351 clevland

ive always thought this engine to be a big block,and have always been told it's a big block, but this weekend one of my friends said it was a small block and i asked my moms boyfriend and he also said his dad had a 351 small block....i dont trust my moms boyfriend opinion, ive been told by people i trust there opinions about cars thats its been a big block.......if someone would please clarify this itd be greatly apprecitated

everything smaller than about 450 is considered a smallblock. if you're thinking about buying a Cleaveland, you're making a mistake. they're impossible to find parts for. if you already have one, and it's not built up, sell it and buy a Windsor =D.

as i side note, i rarely see parts for the 351M either

everything smaller than about 450 is considered a smallblock. if you're thinking about buying a Cleaveland, you're making a mistake. they're impossible to find parts for. if you already have one, and it's not built up, sell it and buy a Windsor =D.

as i side note, i rarely see parts for the 351M either


I smeel a noob here. A big noob.


This all depends on your term of big block or small block, this is why they are called the bastard motor. Basicly they are between a small block and a FE. So look at it this way, their not really a small block or a big block, their a Cleveland block. I like the 351Cs good motors, i knew a guy on the internet who had a blown 750hp 351C.

everything smaller than about 450 is considered a smallblock.

So Fords 390, 427, 428, 429, Chevy's 396, 427, Pontiac's 389, 400, 428, and Mopar's 383, 392 hemi, 400, 426 hemi, 426 wedge, and 440's were ALL smallblocks? News to me.

Like rerun said. The block is between tha SBF and a BBF. If memory serves me right, they weigh about 50-75 more than a 351W.

They have problems with oiling in the rear sections of the engine. Actually very easly corrected.

I always thought the 351C was the biggest performer out of the three 351's

I always thought my 351C was a screamer. But then again it was tweaked being a BOSS 351

The 351C stock from Ford is the better motor than a 351W. To modify I would rather have the 351W. Besides lighter, parts are more plentiful and cheaper.

Aftermarket favores the 351W.

Yes, the 351C can put out just as good numbers, but the aftermarket makes the 351W the winner.

Aftermarket favores the 351W.

Yes, the 351C can put out just as good numbers, but the aftermarket makes the 351W the winner.

I knew the aftermarket loved the 351 I was talking about direcly form ford. Correct me if im wrong but don't the 351c and the 351m shar the same block??? Also the 302 and the 351W share the same as well??

351m is the same as the 400 block, not the 351C.

351m is the same as the 400 block, not the 351C. Which is part of the FE family. Oops, its been a while since I have read up on the other Ford Engines.

The 351M and 400 are not FE's, they are a cleveland-based block that uses 429-460 motor mounts and trans bolt pattern. Externally they look similar to a Cleveland, untill you try and bolt one in....

They were smog motors from the mid-late seventies. Neither had more than 8:1 compression from the factory, no 4-bbl carbs. However, Hot Rod did a 2500 dollar 400 buildup and got 380 ponies out of her.....

The Ford 351M and 400 cubic inch V8 engines are members of the Cleveland family, or 335 series family of Ford engines. The 351M was developed in 1975 to replace the 351C for use in large passenger cars.

To develop the 351M, Ford simply shortened the “throw” of the 400’s crankshaft from 4.0 inches to the original 3.5 inches used in the 351C. The larger 3.0 inch journal diameter of the 400 was retained in the 351M. To accommodate the shorter stroke, the compression height of the 400’s pistons had to be enlarged to raise the compression ratio up to 8.0:1. So, other than the crankshaft and pistons, the 351M is exactly the same as the 400. Even the connecting rods interchange. And the 351M/400 block is almost the same as the 351C block, except for the bell housing bolt pattern for use with the 460 C6 tranny.

Long story short a 351C and 351M/400 relationship vs. a 302/351W relationship are the same. They share things but are also different.

351M/400 are a cleveland block wit a larger main journal and different bellhousing pattern. They were both cast in the same forging but then machined differently after.

302 and 351W are different. Same thin wall cast block but the 351W has a taller deck so it is a different forging. Also it is has different main journals and main webbing.

clevelands are basically small blocks with a big block head design. they are stout motors if built right, and yes you can get everything you could want for a 351c, you just have to look in the right places. summit has alot, they just dont list it all. lemme know if you have a 351c you want to get rid of :).

