how can this be?

I was hanging with my friend that’s a girl (she's a Christian (Lutheran to be exact), which doesn't mater right at the moment but will in a second) last night and we were playing cards and talking like we have done almost every Sunday night for the last 6 months or so and we were blabbing about this and that and so I told her that I almost finished my newest book ("anger" by Thich Nhat Hanh, he's a Buddhist monk) and I was telling her about it and all his ideas and how they were really practical to everyday life

Then I mentioned meditation and how I'm really beginning to enjoy it and I was telling her that I had told one of my other friends (a Baptist, I think I spelled that right?) about how I started meditating and how she (the Baptist) started freaking out on me saying that it was wrong and the only reason I was doing it was because that was the only way I was going to get in contact with anything divine (I guess because I'm to much of a sinning a-hole to "find" anything divine the "correct" way) so my Lutheran friend starts telling me that this is understand able and then relates meditation to prayer in Christianity (which is kind of true but not really)

So then I mention how I think that monks (of all kinds) understand things really well and that they have really good advise, at which point the conversation got kind of creepy, she started saying that SOME (most likely implying Buddhists) "had it wrong" and then went on to bash the idea on reincarnation and a few other things. seeing that it was making her upset I stopped talking about it and decided to go home but, it was kind of upsetting that someone who I thought was open minded would be so rude toward another belief system. (as a side note I respect her religious beliefs and have never argued against them even thought I don't particularly care for them)

What I'm trying to get at is why is it that we yell about the need for world peace, yet then turn right back around and separate beliefs in to "good" and "bad" "right" and "wrong". beliefs are exactly that beliefs they are neither right or wrong good or bad they just are. and by thinking that "MY belief is right" and "YOUR belief is wrong" is harmful to both parties and does nothing but spread us farther apart than bring us together.

The only wrong views are those that separate us or cause people harm. right views are those that bring us together, because under our skin color eye color, etc. we are all human beings and by thinking that we are "better" or more "right" than another person will continue to cause pain and hatred and we will never reach peace through hatred. so love your friends and your enemies the same, even if someone believes differently than you it doesn't mean they are wrong it means they are different and you should respect the beliefs that make a person happy not that ones that would make you happy for them to believe. think about it. -Justin

That's why I try to be friends with agnostics or atheists...extremely religious people can be great, but they tend to close their minds and don't try to even see things any other way. Most (true) atheists question everything and try anything...Then they become atheist after exhausting all the religions...

Meditation is something I do practice...it helps me focus on weight lifting and helps me do nearly everything in life more effectively. To me, it isn't a religion and doesn't have any religious conatations (sp?)...it's just a way to help the mind keep in touch with the body...just like reinstalling drivers on windows...so it can keep in touch better with all the peripherals i have installed...we too suffer from poor programming and bad evolution...

To some folk, all that they have is their faith.

I can understand your bewilderment but religions are bit like some of my old girlfriends - they are jealous things and they don't appreciate being compared to other ones especially any bits that seem better.

In some respects, at least you know where the person stands - I have friends that believe in things that I don't, have views that I do not share and values that are different from mine. One of the reasons for the enduring nature of our friendships despite the logistics, gaps in geography, life changes and differences in situation is that we are prepared to understand that we are different people.

To have religion is to have faith. And I confess that in some respects that I envy those who have faith - it implies a belief in something that isn't tangible, hope that something better will reward them for their obedience and worship and that someone is watching over them.

I don't have faith, much less hope that I will be rewarded or that someone is watching over me. Although I have a life less ordinary each step toward my goal is hard won and a grind. I have and will experience and see things that most of you will not ever come close to but it can't shake that for all the wondrous moments that I have lost my faith too long ago for it to return.

Give them folk their faith because it's better that they have faith/hope because the alternative is to lose it and once it's gone it can take more than a lifetime to be restored...

it is very true what you say replicant faith is an important thing. In buddhism we accept that all things are impermenant and through that are able to overcome negative emotions that are associated with death, betrail, rejection. I think it's wonderful that people have a faith in something whatever that faith is. faith doesn't have to be believing that you are going to heaven or hell, becoming one with "God" who ever or whatever you belive it is or is not. faith doesn't even have to be religious faith it can just be faith in yourself, faith that you are the best person you can be for yourself your loved ones, and your community. By doing things that help you and those around you you can recreate a faith that you think you may have lost and find infact that that faith was not lost it is always there it's just that it has been overlooked because something else has been put in it's place. I hope that you are able to restore your faith in yourself if nothing else because in doing so you strengthen the faith in other people no mater what that faith is personal, religious or otherwise. have a good day. -Justin

Some religious people will preach to you their beliefs until they're blue in the face. I'm catholic and agree and disagree with beliefs in the church. I, however, am open to allow people to believe what they want as long as they don't go off the deep end and b/c crazy in their beliefs and try to push it on me. All my life i've gone to church sometimes forced on occasions I didn't want to go. I currently don't go to church except on the important days. Not b/c im against going, i just feel i can still believe/love God without attending church. I will defend my religion to the death if I have to as well.

Now there were kids in my high school that looked down and talked mess about my group of friends and others b/c we drank. Come to find out, a few were having sex and now drink/smoke pot. After finding this out it pissed me off quite a bit b/c they were contradicting all they were saying about us. Just don't read too much into it man. The religious extremists can be a bit on the wierd side. At least by my experiences.

Yeah I know what your saying I tried not to read in to it all that much. I was just really freaked out that she got all deffensive when I brought up the book. It had little to do with anything and all I was doing was keeping the conversaion flow going. I in no way was trying to change her beliefs or way of thinking because for one that wrong, and for two I'm glad she has a faith that she enjoys I was just telling her about something I had read and didn't really expect to catch as much crap as I did because of it. I also agree that you should "practice what you preach" so to speak and if you disagree with something be they views practices or otherwise then my advise is don't follow them. as you said it's not necessary for you to go to church everytime in order to love or believe in God. in Buddhism buddha himself said that if you ever found, through your own experience, that what he said was not the case you didn't have to follow it. in other words he made "educated suggestions" and you are to try them out for yourself and not simply follow them because he said them. basically they were a guide but were not rules and for me that works ;-) -Justin

People can believe what they want, Catholics (my religion) are notorious for trying to force thier views on everydoby- makes me sick, hence why I dno't go to church

People can believe what they want, Catholics (my religion) are notorious for trying to force thier views on everydoby- makes me sick, hence why I dno't go to church
ding ding ding, you hit the nail on the head. i've seen the way people look at me at church b/c i have an earring and im just waiting for someone to comment on it and i will go off on them. no wonder catholics seem to be so hated by so many.

People can believe what they want, Catholics (my religion) are notorious for trying to force thier views on everydoby- makes me sick, hence why I dno't go to church
It's not only the Catholic church Jim, the church I attended in SA was the same, they could give you a thousand reasons what was wrong with everyone else and what was right with them.

they could give you a thousand reasons what was wrong with everyone else and what was right with them. see this is what I was talking about in the very begining. I understand that everyone interpretes things differently, and thats cool. Life would be boring as hell if everyone thought the exact same way. and in trying to change the way a person views something you cause them un needed stresses. I love that there is diversity, it's great that people think independantly and that we all think a little bit different from the people around us. it's only when we get the additude that we are right and everyone (or even just some) peoples views are wrong we ourselves are wrong. all views are great in thier own way and when we realize that we will be able to put our efforts to things that really matter like world peace, solving racism, etc. Peace -Justin

Well said firebird and everyone, I am glad everyone has their own view. I actually join many different views to make up a sort of religion for me, so I won't go into detail what I believe because I can't just put a name on it, but I just wanted to say well said Firebird! And I hate it when people judge someone by their religion.

-Justin