Help!!!!! 1999 A41.8t Or 2000 Maxima Gxe
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tomek_nj
10-26-2003, 04:20 PM
I know the 2000 maximas are faster 0-60 6.5 and the 1.8t 8s but I CAN NOT decide which one to get heelP PLZZZZZZ.
THE4TH
10-27-2003, 02:11 PM
A4 1.8t > Gxe
Glenn Peters
11-23-2003, 06:34 PM
I'm an audi tech, used to work on nissan's! Be smart go with the jap car!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maxima, thats what I would choose.
therion
11-28-2003, 06:57 PM
I'm an audi tech, used to work on nissan's! Be smart go with the jap car!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maxima, thats what I would choose.
No absolutely not!!!
The fit and finish on the audi is much better than the maxima. If you can spend some money on mods then the Audi will be faster than the maxima. Add alittle snow or rain and the maxima will be begging for mercy cus its front wheel drive. The handling on the audi is awesome no comparision to the maxima. Just drive both cars if you can, the audi is better built and more solid of a car. But don't take my word for it drive it and see.
No absolutely not!!!
The fit and finish on the audi is much better than the maxima. If you can spend some money on mods then the Audi will be faster than the maxima. Add alittle snow or rain and the maxima will be begging for mercy cus its front wheel drive. The handling on the audi is awesome no comparision to the maxima. Just drive both cars if you can, the audi is better built and more solid of a car. But don't take my word for it drive it and see.
Glenn Peters
12-01-2003, 07:19 PM
Let's talk reliability,NISSAN !!!!!!!! I have worked on both. GO JAP !!!!!!
therion
12-01-2003, 08:58 PM
Nissan is quite reliable, i've owned quite a few in my lifetime. No more, or less reliable an audi though
Glenn Peters
12-02-2003, 07:20 PM
ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!!! NISSAN IS MORE RELIABLE!!!!!!! I fixed them both, ASE CERTIFIED MASTER AUTOMOTIVE TECHNICIAN, SORRY DUDE, NISSAN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Want to know the reasons, send me a private message!!! Can't sway an Audi fan, Some people LOVE them!!!!!! As for being better built,well BELIEVE WHAT YOU WANT.
Glenn Peters
12-02-2003, 07:24 PM
Oh,I forgot if you know how to DRIVE!!!!!!! A MAXIMA with snows if Fine!!!!!!!!!!
therion
12-02-2003, 09:46 PM
Oh,I forgot if you know how to DRIVE!!!!!!! A MAXIMA with snows if Fine!!!!!!!!!!
In any situation, the Maxima has terrible understeer during corning even in the dry. This is extremely dangerous. Front-wheel-drive is a totally inappropriate configuration for a car that is to be driven fast. in a RWD car the rear wheels tend to have less traction in slippery low speed conditions. Some people have trouble pulling out of their driveways on a wet or snowy day. Of course, front-wheel-drive cars also spin their wheels under the same conditions, and rear-wheel-drive vehicles can gain traction by simply adding ballast weight to the rear luggage compartment. However, rear-wheel-drive vehicles have a natural stability in emergency situations. That's why all thoroughbred race cars are rear-wheel-drive, even ones that are built to resemble front-wheel-drive "factory" cars, as seen in so-called stock car racing today. But AWD vehicles like the Audi A4 have all the advantages of rear wheel drive with the pluses of extra traction in slippery wet conditions which prevent "oversteer" common on some rear wheel drive cars due to most of the weight being in the front.
Bottom line: front-wheel-drive cars like the maxima especially feature huge understeer in almost any situation, which is preferred in cars designed for low-performance, untrained drivers
In any situation, the Maxima has terrible understeer during corning even in the dry. This is extremely dangerous. Front-wheel-drive is a totally inappropriate configuration for a car that is to be driven fast. in a RWD car the rear wheels tend to have less traction in slippery low speed conditions. Some people have trouble pulling out of their driveways on a wet or snowy day. Of course, front-wheel-drive cars also spin their wheels under the same conditions, and rear-wheel-drive vehicles can gain traction by simply adding ballast weight to the rear luggage compartment. However, rear-wheel-drive vehicles have a natural stability in emergency situations. That's why all thoroughbred race cars are rear-wheel-drive, even ones that are built to resemble front-wheel-drive "factory" cars, as seen in so-called stock car racing today. But AWD vehicles like the Audi A4 have all the advantages of rear wheel drive with the pluses of extra traction in slippery wet conditions which prevent "oversteer" common on some rear wheel drive cars due to most of the weight being in the front.
Bottom line: front-wheel-drive cars like the maxima especially feature huge understeer in almost any situation, which is preferred in cars designed for low-performance, untrained drivers
Glenn Peters
12-03-2003, 06:26 PM
Dude, the streets are not a race track!!!! There is nothing wrong with front wheel drive!!!!! Lets get real and think every day life, cost of repairs!!!! I know guys who road rally with front drive, I know guys who drag front drive, and they beat guys with all wheel drive!!!!!!Tons of people drive them in all weather conditions with no problem!!!!! Not to mention I feel the A4 1.8T under powered for the weight of the car!!!!! But for you it's AUDI. Know what it stands for??
therion
12-03-2003, 07:28 PM
Dude, the streets are not a race track!!!! There is nothing wrong with front wheel drive!!!!! Lets get real and think every day life, cost of repairs!!!! I know guys who road rally with front drive, I know guys who drag front drive, and they beat guys with all wheel drive!!!!!!Tons of people drive them in all weather conditions with no problem!!!!! Not to mention I feel the A4 1.8T under powered for the weight of the car!!!!! But for you it's AUDI. Know what it stands for??
What do race cars and their driving skills have to do with the everyday joe schmoe?? I know your thinking what the heck does this have to do with street driving well let me explain
Have you ever had a car suddenly pull out in front of you? Have you ever had an animal run out in front of you? Have you ever felt your car slide on a slick road? Have you ever gone around a corner only to discover you went in alittle too fast??
On the highway, understeer on FWD cars is the #1 cause of head-on collisions these days. In these situations, the driver has his foot completely off the throttle pedal, and the engine is "helping" to slow down the vehicle (but "hurting" the steering).
The government tells us to never exceed the speed limit. However, in an emergency situation, that tip is meaningless.
What do race cars and their driving skills have to do with the everyday joe schmoe?? I know your thinking what the heck does this have to do with street driving well let me explain
Have you ever had a car suddenly pull out in front of you? Have you ever had an animal run out in front of you? Have you ever felt your car slide on a slick road? Have you ever gone around a corner only to discover you went in alittle too fast??
On the highway, understeer on FWD cars is the #1 cause of head-on collisions these days. In these situations, the driver has his foot completely off the throttle pedal, and the engine is "helping" to slow down the vehicle (but "hurting" the steering).
The government tells us to never exceed the speed limit. However, in an emergency situation, that tip is meaningless.
therion
12-03-2003, 07:36 PM
ABSOLUTELY!!!!!!!!!!! NISSAN IS MORE RELIABLE!!!!!!! I fixed them both, ASE CERTIFIED MASTER AUTOMOTIVE TECHNICIAN, SORRY DUDE, NISSAN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Want to know the reasons, send me a private message!!! Can't sway an Audi fan, Some people LOVE them!!!!!! As for being better built,well BELIEVE WHAT YOU WANT.
