50$ goes to whoever can solve this problem with MPFI

Hey guys...I am offering up 50$ or your choice of miscellaneous crx/civic hatch parts like clear tails, starters, dizzys, a/c, wutever u want....I promise to give this to whoever gives me the answer with solves my problem.

Here it goes. So earlier this month, I swapped a 91 D16A6 into my 88 civic hatch dx. I encountered no problems besides the fact that it wont start. I've checked over the wiring at least 10 times. I've checked for continuity with a multimeter on all the wires I've added like the 4 injectors(brn, red, blue, yellow), the inector resistor box power (yellow/blk), the 4 injector resistance feeds (red/blk), the 2 dizzy wires (blue/yellow, blue/green) at C1 and C2 and the org. and wht. wires i switched to b10 and b12.
The wires were all fine. I soldered and heat shrunk ALL connections. I also checked the resistor box to see if the resistance was still good...yep, 6 ohms to each of the four wires...perfect. I checked for fuel...yep getting fuel. I checked for spark....yep getting spark. I checked for compression...yep fine there. I'm throwing no ecu error codes except an occasional code 20 which is the code for "electronic load sensor". Which means that I have bad grounding somewhere. But i've double and triple checked all that. I checked all the grounds on the valve cover, thermostat, and transmission. I even ground down to the metal with a grinding bit so that there was a perfect connection to the chassis with each ground.
So wut can it be?

I would also like to add that my battery light stays on. That is obviously because my alternator is bad...but it wasn't bad before the swap. Could it have gone bad through the continuous cranking over of the motor without it starting?
My battery keeps going dead when I keep trying to start it because the alternator isn't supplying the return current it needs. But even when I jump start my car to another car, my battery doesn't charge up. When I jump start my car to someone else's, my car just keeps turning over and after about 10 seconds you can smell the presence of fuel as if the cylinders are being flooded and theres no spark(although there is). I also did switch the yellow and green wires on the TPS in case you were wondering.

I've had code 20's in other swaps but I've fixed them before. I'm guessing that this code 20 is the only reason my car won't start. That's the very last thing I can think of.

I'm no newb when it comes to "honda-tuning" but for some reason...I can't get this car started...it baffles me and i'm frustrated because I'm supposed to be an "expert" at this kind of shit. I'm one of the local people that is known for honda swaps but this mpfi conversion has been the toughest one yet...

Please help me...and as i stated above, the person who posts the answer to my starting problems will recieve $50 dollars...on my word.

Here are the only problems I have:
Occasional code 20..........why?

Battery light stays on.........the alternator is bad but that shouldn't keep the car from starting.

Battery won't charge.....even when boosted to another car.

Thanks in advance

Hey guys...I am offering up 50$ or your choice of miscellaneous crx/civic hatch parts like clear tails, starters, dizzys, a/c, wutever u want....I promise to give this to whoever gives me the answer with solves my problem.

Here it goes. So earlier this month, I swapped a 91 D16A6 into my 88 civic hatch dx. I encountered no problems besides the fact that it wont start. I've checked over the wiring at least 10 times. I've checked for continuity with a multimeter on all the wires I've added like the 4 injectors(brn, red, blue, yellow), the inector resistor box power (yellow/blk), the 4 injector resistance feeds (red/blk), the 2 dizzy wires (blue/yellow, blue/green) at C1 and C2 and the org. and wht. wires i switched to b10 and b12.
The wires were all fine. I soldered and heat shrunk ALL connections. I also checked the resistor box to see if the resistance was still good...yep, 6 ohms to each of the four wires...perfect. I checked for fuel...yep getting fuel. I checked for spark....yep getting spark. I checked for compression...yep fine there. I'm throwing no ecu error codes except an occasional code 20 which is the code for "electronic load sensor". Which means that I have bad grounding somewhere. But i've double and triple checked all that. I checked all the grounds on the valve cover, thermostat, and transmission. I even ground down to the metal with a grinding bit so that there was a perfect connection to the chassis with each ground.
So wut can it be?

I would also like to add that my battery light stays on. That is obviously because my alternator is bad...but it wasn't bad before the swap. Could it have gone bad through the continuous cranking over of the motor without it starting?
My battery keeps going dead when I keep trying to start it because the alternator isn't supplying the return current it needs. But even when I jump start my car to another car, my battery doesn't charge up. When I jump start my car to someone else's, my car just keeps turning over and after about 10 seconds you can smell the presence of fuel as if the cylinders are being flooded and theres no spark(although there is). I also did switch the yellow and green wires on the TPS in case you were wondering.

