Gay Marriage Ban
Graphik Styles
07-31-2003, 04:50 PM
"I don't know if it's necessary yet," Bush said of the proposed change, which is gaining steam in GOP circles after a landmark Supreme Court ruling last week. "Let's let the lawyers look at the full ramifications of the recent Supreme Court hearing. What I do support is a notion that marriage is between a man and a woman."
Among supporters of such an amendment is Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tennessee, who on Sunday said he "absolutely" supports it.
"I very much feel that marriage is a sacrament, and that sacrament should extend and can extend to that legal entity of a union between, what is traditionally in our Western values has been defined, as between a man and a woman. So I would support the amendment," Frist told ABC's "This Week with George Stephanopoulos."
Frist said sodomy should be addressed by state legislatures, "not in the courts."
A draft of the amendment, which has been referred to the House Judiciary Committee, states that "marriage in the United States shall consist only of the union of a man and a woman. Neither this Constitution or the constitution of any state, nor state or federal law, shall be construed to require that marital status or the legal incidents thereof be conferred upon unmarried couples or groups."
The push for an amendment has gained momentum among Republicans since last week's Supreme Court ruling that struck down a Texas state law barring homosexual sex.
Religious conservatives have sharply criticized the decision, saying it will open the way for gay marriages. Many have cited Justice Antonin Scalia's dissenting opinion, which blasted the high court for signing on "to the so-called homosexual agenda."
"Many Americans do not want persons who openly engage in homosexual conduct as partners in their business, as scoutmasters for their children, as teachers in their children's schools, or as boarders in their home," Scalia wrote. "They view this as protecting themselves and their families from a lifestyle that they believe to be immoral and destructive."
Gay activists have lauded the Supreme Court ruling as one of the most significant in decades.
"This is a giant leap forward to a day where we are no longer branded as criminals," said Ruth Harlow of the Lambda Legal Defense Fund on the day of the court's decision.
Patrick Guerriero, the head of the Log Cabin Republicans, the largest gay GOP organization, said he was pleased Bush did not come out stronger against gay marriage.
Bush, Guerriero added, has "recognized the value of gay and lesbian Americans as part of the American family" since the start of his administration.
"We hope he will use that same language as we head to the 2004 election," he told CNN.
But Genevieve Wood of the conservative Family Research Council predicted a mighty battle between conservatives and gay Republicans.
"I think there's probably going to be a war at the 2004 convention," she said. "The American public now has a wake-up call."
Among supporters of such an amendment is Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, R-Tennessee, who on Sunday said he "absolutely" supports it.
"I very much feel that marriage is a sacrament, and that sacrament should extend and can extend to that legal entity of a union between, what is traditionally in our Western values has been defined, as between a man and a woman. So I would support the amendment," Frist told ABC's "This Week with George Stephanopoulos."
Frist said sodomy should be addressed by state legislatures, "not in the courts."
A draft of the amendment, which has been referred to the House Judiciary Committee, states that "marriage in the United States shall consist only of the union of a man and a woman. Neither this Constitution or the constitution of any state, nor state or federal law, shall be construed to require that marital status or the legal incidents thereof be conferred upon unmarried couples or groups."
The push for an amendment has gained momentum among Republicans since last week's Supreme Court ruling that struck down a Texas state law barring homosexual sex.
Religious conservatives have sharply criticized the decision, saying it will open the way for gay marriages. Many have cited Justice Antonin Scalia's dissenting opinion, which blasted the high court for signing on "to the so-called homosexual agenda."
"Many Americans do not want persons who openly engage in homosexual conduct as partners in their business, as scoutmasters for their children, as teachers in their children's schools, or as boarders in their home," Scalia wrote. "They view this as protecting themselves and their families from a lifestyle that they believe to be immoral and destructive."
Gay activists have lauded the Supreme Court ruling as one of the most significant in decades.
"This is a giant leap forward to a day where we are no longer branded as criminals," said Ruth Harlow of the Lambda Legal Defense Fund on the day of the court's decision.
Patrick Guerriero, the head of the Log Cabin Republicans, the largest gay GOP organization, said he was pleased Bush did not come out stronger against gay marriage.
Bush, Guerriero added, has "recognized the value of gay and lesbian Americans as part of the American family" since the start of his administration.
"We hope he will use that same language as we head to the 2004 election," he told CNN.
But Genevieve Wood of the conservative Family Research Council predicted a mighty battle between conservatives and gay Republicans.
"I think there's probably going to be a war at the 2004 convention," she said. "The American public now has a wake-up call."
blasian_man
07-31-2003, 04:58 PM
even though i don't understand it, i believe that two people of the same sex should have the right to marry. my uncle (now uncles) had a commitment ceremony, but no wedding. but if 2 people love eachother, and plan to spend the rest of their life together, they should be able to get married.