Why dont you explain to us all.. :=)
Why dont you explain to us all.. :=)
Glenn Peters
12-04-2003, 07:56 PM
I'v driven all sorts of different vehicles,I'll drive my chevy caprice with snows any where the quattro goes. Audi is not the only quality, good handling vehicle on the road. I could sit here and talk about audis differential split and configuration, and why it helps but not as much as you think,I'v driven them in the snow! I could sit here and blow your mind with common and repeated part failures.But I'm not going to!!!!!! And yes all makes have their problems, trust me I know!!!!!!! I love a true blue Audi fan, they make me money!!!!!! And no matter what I say, you will have a negative reply!!!!!! So my friend I am done. Good luck with your Audi !!!!!!!!
therion
12-05-2003, 07:29 AM
Why becuase you know that FWD isnt as safe as a RWD or AWD car??
NarbehX
12-05-2003, 12:40 PM
actually, FWD is safer than RWD therion... whether in rain or snow, RWD cars have less control than FWD... for example, my mom's toyota camry does better in the rain and snow than my brother's M3... you're jus desperately lookin for ways to get him to argue with u so jus quit because like that one quote i read on here somethin like "arguing on the internet is like the special olympics. even if u win, ur still retarded." he basically made u look stupid by sayin hes done discussin it wit u therion
NarbehX
12-05-2003, 12:42 PM
and by the way, dont turn it on me now, FWD, RWD, and AWD all have their pluses and minuses, pick and choose which ones u'd like to believe.
therion
12-05-2003, 05:35 PM
actually, FWD is safer than RWD therion... whether in rain or snow, RWD cars have less control than FWD... for example, my mom's toyota camry does better in the rain and snow than my brother's M3... you're jus desperately lookin for ways to get him to argue with u so jus quit because like that one quote i read on here somethin like "arguing on the internet is like the special olympics. even if u win, ur still retarded." he basically made u look stupid by sayin hes done discussin it wit u therion
Yes FWD is more fool-proof. Vehicles with RWD tend to have less traction in slick low speed conditions. This was one of the #1 complaints that I heard from some people, they had trouble pulling out of their driveways on a wet or snowy day. Of course, front-wheel-drive cars also spin out in the same conditions, and rear-wheel-drive vehicles can gain traction by simply adding ballast weight to the rear luggage compartment. However, rear-wheel-drive vehicles have a natural stability in emergency situations. This especially applies during braking. Therefore safety under low speed acceleration on a FWD may be better, but under most other circumstances RWD is better, including braking ability.
And btw, AWD has most of the advantages of FWD (less slip in the wet), and a naturally equal steering that can be pushed to the edge similer to RWD. RWD may be preferred by some who like to drift around corners, but where are you going to do that here ??? it would be an unsafe practice but its fun to do on an isolated road! (my next car is a 911 :) )
And he made himself look stupid becuase he doesnt know what the F*CK he's talking about.
Yes FWD is more fool-proof. Vehicles with RWD tend to have less traction in slick low speed conditions. This was one of the #1 complaints that I heard from some people, they had trouble pulling out of their driveways on a wet or snowy day. Of course, front-wheel-drive cars also spin out in the same conditions, and rear-wheel-drive vehicles can gain traction by simply adding ballast weight to the rear luggage compartment. However, rear-wheel-drive vehicles have a natural stability in emergency situations. This especially applies during braking. Therefore safety under low speed acceleration on a FWD may be better, but under most other circumstances RWD is better, including braking ability.
And btw, AWD has most of the advantages of FWD (less slip in the wet), and a naturally equal steering that can be pushed to the edge similer to RWD. RWD may be preferred by some who like to drift around corners, but where are you going to do that here ??? it would be an unsafe practice but its fun to do on an isolated road! (my next car is a 911 :) )
And he made himself look stupid becuase he doesnt know what the F*CK he's talking about.
jgood2709
12-05-2003, 05:51 PM
everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it all comes down to an audi with quattro is simply the best car ever :werd:
Glenn Peters
12-06-2003, 10:35 AM
I drove them in the snow yesterday at work and they are not all that impressive, even with snows. My blazer 4wd will smoke it in the snow, so why not get a true 4wd!!!!!!!!!
therion
12-06-2003, 05:39 PM
I drove them in the snow yesterday at work and they are not all that impressive, even with snows. My blazer 4wd will smoke it in the snow, so why not get a true 4wd!!!!!!!!!
Hmmm awd has been banned in every racing category i know off (f1, touring cars [fia class 2], gt, imsa, etc)- except fia class 1 which died last year anyway. in that category (450hp, active suspension, carbon/carbon brakes etc).
The fact is on the Quattro rally cars, the entire
drivetrain was custom made, and as you mentioned had a manual bias setup for transferring power from one end of the car to the other. I do agree that for daily driving Audi is more practical.
but 4WD must be disengaged when running on dry pavement. This is because the transfer case provides a 50-50 power split, and there's no mechanical compensation for the differences in tire speeds that occur when rounding corners. Leaving 4WD engaged on dry pavement causes the transfer case to wear--and eventually fail. Repairing a 4WD transfer case is expensive. that is inconvenient in conditions of light rain or patchy snow because they must be switched back and forth while driving. To engage 4WD Low, which is typically used only in severe off-road driving, the vehicle must be brought to a complete stop. Unless u have a full time 4WD vehicle.
AWD is a system where the majority of power, sometimes all, is placed to one set of wheels (the front, or the rear in most cases) and approx. 20% is towards the other. If the AWD system detects wheel slippage, the computer transfers power from the rear wheels to the front, helping to prevent loss of control.
If 4wd is better than AWD then why do you think Range Rovers, Jeep Grand Cherokee the best in off road use AWD. Audi came out with Quattro in 1977. Audi is the market leader in the all-wheel-drive passenger car sector in Germany, and also in Europe as a whole, where its market share is over 13 percent.
Hmmm awd has been banned in every racing category i know off (f1, touring cars [fia class 2], gt, imsa, etc)- except fia class 1 which died last year anyway. in that category (450hp, active suspension, carbon/carbon brakes etc).
The fact is on the Quattro rally cars, the entire
drivetrain was custom made, and as you mentioned had a manual bias setup for transferring power from one end of the car to the other. I do agree that for daily driving Audi is more practical.
but 4WD must be disengaged when running on dry pavement. This is because the transfer case provides a 50-50 power split, and there's no mechanical compensation for the differences in tire speeds that occur when rounding corners. Leaving 4WD engaged on dry pavement causes the transfer case to wear--and eventually fail. Repairing a 4WD transfer case is expensive. that is inconvenient in conditions of light rain or patchy snow because they must be switched back and forth while driving. To engage 4WD Low, which is typically used only in severe off-road driving, the vehicle must be brought to a complete stop. Unless u have a full time 4WD vehicle.
AWD is a system where the majority of power, sometimes all, is placed to one set of wheels (the front, or the rear in most cases) and approx. 20% is towards the other. If the AWD system detects wheel slippage, the computer transfers power from the rear wheels to the front, helping to prevent loss of control.
If 4wd is better than AWD then why do you think Range Rovers, Jeep Grand Cherokee the best in off road use AWD. Audi came out with Quattro in 1977. Audi is the market leader in the all-wheel-drive passenger car sector in Germany, and also in Europe as a whole, where its market share is over 13 percent.
Glenn Peters
12-08-2003, 06:41 PM
therion, just so you know there is no computer for the AWD system on the A4,A6and A8. They use what is called a torsion differential in the back of the trans which send power to the rear wheels based on heat build caused by slippage!!!!! The TT does have a control unit on the rear differential!!!!! If the vehicle has ESP, Electronic Stability Protection, the system is part of the ABS and actually activates ABS when slip is detected!!!!!! Just so you know!!!!!