I've had code 20's in other swaps but I've fixed them before. I'm guessing that this code 20 is the only reason my car won't start. That's the very last thing I can think of.

I'm no newb when it comes to "honda-tuning" but for some reason...I can't get this car started...it baffles me and i'm frustrated because I'm supposed to be an "expert" at this kind of shit. I'm one of the local people that is known for honda swaps but this mpfi conversion has been the toughest one yet...

Please help me...and as i stated above, the person who posts the answer to my starting problems will recieve $50 dollars...on my word.

Here are the only problems I have:
Occasional code 20..........why?

Battery light stays on.........the alternator is bad but that shouldn't keep the car from starting.

Battery won't charge.....even when boosted to another car.

Thanks in advance

Have you tried the main relay, i did a ls swap in my 4dr and fuel was going into the fuel rail but the relay wasnt turning the injectors on. I changed the relay and it started right up. As for the battery i would say that the alternator is going bad or the belt is loose or something.

If your getting fuel the main relay is most likely still good, but I would also still check it.

Have you looked @ a manual for code 20?
http://www.binghamtonlife.com/manual/2gsm/images/91-11-68.jpg
http://www.binghamtonlife.com/manual/2gsm/images/91-11-69.jpg
http://www.binghamtonlife.com/manual/2gsm/images/91-11-70.jpg

Also the whole manual will be of help - electrical & fuel and emmisions. http://www.binghamtonlife.com/manual/2gsm/default.htm

If the alternator is bad, replace it. Test it & the battery. Replace if needed. You can only fix one thing at a time, start with the obvious & easiest.

Maybe a bad ground somwhere else on the car? maybe the alternators conections are backwards? that happend in my zc swap somehow and it fried the alternator and wouldnt start.

Charge up your battery, then wait 10-15 min. then try this...

Put a (Big) Ammeter on the batter gound wire, and put a analog voltmeter on the battery.

If your amps go really high (150ish), and volts hover around normal (10V) low you have a mechanical resistance. (not likely)

If your volts go low (under 8 volts), and amps stay normal (100ish), you have a dead battery, replace it, it is gone.(possable)

Okay if your still getting good voltage, watch the ecu as you turn it on, it should blink once. Then crank and watch for codes.

If none, You can also get a code 20 when a wire shorts out to ground that is not supposed to. My guess is that one of your wires has contacted ground for whatever reason. You may only get a code 20 when the ECU checks this sensor or aplies an output to this device. (I had a similar once, I accidentally hooked injectors up to wrong pin in connector).

-Dustin

its the dam altanator

Main Relay is about the only thing that is popping into my head...you've got spark, you've got fuel,...hmmm..."air" is the combustion components getting air? Cause we all know that even though we have fuel and spark...you need air to burn!
Other than that...ummm...starter? :screwy:

Jason

I'm by no means a mechanic but, my gut feeling is telling me that you may have a lack of compression. This could be caused by a broken timing belt or misadjusted timing.

Hope this helps. It's worth a check. Troy

[email protected]

the code 20 isnt anything to really worry about, i've had it in my car for like 6 or 7 months now tryin 2 fix it and cant figure it out, car runs fine tho, i suggest replacing the battery and alternator,
to be 100% sure, take the battery and alternator to a local parts store and get them to check it, should be a free service, they will do a bench test on your alt to see if it works, and they will do a load test on your battery

also, is it cold where ur located?? pop off the caps on the battery and see if she froze on you... if so, replace it, rarely they work when un-thawed, i've seen a couple at work and those are newer batteries but usually when u have an old one, once it freezes its done for, so check that. a reason for it freezing is that it could have lost its charge a bit then they freeze,
also if u had it sitting on a concrete floor that could make ur battery screw up too,

hope this helps bro

Did you use the proper injectors and intake manifold(88-91 si/ex)or ecu? Is you resistor box good? One of these could be your problem.

yeah if your intake maifold is a 92-95 then you dont use the resistor box.

it was the 91 Si engine he put into his hatch. So he is not using the intake manifold from a 92-95.

yeah if your intake maifold is a 92-95 then you dont use the resistor box.

FALSE!!!!


Hit me up on AIM ("krustindumm")and I'll try to talk u through the problem, I've had soo many I am fairly good at diagnosis.

Your alternator is not spinning fast enough to charge the battery at cranking speeds.

Run a compression test and post the results.

yea, we got his alternator tested and it was pretty damn bad lol

FALSE!!!!


