Military surplus sand tracks

Hey, I found something that I thought you guys might find interesting. I've been searching for "sand tracks" for awhile, and the closest I've found are absurdly expensive ones from Britain, or "waffles" - also absurdly expensive. I just found a military surplus place that sells them (used) in several different sizes (from 16"x5' to 20"x11'11") starting at ~$17. http://www.whiteowl.com/equipment.html (Landing mats)

They've got some pretty cool trucks for sale also :D

what are you going to use those for? :(

Not sure yet, I haven't gotten myself stuck :) I'd like to carry them for extreme muddy conditions, or if they're string enough, I could use them as bridging ladders to go across ruts that I couldn't otherwise cross. In theory, they're for sand, but not sand near Missouri.

I like those.....when we get snow around here, it is usually near the 32 degree mark, which means it quickly melts and re-freezes when cars drive over it. Those could be great for getting out of slick icy conditions (as well as the sand and mud).....too bad they look pretty rusted. No wonder they're so cheap.

I think I could have used some of those last Saturday. I was on a narrow snow covered trail, my ass end started sliding off the edge towards a cold-looking pond. At least if I had those ramps I could have smacked myself on the head with them for getting in that position in the first place. :D

I'm sure they have less rusted ones. ;)

But I'm not sure how much weight they can support, maybe a couple hundred pounds but not an Xterra.

Maybe some reinforcements welded on?

They aren't made to suspend, like a bridge, just give the X traction. I saw them used in Kenya a couple times with Rover 110's.

Thanx for the link. I've been looking for those for the past month. I was looking into going through a steel shop to order the pieces. unfortunately they want about $195 for (2) 1'X5' pieces of stainless steel
open grating, and of course truck freight was like $85.
I'm going to probably weld up some 1x1 box steel tubing and make them into Bridging ladders. They are quite useful. As far as Land Rover, The Sand ladders are a mere $229, with an $89 mounting kit, and the Bridging ladders were $429, $89 mounting kit..
I think I'll buy these and have them sand blasted and powder coated for 1/4 the price of the Land rover ones..
Thanx again. You saved me a lot of searching..
L8r
Ken

The 12" landing mat looks like it might be usable as a bridge. It's double-wall steel, 145 lbs. each. That's a lot to lug around though.

Brent

Well, I just called the guy and ordered 2 5' sections. In the pictures, i thought the 10' looked like stronger construction than the 5', but he said the 5' is just the 10' cut in half. I think I might steal Salsa's idea about welding on supports for bridging use, that would work well I think. He said that they are all new, never been used, but they have been stored outside. Structurally, they are in good condition, but they have some surface rust. Now if I can just find enough Rust-Oleum...

Just goto your local speed shop and get some POR-15. Then paint right over the rust. That stuff kicks major ass!! I've used it on rusted frames. The only thing that you should do before brushing or spraying it on is maybe wire brush the piece just to get the loose stuff off, so the paint has something to bite onto.
How much was shipping? Did you have to have it sent via truck freight or will UPS suffice?
I'll be ordering my pieces this week. I'd appreciate any info about shipping. Im in NY. Thanx
L8r
Ken

If they do just have surface rust, then I'm very interested. When I see rust and no one has any experience with the seller or the product, I just assume the worst. Be sure to toss up pics once you get them.....

No way am I wasting POR-15 on those things, that stuff's expensive! They're just going to get beat to shit anyway, so I'll just use some cheap paint to keep the rust from growing on them. Not sure on shipping, but he said he should be able to get them out UPS. He won't know the $$ until UPS takes it. He said he's never had anyone order "just two", so he usually ships a ton of them truck freight. I'll definately post when I get them.

Received today. These things are REALLY DAMN HEAVY!! Haven't gotten 'em unwrapped yet, but I can tell the steel is quite thick (a little more than 1/8" I believe) and they do not flex at all. More to follow with pictures.

Great, glad to hear that they are about 1/8" thick. I'll do the calcs tomorrow at my office to find out how much of a point load they can take. If they are pretty strong to begin with, then 1x1 box tubing the entire length will be More than needed to make them into bridging ladders. Depending on calcs, I might use steel angles to reinforce them in lieu of the 1x1's. The steel angles will take up less space making them a little easier to store. I'm just thinking out loud again. Doh!

How much was shipping? Grand total for (2) five footers?
How long did it take?

Thanx Chris, I greatly appreciate it.
L8r
Ken
01SalsaX

Originally posted by O1SalsaX
Depending on calcs, I might use steel angles to reinforce them in lieu of the 1x1's. The steel angles will take up less space making them a little easier to store

Good Idea!

I've been thinking of ways to store them, that would help.
How thick would the steel angles have to be though. You want some safety margin so they dont collapse just as you're crossing a gap.
(I'm thinking of how will they would work across the Golden Crack, hopefully with more ease than this guy (http://www.4x4trails.net/videos/video_goldencrack01.html).)

The total charged to my credit card was $60.70. I was also thinkin about using angle iron instead of square tube. I would guess (and I'm just guessing here) that 2" x 3/16" would be good. The weight would be a major issue. I was planning on putting them on the roof, but once you weld on some reinforcements, that would be extremely heavy. Even storing them in the truck, they would be difficult to handle. I wouldn't want to imagine what they'd weigh if they had 1.5 or 2" square tubing welded on... I didn't get a chance to get into them last night, but I will tonight and post pics.