Glenn Peters
12-08-2003, 06:59 PM
Sorry was talking to a friend on the phone when I wrote last reply about anti theft protection. ESP= Electronic Stability Program.
therion
12-08-2003, 09:12 PM
manual bias setup for transferring power from one end of the car to the other. I do agree that for daily driving Audi is more practical.
I dont know if you didnt read that part or not, but i am aware that is isnt computer controlled, hence manual bias.
I dont know if you didnt read that part or not, but i am aware that is isnt computer controlled, hence manual bias.
RACER D12
12-09-2003, 10:27 AM
Seeing as where he lives I would say get the A4 because of snow and tons of stupid drivers (if he lives in city). I do like both cars but the Audi is just better IMO. Now if the max was RWD or AWD then it would be different. However I just dont understand why all these people in hear keep arguing that FWD is better than RWD and AWD? It dosnt make any sense! If you know anything about cars and weight transfer RWD and AWD AWAYS! come out on top. FWD is made for people who do not know how to drive and in the long run FWD is really only hurting those people. They only place FWD can compare to RWD some what is in snow. And thats because when you slid with FWD you can correct the slid by just steping on the gas. However if you didnt have FWD you probably wouldnt be sliding in the first place :icon16: But lets just forget all this FWD vs RWD right now because its FWD vs AWD and AWD is just better.
So I would go with the Audi more comfortable and its AWD. If you need more power just chip it the 1.8T motor responds very well to bolt on mods. No matter which one you pick tho you will be happy both are nice cars.
So I would go with the Audi more comfortable and its AWD. If you need more power just chip it the 1.8T motor responds very well to bolt on mods. No matter which one you pick tho you will be happy both are nice cars.
therion
12-09-2003, 02:38 PM
Seeing as where he lives I would say get the A4 because of snow and tons of stupid drivers (if he lives in city). I do like both cars but the Audi is just better IMO. Now if the max was RWD or AWD then it would be different. However I just dont understand why all these people in hear keep arguing that FWD is better than RWD and AWD? It dosnt make any sense! If you know anything about cars and weight transfer RWD and AWD AWAYS! come out on top. FWD is made for people who do not know how to drive and in the long run FWD is really only hurting those people. They only place FWD can compare to RWD some what is in snow. And thats because when you slid with FWD you can correct the slid by just steping on the gas. However if you didnt have FWD you probably wouldnt be sliding in the first place :icon16: But lets just forget all this FWD vs RWD right now because its FWD vs AWD and AWD is just better.
So I would go with the Audi more comfortable and its AWD. If you need more power just chip it the 1.8T motor responds very well to bolt on mods. No matter which one you pick tho you will be happy both are nice cars.
Thank you finally someone with wisdom posts on this thread. Yes i dont say the maxima sucks either becuase if you want 0-60 performance and thats all u care about than the maxima is better, but the audi is more of a car overall.
So I would go with the Audi more comfortable and its AWD. If you need more power just chip it the 1.8T motor responds very well to bolt on mods. No matter which one you pick tho you will be happy both are nice cars.
Thank you finally someone with wisdom posts on this thread. Yes i dont say the maxima sucks either becuase if you want 0-60 performance and thats all u care about than the maxima is better, but the audi is more of a car overall.
Glenn Peters
12-10-2003, 07:00 PM
Are you saying I have no wisdom???? If you had any wisdom you would know that they are JUNK!!!!!!!! Sorry Dude, that is my humble but accurate opinion.
therion
12-10-2003, 07:07 PM
Are you saying I have no wisdom???? If you had any wisdom you would know that they are JUNK!!!!!!!! Sorry Dude, that is my humble but accurate opinion.
I dont question your technical expertise becuase you oviously know alot about cars. But the way you talk on these boards is very childish and no respect. You shouldn't just bias ur opinion on japanese is better german cars suck. Each of them has there pluses and minuses. I've owned 3 japanese cars and german cars too so i know how each of them rate.
I dont question your technical expertise becuase you oviously know alot about cars. But the way you talk on these boards is very childish and no respect. You shouldn't just bias ur opinion on japanese is better german cars suck. Each of them has there pluses and minuses. I've owned 3 japanese cars and german cars too so i know how each of them rate.
Glenn Peters
12-11-2003, 06:06 AM
I'm sorry you think the way I post is childish and with out respect. Respect to what? German cars? I see more stupid failures, that just should not happen, ON ANY VEHICLE!!!And it's not just Audi!!! I think on a whole, having worked on domestics, imports(jap & euro's) that the domestics and euro's do not match the Jap cars!!!!! Don't take it personal, hey I drive Domestic car. People think I'm crazy for that reason,My out look MADE IN THE USA!!!!!!!!
RACER D12
12-11-2003, 12:42 PM
What Euro cars have you been driving? The only unreliable Euro cars I have seen are from the 80s and their not even that bad.
Audi_A4
12-11-2003, 06:44 PM
After reading through each reply stated about the topic, "A4 1.8T vs. Maxima GXE", it seems too many of you have an urge to state or make-up some fatal flaw in the Audi A4 design, not to mention some of you tend to get off topic only to brag about your own car. It seems that the japanese car enthusist are too caught up in the prosicution to consider their own car's weaknesses. Such as the lack of craftsmenship put into each Maxima, they would be the "Cookie cutter" car. Audi servce costs may have been a better topic to poke rather than te AWD. Bottum line is, every car has its own flaw, and buy the car that you feel is right for you not because of someones opinion. Let me remind you all, that not every single person buys a car for pure power, or how fast it will go from 0 to 60. If you are honestly only buying cars for that sole reason here's a hint, buy a Ferrari or Bugatti, they might satisfy your thirst for power.
http://www.gizmo.com.au/pics/2250_04.jpg
http://www.gizmo.com.au/pics/2250_04.jpg
Glenn Peters
12-11-2003, 08:53 PM
O.K. This will be my very last post. I have only driven Audi's when it comes to euros to awnser racerd12. As for the maxima being a cookie cutter car,whatever!!!! I drive American vehicles and ride JAP Motorcycles. Having worked on Nissan's for 2+ years,Audi's for 2+ years now, and knowing what goes wrong with both, and if I were to buy an import I personally would choose nissan or Honda. They have less REPEAT failures then Audi's do, bottom line guys!!!! I have also seen more unhappy Audi owners than I have Nissan owners. None of this is made up just to upset any of you Audi drivers, remember I love people who have to drive Audi's, that is how I currently make an income from fixing Audi's and they brake ALOT. Hope you all have a Happy Holiday!!!!!!
ZackKVtec
12-15-2003, 05:44 PM
back to your first post, i honestly wouldnt be able to choose very easily between either car both have plusses and minuses.
maxima
pros
very powerful
very reliable
not bad in the snow (FWD is second only to AWD)
cons
no race handling
a4
pros
AWD
easy chip upgrade
pretty good looking
cons
reliability of a vw (its like picking a name out of a hat, good or lemon)
depends if you like driving with one headlight out
paying 5-10 grand for AWD (get a jetta GLI)
also it depends what look your going for
maxima is kind of business man, slick looking
a4 is business man, sporty looking
your call man hope you make the right one
maxima
pros
very powerful
very reliable
not bad in the snow (FWD is second only to AWD)
cons
no race handling
a4
pros
AWD
easy chip upgrade
pretty good looking
cons
reliability of a vw (its like picking a name out of a hat, good or lemon)
depends if you like driving with one headlight out
paying 5-10 grand for AWD (get a jetta GLI)
also it depends what look your going for
maxima is kind of business man, slick looking
a4 is business man, sporty looking
your call man hope you make the right one
Nexus_1
12-27-2003, 04:50 AM
One of the big considerations no one has brought up is manual vs automatic. If the A4 is an Auto I'd deffinalty go for the Maxima or find a manual A4. I for one want the AWD simply to get past chain control in the Taho Reno areas. I also think the interior is better on in the Audi I had a friend with a 97 Maxima and it was very nice and very fast but handled like a barge and the interior whal nicer then many amarican cars, falls way behind the A4 I test drove today.
