best turbo system

whats the best turbo system out right now? are twin-turbos good or bad... i read that twin turbos actually slow down intake or something like that. is a garrett t-72 a good turbo for a v8 5.0l and up?

whats the best turbo system out right now? are twin-turbos good or bad... i read that twin turbos actually slow down intake or something like that. is a garrett t-72 a good turbo for a v8 5.0l and up?
Define best.

to complete what 454 said define best for what aplication

Anyway, the best of each application can be had if you have enough money.

There is no single "best" for every application.

I believe he means "Best" as in better than the rest... :cwm27: Geez, I'm a useless poster sometimes.

A twin turbo setup certainly does not slow down intake, but rather it "takes air in". Is that a complicated concept? I've heard of a guy who twin turbo'ed his 1990 Mustang LX (a 5.0). He used a sequential turbo setup, which means that a smaller turbo spools up quickly to produce less boost while a larger turbo spools up slowly to produce substantial boost. Therefore, you can still get decent off the line performance while maintaining top end performance that turbos are known for. However, this setup is difficult and costly because you need to replace a multitude of parts to deal with boost on a n/a vehicle (bigger injectors, bigger fuel pump, reprogrammed ECU to retard ignition during boost, possibly a new block, lower compression pistons, new piston rings/gaskets, heat shielding, etc). Also, to prevent detonation in f/i situations, you need an intercooler or in this case, twin intercoolers (or one massive one). On top of this, you need a custom headers, numerous mandrel-bent pipes, oil lines, turbo lines, and a free-flowing exhaust if you dont already have one.

That's alot to fit under the hood with a V8, isn't it?

That's my :2cents:

One type of turbo setup might be better for your application than another. What kind of car and engine are you wanting to turbocharge? There are so many things to take into account when think about having the best setup. Things like turbo size, intercoolers, number of turbos used, compressor maps, and the list goes on. To be general though I would say that Twin Turbo "Sequential' setups are better for larger displacement engines while a Single Turbo setup in better for smaller engines.

for a 3.4l v6, or a 5.7l v8... or 5.0l v8 305.

for a 3.4l v6, or a 5.7l v8... or 5.0l v8 305.

I would go with a Twin Turbo "Sequential" setup.

sequential isnt as much as far as volume, but pressure.. they use sequenmtial in tractor pullers + high altitude private planes. if you pick the right size turbo, not only will you not worry about lag, but you'll have plenty of boost.. if you will up with 97 octane and have 8:1 compression ratio.. you can count on about 15psi after intercooler.. think twin turbo on V6 V8 applications, and one larger turbo with I4- I6 apps... for a 5.7 or 5.0 engine get a couple t-3's with a .64ish A/R. or smaller.
for the V6 definetly go smaller ro you wont reach full potential.

is t-80 better for a v8 than a t-3. and do all turbos necessarily have to make that gay rice noise? i like the way my car sounds, i dont want it to sound like an angry bee.

There are a couple of sounds related to turbocharging, the sound of the blow off valve, and the sound of the the turbine wheel compressing the air. Some blow off valves are very quiet, how loud just depends on the blow off valve. The sound of the compressor doing it's job depends greatly on the turbo and how much boost it's creating. It's possible to create an ultra quiet turbo system, many stock ones are.

But I don't see why it matters. That's the ricer mentality only in reverse. If my car ran a 10 second 1/4, but sounded like a weed whacker, so be it. The thing that people hate about ricers is that they like to present their cars as ultra fast, race machines, when in actuality they are bone stock. If your car is fast, the people who's opinions actually matter will respect your car no matter how it sounds, because anyone who discriminates based on the sound of a car doesn't know anything about them.

There are a couple of sounds related to turbocharging, the sound of the blow off valve, and the sound of the the turbine wheel compressing the air. Some blow off valves are very quiet, how loud just depends on the blow off valve. The sound of the compressor doing it's job depends greatly on the turbo and how much boost it's creating. It's possible to create an ultra quiet turbo system, many stock ones are.

But I don't see why it matters. That's the ricer mentality only in reverse. If my car ran a 10 second 1/4, but sounded like a weed whacker, so be it. The thing that people hate about ricers is that they like to present their cars as ultra fast, race machines, when in actuality they are bone stock. If your car is fast, the people who's opinions actually matter will respect your car no matter how it sounds, because anyone who discriminates based on the sound of a car doesn't know anything about them.
u seem to know a lot about rice... are u a honda owner?

u seem to know a lot about rice... are u a honda owner?
You don't need to own a Honda to know about rice.