OK. I started doing the calcs for the bracing. This is the start of it.. The finished dimensions of my bridging ladders will be (+/-) 12" wide by 48" long. The reason for these dimensions are.. Weight (key factor), the widest tire people are running are 11.5s. My tires are 31X10.5s, and I want to put then on my safari rack (i.e land rover). I know that the rover bridging ladders are 5' long BUT they are only 12" wide including 1"x1" box tubing, Theirs are also Aluminum!! I dont trust Alum. when it comes to bridging a 4000+ lb. truck.
The 4' length allows you a higher point load before failure (i.e. smaller unbraced length). So, by adding small steel angles to the entire length it'll do the trick.
Next comes the fun part, Sizing the actual Angles..I'll post it later, if I figure it out, otherwise I'll oversize it and avoid the calcs and the headache.
Any Engineers here?! Not the ones who operate trains. :D

$60 is a hell of a lot better than $429. I'll suffer with the added weight. No biggie. As far as mounting them to the rack, thats a different animal. I have a little idea I'm toying around with on my X. Hopefully I can cut that stuff with minimal effort.

L8r
Ken
01SalsaX

Ok, I finally ripped them open and played. Photos are in my HXOC photo album (http://photos.hxoc.net/view_album.php?set_albumName=sandtracks) (click photos for larger versions). They seem to be pretty sturdy. The weight is not as bad as I thought when you pick them up individually, but still substantial. The surface rust is fairly thorough, but a wire wheel removes it quickly, and the steel seems to be in good shape. They seem to be 1/8" steel sheet that was stamped or pressed into shape. They have two "channels" down the middle (for strength I'm assuming), and all the holes you see are actually pressed through and stick up about 5/8" on the other side. Between the circles and the channels, it will be difficult to attach angle iron and nearly impossible to attach square tubing. They have "hooks" along the sides that seem to be to attach multiple tracks together. They snag on everything, and I would recommend removing them. I will be doing this soon (I'll be getting a cutting torch Dec 25, imagine that...). The only way I can see to strengthen them is to attach angle iron with the "V" over the existing channel. That would limit you to 1.5" or 2" angle iron at the most, it would need to be thick (3/16"). They WILL need the reinforcement to use for bridging. I put one end of one on jack stands, and started to drive up (RTI ramp?). It bent. Luckily, it bent back after driving over it on flat concrete. I think the length is just about right after seeing them in scale with my tires. The width will be about right after torching off the tabs on the sides. I'll post more after I find some lengthy (and beefy) angle iron. I took photos of most aspects of this writeup, check out the album referenced above.

*Edit: UBB code works better than HTML for posting links :)

Thanx chris. I did a little research on sizing the Angles and finding out what kind of point load or impact load these can take, and by my estimates it is not much at all. As far as bracing.. I think a C-channel is a better idea than an angel or a piece of box tubing, But Im more concerned about weight, So. My conclusion is as follows.. I think I'll be using my Ladders as Sand ladders and I wont even attempt using them for bridging ladders, unless I have a brick or something to put in the middle of the span. I will hopefully use a Plasma cutter, or torch to cut them, if I can't get access to either, then I'll try an Air Whiz wheel, or sawzall, ugh. In light of this new info from Chris, I'll be Definitely trimming them down to 4' by 1' just so they're easier to use, mount, store and of course finish. Maybe ths guy can cut them for me so I can save some money of shipping. Hmmmmm.
Now I understand why the Land Rover bridging ladders are aluminum, and $429. Aluminum has a strength to weight ratio 7 times better than steel. So the rover ones weigh nothing but can still support a heavy truck over a 5 foot gap. Interesting..
Screw Im sticking with steel. :D

Originally posted by Chris_McCracken
They have "hooks" along the sides that seem to be to attach multiple tracks together. They snag on everything, and I would recommend removing them [/B]

The hooks may be there to "snag on everything". It looks like the hooks angle down, which could help them get some traction in the sand/mud/whatever. I'm guessing, but taking them off might increase the risk of them spitting out the back when you're trying to "de-stuck" yourself.

The hooks are there because they weren't originally used as sand tracks.

When you connect 10,000 of them together in a clear area you get an impromptu air strip. Back in the day when you didn't need a 6ft thick runway to land you could bring down fighters, and bombers on those tracks.
Since the USAF doesn't use anything like that anymore they stack these in piles to rust. Why do you think their so cheap?

Find a book about WWII and look at the pictures of fighters landing on Pacific Islands and if its at a forward base you'll likely see one of these quick-fab runways.

You could always get one of those big millitary trailers to haul them on or just take them and drop them off at your camp site in case you need them send some one back to get them that kinda sounds like a dumb idea tho. Do you think you could make a rack mount and would they be to heavy to be throwing up on the rack.

You might check the following web site for ideas on building your own bridging ladders.

Bridging ladder (http://www.worldoffroad.com/eqpt/nowinch.asp)

I also saw a site that had aluminum landing mats recently but I can't remember where it was.