Volvo, and the Mercedes CLK320.

I'm just big on the GTO and really despise all of its pundits because it's such a good all around car. The old muscle cars guys are all up in arms because it's not just for them (aka; it's refined and poised, ready to take on the world since there's no more muscle cars of its breed to fight in the states) and the import guys still seem to look down on it because it's a big American coupe with a big OHV V8, and we all know that's not the way to make power. :rolleyes:

This is a good car and one that's ready to play with some big boys from beyond Woodward Avenue. Whether or not it's an Australian transplant doesn't matter. It's a good car.


I agree fully :)

What I dont get is why is the GT being compared to the GTO? Theyre not even in the same price range, nor power. Compare it to something more along its line like a Mach 1 or a Cobra :dunno:

I thought I read that the 2004 Mustang GT starts at $32,150. I'm willing to be proved wrong, but that's under $40,000 and I doubt that the Mustang GT is intended to fight with Acura RSX's and Mitsubishi Eclipses.

I thought I read that the 2004 Mustang GT starts at $32,150. I'm willing to be proved wrong, but that's under $40,000 and I doubt that the Mustang GT is intended to fight with Acura RSX's and Mitsubishi Eclipses.
:eek:



GTs start at around $23-24k, Mach 1 $28-29k and Cobra $33-35k. Coupes ofcourse. :)


The convertible GT will most likely have a $30k+ sticker.

I thought I read that the 2004 Mustang GT starts at $32,150.
A salesman told me that the new generation Mustang in GT form will cost that much. I couldn't believe what I was hearing are they actually going to bump the cost up that much? Thats insane, what the hell happened to the $25k price GT's usually went for?

A salesman told me that the new generation Mustang in GT form will cost that much. I couldn't believe what I was hearing are they actually going to bump the cost up that much? Thats insane, what the hell happened to the $25k price GT's usually went for?
I read somewhere that it was going to be based at around $24-25k :dunno:

I dont think anyone would pay 30 grand for a Mustang GT

Well, all of those great deals we've been getting on SN95 chassis Mustangs, just like all the great deals on the 4th gen Camaros/Firebirds, were based on dealer incentives and MSRP cuts to move more units. The cars got old, stopped selling, so bargaining them out to clear inventory was the solution.

Heck, on the corner of my old street there was Axelrod Pontiac and on their lot you'd see Firebirds, 2001, 2002, 2003 Firebirds, with windshield stickers reading between $19,500 and $23,995 as standard practice. It was a firesale.

But Ford is betting on the new more upscale image of the Mustang GT and its ultra-retro styling to offset the increased cost. What's old is new again.

Lord knows I've heard a ton of complaining about the '04 Mustang price amongst the guys at the shop where I work. They're all muscle fans (between the three of them, there's a 1966 Chrysler Imperial with a 383, a 1968 Chrysler New Yorker with a 440, an original 1968 Chevy Chevelle SS396, a 1968 Mustang 289, and a 1971 Camaro Z28) and were excited about the Mustang coming back with more power and classic styling, then they saw the price tag and were pissed off because not one of their cars cost more than it, work included.

"What’s more, all this unrivaled driving excitement will continue to come at an attainable price. Mustang will remain the best performance car for under $20,000, and the most affordable 300-horsepower car made today."

""This is a $30,000 interior in a $20,000 car," said Larry Erickson, Mustang chief designer. "The functional, contemporary look of this interior and its precise execution set a new standard.""

Thats for the 05 Mustang.

Theres no reason why a Coupe GT should cost more than 25 grand unless you start bringing in options. My car had a sticker price of 26,850 fully optioned with auto tranny. :dunno:

Well, like I said, I wanted to be proven wrong, because $32,150 is too much for any Ford Mustang.

Start talking SVT's, Steedas, Roushes, Shelbys, and Saleens and I'll sing a different tune. :iceslolan

Mmmmm, 1965 Shelby GT350R.
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/large/201-3.jpg

Well, like I said, I wanted to be proven wrong, because $32,150 is too much for any Ford Mustang.

Start talking SVT's, Steedas, Roushes, Shelbys, and Saleens and I'll sing a different tune. :iceslolan

Mmmmm, 1965 Shelby GT350R.
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/large/201-3.jpg
Motortrend covered the new Mustang and it showed a pic of a Shelby Mustang concept. Looked really nice. :)

I still need to see it in person cause the rear just isnt doing it for me =\

"a 1968 Mustang 289"

Heheh. :)

Have you gone to Fords site and built one? Out at Haliday Ford here in Shafter there were 2 Mach 1's, one was $30K+ change, one was $29K+change. That's dirt cheap for a Mustang like that. That's without rebates.

"a 1968 Mustang 289"

Heheh. :)

Have you gone to Fords site and built one? Out at Haliday Ford here in Shafter there were 2 Mach 1's, one was $30K+ change, one was $29K+change. That's dirt cheap for a Mustang like that. That's without rebates.
Hell the 2003s are being sold for 26 grand :eek:


If I wouldnt lose so much damn money on trade in Id get one!

It was actually motortrend that called the GTO an extended looking cavalier, not me just quoting. I can't wait to test drive the one were getting where i work..........Oh wait i can't because they're gonna make you put a down payment on it before you test drive it which is very dumb... Speaking of motortrend, anyone see their car of the year. A freakin Toyota Prius. *shudders* out of all the cars to choose from they pick that thing. Can you tell i dont care much for the hybrids.

