F1 Owner on board

Wow. It gives me chills every time I see pics of this car.

Anyways, Peloton, if you're right, that is a strange place to put them... Why not someplace more visible to the driver?

Does the McLaren F1 (still) hold the highest top speed ever acheived (not estimated) of any street legal production car? I remember having a video clip of the actual world record run, and I recalled it hit 243mph, which is 391kph. Am I accurate with these figures? If not how fast did it go and where can I see legitimate information regarding this world record run?

It translates to 243, but that wasn't the actual speed. I think the wind had something to do with it.

391kph divided by 1.6093 equals 242.96mph. That is what it equals, but i remember reading somewhere that the official speed was 241.14mph

It translates to 243, but that wasn't the actual speed. I think the wind had something to do with it.Sorry, but please explain what you mean. I'm not sure what you mean by "it".

391kph divided by 1.6093 equals 242.96mph. That is what it equals, but i remember reading somewhere that the official speed was 241.14mphI believe that I recalled the 391kph (and/or the 243mph) speed from the guy reading off the speed in the video clip of the actual world record run. Does anyone still have this clip to listen to what speed was actually reached? Also, I'm not sure if the speed was being read off of the McLaren's speedometer or a more accurate measurement was taken. I do not remember hearing tenths or hundredths in the announcer's comments, so that implies that a less accurate measurement was taken.

Hopefully someone here can bring forth some legitimate facts on the highest speed actually recorded! :)

i always thought it was 241.14mph

the vid is at the bottom here:
http://www.mclarencars.com/content/sections/mainfr/gall.htm

"the car reached a phenomenal 240.1mph/386.7kmh smashing the previous record of 212mph held by a Jaguar XJ220"
http://www.mclarencars.com/content/sections/mainfr/comp.htm

This article says 240.1 mph: Is that the official record?

http://www.autoweek.com/search/search_display.mv?content_code=04727933
"For almost a decade, chassis No. 65 (McLaren has a strange numbering system) has been window dressing in McLaren’s flagship showroom on London’s Park Lane. Millions of tourists gawked at the silver dream machine as their open-top buses pulled up outside. But in late 2003, McLaren replaced chassis No. 65 with XP5—the record-breaking version that achieved 240.1 mph on March 31, 1998."

Found the article from another AF thread:
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=187842

we must have posted at the same time, read above

i always thought it was 241.14mph

the vid is at the bottom here:
http://www.mclarencars.com/content/sections/mainfr/gall.htm
Thanks. That is the video I was speaking about. My memory served me correct. In the video, of the record run that you posted, the announcer clearly states, "391":

"... 389... 390... 390. 391... 391... it will not go anymore than 391."

That means 391kph which equals almost 243mph (242.956mph). Now... is that an official measurement?

It is 240.14, thats what it says in D.A. and in guiness world records and on the mclaren website...

I thought that the wind had carried the car to a slightly higher speed but I think they factored out the winds effect and it was 240.14.

It is 240.14, thats what it says in D.A. and in guiness world records and on the mclaren website...

I thought that the wind had carried the car to a slightly higher speed but I think they factored out the winds effect and it was 240.14.So Are we both talking about the same run?

Here is what you are talking about:
http://www.mclaren.com/features/2000/circuitbreaker.html
"In the past 12 months, a sustained onslaught by the McLaren F1 has sent records tumbling like dominoes all over Europe. As reported in Racing Line last year, the car set a new speed record for a production roadcar of 240.14mph on the 9km straight at Volkswagen's Wolfsburg test track in Germany. It also smashed the lap record at MIRA's Nuneaton circuit, raising it from the 161mph set by a Jaguar XJ13 back in 1967 to 168mph. This most recent attempt on the Millbrook record, which British readers might have seen on Top Gear last month, was intended to complete the hat-trick and prove beyond any doubt that the McLaren F1 is the world's fastest production roadcar."

For any speed record, Guiness require 2 timed runs in opposite directions within an hour that are then averaged to take into account variations in slope and wind direction. The speed read off by Andy Wallace is the actual velocity of the vehicle at that time (probably off the timing gear - read the speedo at 4 miles a minute anyone?) of 391 kph which is 244 mph. When combined with the highest velocity in the other direction (about the 236 mph mark) you get an average velocity of 240 mph.