YogsVR4
07-31-2003, 05:06 PM
I think the question is a bit backwards. How can they be banned when they are not legal now? Do you mean should a gay couple have the same rights as a married couple? I’m going with no on this one but not by much and I’ll tell you why. I feel that children should be raised by loving parents – both a mother and father. Perspective for boys on women and men for girls etc. Can a gay person be a good parent? Most definitely, in the same vein a single person can be a good parent or a mother or father can be a bad one. But to the question of should gay couples be allowed to adopt? Only as a last resort. One of my sisters and I were adopted as babies. (different times and different original parents) Babies are placed in same race households whenever possible and we were that way. How would you ever know with a child? There is no way to tell if they are going to be gay or not. Like I said before, its better for the child to be raised by both a father and mother. In a gay couple – you don’t have that.
Don’t read any more into this then what I’ve written. Past the family I could give two shits about who wants to stick what in what orifice. Nor do I care if they want to have a ceremony to commemorate their commitment. Let the libertarian in me ring strong on that part. But, I say give adopted babies the best chance and that is with both genders as parents. And, since a legally recognized marriage would make them eligible for adoption, then I say no. (which is Yes in this poll)
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Don’t read any more into this then what I’ve written. Past the family I could give two shits about who wants to stick what in what orifice. Nor do I care if they want to have a ceremony to commemorate their commitment. Let the libertarian in me ring strong on that part. But, I say give adopted babies the best chance and that is with both genders as parents. And, since a legally recognized marriage would make them eligible for adoption, then I say no. (which is Yes in this poll)
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2strokebloke
07-31-2003, 05:23 PM
The reason for getting married is to have a family, and to have a family doesn't one usually have children? What is it that two people of the same sex are unable to do? Oh, I don't know - perhaps reproduce?
Just because it doesn't make sense to me, doesn't mean it should be banned IMHO though.
Just because it doesn't make sense to me, doesn't mean it should be banned IMHO though.
TexasF355F1
08-01-2003, 10:42 AM
Like Yogs said, in most states it can't be banned b/c it's already illegal. Marriage wise, I don't agree with it b/c I am Catholic and it doesn't go with what I believe. But I'm not closed minded, b/c I see gays all the time in the malls and such and it doesn't bother me I just look the other way. I tend to get a chuckle out of it. Should gays adopt? No way in hell. I think that it could really cause damage to the kids, not just from a same sex parent sense, but also from their peers. I mean kids are extremely cruel growing up and if other kids find out that a certain boy or girl(especially a boy) has gay parents all hell will break loose. It will be extremely hard for them to make any friends and they will be harrassed and mocked constantly. And on a last note, the spread of AIDS would increase even more.
freakray
08-01-2003, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
Like Yogs said, in most states it can't be banned b/c it's already illegal. Marriage wise, I don't agree with it b/c I am Catholic and it doesn't go with what I believe. But I'm not closed minded, b/c I see gays all the time in the malls and such and it doesn't bother me I just look the other way. I tend to get a chuckle out of it. Should gays adopt? No way in hell. I think that it could really cause damage to the kids, not just from a same sex parent sense, but also from their peers. I mean kids are extremely cruel growing up and if other kids find out that a certain boy or girl(especially a boy) has gay parents all hell will break loose. It will be extremely hard for them to make any friends and they will be harrassed and mocked constantly. And on a last note, the spread of AIDS would increase even more.
I agree with most of what you say, except the comment about the spread of AIDS.
AIDS is currently being spread quicker in heterosexual couples than through homosexual couples, blaming gays for the spread of AIDS is instilling the old belief on the spread of the disease and promoting stereotyping.
Like Yogs said, in most states it can't be banned b/c it's already illegal. Marriage wise, I don't agree with it b/c I am Catholic and it doesn't go with what I believe. But I'm not closed minded, b/c I see gays all the time in the malls and such and it doesn't bother me I just look the other way. I tend to get a chuckle out of it. Should gays adopt? No way in hell. I think that it could really cause damage to the kids, not just from a same sex parent sense, but also from their peers. I mean kids are extremely cruel growing up and if other kids find out that a certain boy or girl(especially a boy) has gay parents all hell will break loose. It will be extremely hard for them to make any friends and they will be harrassed and mocked constantly. And on a last note, the spread of AIDS would increase even more.
I agree with most of what you say, except the comment about the spread of AIDS.
AIDS is currently being spread quicker in heterosexual couples than through homosexual couples, blaming gays for the spread of AIDS is instilling the old belief on the spread of the disease and promoting stereotyping.
