what v8 would you choose?

This winter I'm swaping a v8 into my Firebird which right now has a extremely slow 3.1, I mean my smoking 350 truck with 210,000 miles on it is faster then this thing :rofl:

anyway, my dad is a mannic and in his days has had some nice cars, his latest which he got rid of a few years back was a 66 gto that ran 5.5 in 1/8 and now hes building a 502 with 900hp that hes putting in a 69 camaro or firebird.........anyway

my dad and I have thought things out and have come to the conclustion that I want to get a 400small block and build it up with dual carbs. I'd like to know what you all think about that and opinions, such as if I bore and stroke would it be 427.....or should I do a built 305 or 350 vs the 400.........I mean really they are pretty much the same but I see more poltenional with the 400 because it has 1.1litres over the 350......anyway drop your opinions!

Is this going to be a daily driver or a weekend strip car?
Either way if you drop a big engine then it's not just the engine that's going to be changed. You are talking major money pit. You'll change out the tranny, rear end, suspension, etc. Your best bet would be to find a 350 TPI engine and get it worked on. This way you'll have a good strong engine you can drive everyday and still be able to work on it. You'll still have to swap the tranny if you don't have a 4L60(can't remember), and also get bigger wheels too.
Check out thirdgen.org if you haven't already.

-Ozzy

well first off all for some reason my car came with a Formula Suspention Package and a 700R4 tranny.....how I know? my dad ran all the numbers.....oh and of course bigger tires along with 3.73 posi, I got all that shit set......and this car isn't a daily driver, it's intended souling for a plasure/crusing/weekend car

Thanks for all the advice :thumbsup:

That's cool, sounds like you got a good working partner. You still might have to get the tranny beefed up some since the 700R-4 has it's limitation on the power it can handle. A 400 ci small block sounds like a winner to me. Good torque and HP yet not too much of a gas guzzler even for weekend drives. Good luck.

-Ozzy

Change the whole rear end, the stock ones are very weak.

I would go witha 350, because they are relatively cheap but still have great power potential.

a 400 would be better then a 350 just for torque

but if your looking for all out power torque sound and fun try finding a 455 and doing some work to it

I have a link with all the information on dropping a 455 in it. Now that would be a different car thats for sure ;)

There is a 3rd gen in my town running a 455. One quick car. Plus its a true Pontiac.

I think the 350 is the best. It should be able to rev higher and will still have good torque. I read I think a while back that the 400 block and heads have bad water passages compare to 327/350 block. I could be wrong though. The 400 sbc was never intended to be a performance motor as they never even put a 4bbl on it from the factory. But then again many 400's have gone fast on the tracks. I think 350 is the best all around choice then 400 and not the 305 unless it was a low buck daily driver.

I think the 350 is the best. It should be able to rev higher and will still have good torque. I read I think a while back that the 400 block and heads have bad water passages compare to 327/350 block. I could be wrong though. The 400 sbc was never intended to be a performance motor as they never even put a 4bbl on it from the factory. But then again many 400's have gone fast on the tracks. I think 350 is the best all around choice then 400 and not the 305 unless it was a low buck daily driver. As for tranny go with a th350 since its gonna be a weekend toy and find a stronger rear end.

what are you talking about a 400 not intended for a hi-po motor???

ever heard of a ram air 400? 375hp

and 400 did come with 4bbls...

you need to re-read some of your info

what are you talking about a 400 not intended for a hi-po motor??? ever heard of a ram air 400? 375hp

and 400 did come with 4bbls...

you need to re-read some of your info

Hey smart guy Im talking about the SBC 400 it was always a 2bbl used on chevelles/nova/wagons and I think trucks. Yes the I heard of the pontiac 400 and I know they have rochester 4bbls.

ok so why are you talking about a chevy when everyone else is talkin about pontiacs?

If it ain't going to be a daily driver I got an engine for you.

It's a 350 V8 called the ZZ4.
Here is a list of what it includes.
http://www.gmgoodwrench.com/crate_eng/partlistsmall_zz.shtml

ok so why are you talking about a chevy when everyone else is talkin about pontiacs?
Everyone is talking about chevy 400's, what were you reading??

This guy is selling a 400:

http://www.cardomain.com/member_pages/view_page.pl?page_id=266865&page=2

i dunno what i was reading i just figured that in a pontiac forum we would be talking about good engines....i guess it was my mistake


and i do hope you dont butcher the pontiac name by putting a chevy motor in it........

i dunno what i was reading i just figured that in a pontiac forum we would be talking about good engines....i guess it was my mistake.