Next... ;)

Hi people,

I came to work early this morning and when I was checking the email I found a message from my brother with a link to this thread... I just could not stop reading this! 'Grats to both lucky McLaren F1 owners here! And about the fact that Enzo is bad looking and furthermore - not fast enough to match F1 - here are the links with road test scan.

http://speed.supercars.net/Pic?s=14&dir=2003-4-2&p=a&f=691&t=42776&m=424103

http://speed.supercars.net/Pic?s=14&dir=2003-4-2&p=b&f=691&t=42776&m=424103

http://speed.supercars.net/Pic?s=14&dir=2003-4-2&p=a&f=691&t=42776&m=424106

http://speed.supercars.net/Pic?s=14&dir=2003-4-2&p=b&f=691&t=42776&m=424106

For any speed record, Guiness require 2 timed runs in opposite directions within an hour that are then averaged to take into account variations in slope and wind direction. The speed read off by Andy Wallace is the actual velocity of the vehicle at that time (probably off the timing gear - read the speedo at 4 miles a minute anyone?) of 391 kph which is 244 mph. When combined with the highest velocity in the other direction (about the 236 mph mark) you get an average velocity of 240 mph.

Next... ;)As for conversion, 391kph is 242.956136... mph, not 244mph:
http://www.google.com/search?q=391+kph+in+mph

As far as I know, Google is correct in that the conversion is exactly 1mph = 1.609344kph, and I mean EXACTLY. There are no more digits after the last '4':
http://www.google.com/search?q=1+mph+in+kph

Let me know if I am wrong on this. My TI-85 calculator uses this precise scale factor as well. The other way around is not as accurate, as it involves the inverse of the scale factor which results in a number that repeats forever. I.e.:
http://www.google.com/search?q=1+kph+in+mph

Of course, all this accuracy is unnecessary if the measurement of 391kph was not accurate. But, anyways...

...

So, was that 391kph run one of the two runs that you are speaking about for the Guiness record, or are you just guessing at this? Sorry, but I could not tell from your post, but your inaccuracies in measurements imply you were just guessing at the numbers.

...

As for my own car, this is how fast it goes:

http://www.google.com/search?q=speed+of+sound+in+kph
http://www.google.com/search?q=speed+of+sound+in+mph

:)

The exact figures are not important in my above post but the facts are. My mistake in conversion stems from using a conversion factor of 1.6009 rather than 1.609.
I am saying that the 391 kph is an accurate figure of the velocity XP5 attained in one direction but this is the maximum velocity achieved rather than the official Guiness maximum velocity. This second figure (that we all know as 240.1mph or there abouts) is the important one, although one could argue that technically XP5 has travelled 2.82 mph faster...

I understand what you are saying. I was only unclear about if the 391kph run was one of the two necessary runs to obtain the official 240.14mph record. Was it?

Yes.

Thanks!

Hi guys, i found this on a BMW related page.
It may helps...... :)

"Fastest car in the world

In April 1998, McLaren took its 5-year old F1 to Germany's Ehra-Leissen test track. After two runs, race car driver Andy Wallace took the BMW V12 engines' rev to 7800 rpm. A two-way run was performed to eliminate the effect of wind and the average speed was calculated to be 240.1 mph (386.7 kph). A new world record was set !

Test car was identical to production F1, with the same side mirrors, same tires, same suspensions setting, only the 7500 rpm rev limiter was disabled."

Well there you have it. It says that the speed was an average. That means that it was not obtained by using the 391kph to mph conversion.

does it really matter THAT much? 240? 241?

Averaging has to do with results.
Conversion has to do with units.
You can obtain an average and still do a conversion to a different set of units. Depending on the precision of the conversion factor used, you can get differences in results.

And yes, the precision matters. The most informed and most accurate post is Mr. Bernoulli's.

There seems to be more to the story than Mr. Bernoulli's post. One would not calculate a 240.14mph average speed so accurately by reading 391kph off of a speedometer. I would assume the measurement would have to be calculated with an instrument not found in the McLaren F1 itself. Is this right? It doesn't seem right to depend on the accuracy of the car's instruments, even if it is the McLaren F1 we are talking about. Besides, how can you be accurate to one hundredth of a mph by reading off of the McLaren F1's speedometer? It's impossible.

mini magin, it does matter that much. There is talk of the Koenigsegg CC acheiving 242mph in the Gumball 3000 Rally. (Go to http://www.gumball3000.com/new/content.htm, click "about", and click "2003".) If just any measurement is accepted, than the McLaren F1 has already been defeated.