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:00 AM
Originally posted by 2strokebloke
The reason for getting married is to have a family, and to have a family doesn't one usually have children? What is it that two people of the same sex are unable to do? Oh, I don't know - perhaps reproduce?
Just because it doesn't make sense to me, doesn't mean it should be banned IMHO though.
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
What's wrong with adoption as a way to have a family?
I don't care if you define "marriage" as a union "between a man and a woman" as long as you don't deny committed homosexual couples from the same rights granted heterosexual couples. A formalized "commitment" allowing for all of the benefits a married couple receive should cover it in my eyes.
Is it me, or is the Catholic Church getting farther and farther away from the "real world?" I already know that the Bush family (senior and junior, in particular) are quite removed from real life.
The reason for getting married is to have a family, and to have a family doesn't one usually have children? What is it that two people of the same sex are unable to do? Oh, I don't know - perhaps reproduce?
Just because it doesn't make sense to me, doesn't mean it should be banned IMHO though.
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
What's wrong with adoption as a way to have a family?
I don't care if you define "marriage" as a union "between a man and a woman" as long as you don't deny committed homosexual couples from the same rights granted heterosexual couples. A formalized "commitment" allowing for all of the benefits a married couple receive should cover it in my eyes.
Is it me, or is the Catholic Church getting farther and farther away from the "real world?" I already know that the Bush family (senior and junior, in particular) are quite removed from real life.
Dublinguy
08-01-2003, 11:02 AM
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
....And on a last note, the spread of AIDS would increase even more.
Oh what a load of BS...how can allowing same sex couples get married increase the spread of AIDS. You have no basis to say that. Homosexuality is already out there by banning homosexuality or same sex marriage isnt going to stop AIDS, it will just puch homosexuality underground.
As for the catholic thing what a load of crap aswell. Im catholic but dont agree with what a lot of the church says. For instance it opposess same sex amrriages and homosexuality but yet it hasnt once come out and condemended the many many clergy both male and female that abused kids in the past that where put into their care. Any religion or organisation that wont condemn something like that as far as I am concerned should be disbanded.
Too say that a same sex marriage cant give as good a quality life to a child as a hetrosexual marriage is untrue and unfounded. How many broken families have there been in the last years, through abuse of one parent or the other,drugs or alcohol abuse or child abuse. So to say that a same sex marriage cant give a child a good life is other bullshit. If both people are strong enough, mentally stable and can provide for the child then I say yes let them adopt.
I cant believe we still live in such a homophobic close minded society.
Ciaran
....And on a last note, the spread of AIDS would increase even more.
Oh what a load of BS...how can allowing same sex couples get married increase the spread of AIDS. You have no basis to say that. Homosexuality is already out there by banning homosexuality or same sex marriage isnt going to stop AIDS, it will just puch homosexuality underground.
As for the catholic thing what a load of crap aswell. Im catholic but dont agree with what a lot of the church says. For instance it opposess same sex amrriages and homosexuality but yet it hasnt once come out and condemended the many many clergy both male and female that abused kids in the past that where put into their care. Any religion or organisation that wont condemn something like that as far as I am concerned should be disbanded.
Too say that a same sex marriage cant give as good a quality life to a child as a hetrosexual marriage is untrue and unfounded. How many broken families have there been in the last years, through abuse of one parent or the other,drugs or alcohol abuse or child abuse. So to say that a same sex marriage cant give a child a good life is other bullshit. If both people are strong enough, mentally stable and can provide for the child then I say yes let them adopt.
I cant believe we still live in such a homophobic close minded society.
Ciaran
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 11:03 AM
I think that it is unnatural for 2 creatures of the same sex to be joined together in marriage or even to be together peroid.....a bunch of homosexual retards :bloated:
i was born :greddy2: no u wern't dumbass :twak:
just my opnion:bigthumb:
i was born :greddy2: no u wern't dumbass :twak:
just my opnion:bigthumb:
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:12 AM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
I think that it is unnatural for 2 creatures of the same sex to be joined together in marriage or even to be together peroid.....a bunch of homosexual retards :bloated:
i was born :greddy2: no u wern't dumbass :twak:
just my opnion:bigthumb:
Yes...just your opinion. An uneducated one...but it is yours.
Homosexuality is a "condition" you are born with...just like heterosexuality. Homosexuality is natural...happens in the human species...happens in other animals. Look around.
I think that it is unnatural for 2 creatures of the same sex to be joined together in marriage or even to be together peroid.....a bunch of homosexual retards :bloated:
i was born :greddy2: no u wern't dumbass :twak:
just my opnion:bigthumb:
Yes...just your opinion. An uneducated one...but it is yours.
Homosexuality is a "condition" you are born with...just like heterosexuality. Homosexuality is natural...happens in the human species...happens in other animals. Look around.