Actually I'm a Dodge and Mazda owner.

u seem to know a lot about rice... are u a honda owner?



actually it is you that are closer to a riceboy since you seem to care so much about the sound of an engine....


what patton said is the farthest from rice....if all you care is about performance and not care what kind of looks and sound that performance comes with...that is the farthest from a riceboy as you can get

riceboy? lol... ok.. my car dont sound like a lawnmower and it kicks 'rice-ass'(riceboy?).

Ok C-A-M-A-R-O do me a favor crack open a fuckin book or do a damn search and get the fuck off of AF. its stupid motha phuckas like you that come here and dont kno shit and expect to learn everything you can jus by asking questions on a forum........ 1st off a ricer is somebody that is fake like you they dont kno shit but to make there cars look ugly to other people when indeed that is their knowledge and money so what ever they want to do is what they want to do..... So u ever down Hondas or Acuras or any other imports for how they sound or look... i bet ur make believe camaro is a rust bucket.. not to mention that there are some beautiful muscle cars... But for crying out loud i kno imports that turn out 15 sec passes stock in a damn 4 cylinder but wait you gotta have 4 more to run the same time...(not downing any of the Vs out there)... All im saying is dont judge a book by its cover man... O yea and about your turbo.... fuck it bore the bitch out rebuild it and give it 150 shot im done with this thread.......................... :loser: :smokin: :nono: :nono:

most guys serious about power (pro drag racers) are using one very large turbo on their V8's.
twins would be better for street applications however.

suck my dick. my rustbucket looks better than any fuckin import and thats a fact, second i ask questions to learn, third, whatever the fuck u drive im sure your just pissed off cuz i dissed japanese cars and u have one... well it was a joke get over it. and dont be dissin camaros bitch, it'll take you like $20k to "hook" up your cheapshit honda or acura to beat a stock 4th gen z28. GO FUCK YOURSELF YOU WHINY BITCH

oh and as for "make-belive camaro" my vin number is 2G1FP22S7R2180792... feelin stupid yet... go to the camaro forums and ask someone if they ever got beat by a honda or acura... enlighten yourself fool.

95 honda civic. roflmao.. burn that bitch and bury it deep...

i bet ur make believe camaro is a rust bucket.. not to mention that there are some beautiful muscle cars... But for crying out loud i kno imports that turn out 15 sec passes stock in a damn 4 cylinder but wait you gotta have 4 more to run the same time
ok.. to start off. my camaro looks better than any japanese cars i've seen yet, and i like some japanese cars myself, not hondas or acuras, but eclipse and 3000gt look hot, but still they DO NOT match up to a camaro. 15 sec is kinda slow, a 4th gen z28 can do mid 12s to low 13s STOCK. and the reason japanese cars can do that with 4 cyl, is that their lighter (thats the only positive i see about them), and how dare you call my car rice, camaro is an american muscle car, there aint no way to rice it up, fuckin, even if u do hook it up, the parts cost like 5 times more than japanese car parts. and holy shit.. u called a camaro ugly? and u drive a civic? please, any camaro looks better than a civic. shit the only decent cars honda put out was nsx and s2000, but THEY STILL SLOWER than camaros. the turbo by the way, was not for my camaro, it was for a friend with a 1984 camaro, i would never put that SHIT in my car. wow...ok... i gotta stop myself.

Ok C-A-M-A-R-O do me a favor crack open a fuckin book or do a damn search and get the fuck off of AF. its stupid motha phuckas like you that come here and dont kno shit and expect to learn everything you can jus by asking questions on a forum........

I hate to break it you, but AF, like the internet in general, is here for information purposes. Coming here to learn is not a crime. Talking smack about things you don't understand is a different matter, but we'll get to that in a minute.

All im saying is dont judge a book by its cover man...

Practice what you preach: don't jump to conclusions about someone you don't even know.

Okay, your turn now.

ok.. to start off. my camaro looks better than any japanese cars i've seen yet, and i like some japanese cars myself, not hondas or acuras, but eclipse and 3000gt look hot, but still they DO NOT match up to a camaro.

You're right about the eclipse, but the 3000GT is a different story. Assuming that you're talking about the Z28, with it's lovely LS1 swiped from the Corvette, then it's only fair to compare to the 3000GT VR-4...

15 sec is kinda slow, a 4th gen z28 can do mid 12s to low 13s STOCK. and the reason japanese cars can do that with 4 cyl, is that their lighter (thats the only positive i see about them),

The VR-4 has pretty much the same average ETs through the 90s as your beloved Z28, which are mid 13s to mid 14s, depending on year. And BTW, the VR-4 is heavier than the Camaro. Not all Japanese cars are featherweights.

and how dare you call my car rice, camaro is an american muscle car, there aint no way to rice it up, fuckin, even if u do hook it up, the parts cost like 5 times more than japanese car parts.

You can rice up any car. In fact, a lot of the companies that make "ricer gear" for imports make it for domestics as well, APC (A for American) is one of the worst offenders. 5 times more than Japanese car parts? Is this supposed to be a good thing? Regardless, it is complete nonsense. Go call a junkyard and ask them how much they want for a Civic quarter panel.

and holy shit.. u called a camaro ugly? and u drive a civic? please, any camaro looks better than a civic.

Asthetics are completely subjective; this is a pointless argument.

shit the only decent cars honda put out was nsx and s2000, but THEY STILL SLOWER than camaros. the turbo by the way, was not for my camaro, it was for a friend with a 1984 camaro, i would never put that SHIT in my car. wow...ok... i gotta stop myself.

No, let me stop you. You're using very limited criteria to determine that Honda only produces two decent cars, and even then, you don't have your facts straight. The NSX's performance has varied over the years, but late models average about .35 seconds faster in the 1/4 mile. And as for the turbocharger, that "shit" was pioneered by GM, just to let you know.

Do you see how asinine this whole thing is? Both of you are just running your mouths, spouting garbage and taking this thread as far OT as possible. This is how threads get closed without the original questions ever being answered. If you don't know what you're talking about, watch and learn, ask questions. And if you do know what you're talking about, present the information is a polite, acceptable form to anyone who asks. Mutal respect and cooperation are the fuel that these boards run on, and this thread is running very lean. So why don't we do everybody a favor and try to act civilized.

Okay, who wants to get us back on topic?

boy are you a tard.
and an angry one at that.
1. Import parts cost more than domestics.
I don't know how many times I have been surprised to learn the guy with a honda paid almost as much for his 1 HEADER as I paid for my whole exhaust system.
2. muscle cars are not that heavy, and imports are not that light.
1971 Ford Mustang Boss 351..............3452 Lbs
1998 Toyota Supra TT....................3505 Lbs
1970 Plymouth 'Cuda AAR.................3515 Lbs
1969 AMC AMX............................3090 Lbs
2000 Lexus GS400........................3693 Lbs
1969 Buick GS400........................3594 Lbs
1970 Chevy Camaro SS....................3172 Lbs
2003 Mitsubishi Lancer Evo VII..........3298 Lbs
2004 Mazada RX-8........................2940 Lbs
1970 Ford Maverick......................2487 Lbs
2004 Honda Civic........................2736 Lbs
2004 Nissian 350 Z......................3225 Lbs
2002 Chevy Camaro Z28...................3439 Lbs
1970 Plymouth Duster 340................3105 Lbs
1970 Datsun 240Z........................2355 Lbs
1970 Plymouth Road Runner (383).........3457 Lbs
1999 Nissian Skyline R34................3395 Lbs
1981 Delorean DMC-12....................2840 Lbs
2001 Honda S2000........................2810 Lbs
2001 Corvette Z06.......................3215 Lbs
1963 Corvette...........................3015 Lbs

3. As far as getting abck on topic goes, I don't think there is such a thing as one "best" turbo system, but one large turbo is the way to go for your "friends" 84 camaro. because of course, you, in your infinite wisom would never want to put anything as stupid as a cheap power adder on to your car.
stick to your giant cam and crappy power band.

Holyterror - pwnage! :D

ok... by parts i meant body kits. and rice is japanese thats where the term came from didnt it? and i never sed i dont like japanese cars, its just dont like those fuckin noisemakers that barely pull, which is why i dont want my car to sound like a weedwacker, that doesnt make me a "riceboy" just cuz i dont wanna hear that crappy noise. ok maybe 3000gt can pull about the same speed as a z28 but wait a sec. it has a 6 cylinder engine, they cant take a beating like a v8 can, a v8 can stay up on speed longer. and most ppl that own japanese cars dont drive cars like 3000gt, but it pisses me off when they buzz their little 2 liters at me, like they're a challenge for me. i've beaten a 2004 "hooked-up" maxima, and my car is a 1994 with nearly 180k miles. im sorry if i offended anyone with a honda, i meant it as a joke, but damn straight im mad, this fucker posted this shit out of nowhere, on like a month old thread. ok... "dont judge a book by its cover" ... thats reasonable. but sayin i dont know nothing, just cuz i dont turn wrenches for a living is not cool.