The F1 has a very accurate speedometer but this is irrelevant.
Guiness obviously require an external, accurate and calibrated measuring system such as that produced by Datron which is what I think was used. A digital readout displaying velocity was placed on the dashboard in the line of sight of Andy Wallace as stated in DA (and can be seen in the video of the 391kph run found here: http://www.mclarencars.com/content/sections/mainfr/gall.htm ) Such equipment is usually accurate (in such an application) to at least 5 decimal places, more than enough for Guiness at least, although would only probably display whole numbers to the driver. These devices are capable of logging all the information required which can then be reviewed on a laptop or similar.

If you had read my first post more closely you would have seen that I discounted reading the speedo in favour of timing gear already...

Thanks for the info! :)

BTW, I did read your first post quite clearly, but didn't understand that particular sentence about the speed being read "off the timing gear":

"The speed read off by Andy Wallace is the actual velocity of the vehicle at that time (probably off the timing gear - read the speedo at 4 miles a minute anyone?) of 391 kph which is 244 mph."

But now I know what you mean. Thanks. And you can see some additional gear inside the McLaren F1 in that video. I wasn't aware that they set it up so that the driver can see the recorded speed from the outside measurements.

I like the quote at the end of that video:

"I still say this is the best car ever built, ever, and probably will never be beated."

i am aware of the koenigsegg's story, and aparently there is a video but there are a few things that annoy me:

1. 242 on the streets is just idiotic. period

2. How are we to know how accurate the speedo is?

3. Kinda risky considering if the vid got out it could be used against him as evidence he was breaking the law

4. The car had a lot of problems during the rally, i'm not convinced it would have accheived that speed anyway.

All my opinion. Think what you want

mini magic, those are valid opinions. But I was just making a point that accuracy of measurement is important. (I do not believe the Koenigsegg CC rumor.) You just made that exact same point.

I would love to see the video if it exists.

Thats true and a good point, i just dont see why a whole page in a thread that was made by an owner of an F1 should be devoted to it.

Cheers

I just wanted to know. I like to know details. It's just the way I am! :)

In the future you could try starting another thread of your own, rather than dragging a current one far off topic. ;)

>8^)
ER

In hindsight, I would have started a new thread. However, it was on topic because there were discussions in this thread about other cars coming close to beating the McLaren F1, but never accomplishing it. After some personal discussion with one of my friends, we wanted to see the official details. Besides, the point of this thread almost is that the McLaren F1 is the best supercar ever.

ok. Its over.

This newcomer would also like to add his thanks to the owners for being so gracious with their time and knowledge. It is a very interesting (long) thread. I'm sure that all would agree that if McLaren had continued development on the chassis and BMW were allowed to tweak the engine to the latest specs that the McLaren would remain head and shoulders above the competition. It's timeless styling and normally aspirated engine leave the other exotics far behind and wheezing to keep pace with the only true Supercar. The owners are truly very fortunate individuals and their generosity is greatly appreciated.

Hello Mr Selldorff!
I read some very interesting things on this forum, thanks for sharing your experience!
I'm a modeller and I'm working on a diecast: it's a McLaren F1 in the scale of 1/12 from Minichamps and I started to modify it in the LM version. Your pics on turnermotorsports are really great for me in addition with the book "Driving ambition". I still need something very important: it's hard to find the right colour and I'm looking for the colour code to match the exact colour. Do you have a code for the orange? It would be so great to find it, because the colour is one of the most important thing to have a perfect model!!
If you have some more pics of he interior too...
Thanks!

Hello Mr Selldorff!
I read some very interesting things on this forum, thanks for sharing your experience!
I'm a modeller and I'm working on a diecast: it's a McLaren F1 in the scale of 1/12 from Minichamps and I started to modify it in the LM version. Your pics on turnermotorsports are really great for me in addition with the book "Driving ambition". I still need something very important: it's hard to find the right colour and I'm looking for the colour code to match the exact colour. Do you have a code for the orange? It would be so great to find it, because the colour is one of the most important thing to have a perfect model!!
If you have some more pics of he interior too...
Thanks!

sorry, no idea. i wouldn't dream of painting/touching it up anywhere other than the factory, so i wouldn't have reason to know the color code.

Hows that LM video going Mr Selldorff?
I really want to see and hear it changing gears..
Also is 068 still in the showroom?
-Mike:aus:

Mr Selldorff, i have an oppontunity to meet a McLaren Owner few weeks back and as he mentioned his F1, i natrually asked him if he loved the car, and his answer was quite suprising.

Although overall he thinks the car is brilliant, but there are a few things that he didn't like

1) the car is not as stable as everyong thinks at high speed or acceleration, takes great skills to control the car, a lot greater than other supercars,

2) the engine is too jumpy to be driven around town and very hard to control the throttle

3) have to take the car 1000km away to do service

4) not very good to overtake at 5th or 6th gear when crusing at 80km entering the freeway

i still don't get this one, he laughed and said that he have to change the clutch more regular than petrol. ??

My question is Mr Selldoff, do you have the same experience or your oppinion on it. Would like please share your view on it?

Hello,

I would like to ask you M. Selldorff if McLaren Car Limited take care of their F1 customers ? I imagine yes but for example, they can call you if a F1 is to sold or others secific things.

I hope too that F1 heritage will be preserved in the new Paragon factory. A museum would be great !

Thank you M. Selldorff for all your enthusiasm and help on this forum.

Ciao
Phil

Hows that LM video going Mr Selldorff?
I really want to see and hear it changing gears..
Also is 068 still in the showroom?
-Mike:aus:

i took some video a few weeks back but it didn't come out well at all. i was in LM03 and a friend in 007 with a video camera. i'll try again with a different chase car, one with more freedom of movement.

BTW, LM03 is insane. I'm still grinning.

Mr Selldorff, i have an oppontunity to meet a McLaren Owner few weeks back and as he mentioned his F1, i natrually asked him if he loved the car, and his answer was quite suprising.

Although overall he thinks the car is brilliant, but there are a few things that he didn't like

1) the car is not as stable as everyong thinks at high speed or acceleration, takes great skills to control the car, a lot greater than other supercars,

2) the engine is too jumpy to be driven around town and very hard to control the throttle

3) have to take the car 1000km away to do service

4) not very good to overtake at 5th or 6th gear when crusing at 80km entering the freeway

i still don't get this one, he laughed and said that he have to change the clutch more regular than petrol. ??

My question is Mr Selldoff, do you have the same experience or your oppinion on it. Would like please share your view on it?

1) i don't have issues with car control, i have plenty of confidence under acceleration and modest speed. i have not driven it over 200mph though, wouldn't know what that's like in it. what other supercars with similar power-to-weight? i doubt it. this car is very well sorted.
2) i don't find this to be true at all. the car is incredibly easy to drive around town. it's easier than my M5.
3) yup. except for simple stuff that TMS can do.
4) if you want to overtake someone at 80km, drop it into 2nd. the torque is great in this car, by the way.
5) true. every 2500 miles or so. i'm on my 3rd clutch in 007.

Hello,

I would like to ask you M. Selldorff if McLaren Car Limited take care of their F1 customers ? I imagine yes but for example, they can call you if a F1 is to sold or others secific things.

I hope too that F1 heritage will be preserved in the new Paragon factory. A museum would be great !

Thank you M. Selldorff for all your enthusiasm and help on this forum.

Ciao
Phil

McLaren Cars is as outstanding an operation as the cars they built. They are a class organization and will help F1 owners with any request at all. They have treated me as if i was an original owner, even though i didn't become a customer until after the final production run.

McLaren Cars is as outstanding an operation as the cars they built. They are a class organization and will help F1 owners with any request at all. They have treated me as if i was an original owner, even though i didn't become a customer until after the final production run.

There is at least one exception, no? I recall you stating that your request for more info regarding the TAG watch that came w/the car fell on deaf ears.

Greg A

Just have to say THANK YOU for taking the time to share your experiences with your great cars with us Mr. Selldorff! :)

I hope I one day will have a collection similar to yours! :grinyes:

There is at least one exception, no? I recall you stating that your request for more info regarding the TAG watch that came w/the car fell on deaf ears.