Hmmm... Such good engines that GM itself stopped putting them in Pontiacs (except for 2.5 liter turds) in 1980. I've had Pontiac 400's and Chevy 350's and the Chevy engine is much easier to work with, revs harder, and has far more aftermarket support. Easy choice, IMHO...

Hmmm... Such good engines that GM itself stopped putting them in Pontiacs (except for 2.5 liter turds) in 1980. I've had Pontiac 400's and Chevy 350's and the Chevy engine is much easier to work with, revs harder, and has far more aftermarket support. Easy choice, IMHO...

Chevy's good if you're a chevy guy. Just don't put it in a car that came with a Pontiac. There is also the fact that pretty much anyone can rebuild a 350 Chevy, if you can't you should really rethink working on a car. Every magazine and book out there is about building a Chevy 350. (First engine I rebuilt was a Chevy 350 for that reason).

Pontiacs and Chevies are completly different engines. To make a 455 Pontiac perform with a 454 is going to take a whole different approach. Pontiacs are torque monsters with lots of low RPM power, so build the engine to utilize that.

For argument here are a few points for Pontiacs over Chevies.
*Pontiac head bolt holes are blind, chebs go into water
* Pontiacs use 1/2” main and head bolts , chebs use 7/16” bigger bolts means better clamping, no need for extra bolts to make up for the small size.
* Pontiacs have a square, relatively even crush pattern around each bore, chevs do not. Later designs (rats) had to add extra bolts to aid in the design flaw.
* Pontiac head bolt holes are cast strongly into the sides of the block minimizing cylinder distortion. chebs have heads bolt mounts cast to the cylinders causing distortion during torquing.
* There is nothing wrong with a well-prepared Pontiac cast crank. Pontiac cranks have more cross section then a cheb. There are Pontiacs running on the strips in the 9’s, 8’s and 7’s with cast cranks (455 version of the Grocery Getter is an example). If you are building more than 800hp or want to go faster than 8‘s or 7‘s than the crank cost is an issue, not until then. At that point the cheb forging cost is less, but few are building more power than that.
* Pontiacs have a taller deck than any passenger car cheb. this allows longer rods for better rod angularity. tall decks and long rods have become quite fashionalbe in cheb land in recent years. Pontiac had them in 1955.
* Pontiacs have a wider oil pan for more capacity and do not need special stroker pans as the chebs do
*Pontiacs design was so good, only 1 basic design version was needed from 265 to 455 and now with over 600 inch capability. chebs have used 3 designs ( 1955 through the 80’s) and few parts interchange between them.
*Pontiac V-8 component interchage is without parallel in the industry, yes, even over the sbc.
*Lower revving Pontiacs need less expensive valve train components than their cheb counterparts that may need to rev higher to go as fast.
* street/strip Pontiacs usually need less rear gear than a cheb to run into the 12’s which is the goal for many who do not want to add a roll bar. I have known many Pontiac powered cars (even years ago) that used 2.56-2.78 gears, including myself to run in the 12's. There were so many cheb guys doing the same thing with their 4.11s and 4.88s.
* a lower revving street engine like a big Pontiac uses less gas, lasts longer and is more reliable than your high revving cheb
* Although many of the “in” group consider the REAL Pontiac a dated design, let’s try to count all the things the cheb guys have done to copy this “dated” design
* the ”stroker” small block craze ( for more bottom end street torque), separate valley covers to keep heat off the bottom of the manifold, moving the starter to the left side of the motor for better use of kickout pans, Oil baffles under the valve covers, hardened push rods with guide plates (Pontiac had them, even on low performance versions by ‘67), street/strip rats with smaller ports to go faster (geez, Pontiac know this decades back!). 2 piece timing covers, taller deck heights, longer rods and on and on.

Thanks Steve Barrack.

I can appreciate any well built engine. Those 302 Fords can be made very quick for small blocks. The Chrysler Hemi still makes me get new pants on. Those early Buick turbo 3.8s were cool. Seeing a 409 Chevy updated with EFI in some older well restored big Chevy bodied car will definitely turn my head.

If the Pontiac engine is so bad Murco where was the mid 70's Camaro compared to the Trans Am? (Hell, how close was the Vette lol!)

A Pontiac could do what you want and it would just be harder then going to the local K-mart and looking for that bluelight special on Chevy motors.