back to the topic, MOST japanese cars are lighter than domestics, dont tell me a civic weighs more than a camaro. yes I know that most japanese cars are assembled in usa, but this thread was never about japanese cars. rice is making your car LOOK/SOUND fast when its not, but who sed my car aint fast? i just asked if all turbos make that noise, cuz i dont like it. i didnt say a car that makes that noise is worse than mine. its not even about cars, its ppl like most honda owners, buy those old crx's and civic's for a couple of hundred bucks, put a $200 polyurethane kit on it, a shitcan exhaust, and just drive around makin noise like it meant somethin. real fast japanese cars, like supra, skyline, etc. need 2 turbos and a lotta other junk to run with camaros, corvettes, and mustangs.

anyway.. my "friend" (whatever u meant mustang) asked me to find out if his garret t3 would be worth puttin on his 1984 z28, and would it change the sound of the car.. cuz theres nothing worse than a hearing a camaro sound like a weedwacker. thats all. I agree with u holyterror, but look at the thread, he started runnin his mouth first. and ill bet anythin its cuz he owns a civic.

ok.
I was confused, because most people call parts "parts" and boky kits "bodykits"
also, turbos do not make much sound, that is mostly the exhaust. they will, however, make your exhaust a little more quiet.

The muffler makes the sound of the exhaust, be it either sounding like a weedwhacker or the throaty V8 sound.
The turbo will give "your friend" more of a sucking sound under his hood. That and the sound of the blow off valve when he let's off the gas.

The definition of a good turbo kit varies per car and how it is applied. The biggest part in any forced induction application is the tuning. Your friend could run the biggest turbo in the world and only make 30 more HP than stock.

How do I judge a good system? I look at the dyno sheets and psi levels run and then find out some info about the N/A version of the same engine. That way I can find out how much whp per 1 psi the turbo kit puts out. In my experience a good system puts out more than 15 whp per 1 psi.

As an example:
There is a turbocharged 3rd gen Eclipse. The car dyno's at 264whp at 8.5 psi.
The stock car dyno's at 117 whp.
Subtract the 117 from 264 and you get 147. This is the power that the turbo kit makes.
Divide the 147 by 8.5 and you get 17.29
This is the whp per 1 psi.

I have also seen turbocharged Preludes making only 6 whp per 1 psi.

So the kit is all in the tuning.

ok wtf is up with the quotes around 'your friend', and wait.. doesnt the vr4 have twin turbos? and it's still slower than z28? i know supra's gotta be faster than z28 tho.. but z28 doesn't have twin turbos. in the eclipse manual it says the automatic versions with 4 cyl have 205hp and the 5-speeds got 214hp @6000 rpm thats for the '96 models. i might buy it, cuz i wanna see why ppl like them, and THEN ill put that SHIT in there. i can get it for about $800 from the sherif, seized w/42k miles. the rear bumper is messed up, but thats about it. btw... wats a 'boky kit'? im sorry, i dont understand aircraft-mechanic tech terms.

body kit / boky kit - that was a typo.
to answer your question, the "your friend" thing was made in reference to another thread where someone pointed out that it seems like an awfull lot of people ask questions for a friend or about a friends car.
the reason the Vr4 is slower than the z28 is that it is heavier, has AWD, and has relatively tame turbos on a v6. The supra has better turbos, RWD, and weighs about the same as the camaro.
About the Eclipse, I seriosly doubt the manual has an extra 40 HP.
turbo would be more than the cost of the car, but if that's what you want, go for it.
to me the money would be better spent making a fast car faster than a slow car fast.

eclipse is slow? it says 165 on the speedo. well if anything, i can resell it for a lot more than $800, i've seen em go for as much as 8k with 100k miles. not 40 extra hp, 9... 214-205?.. i didnt believe it either... cuz the turbo model it says 140, but for the regular it shows 205.. thats a lot from a 4 cyl.

I can't beleive you honestly equate a speedometer with a fast car.
I really hope you don't.
really.

I can't beleive you honestly equate a speedometer with a fast car.
I really hope you don't.
really.
lol.. i knew u were gonna say somethin like that. but really why would they put a 165 speedo if it cant go 165? i mean i know speedo doesnt mean shit but stock speedo, why would they make it 165? just to raise the insurance rates? i mean camaros got a 155 speedo, but it can go more like 160-170 stock from what i've read. i know mine cant, cuz that shit is old, and got a lot of mileage.. unless i rebuild it. but the ls1 camaros can do more than 155.