[QUOTE=GTStang]
351M/400 are a cleveland block wit a larger main journal and different bellhousing pattern. They were both cast in the same forging but then machined differently after. [QUOTE]

The 351C and the 351M/400 are entirely seperate castings although you can oversimplify things by saying that the blocks are designed basically the same but the 351M/400 is just a taller decked version with the larger bellhousing pattern.

[QUOTE=SkylineUSA]Like rerun said. The block is between tha SBF and a BBF. If memory serves me right, they weigh about 50-75 more than a 351W.QUOTE]

Since the 351C has an even shorter deck height than a 351W, and the bore and the bore spacing is identical, it can still be called a small block engine. There is nothing "bastard" about it. If anything, the 351M/400 is between a big block and a small block, but because of the parts interchange with the Cleveland I personally consider it a small block.
Just because a Boss 302 had the large Cleveland style heads, you do not try and call that engine a big block, right?

The whole small block/big block thing is really a chevy thing. Since Ford breaks their engines into families, We can say that it is an "FE" , a "335 series" , a "385 series", a "FT" , a "Lima" "90 degree V small block", etc.

Which 351 heads will bolt on to a 302 and add horsepower? I used to know but it has been a long while since I needed the info.

Which 351 heads will bolt on to a 302 and add horsepower? I used to know but it has been a long while since I needed the info.

For the bang for the buck, go with GT-40 heads. They are cheap and plentiful, and take standard intake/exhaust manifolds. Early 351W heads are dinosaurs now, and not worth the effort and money to make them perform. 351C heads will work, but you need different pistons, manifolds, and accessory brackets. Not practical for the average guy, but you can get decent performance out of them if you find all of the parts cheap.
GT-40 heads will support 350+ HP from a 302, and near or over 400 HP from a 351.

351C used to be very popular but they have a few problems. First they can only be bored .030 over, if your lucky. Second they used different heads depending on whether the motor came with a 2bbl carb or a 4bbl carb. The 4bbl heads are rare. Finally they won't fit in the early Mustang which is the most popular Ford to modify. They take up as much room as a "big block" so its basically a Catch-22. You might as well run a 460 if you have room for a 351C. Before their was much aftermarket parts, the 351C was one of the best performance Ford engines because the factory parts were very good. After the 5.0 mustang came out and development $$$ went into the Windsor family it became the superior motor. The 351C was a great motor, but I think its time has passed.

i have a 72 mustang with a 351 clevland, i bought the car with a stock 2bbl carb and switched it out to a 4bbl i switched the manifold but didnt know enough about the car to know that i needed differant heads. does anyone know what happens if you dont change out the heads?

haha,
Australia unlike america ran the 351C for about ten years.You see way more 351C than 351W.And the after market for 351C is bigger and better.the 351C was introduced in 1971(i think) and at the height of its power it ran about 290Kw(cant remember he horsepower).But fell down at the next year when the supercar scare took out highpowered muscle in Ford,Chev and chyrsler thus ending the age of the Ford GT HO.Australia is only now catching up.hopefully a brand spanking new 351c will make its way back into fords in australia, to take on the GENIV.

The 351C as it was known from 1970-1974, has gone the way of the dinosaurs. The ports were huge but inefficient. It takes a Victor Jr or another head in that class to outflow them, but the air/mixture velocity is terrible because of the port size. This is why they only function well on a small block at elevated RPM's. Forget about fuel economy or low emissions.
4V aftermarket intakes are available for the 2V heads, and if you bolt a factory 4V intake onto a 2V engine, you will still see a horsepower boost in spite of the port missmatch.
The basic canted valve design has thrived in Nascar racing with the Roush heads and now Blue Thunder has released a race version of the Cleveland head.

:loser: THE GUYS REPLYING TO YOU SHOULD HAVE TOLD SAID THAT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A 351 BIG BLOCK THERE IS CLE.WINS. AND MOD. ALL SMALL BLOCKS

:loser: THE GUYS REPLYING TO YOU SHOULD HAVE TOLD SAID THAT THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A 351 BIG BLOCK THERE IS CLE.WINS. AND MOD. ALL SMALL BLOCKS

And you should have read the AF rules no bringing back long since dead posts! :loser: