complete swap in 2nd gen

anyone know of a common swap into an 82 civicim looking for motor trans wiring harness and ecu. ill need custom motor mounts and half shafts, but id like to upgrade to a brake setup off a newer ride also. :bandit:

For motor mounts check out www.hasport.com

Originally posted by Beyond Imagination
For motor mounts check out www.hasport.com

Im a HASport dealer now...

And I also have JDM swaps...

Wow, hehehe contact me maybe we can work something out!


nickt@redime.com

Originally posted by sparq


Im a HASport dealer now...

And I also have JDM swaps...

Wow, hehehe contact me maybe we can work something out!


nickt@redime.com

Hmm... I am looking for a 88-91 b16a :licker: Do you think you could work something out here?!?

Originally posted by 91HBSi


Hmm... I am looking for a 88-91 b16a :licker: Do you think you could work something out here?!?

Absolutely... hit me up on AIM, ICQ, or EMAIL (preferred) just mention you are from PH (errr Automotive forums... whatever)

nickt@redime.com
ICQ: 2169035
AIM: Foreisp

Originally posted by 82civicwagon
anyone know of a common swap into an 82 civicim looking for motor trans wiring harness and ecu. ill need custom motor mounts and half shafts, but id like to upgrade to a brake setup off a newer ride also. :bandit:


Well the easiest swap into your car is the old Carbed Turbo engine from the First Honda City Turbo, if you can find one its a straight bolt in.
Anything else would require rewiring and relumbing all the fuel lines for fuel injection.
If you really want to make an old civic go fast then start with an RS, comes standard with bigger brakes, I think differnt struts.
Then it will be a challange getting something like a B16a in to it.
Your not only talking about custom engine mounts, but also axles, or wheel hubs as yours will not match the b16a gear box, and the b16a axles will not match your hubs.
Its a lot of work for just a back yard mechanic to accomplish and it wont be cheap.
You would be better of just building up the engine thats already in there, take it out as close as you can to 1300 and either turbo it, or get the head ported, Find the Mugen Cam (they are still avliable) or get a custom one ground and feed it all with some webbers. Find a 5sp and you've got your self a car with plenty of potential to embrass some more modern cars. If you lower it a little, and uprate all the springs and shocks you will have a real autocross weapon.

But if you want to beat mustangs and GSR's then expect to spend a lot of money and a lot of time.

Originally posted by Moppie



Well the easiest swap into your car is the old Carbed Turbo engine from the First Honda City Turbo, if you can find one its a straight bolt in.
Anything else would require rewiring and relumbing all the fuel lines for fuel injection.
If you really want to make an old civic go fast then start with an RS, comes standard with bigger brakes, I think differnt struts.
Then it will be a challange getting something like a B16a in to it.
Your not only talking about custom engine mounts, but also axles, or wheel hubs as yours will not match the b16a gear box, and the b16a axles will not match your hubs.
Its a lot of work for just a back yard mechanic to accomplish and it wont be cheap.
You would be better of just building up the engine thats already in there, take it out as close as you can to 1300 and either turbo it, or get the head ported, Find the Mugen Cam (they are still avliable) or get a custom one ground and feed it all with some webbers. Find a 5sp and you've got your self a car with plenty of potential to embrass some more modern cars. If you lower it a little, and uprate all the springs and shocks you will have a real autocross weapon.

But if you want to beat mustangs and GSR's then expect to spend a lot of money and a lot of time.


i never knew that honda made a factory turbo motor. where might i start looking for one. a direct bolt in is always easier and cheaper, but until now i didnt know of any.

on the second matter, ive heard of many but never seen with my own eyes of b16's in first and second gen. civic's. size of a task dose'nt bother me, i have acess to a hoist that is actually a little too big for my car due to the short wheelbase. unlimited tools, and i'm much more than just a backyard mechanic. if you checked my profile you will see that i am a ford service technician dooing this kind of thing as my livelyhood.

i have many ideas but dont know if they will work. i've actually been thinking as to wether or not the diamater of the base of the strut where it connects with the spindle is the same as newer hondas in the possibility of a spindle swap to upgrade to larger rotors and hubs that will fit b16 halfshaft's. converting from carburation to fuel injection has always been in the plan, and i have strongly considered forced induction compared to natural aspiration.

in a nutshell i want to see with my own eyes a 2nd gen civic that has a b16 or even possibly a b18 in it so i can see exactly what it takes. i would also like to find out more about that honda turbo motor.:smoka:

There were several Turbo'd hondas all made at about the same time.
There were two Turbo'd versions of the honda city, one feed by a carb the other with Fuel injection. Both were sold only in the Japan and here in New Zealand and, and both are fast little cars. Finding one in japan is still possible, but I have no idea how hard it would be to get the engine sent to the states. I do know they are capable of well over 200hp with little work, and are a direct bolt into your car.
I do know you can stil by the mugen Turbo kit for your car though.

Check this out. http://hybrid.honda-perf.org/news/oldcivic.html

There was also a Turbo version of the 1st gen CRX, (iv seen two of them, but have no idea how they performed) and also a Twin Turbo V6 Legend, (Iv seen a few of these here, and they are pretty quick for a big heavy car)


Any way it sounds like your pretty well equiped to do any swap you need to, unforunatly I have no idea where you will find info on putting a B16a into a 2g Civic. I know of one put into Mini, (yes a mini) and Iv also heard of people putting them into 1g and 2g Civics. Might be time to exercise the search engines. :)

Any way, I believe the 1g Accord frount brakes and hubs will swap onto the early civic struts, which combined with some good pads should give you plenty of stopping power.
But it might be easier to use the SiR frount axles and hubs, and prehaps convert your struts to fit them. That way you get the larger SiR brakes and can use the SiR axles.
What ever version of the B16a you get, you will need either a Y1, J1 or YS1 gearbox which all have a cable clutch.
The Y1 has the tallest ratios and is the most common, while the YS1 has the shortest ratios and is the hardest to find. All 3 came with an LSD option. (which I highly recomend, I have traction troubles in my car, and a 2g is a LOT lighter)

As for customizing engine mounts etc, well you will need to get the engine in the car and see what can be made to go where, but there are 4 mounts on the B16a and gear box.
It might also be an idea to pay some attention to chassis strength, as your providing a huge increase in Torque.

Anyway, thats enough ranting for now, feel free to keep asking questions, and we will answer what we can.
I now a guy who's racing a worked over 2g RS Civic, Ill ask him whats he done regarding suspension and brakes etc.

Originally posted by Moppie



Well the easiest swap into your car is the old Carbed Turbo engine from the First Honda City Turbo, if you can find one its a straight bolt in.
Anything else would require rewiring and relumbing all the fuel lines for fuel injection.
If you really want to make an old civic go fast then start with an RS, comes standard with bigger brakes, I think differnt struts.
Then it will be a challange getting something like a B16a in to it.
Your not only talking about custom engine mounts, but also axles, or wheel hubs as yours will not match the b16a gear box, and the b16a axles will not match your hubs.
Its a lot of work for just a back yard mechanic to accomplish and it wont be cheap.
You would be better of just building up the engine thats already in there, take it out as close as you can to 1300 and either turbo it, or get the head ported, Find the Mugen Cam (they are still avliable) or get a custom one ground and feed it all with some webbers. Find a 5sp and you've got your self a car with plenty of potential to embrass some more modern cars. If you lower it a little, and uprate all the springs and shocks you will have a real autocross weapon.

But if you want to beat mustangs and GSR's then expect to spend a lot of money and a lot of time.

But would it really be worth importing it, I mean don't those things have really low hp ratings?

P.s. I am a former PH member WOOOHOO!!! I still go to the site.

:D thanks for the info on the honda city, youve opened my eyes to something that us boys in the states dont see to often and i think i'm getting a sweettooth for it! :D


and yes i really do think it would be worth it to import the motor, $hit i'd import the whole car.:smoka:

after reading that article at
http://hybrid.honda-perf.org/news/oldcivic.html
ive found answers to some questions that have been bugging me for a while.

Originally posted by 82civicwagon
:D thanks for the info on the honda city, youve opened my eyes to something that us boys in the states dont see to often and i think i'm getting a sweettooth for it! :D


Your quite welcome, There was one for sale in the US on e-bay sometime ago, so there is at least on already in the states.
However I would work on just getting an engine shipped over.
Your $ is so strong at the moment it wont cost to much at your end, and as the Hybrid-Honda page said, they are capable of 200hp. :D
(I have to get some bits for my car, so Ill have an ask on rough price and how avliable they are just to give you an idea of what your looking at).
Otherwise just get hold of your local Mugen supplier, or even better get in touch with Mugen in Japan, as they still stock and sell the Turbo kit, that was fitted to the City.

Of course if you want to get a city, there are plenty left over here, altough most are suffering from terminal cancer, something all the Citys had HUGE problems with.

Otherwise have good hunt with some differnt search engines, I Know there's more City and 2g Civic related material out there, it just requires a bit of effort to find it.

:cool:

Almost any engine can be installed in the 1st and 2nd gen Civic. I've seen some pics of 1st gens with SOHC VTEC, ZC and City Turbo engines. The 2nd gen is a little bigger so fitting an engine will be easier. I'll attach a pic of a 2nd gen with a B16 being installed. Also, I have a pic of a 2nd gen with the B20/B16 combo but I have to find it.

Wow, thats a cool pic!

I did little more talking to people, including a guy whos now building his 2nd EB race car.
His current car is useing standard read drums, but frount discs and calibers from a 1st gen Accord. He has no throuble with brakes, and often out brakes faster cars with flash after market calipers and discs.

The B16a is also apprently a little to long, and requires some modification to the engine bay to squeeze it all in there. as well as shortened axles, as the EF has a much wider frount track.