I hope I get a good one.
I hope I get a good one.
therion
12-30-2003, 08:59 AM
Audi_A4, well said i agree with your statements.
Btw, im in europe right now and people here would take an audi over a honda or nissan anyday.
Btw, im in europe right now and people here would take an audi over a honda or nissan anyday.
BadAssAuditude
12-30-2003, 12:45 PM
Hey Guys! I'm knew to this site, thought I'd enter my 2-cents...
My father & brother are avid Audi lovers. Yes, Audi's have their pro's & cons. My father has a few Audi's (all manual trans., of course). He actually perfers his (stock) '87 5000 Turbo Quattro over his (stock) '99 A4 Turbo Avant Quattro. His 5000 has over, believe it or not (same motor), 600k miles and has had very little problems with it (other than just regular maintenence and wear-n-tear). It's been driven at least 4 times cross-country. This car is unbelieveable! For an example, we live in the mountains and one area, we call the Rock Slide. I wouldn't even ride my 3-wheeler down it let alone drive a car. Most 4wd trucks built for climbing, etc. even get stuck, most don't make it and are still sitting there. Well, that 5000 (boat) goes up, goes down, does circles around all others...and keeps going (watching it definatley makes for a great Audi commercial). But, his '99 A4 has over 120k miles and has had problems. Sadly, I think it's a lemon. It's a beautiful car, drives like a dream but just doesn't seem to hold up to the '87 5000. And no, he doesn't drive the A4 like the 5000. He's put a lot of (freeway) miles on it in a short time but has babied it. Anyway, it just goes to show...every car, not just mfg'er, has it's own problems. Funny thing is, over the years, I've learned that most technicians don't like Audi's (German cars) because they don't really understand or have the desire to learn the sofistication and reasoning behind Germany Engineering and/or don't have the money to maintain it, I mean, afterall, it's just a car, right? They're a different breed than say, a Jap car. They may be easier and cheaper to work on but you also get what you pay for (except for the lemons). Just depends on what you're looking for and how much money you wanna spend.
FoodForThought: The true way to know it's time to change the oil is not by mileage or how clean it looks, but by how gritty it feels. Even clean-looking oil is contaminated and contributes to engine wear. Basically just depends on how much you like yer car and wanna keep it and how much money yer willin' to spend to maintain it. 600k miles is A LOT of miles on one motor. :naughty:
My father & brother are avid Audi lovers. Yes, Audi's have their pro's & cons. My father has a few Audi's (all manual trans., of course). He actually perfers his (stock) '87 5000 Turbo Quattro over his (stock) '99 A4 Turbo Avant Quattro. His 5000 has over, believe it or not (same motor), 600k miles and has had very little problems with it (other than just regular maintenence and wear-n-tear). It's been driven at least 4 times cross-country. This car is unbelieveable! For an example, we live in the mountains and one area, we call the Rock Slide. I wouldn't even ride my 3-wheeler down it let alone drive a car. Most 4wd trucks built for climbing, etc. even get stuck, most don't make it and are still sitting there. Well, that 5000 (boat) goes up, goes down, does circles around all others...and keeps going (watching it definatley makes for a great Audi commercial). But, his '99 A4 has over 120k miles and has had problems. Sadly, I think it's a lemon. It's a beautiful car, drives like a dream but just doesn't seem to hold up to the '87 5000. And no, he doesn't drive the A4 like the 5000. He's put a lot of (freeway) miles on it in a short time but has babied it. Anyway, it just goes to show...every car, not just mfg'er, has it's own problems. Funny thing is, over the years, I've learned that most technicians don't like Audi's (German cars) because they don't really understand or have the desire to learn the sofistication and reasoning behind Germany Engineering and/or don't have the money to maintain it, I mean, afterall, it's just a car, right? They're a different breed than say, a Jap car. They may be easier and cheaper to work on but you also get what you pay for (except for the lemons). Just depends on what you're looking for and how much money you wanna spend.
FoodForThought: The true way to know it's time to change the oil is not by mileage or how clean it looks, but by how gritty it feels. Even clean-looking oil is contaminated and contributes to engine wear. Basically just depends on how much you like yer car and wanna keep it and how much money yer willin' to spend to maintain it. 600k miles is A LOT of miles on one motor. :naughty:
therion
12-31-2003, 07:45 AM
BadAssAuditude, Damn straight 600k is alot of miles, its even alot of kilometers here in europe :) Do you know what kind of oil your dad uses in his 5000 quattro? becuase thats alot of miles for even diesel engines. I'm assuming its a very good synthetic like amsoil...
In europe though i haven't seen anyone have problems with their newer audis so maybe it's just a problem in the U.S.A. ???
In europe though i haven't seen anyone have problems with their newer audis so maybe it's just a problem in the U.S.A. ???
BadAssAuditude
12-31-2003, 01:33 PM
Therion, you'll prolly laugh at this but I'm pretty sure he's only used Castrol 10/40w. I believe if you change the oil frequently, you don't need synthetic. But, I'll find out for sure today & get back to ya. As far as problems on U.S models, it's hard to say...my Dad's turned quite a few friends (and family) onto Audi's and they LOVE 'em! Has had no problems, same models even. So, I think that's why his is a lemon. However, one thing I have to say is an amazing end to dreadful situation...unfortunately, he paid a (reputable) shop to do the major maint. service recently because he didn't have the time and was going out of town for a few months (he's always done his own services & repairs, but this one time...) the tech failed to torque the plugs down to spec., something simple you'd think. After being garaged for a few months and then only put a few miles on it, the plug came loose and blew out one spark plug, literally and damaged the boot. The second plug and ignition pack were loose but ok. We bought a new plug, boot and an insert kit. (the shop won't warranty the repair because it's been just over 12k miles/1 year...typical) and retorqued the plugs. Thought fer sure the motor was gone. After charging the battery, started it up, it blew out blue smoke (due to blowing out the grease we used to thread in the insert so the shavings didn't drop into the head) and it made this god-awful noise and died. We were suspecting the prong (I forgot the actually name) on the tip of the spark plug was lodged somewhere inside the motor/turbo. Started it again and same thing, only it died right away. We left the charger on the battery anyway and about an hour later, tried it again, for shits and giggles, and the engine started right up and the noise (and smoke) were gone. For about $45. and a battery charger, the next day, the CEL (check engine light) went out and still purrs like a kitten. So, I think THAT's somethin' to write home about. I have a question, though, maybe you can help...out of curiosity, if the Turbo WAS damaged, what signs would there be, if any, other than the obvious?
therion
01-02-2004, 02:44 AM
badassattitude, if he is using regular oil in there than that truely is remarkable. I heard synthetic has better lubricating properties than dino oil but i guess if you have a really well built engine its ok.
Geez, thats a terrible story. I also am a do it yourselfer when it comes to maintenance and i wouldn't trust anyone even with something like an oil change (unless im standing by the mechanic the whole time hes doing it).
If the prong found its way to the turbo which is the favorable option, then it might clear the passages i the housing. but if it got stuck and wore out the turbo then some other signs other than poorer performance can be:
Rubbing noise on acceleration. Means the turbo bearings are badly worn.
Whistling noise on acceleration (of course different sound than the whistle of the norm). Turbo imbalance or air leak.
Also when the car is idling check if there is any faint blue smoke it, if there is than it can also be Defective turbo seals, or excessive bearing wear.
But the the only real way to check for damage on the fins if to remove the intake tube on the turbo and visually inspect the turbo fins for any damage. Also check if there is any metal shavings inside (this is a VERY bad sign if there is). I hope this helps.
Geez, thats a terrible story. I also am a do it yourselfer when it comes to maintenance and i wouldn't trust anyone even with something like an oil change (unless im standing by the mechanic the whole time hes doing it).
If the prong found its way to the turbo which is the favorable option, then it might clear the passages i the housing. but if it got stuck and wore out the turbo then some other signs other than poorer performance can be:
Rubbing noise on acceleration. Means the turbo bearings are badly worn.
Whistling noise on acceleration (of course different sound than the whistle of the norm). Turbo imbalance or air leak.
Also when the car is idling check if there is any faint blue smoke it, if there is than it can also be Defective turbo seals, or excessive bearing wear.
But the the only real way to check for damage on the fins if to remove the intake tube on the turbo and visually inspect the turbo fins for any damage. Also check if there is any metal shavings inside (this is a VERY bad sign if there is). I hope this helps.
Nexus_1
01-02-2004, 09:05 AM
Therin a lot of good advice but the damage would be on the exhaust side of the turbo not the intake. Also if it did get past the turbo without damage it is now probobly stuck in the cat...I don't know what kinds of problems that would cause if any.
BadAssAuditude
01-02-2004, 01:28 PM
Therion, my Dad confirmed he's only used Castrol 10w40. Nice, huh? But he changes it frequently.
He also said his A4 does blow a little blue smoke @ idle. He said the seals are bad on the Turbo, just like you mentioned. Goes away when the rpm's are revved (luckily, no noise noted). Hopefully this will be a fairly (simple) job. I didn't ask him, what do you think?
Nexus_1, thank you for yer input. My thought would be ('cause I really don't know) that if the prong did get into the cat, that if damage were to happen, it'd be the honeycomb. Or maybe it just found a new home with no damage. I hope we won't have to find out. BTW, out of curiosity, why would the damage be on the exhaust side and not the intake? I'll never know if I don't ask, right?
Changing the subject (not to offend anybody), I've read quite a few interesting replies on A4 verses Maxima. I have to agree that a manual AWD (A4) kicks ass. So what if they think the Maxima (or Civic) is faster (?) off the line. Who wants to race drag? Streetlight to streetlight? May as well install neon illuminators to the undercarriage and a big 'ol ugly fin (whale tail) on the back. Big deal. You get that Audi on the winding roads (dirt or paved) and you'll be sippin' yer 4th cup of tea at the finish line (and lookin' good while doin' it) before the Maxima rolls in (if it even makes it). More fun & challenging, too.
I agree with Therion about the encounters the average Joe Schmoe go thru on city streets (and there are a lot of 'em/us). And those who don't realize the importance of a well handling car just to make it safely thru the hussle & bussle of everyday life on the roads. But then again, some people don't mind, they only want a "commuter". And that's fine. But wait...some want a fast & furious commuter. Silly because....
it's not how fast you drive, it's how well you drive fast!
DOH! :eek:
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Maxima is not a safe car or everybody should be driving Audi's, I'm just speaking from personal preference & experience. A well handling car -period- just makes a world of difference, especially in that "emergency" situation when reaction, timing & precision are everything. Besides, how well-handling the other guys car is improves the odds on how my car won't get hit by his. No? Maybe I'm just lame.... :screwy:
Hey, Therion, I just thought of somethin'. You say yer in Europe? I understand the way of driving out there is much different then out here; the laws, etc. Can you elucidate (clarify) for me? I think I heard that there really aren't any actaul (set) speed limits but by a "rule of thumb", so to speak. If there is an accident, they determine who was at fault by certain somethin', somethin', I forgot what. But supposedly because of that, the accident rate is much less there than here. True or no? Thanks.... :biggrin:
He also said his A4 does blow a little blue smoke @ idle. He said the seals are bad on the Turbo, just like you mentioned. Goes away when the rpm's are revved (luckily, no noise noted). Hopefully this will be a fairly (simple) job. I didn't ask him, what do you think?
Nexus_1, thank you for yer input. My thought would be ('cause I really don't know) that if the prong did get into the cat, that if damage were to happen, it'd be the honeycomb. Or maybe it just found a new home with no damage. I hope we won't have to find out. BTW, out of curiosity, why would the damage be on the exhaust side and not the intake? I'll never know if I don't ask, right?
Changing the subject (not to offend anybody), I've read quite a few interesting replies on A4 verses Maxima. I have to agree that a manual AWD (A4) kicks ass. So what if they think the Maxima (or Civic) is faster (?) off the line. Who wants to race drag? Streetlight to streetlight? May as well install neon illuminators to the undercarriage and a big 'ol ugly fin (whale tail) on the back. Big deal. You get that Audi on the winding roads (dirt or paved) and you'll be sippin' yer 4th cup of tea at the finish line (and lookin' good while doin' it) before the Maxima rolls in (if it even makes it). More fun & challenging, too.
I agree with Therion about the encounters the average Joe Schmoe go thru on city streets (and there are a lot of 'em/us). And those who don't realize the importance of a well handling car just to make it safely thru the hussle & bussle of everyday life on the roads. But then again, some people don't mind, they only want a "commuter". And that's fine. But wait...some want a fast & furious commuter. Silly because....
it's not how fast you drive, it's how well you drive fast!
DOH! :eek:
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the Maxima is not a safe car or everybody should be driving Audi's, I'm just speaking from personal preference & experience. A well handling car -period- just makes a world of difference, especially in that "emergency" situation when reaction, timing & precision are everything. Besides, how well-handling the other guys car is improves the odds on how my car won't get hit by his. No? Maybe I'm just lame.... :screwy:
Hey, Therion, I just thought of somethin'. You say yer in Europe? I understand the way of driving out there is much different then out here; the laws, etc. Can you elucidate (clarify) for me? I think I heard that there really aren't any actaul (set) speed limits but by a "rule of thumb", so to speak. If there is an accident, they determine who was at fault by certain somethin', somethin', I forgot what. But supposedly because of that, the accident rate is much less there than here. True or no? Thanks.... :biggrin:
Nexus_1
01-02-2004, 02:21 PM
The prong would have been blown out the exhuast valve and gone through the exhuast manifold into the turbo or through the turbo bypass valve. The two sides of the turbo are coneced by a sealed and berringed shaft. the only way for damage to be done to the Impeler (intake) side of the turbo is for it to have been introduced to the air streem before the turbo...near the air filter...this is one reason it is very bad to ever run a turbo engine without an air filter
I once heard somone set up a water injection on a ford 2.3 tubo and put it in before the turbo. The water alone was enought to pit (make small indentations on) the impeler.
the smoke you describe when the car is started is a sure sign that the shaft seals on the turbo are wearing out. As the turbo heats up and the mettal expands it seals back up...that is why you only see smoke at cold start.
I had a Nissan Skyline (R31) that had a turbo seize it is very obvious when it happens the engine can barely run because the exhaust gasses have no where to go.
I once heard somone set up a water injection on a ford 2.3 tubo and put it in before the turbo. The water alone was enought to pit (make small indentations on) the impeler.
the smoke you describe when the car is started is a sure sign that the shaft seals on the turbo are wearing out. As the turbo heats up and the mettal expands it seals back up...that is why you only see smoke at cold start.
I had a Nissan Skyline (R31) that had a turbo seize it is very obvious when it happens the engine can barely run because the exhaust gasses have no where to go.
BadAssAuditude
01-02-2004, 02:33 PM
Ya know, reading that sounds familiar. I'm more a visual kind of person rather than text. It doesn't really sink in until iI see it. Anyway. it makes sense. I guess in a sick way, I can't wait to get in there and find out. Is a be-atch to replace those shaft seals?
therion
01-03-2004, 10:40 PM
Therion, my Dad confirmed he's only used Castrol 10w40. Nice, huh? But he changes it frequently.
He also said his A4 does blow a little blue smoke @ idle. He said the seals are bad on the Turbo, just like you mentioned. Goes away when the rpm's are revved (luckily, no noise noted). Hopefully this will be a fairly (simple) job. I didn't ask him, what do you think?
Depends on what location the turbo is in. You have to yank out the turbo either way and once you do i'd recommend he change ALL the seals etc.
I have to agree that a manual AWD (A4) kicks ass. So what if they think the Maxima (or Civic) is faster (?) off the line. Who wants to race drag? Streetlight to streetlight? May as well install neon illuminators to the undercarriage and a big 'ol ugly fin (whale tail) on the back. Big deal. You get that Audi on the winding roads (dirt or paved) and you'll be sippin' yer 4th cup of tea at the finish line (and lookin' good while doin' it) before the Maxima rolls in (if it even makes it). More fun & challenging, too.
I agree with Therion about the encounters the average Joe Schmoe go thru on city streets (and there are a lot of 'em/us). And those who don't realize the importance of a well handling car just to make it safely thru the hussle & bussle of everyday life on the roads.
Thanks, i knew i wasn't alone. :) btw where did GlennPeters go? i hope we didnt scare him off :(
Hey, Therion, I just thought of somethin'. You say yer in Europe? I understand the way of driving out there is much different then out here; the laws, etc. Can you elucidate (clarify) for me? I think I heard that there really aren't any actaul (set) speed limits but by a "rule of thumb", so to speak. If there is an accident, they determine who was at fault by certain somethin', somethin', I forgot what. But supposedly because of that, the accident rate is much less there than here. True or no? Thanks... :biggrin:
I'm back in the USA now i was there on vacation for 3 weeks. Yes the driving is totally different than on the US roads. There is roundabouts, and other intersections other than the boring stoplight famous in the US. The laws are harsh too but you can pay your way out of most. (unless u try to run away and then get caught, then you pay double fines plus you get it punched on your record). There is speed limits throughout europe except some parts of france and most of german highways are unhindered by speed limits. Although speed limits arent generally followed by anyone in europe everyone breaks the speed limit. (unless you have a crappy car then you cant speed if you tried).Yes that is true, the German Autobahn (with no speed limit) is the safest highway in the world, and the death rates drop every year. Yet in america we keep lowering the speed limits and the death rates skyrocket, why? I think it's because of insufficient driver education courses, poorly constructed and designed roads, and too low of speed limits (you have people always speeding anyway creating hazards). I'm not quite sure how they determine who is at fault in a crash sorry. A worthy website to check-out is AMERICANAUTOBAHN.COM (www.americanautobahn.com)
He also said his A4 does blow a little blue smoke @ idle. He said the seals are bad on the Turbo, just like you mentioned. Goes away when the rpm's are revved (luckily, no noise noted). Hopefully this will be a fairly (simple) job. I didn't ask him, what do you think?
Depends on what location the turbo is in. You have to yank out the turbo either way and once you do i'd recommend he change ALL the seals etc.
I have to agree that a manual AWD (A4) kicks ass. So what if they think the Maxima (or Civic) is faster (?) off the line. Who wants to race drag? Streetlight to streetlight? May as well install neon illuminators to the undercarriage and a big 'ol ugly fin (whale tail) on the back. Big deal. You get that Audi on the winding roads (dirt or paved) and you'll be sippin' yer 4th cup of tea at the finish line (and lookin' good while doin' it) before the Maxima rolls in (if it even makes it). More fun & challenging, too.
I agree with Therion about the encounters the average Joe Schmoe go thru on city streets (and there are a lot of 'em/us). And those who don't realize the importance of a well handling car just to make it safely thru the hussle & bussle of everyday life on the roads.
Thanks, i knew i wasn't alone. :) btw where did GlennPeters go? i hope we didnt scare him off :(
Hey, Therion, I just thought of somethin'. You say yer in Europe? I understand the way of driving out there is much different then out here; the laws, etc. Can you elucidate (clarify) for me? I think I heard that there really aren't any actaul (set) speed limits but by a "rule of thumb", so to speak. If there is an accident, they determine who was at fault by certain somethin', somethin', I forgot what. But supposedly because of that, the accident rate is much less there than here. True or no? Thanks... :biggrin:
I'm back in the USA now i was there on vacation for 3 weeks. Yes the driving is totally different than on the US roads. There is roundabouts, and other intersections other than the boring stoplight famous in the US. The laws are harsh too but you can pay your way out of most. (unless u try to run away and then get caught, then you pay double fines plus you get it punched on your record). There is speed limits throughout europe except some parts of france and most of german highways are unhindered by speed limits. Although speed limits arent generally followed by anyone in europe everyone breaks the speed limit. (unless you have a crappy car then you cant speed if you tried).Yes that is true, the German Autobahn (with no speed limit) is the safest highway in the world, and the death rates drop every year. Yet in america we keep lowering the speed limits and the death rates skyrocket, why? I think it's because of insufficient driver education courses, poorly constructed and designed roads, and too low of speed limits (you have people always speeding anyway creating hazards). I'm not quite sure how they determine who is at fault in a crash sorry. A worthy website to check-out is AMERICANAUTOBAHN.COM (www.americanautobahn.com)
Glenn Peters
01-04-2004, 06:42 PM
No you didn't scare me off,just to busy to argue over personal opion!!!! I have all these Audi's at work breaking keeping me busy!!!!!! And it's Ski season!!!! Happy New Year Boys!!!!!
therion
01-07-2004, 07:14 PM
I'v driven all sorts of different vehicles,I'll drive my chevy caprice with snows any where the quattro goes.
Chevy caprice isnt FWD last time i checked.
Chevy caprice isnt FWD last time i checked.
Glenn Peters
01-07-2004, 10:26 PM
Dude, that post is old where ya been? I never said it was! Are you trying to get me to argue over this again? Hey guess what I did yesterday at work,another 1.8t oil pump due to oil pick up being clogged and 0.5bar of oil pressure which is low!!!!! And this time the cam chain tensioner failed because of it!!!!!!!!! But its such a great engine right.
BadAssAuditude
01-08-2004, 11:33 AM
Only YOU can get you to argue, it's not worth it but it's fun to read what you have to say. :) Which leads me to ask: what caused the oil pick up to clog? Lemme guess, factory defect. No, 'cause it's a 1.8T. No, 'cause it's an Audi. Oh wait, I got it..it's because the tech said so <grin>. Tell me, what condition was the oil in? Was it "clean"? Did possibly any contaminates get in the system? Did the owner ever even check the oil?...maybe he (or Jiffy Lube) topped it off with gear oil or something by mistake? I'm just curious what causes oil pumps to go "bad".
RACER D12
01-08-2004, 12:40 PM
Glenn Peters changing oil does not make you an "Audi Tech" :loser: Everyone read some of his other posts in other threads. He is clearly not an Audi Tech. Its sad im still in high school and I can tell this guy is a fake. Admit it Glenn you have been :owned: Now cut the act.
http://www.nexus-point.net/forums/owned-rally.jpg
Stole this from flywish
http://www.nexus-point.net/forums/owned-rally.jpg
Stole this from flywish
Glenn Peters
01-08-2004, 07:18 PM
To BadAssAditude, The reason for the oil pumps going bad is that Audi's service intervals of 8 to 10k depending no the year. Part 2 is that the oil gets really hot and bakes into the pick up screen and the result is very reduced oil flow!!!!!!! This problem has also caused cylinder head and turbo charger failure!!!If you have read the previous posts on this subject, yuo would have read that this can be avoided.Although I have seen it happen on cars that have had more recent oil changes!!!!! As for RACERD12, if you would like I could send you my resume and some references you could call !!!!! And after that you can go back to your studies because you have a lot to learn!!!!!!! P.S. Not that it means anything to you, I am an ASE Certified Master Technician and happen to be very good at what I do!!!!!!!!!!
therion
01-08-2004, 08:07 PM
To BadAssAditude, The reason for the oil pumps going bad is that Audi's service intervals of 8 to 10k depending no the year.
In europe 8-10,000 miles is the norm for all cars and has been for quite some time. Wouldn't all the cars be in the shop over there since there is more audis over there than here and there is also lots of highly stressed small cars that are overworked. They are actually talking about increasing it again. So how can you say this problem is caused by the service interval?? In europe reliability in cars is a buyers #1 concern and if the oil pumps blow for no reason on the audis then not too many people would be buying them. Bottom line use a quality synthetic oil and you will be fine!, Amsoil is the top choice in the USA.
Although I have seen it happen on cars that have had more recent oil changes!!!!!
Thats most likely becuase of cheap oil, I hate how some people have the philosophy "oil is oil" it's not the case. Especially with a sophisticated high output performance turboed engine requires especially good lubrication.
You can probably go 10,000 miles on Amsoil 0W-30 according to amsoil with filter changes. but i would change it more often
In europe 8-10,000 miles is the norm for all cars and has been for quite some time. Wouldn't all the cars be in the shop over there since there is more audis over there than here and there is also lots of highly stressed small cars that are overworked. They are actually talking about increasing it again. So how can you say this problem is caused by the service interval?? In europe reliability in cars is a buyers #1 concern and if the oil pumps blow for no reason on the audis then not too many people would be buying them. Bottom line use a quality synthetic oil and you will be fine!, Amsoil is the top choice in the USA.
Although I have seen it happen on cars that have had more recent oil changes!!!!!
Thats most likely becuase of cheap oil, I hate how some people have the philosophy "oil is oil" it's not the case. Especially with a sophisticated high output performance turboed engine requires especially good lubrication.
You can probably go 10,000 miles on Amsoil 0W-30 according to amsoil with filter changes. but i would change it more often
Glenn Peters
01-08-2004, 08:34 PM
Audi covers services here in the us it's called Audi Advantage I believe. For some reason they won't pay for synthetic oil. Synthetic oil is what the car comes from the factory with. And yes synthetic oil very much helps. Why don't the 2.7t,2.8 and 4.2 engines have this problem, when the same oil is used in those engines. By the way I think it is Castrol GTX that we use.
therion
01-08-2004, 08:46 PM
Audi covers services here in the us it's called Audi Advantage I believe. For some reason they won't pay for synthetic oil. Synthetic oil is what the car comes from the factory with. And yes synthetic oil very much helps. Why don't the 2.7t,2.8 and 4.2 engines have this problem, when the same oil is used in those engines. By the way I think it is Castrol GTX that we use.
They wont put synthetic oil in our cars becuase they know it may make it last twice as long as without it and they want to make money on service and selling new cars. And i don't think the factory oil is synthetic, i changed out mine at 5,000 miles and it was pretty dirty already and it smelled like dino oil when i drained it. The mechanic told me they come with regular oil to "break in" the engine.
Click here for a comparision of Amsoil, Castrol GTX and some other oils (http://www.go-synthetic.com/amsoil_testing/amsoil_testing.html)
They wont put synthetic oil in our cars becuase they know it may make it last twice as long as without it and they want to make money on service and selling new cars. And i don't think the factory oil is synthetic, i changed out mine at 5,000 miles and it was pretty dirty already and it smelled like dino oil when i drained it. The mechanic told me they come with regular oil to "break in" the engine.
Click here for a comparision of Amsoil, Castrol GTX and some other oils (http://www.go-synthetic.com/amsoil_testing/amsoil_testing.html)
RACER D12
01-09-2004, 10:28 AM
Post these numbers and your resume and if its true then I will give you a full apology. However we will have to see if these are real.
BadAssAuditude
01-09-2004, 11:37 AM
I agree that good lubrication is necessary but I don't believe in waiting by mileage because the mfgr says so. Therion, it just goes to show; you said yer oil was dirty and smelled @ 5k miles and yet the oil is "recommended" to be changed 8k - 10k miles? (Amsoil recommends 5k - 7k miles) Doesn't that seem a little long, even for synthetic? Not knocking synthetic's abilities (a 'lil expensive but has good lubricating properties), I still stand by the "grit" test. Change the oil as frequently as needed by how gritty the oil feels on the dipstick; synthetic or not and regardless if it "looks" clean. Remember, most people either don't have the time (or the money) to keep the oil "fresh" in their motor. Then there's some people who just flat out don't understand, you know, ignorant...being in the automotive repair business, I've seen quite a few people stand there and argue about how maintenence isn't necessary; morons! That's why they need a new motor. They actually think 100k miles is ALOT of miles and it's time to buy a new car. Oohh, I bet the dealers LOVE that response. The 4 seasons (driving conditions) we have here <or anywhere for that matter> affect how often the oil should be changed. The mfgr's recommendations are based on an "average". If (most) people weren't "told" when to change the oil then they'd never change it or not change it on a regular basis. Remember 600k miles on one motor (without synthetic) is rare, but possible. :)
therion
01-09-2004, 03:53 PM
BadassAuditude (finally spelled your name RIGHT hehehe), I agree the grit test is a good means of telling if the oil is suitable for continued usage or not. The color doesn't really mean that much, for example in Diesel motors you change the oil and within an hour the oil is Jet black, does this mean it's bad?? no absolutly not it's just becuase of the soot and other things in diesel oil. Gasoline will darken the oil to brown after usage which is ok but when it's black that means too much gas is in your oil and you should change it. The only REAL way to determine how good the oil is is to take an oil analysis test.