Hit me up on AIM ("krustindumm")and I'll try to talk u through the problem, I've had soo many I am fairly good at diagnosis.

Your alternator is not spinning fast enough to charge the battery at cranking speeds.

Run a compression test and post the results.

if you goning to say flase then explain your self this subject is really pissing me off. one person says you dont need the resistor box one says you do. wtf is it already????

It is the injectors not the manifold. You can run OBD0 injectors on an OBD1 mani and you still need the resistor box. If you run OBD1 injectors on an OBD0 mani you don't need the resistor box.

Low Impedance injectors (OBD0 Honda's) need the resistor box.
High Impedance injectors (OBD1+ Honda's) do not need the resistor box.

-Dustin

my guess is that you damaged teh alternator in swapping ther engine. i damaged mine when i change the head gasket and some other things. i just went to a junk yard and goy a used alternator for 75 bucks and it worked fine. that would be why you don't have spark sometimes and it could also be the fact that you dont haver the alternator set properly. just a thought that could work. hope it works out for you.

why would you go to a junk yard and pay 75 bucks for a use alternator?

anyways i will be running a obd1 manifold with obd1 injectors. so there no resistor box. final.

Ok guys....here's a little update....my car's still not running.
I got some "expert" on 4th gen's coming over tomorrow night. He "guarantees" he can fix my car for $100 in less than 2 hrs. He owns a crx with an ls engine, full integra brake conversion at all four corners, and a junkyard turbo setup which he did all of this himself. He's supposed to be good with crx/civic swaps...he's even putting Masta's (Ray's) D16Y8 in for him sometime this week. He said if he doesn't get it fixed, he won't charge me anything either. So, I'm hoping that he'll get it fixed.

Here's my problems:
My car still has a code 20.
My battery light still stays on.
My battery wouldn't charge even when boosted to another vehicle.
I went out and bought an oversized 800 amp battery that was $80. I shoulda just bought the optima for 140 but ohhh well. Anyways, here's my thoughts: I think it may have something to do with the injectors like they may be stuck open or they may be "fried"...is that possible?

My resistor box is fine...I checked it...the resistance is 5.9 which is fine because it is a 6 ohm resistor.
My battery light stays on when I turn the car over and im guessing it's the alternator but I don't know how that could've went bad because it was fine b4 I put it in the car and it was fine in the car. All of a sudden the battery light came on when I was trying to turn it over and it hasn't gone off since. Also the battery doesn't charge when the car is boosted to another vehicle...the battery continues to stay dead.

I have one more question. I went to the junkyard to get an extra plug for the 4 extra wires....the 2 injector wires and the 2 distributor wires. I put the injector wires and the dizzy wires on the same connector and I also didn't shield the distributor wires like most people said I shouldv'e. So....is it possible that by not shielding the dizzy wires....that could give me a code 20 or possibly mess up my injectors or cause my car not to start?

YES it can matter. i had my ZC wires from the distributor backwards and unshielded and i was throwing all kinds of codes from cam sensor to ecu. You should shield them. If thats not the problem its stil a good idea.

Yeah, you ran low voltage sensative signal wires (and they're square wave signals :nono:) next to higher voltage pulsed wires, that is going to cause problems.

I'll try my hand at this mistery $50 problem. No checks please.

Code 20 is probably just that the inside wire on the 3 pin connector located in the engine compartment fuse box has a crack or is loosely connected. Mine had the side of the connector pop off and it would only allow me to turn it over for about a half of a second before it would pop a light and the injectors would shut off.

The resistor box is not dependant of the intake. It depends on the injectors being used. OBD1 injectors do not use it but OBD0 injectors do. OBD0 used point and hold injectors and OBD1 used saturation type injectors.

If you know that the alternator is bad then replace it before you burn a cell in the battery trying to jump and already charged battery. If the battery is not currently holding a carge in a known good vehicle then scrap it too. It's one less headache for later.

I hope that this helps a little. Hit me up and let me know how it goes.

you know I'm willing to bet .. oh lets say $50, that he got it running ABOUT A YEAR AGO!

Three things you gotta have for it to run: properly-timed spark, fuel, and compression.
You've got spark, you've got fuel. That leaves compression (and the possibility that the timing isn't right...improperly installed timing belt?).
Good luck.
Flunky

rofl, lots of ppl bring up old threads to keep em kickin

give me money first than i'll tell you the meaning of life

Thanks ice, I love the hub caps