However the Civic Wagon is slightly larger all over, and has a much larger engine bay, but then you have to worry about the cart sprung rear end staying on the road with all that power draging it down the road by the front end.

i'll have to see if i can find a 1st gen that i can get the brakes off of, conviently at the moment i need new calipers.:)

Moppie: All City turbos were PGMFI, not carburettored. The City Turbo will drop straight into the 2G Civic Chassis as they share the same castings on the block. I've done the City Turbo to SBC (1G) swap and it required a stabiliser bar mod - unneccessary for the 2G as it shares the same mounts with the City. I used a Wolf3D programmable comp (easier to wire up than the factory one) and added a front mounted intercooler (City Turbo was top located - next to useless as it soaked up heat). Use the existing shift linkage. Driveshafts stayed the same as they would with a 2G - same length and input. Use a City Turbo gearbox - it has better ratios for the turbo engine than a 2G gearbox - it runs out to 90km/h in second.

Brakes - when I did the swap on my SBC('s), I actually used the 2G arms and hubs as they let me go from the 120mm PCD to the better 100mm PCD - giving a better range of wheels to draw from. CRX, Accord or Integra brakes will drop on with minimum hassle - I used Accord. I also used '81 Wagon drums at the back - forget disks all around - in a 700 kilo car it's not worth the hassle. City turbo brakes will bolt straight up to a 2G if you get a front cut.

I popped the boost up to 15 lbs and the damn thing was a rocket. I've just spotted a straight SBC shell at a wreckers for 300bucks - blown engine. Guess what I'm seriously thinking about doing... :D

I love my SiR... but I love modifying 1Gs even more, so the SiR is going to stay a daily driver while I build up a car to run faster than it.

Going to stop rambling now :)

Originally posted by sparq


Im a HASport dealer now...

And I also have JDM swaps...

Wow, hehehe contact me maybe we can work something out!


nickt@redime.com


how much for the hasport mounts and linkage for a b16 into a 86 crx?

BTW - there was a "S" version of the 2G Civic - it cam with red piping on the seats but I'm not too sure if had engine enhancements.

Now I'm not too sure if the RS got the EN series 1335 in their 2Gs or just got the 1500 CVCC. I think that it was a 1335 with a shit head on it similar to the minis with intake and exhaust on the same side ( this is thinking back when I really researched the 1G/2G mods). Canada, Australia, Japan all got a good head (nothing like good head).

If you have the 1335 with the crossflow head there are some nice mods for it. Easiest is a 1G RS twin mikuni carb and manifold bolt-on. You could also go single 40mm webber or twin 35mm DellOrtos. Also, Jackson Racing used to do twin 40mm webbers (plus distributor relocator) or track down a Mugen quad-keihin setup. Add a Mugen R1 cam (best for the street) or a wild Yoshimura cam (yoshis only really make power at 6000-7500 though). To that you could go RS 1200 4-2-1 spec extractors or Jackson Racing 4-1 headers (I had a set of these for a 1G - looked awesom curling out through the lower grill and under the car - nicknamed cat scorchers 'cause one of my cats fried itself on mine :D. I can get regrinds of the Mugen cam, plus the R2 and R3 spec. Finall, drop in goldwing 73mm pistons to bump compression and capacity.

Keep in mind that anything up to a D16 engine will go in. But the original all-alloy engines were light - 2 of us could physically lift engine and gearbox out of a 1G or 2G. As you get heavier, you ruin the handling. So yes a B16A or ZC might go in, but will it handle?

Originally posted by Setanta
Moppie: All City turbos were PGMFI, not carburettored.

Nice rant, but did I ever say the City Turbo was carbed?
The early one's used a single point injection, and the City Turbo II used Multi point. :)

Good to know that the Civic and teg brakes will also work, Ill pass that onto my mate.
As far as I know all the EN and EB civics had a cross flow head, its much easier to fit into a FWD configeration. (I think the EN RS used a cross flow head on an EB block, but Im not very sure of it. However like the frount end of our SiRs shares parts with the later EG I wouldn't put it past Honda.)

Best exhaust mod for a 2g is to run the headers out the frount grill beside the radiator, then over the frount of the bumber and back under the car. Apprently the Factory race cars had this and it allows for a much more effciant header design.

My mate has a whole pile of engine bits that came with an RS rally car. It includes a complete NEW unused block, several NEW unused Cranks, New pistons and rods a huge pile of valves, valve springs, etc as well as a huge collection of differnt boby panels and trim. The guy he bought the car off worked for Honda for several years. :)
Its amazing how light a bare block is, you can literaly lift it with one hand and twirl it round. :D

Originally posted by Moppie



Well the easiest swap into your car is the old Carbed Turbo engine from the First Honda City Turbo, if you can find one ...


:finger: Ummm.... "Carbed" = Carburettored in my language :finger:

BTW - I screenshot your post - no editing mr Moderator :D

Oh and I do remember reading somewhere that the US heads were ported on the same side, not crossflow. As I recollect, Oscar Jackson was talking in an article about needing to source a Canadian or JDM/rest of the World crossflow head to get decent power improvements.

It was in regards to Californian emissions laws - what could be done legally and what couldn't. Actually - now I think about it, it might have benn the 1500 CVCC SBC he was talking about as one of the options was to swap a 1G Accord engine in (am I indicating how long ago I read this by that statement? :D )