Actually, For small turboed engines like the 1.8t I would change it every 7,000 miles or so using Amsoil, depending on how you drive. Remember short trips and cold starts account for the most oil degradation. Amsoil W-30 Motor Oil is highly resistant to volatility. For example, in heat that causes conventional motor oils to lose as much as 25 percent of their mass over 5,000miles, AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil loses less than ten percent in that same time. This is why people have "clogged" oil pickups becuase the conventional dino oil is pretty much done after 5,000 miles (as i found out myself) and by going 10,000 miles is just torturing your engine. This is one of the most important factors when safely extending drain intervals. As well as having a robust additive package, which amsoil has. Yeah you are right about the temperature plays a difference in how quick the oil gets ruined. Although this effects petroleum oils alot more than synthetics. They gel up in the winter time making them hard to pump, Amsoil 0W-30 stays fluid even at -40*F! But on Mobil 1 synthetic, i wouldn't go longer than 5,000miles.
It's all very well changing your oil often, but it's not just the oil that helps prevent engine wear. The oil filter does its part too. Dirt is the prime cause of engine wear. Once in, they don't come out easy, but tend to stay there, wearing grooves, grinding and generally messing up your engine. Becuase these filters are designed to not interupt the oil flow (full flow as they are called), they cannot filter out the smaller particles that cause alot of wear also. This is why regular oil changes are a necessity, because these tiny little things can be the most damaging to your engine. This is the other major factor when considering extending intervals. You should be fine with an OEM Filter, but some cheap filters dont have a number of features that are important. I always change my filters at least every 3 months.
Most important thing: if you start the engine and let it idle for 15 seconds or so before moving off, you can probably add another 100,000 miles to your engine's life. This warms the oil up a tad and makes sure it's in all the most vital areas before you start putting a strain on the engine. Synthetic oils dont account for foolish operation. You can probably toast your engine within 150,000 miles running amsoil if you thrash it all the time.
The last part is the most important becuase even if you use regular oil, you can make it last a decent amount of time if you take care of it. But synthetics will reign in the new car market becuase under the hood temps are much higher in the new cars (pop the hood open on your 1.8t after some spirited driving) so synthetic oils are more mandatory than on the old cars that run cooler. Emissions have alot to do with it too.
Actually, For small turboed engines like the 1.8t I would change it every 7,000 miles or so using Amsoil, depending on how you drive. Remember short trips and cold starts account for the most oil degradation. Amsoil W-30 Motor Oil is highly resistant to volatility. For example, in heat that causes conventional motor oils to lose as much as 25 percent of their mass over 5,000miles, AMSOIL Series 2000 Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil loses less than ten percent in that same time. This is why people have "clogged" oil pickups becuase the conventional dino oil is pretty much done after 5,000 miles (as i found out myself) and by going 10,000 miles is just torturing your engine. This is one of the most important factors when safely extending drain intervals. As well as having a robust additive package, which amsoil has. Yeah you are right about the temperature plays a difference in how quick the oil gets ruined. Although this effects petroleum oils alot more than synthetics. They gel up in the winter time making them hard to pump, Amsoil 0W-30 stays fluid even at -40*F! But on Mobil 1 synthetic, i wouldn't go longer than 5,000miles.
It's all very well changing your oil often, but it's not just the oil that helps prevent engine wear. The oil filter does its part too. Dirt is the prime cause of engine wear. Once in, they don't come out easy, but tend to stay there, wearing grooves, grinding and generally messing up your engine. Becuase these filters are designed to not interupt the oil flow (full flow as they are called), they cannot filter out the smaller particles that cause alot of wear also. This is why regular oil changes are a necessity, because these tiny little things can be the most damaging to your engine. This is the other major factor when considering extending intervals. You should be fine with an OEM Filter, but some cheap filters dont have a number of features that are important. I always change my filters at least every 3 months.
Most important thing: if you start the engine and let it idle for 15 seconds or so before moving off, you can probably add another 100,000 miles to your engine's life. This warms the oil up a tad and makes sure it's in all the most vital areas before you start putting a strain on the engine. Synthetic oils dont account for foolish operation. You can probably toast your engine within 150,000 miles running amsoil if you thrash it all the time.
The last part is the most important becuase even if you use regular oil, you can make it last a decent amount of time if you take care of it. But synthetics will reign in the new car market becuase under the hood temps are much higher in the new cars (pop the hood open on your 1.8t after some spirited driving) so synthetic oils are more mandatory than on the old cars that run cooler. Emissions have alot to do with it too.
BadAssAuditude
01-09-2004, 07:16 PM
Yep. That's all very true. You pretty much summed up what I meant, thanks for elucidating for those who didn't know. I always change my oil filter, too. I didn't mention it 'cause, to me, it's part of performing an oil change. Some change it every other oil change but, like you, find it necessary to do it every time. :) O.E. filter is what I prefer but I found Wix to be acceptable, too. Fram? Hell no. But that's just me.
BTW, it's also a good idea to let the engine idle for a few seconds before shutting it off after putting a heavy load on it (driving uphill for example).
BTW, it's also a good idea to let the engine idle for a few seconds before shutting it off after putting a heavy load on it (driving uphill for example).
therion
01-09-2004, 07:25 PM
Yep. That's all very true. You pretty much summed up what I meant, thanks for elucidating for those who didn't know. I always change my oil filter, too. I didn't mention it 'cause, to me, it's part of performing an oil change. Some change it every other oil change but, like you, find it necessary to do it every time. :) O.E. filter is what I prefer but I found Wix to be acceptable, too. Fram? Hell no. But that's just me.
BTW, it's also a good idea to let the engine idle for a few seconds before shutting it off after putting a heavy load on it (driving uphill for example).
Yeah your right it's good to idle it before turning it off. Thats the stupidest idea ever to change your oil filter every other oil change, since there is about a half of quart of old oil IN the filter + the fact the filter can be plugged up with dirt and can hinder oil flow. Yeah Fram sucks! my friend put one on his car and it leaked a bunch of oil out and he almost blew his motor. Umm Purolator are really good quality filters too. Amsoil super duty SDF have are the best though. (they are guaranteed to last 7,000miles).
*edit* Those Wix filters have the two most important features :) the By-Pass Valve, and Anti-Drain Back Valve. Thanks i didnt even know about this filter.
BTW, it's also a good idea to let the engine idle for a few seconds before shutting it off after putting a heavy load on it (driving uphill for example).
Yeah your right it's good to idle it before turning it off. Thats the stupidest idea ever to change your oil filter every other oil change, since there is about a half of quart of old oil IN the filter + the fact the filter can be plugged up with dirt and can hinder oil flow. Yeah Fram sucks! my friend put one on his car and it leaked a bunch of oil out and he almost blew his motor. Umm Purolator are really good quality filters too. Amsoil super duty SDF have are the best though. (they are guaranteed to last 7,000miles).
*edit* Those Wix filters have the two most important features :) the By-Pass Valve, and Anti-Drain Back Valve. Thanks i didnt even know about this filter.
BadAssAuditude
01-09-2004, 07:47 PM
You just now heard of Wix? Did you look 'em up before you just replied? :)
therion
01-09-2004, 07:51 PM
You just now heard of Wix? Did you look 'em up before you just replied? :)
Yeah i checked out their website and cheated alittle bit. Yeah cus i only used Purolators, Motorcraft, and now using Amsoil filters in my cars. The Amsoil filter is probably the best.
Yeah i checked out their website and cheated alittle bit. Yeah cus i only used Purolators, Motorcraft, and now using Amsoil filters in my cars. The Amsoil filter is probably the best.
BadAssAuditude
01-09-2004, 07:54 PM
Right on! :naughty:
I wonder what GlennPeters would say about the filters....hhmmm? :rolleyes:
I wonder what GlennPeters would say about the filters....hhmmm? :rolleyes:
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