Greg A

I didn't buy the car(s) directly from McLaren Cars, it was not their responsibility to provide the watch. i was referring to the dealer that sold me the car(s).

mr selldorff,

you say the clutch needs a change every 2500 miles or so, so about once a year for your cars (following S&D restrictions), but that clutch design is over a decade old, didn't mclaren cars came up with a better design? because i know there are updates for headlights, a/c, steering rack, and if the clutch is such a weaklink, can't that be redesigned as well?

this thread is pretty long so i'll ask.
have you taken it to the track at all?
what do mclarens run in the 1/4 mille stock?
low 11's high 10's?

I think they designed the clutch to be the best and being the best means it has to be replaced to work the way its supposed to.
It would save mclaren a good bit of money designing a new clutch.

Hello,

Thank you M. Selldorff. Here are two examples of pics that would be great with your two McLaren together !

http://www.s2000.fr/linpha/get_thumbs_on_fly.php?prev_path=albums/Charly/24 et 25 Avril 04&filename=DSC00902.JPG&new_width=800&new_height=600

http://www.s2000.fr/linpha/get_thumbs_on_fly.php?prev_path=albums/cabrio92_pics/Suisse_avril_2004_with_JapanPowerTeam&filename=DSC01959m.jpg&new_width=800&new_height=600

These pics were taken from a Honda S2000 (it's not me on pics !). A convertible is great to make original pics on highway.

The yellow Gumball enzo was serviced after the 3000 miles in a Monaco dealer with clutch too.

Ciao
Phil

4) not very good to overtake at 5th or 6th gear when crusing at 80km entering the freeway

80km/hr? That's barely 50mph, isn't it? The torque is great on this car but I don't think the engine likes to accelerate in top gear from 50mph. You likely wouldn't be in 5th or 6th at that gear anyway, not even for cruising.

At 80MPH the car would accelerate with a small delay as the throttles take a deep breath then smoothly up to 120 without the driver really noticing (especially when tailing an LM).


BTW Frank, I sold my convertible. It will be gone on Saturday. I thought that would be the perfect camera car but we can find something else.

da MCLaren F1 takes off from zero to 60 in 10 or 11 sec with only a Fifth gear IIRC.

now you all stfu...

4) not very good to overtake at 5th or 6th gear when crusing at 80km entering the freeway

Here's an idea, downshift. It's just crazy enough to work :rolleyes:

I mean, cars do come with multiple gears for a reason...

this thread is pretty long so i'll ask.
have you taken it to the track at all?
what do mclarens run in the 1/4 mille stock?
low 11's high 10's?

The American spec McLaren is supposed to do 11 flat, but I've read about euro versions doing 10.6 stock.

EDIT: I'm not sure if there was an American spec McLaren, but I've seen American magazine companies run 11 flat with an F1.

BTW Frank, I sold my convertible. It will be gone on Saturday. I thought that would be the perfect camera car but we can find something else.

What about the video of Doug in his mini and Will driving the LM?

What about the video of Doug in his mini and Will driving the LM?

That's on the web, I think. But it's only a minute long and taken with a handheld digital still camera. There are a couple of good shots from this most recent one with Frank and myself but we first have to find a way to get them on the web.

Please do, it would be amazing as the LM leaving TMS was unbelievable and it doesn't change gears..
-Mike:aus:

Hello Mr. Selldorff:

When I saw that you are in Boston, MA, I almost had a heart attack. Turns out you live 2 miles from where my dad works (111 Huntington). My parents don't understand my fascination with the McLaren, not being car people, but I'm working on them :)

What cars did you drive as a kid? I just finished Driver's ed (16 next week) myself, so it would be interesting to compare your old car(s) with my Jetta (Surely I can beat you in a race! :D ).

Thanks again for offering your knowledge to us.
I am not worthy.

That's on the web, I think. But it's only a minute long and taken with a handheld digital still camera. There are a couple of good shots from this most recent one with Frank and myself but we first have to find a way to get them on the web.


Does that mean you need a host?

Email me, I can host the pics no prob!

lmwp[removethisthing][email protected]

I know that Drew has a host for photos... I'm thinking when he said 'shots' he was referring to a video.

>8^)
ER

thanks for the clear up Peloton :)
The vids not on a digicam or something? Tough luck :(

Hello,

I can host 100MO if you want.
check your pm

Ciao
Phil