Ha, The SLP Forums were calling the GTO a Cavaliar with an LS1. Even John Colleti from SVT said "Its a Cavaliar on a Camaro chassis" :lol:


I wonder when SLP gets their hands on the GTO. They mentioned a while back that they were going to release a 400hp GTO. :dunno:

Well, Z28Josh, I wouldn't expect you to see any benefit in a truly revolutionary vehicle such as the Prius.

You see, the Prius is unique amongst hybrids in that it's actually a car. Unlike Honda's Insight, or the previous generation Prius, this new Prius is a worthwhile (and cost effective) alternative to a Corolla or Civic. Now, this is coming from a car that can effectively deliver 60mpg.

Now, in a period of time when people are marching down streets with "No Blood for Oil" signs (I won't give you my opinion of them, but it's a good example of the socio-political climate) can you name a better time to introduce a good value of an alternative.

If nothing else, consider this; CAFE and the EPA demand a certain average fuel economy from each manufacturer's lineup. Toyota can now skate the average, which means if they want to build one of those always thirsty super sports coupes (like, say, a MkV Supra with a twin turbo version of the Lexus SC430 V8) they can.

No, i really dont care. Revolutionary.....I dont care. Right now, i dont care about gas mileage or economy or technology. I'm more concerned with performance, if this leads you to believe that i'm some simple minded motor head, i dont care. 60 MPG.... Gas prices are bad, but not that bad. I guess for some ppl who want a cheap car and want to pay cheaply for gas...well then that's the car for them. For people like me who really could give a shit, then we get cars like 66' Chevelles, or 79' Z28's with gas sucking double pumpers or what not. And i've never seen anyone around her with signs like that, you must be from Cali or something. So, obviously GM doesn't have to make cars like that if they want to build gas suckers, so why would Toyota... :eek: Your argument is BS and it insinuates you think i'm some dumb redneck who doesn't know what's going on in the auto industry, i live the auto industry...dont tell me, i know what's going on without you telling me.

I also "live" the auto industry. Not only do I make my daily bread as a mechanic, wrenching on the Luminas, Camrys, and Tauruses of the far larger group of people who care only that their cars are trouble-free, efficient, and comfortable, but I've been involved in aftermarket tuning and design plus motorsport since age 8.

And yes, you do come across as someone who's underinformed and can't see the benefits of progress. The Toyota Prius is opening the door to an era where the people who want their cars as trouble free as their refrigerators can have them, and we enthusiasts can get more specialized and more highly developed cars in the same stead.

I would not be surprised if, withing ten years, all new midsize family sedans have some sort of either alternative fuel or hybrid drive system as an option.

And, by the way, I'm an Ohioan whose racing background revolves mostly around sprint cars, midgets, and supermodifieds with forays into sports cars, formula 440's, and (once) late model stock cars.

Maybe it's just that I'm an enthusiast with a bit more of a realistic viewpoint than you, because I welcome the idea of not having to compromise enthusiast cars for people without a place in enthusiast cars.

Maybe it's just that I'm an enthusiast with a bit more of a realistic viewpoint than you, because I welcome the idea of not having to compromise enthusiast cars for people without a place in enthusiast cars.


Really, the fact that i care more about performance than anything is unrealistic? The fact that the GTO was built for performance only characteristics is unrealistic, did you know the only thing a consumer can choose when he/she buys the new GTO is the color and auto or manual transmission, i think that's saying "it has 350 HP, what more do you want from it." Other than more HP nothing really. And you must be saying i dont deserve an enthusiast car, what could you possibly no about what i deserve and what i dont. Again trying to figure me out, but you can't. And i think i ten years it may be an option but i doubt all Midsized cars will have alternative fuel cells.

Here ya go Josh, read it, and go complain to GM: http://www.automotriz.net/2001/motoring/gm-hybrid.html


Although, I would think they're bit more realistic about cars, since their living is based-off them, you think?

I'm using GM as an example, as you seem to prefer their products, although most major manufacturers already have programs in place, including high-performance hybrid applications.

What you don't understand is, electric motors are capable of MORE torque-per-engine-size than combustion-based motors ever will. The biggest drawback is that the batteries required to power them to that extent are (currently) SO heavy.

With hybrids, this concern is less of problem. BTW, have you ever heard of a combustion motor smaller than a Honda 4-banger physically generating 1000 ft-lbs of TQ at 0 (yes, ZERO) RPM?

http://www.findarticles.com/cf_dls/m4PRN/2003_Jan_6/96145469/p1/article.jhtml

That link above is for the truck that GM is developing that not only tow and carry just as much as it's combustion-only counterparts, but can also power your tools at a jobsite, and even power your house in a pinch.

Practical in reality, no?

I did see an acticle about a 500HP Civic Hybrid, i can't remember what magazine it was in though.

"That link above is for the truck that GM is developing that not only tow and carry just as much as it's combustion-only counterparts, but can also power your tools at a jobsite, and even power your house in a pinch."

I hope they don't have a bunch of dumbassed little problems with that design, if they don't however, they are the top notch on the truck list for usefulness. Im all over that whenever I'm in the market for a new truck! :)

Ha, The SLP Forums were calling the GTO a Cavaliar with an LS1. Even John Colleti from SVT said "Its a Cavaliar on a Camaro chassis" :lol:


I wonder when SLP gets their hands on the GTO. They mentioned a while back that they were going to release a 400hp GTO. :dunno:


GTO looks nothing like the cavaliar, john colleti is just mad that pontiac made a nice comfortable car with nice hp. Id pick a Cobra over the gto but...the gto is a much nicer car for the passenger.