It's called marketing.
what kind of people buy the eclipse?
young people who want to believe their car is fast.
same type of people who buy a celica.
And the speedo is usually not too accurate above 150 on passenger cars anyway.
there is NO WAY that car can do over 140.
it might get 150 with a turbo.

The 2nd Gen eclipse (95-99) are rated at 210 HP from Mitsubishi. Turbo models anyway. Another thing you are forgetting about the turbos. The Supra is in inline 6 cylinder with sequential turbo's. That means one small one for fast response and low boost. As the RPM's increase, the larger turbo begins to make high boost and more power.
The 3K GT VR4 is a V6 with twin turbo's, not sequential. Each bank of the V6 has a 14b turbo which is fairly small. So each turbo can only put out so much power. The AWD does help a little.

Oh, both the Supra TT and VR4 are rated at ~280HP. Whether that is what they actually lay down or not is another story.

Car are also drag limited in what speeds they are able to attain. The speedo might say 150 (like mine does), the gear ratio's might be able to let the car up to 172 mph (like mine do), but the drag on the car limits it to about ~120-130 mph. But as you add power, the limits of drag decrease becuase the power of the car is more than the power of drag.

hp ratings are always lower than the actual hp, at least on serious cars. i thought the new supra makes 800hp. but its gotta be shipped from Japan.

hp ratings are always lower than the actual hp, at least on serious cars. i thought the new supra makes 800hp. but its gotta be shipped from Japan.
Why do you say that HP is underrated on serious cars?

cuz cars like camaros are rated at 325hp when they really put out like 370 from the factory, supra cannot be 280hp it has to be more, and practically all the fast cars have more than their rated hp, and if a "sports car" like eclipse dynos at 117hp and is rated at 214hp it must be a bit overrated. plus, most domestics (corvette, camaro, mustang, firebird) underrate hp to keep insurance rates down. the wannabe fast cars overrate hp to make them look good.

Horsepower ratings depend on the company. The F-Body's are rated at the wheels, not the flywheel. Most companies rate horsepower at the flywheel. Car's can lose up to 30% of their power thru the drivetrain.

The 3rd Gen eclipse (mine) is rated to be 154HP. the car dyno's at 103 whp, automatic wise. I have added an intake on mine and my car dyno's 114 whp. The 117 whp eclipse is the 3rd gen manual transmission. Both 4 cyl models anyway.

That said the 2G eclipse turbo's which are rated to 210HP are putting down maybe around 165 whp.

Some companies do lower their car's power ratings for insurance reason. For example, the SRT-4. Dodge claims the car makes 215HP. That would mean maybe around 180 whp. Wrong. The car lays down about 223 whp and 250 wtq in stock trim. And for 2004, Dodge has upped the power to 230HP and added a Quaife LSD. The stock 1/4 mile times can be as low as 13.39 seconds.

The stock MKIV supras dyno in at around 288whp. And i was wrong in my previous claim. Toyota says they have 320HP. Same for the VR4.

Some things you have to know:

Japan used to (maybe it still does) have a horsepower limit on its cars. I'm sure it's gone now, but that's why lots of their cars were rated 276/280HP.

GM underrates its F-bodies so that the Corvette's HP doesn't seem as low. Basically they are hyping up their higher-end stuff.

03 mustang cobra is the same way.
rated lower than actual HP, and 1/4 times are higher in tests than they actually are.

The same thing happened to the original Neons, although for a different reason; they underrated the '95 SOHC because it made almost as much power as the more expensive DOHC, and Chrysler didn't want it to make their more expensive model look stupid. The next year of production they detuned the SOHC cam so it actually made less power. There are lots of reasons a manufacturer may underrate a cars hp.

well u guys if you worried about ur car soundin like a "angry bee" dont be ever hear of a "buick grand national" they dont sound like and angry bee and they are V6's and they have some rumble to them. so i wouldnt be worried about the sound of a rice. sry for being so late on this but i jsut read this thread on a google link.

i have a 04 toyota celica gt and i cant find a turbo kit for it. all i find are kits for the gts. can i use the gts kit for the gt? also, what additional things must i do to my engine before installing a turbo? i dont wanna blow anything up under the hood. its my only car lol.

Start your own thread in the forced induction forum. This thread is dead.