TexasF355F1
08-01-2003, 11:16 AM
Originally posted by freakray
I agree with most of what you say, except the comment about the spread of AIDS.
AIDS is currently being spread quicker in heterosexual couples than through homosexual couples, blaming gays for the spread of AIDS is instilling the old belief on the spread of the disease and promoting stereotyping.
On the contrary. I heard the other day on the radio that new reports showed that homosexuals are spreading the virus at an increased rate compared to heterosexuals, and thats why I made my comment about that. Sorry I don't have a source of the info, I can't remember what station I heard it on.
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
I think you misunderstood him, b/c adoption to a "normal" family is perfectly legite b/c some people are unable to have kids or just like to help out in that sense b/c they feel its a good thing to do. Like Bob Hope for instance.
Is it me, or is the Catholic Church getting farther and farther away from the "real world?" I already know that the Bush family (senior and junior, in particular) are quite removed from real life. Thats a total contradictiory statement if I ever heard of one. It's not just the catholic church, christians in general are against it. It comes off to be just the catholic church b/c the media for some reasons hates catholics for reasons I don't know. Apparently you don't understand religion and that it is based upon beliefs and not converting to "the real world" as you call it. The media has put so much of an emphesis on "things the catholic church does wrong". They make it out to seem that every bishop milests(sp) children when thats as far from the truth as it can be. I'd be willing to bet that it goes on in other religions too.
I agree with most of what you say, except the comment about the spread of AIDS.
AIDS is currently being spread quicker in heterosexual couples than through homosexual couples, blaming gays for the spread of AIDS is instilling the old belief on the spread of the disease and promoting stereotyping.
On the contrary. I heard the other day on the radio that new reports showed that homosexuals are spreading the virus at an increased rate compared to heterosexuals, and thats why I made my comment about that. Sorry I don't have a source of the info, I can't remember what station I heard it on.
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
I think you misunderstood him, b/c adoption to a "normal" family is perfectly legite b/c some people are unable to have kids or just like to help out in that sense b/c they feel its a good thing to do. Like Bob Hope for instance.
Is it me, or is the Catholic Church getting farther and farther away from the "real world?" I already know that the Bush family (senior and junior, in particular) are quite removed from real life. Thats a total contradictiory statement if I ever heard of one. It's not just the catholic church, christians in general are against it. It comes off to be just the catholic church b/c the media for some reasons hates catholics for reasons I don't know. Apparently you don't understand religion and that it is based upon beliefs and not converting to "the real world" as you call it. The media has put so much of an emphesis on "things the catholic church does wrong". They make it out to seem that every bishop milests(sp) children when thats as far from the truth as it can be. I'd be willing to bet that it goes on in other religions too.
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:24 AM
Let's try this again. How can committed homosexual couples spread AIDS? Doesn't the spread of AIDS require multiple sexual partners?
And homosexual couples can't "help out" an orphaned kid?
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
Thats a total contradictiory statement if I ever heard of one. It's not just the catholic church, christians in general are against it. It comes off to be just the catholic church b/c the media for some reasons hates catholics for reasons I don't know. Apparently you don't understand religion and that it is based upon beliefs and not converting to "the real world" as you call it. The media has put so much of an emphesis on "things the catholic church does wrong". They make it out to seem that every bishop milests(sp) children when thats as far from the truth as it can be. I'd be willing to bet that it goes on in other religions too.
I understood what was being said. Homosexual couples aren't "normal'....TO YOU! Homosexuality is gaining in acceptance among the mainstream to the point where a recent poll showed over half of Americans looked favorably upon homosexuals.
Religion evolves with time. If it didn't, we'd still be worshipping many gods or worshipping the Sun (literally) as humans did thousands of years ago. I do understand that religion is based on beliefs. How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
And homosexual couples can't "help out" an orphaned kid?
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
Thats a total contradictiory statement if I ever heard of one. It's not just the catholic church, christians in general are against it. It comes off to be just the catholic church b/c the media for some reasons hates catholics for reasons I don't know. Apparently you don't understand religion and that it is based upon beliefs and not converting to "the real world" as you call it. The media has put so much of an emphesis on "things the catholic church does wrong". They make it out to seem that every bishop milests(sp) children when thats as far from the truth as it can be. I'd be willing to bet that it goes on in other religions too.
I understood what was being said. Homosexual couples aren't "normal'....TO YOU! Homosexuality is gaining in acceptance among the mainstream to the point where a recent poll showed over half of Americans looked favorably upon homosexuals.
Religion evolves with time. If it didn't, we'd still be worshipping many gods or worshipping the Sun (literally) as humans did thousands of years ago. I do understand that religion is based on beliefs. How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
igor@af
08-01-2003, 11:27 AM
I agree with Yogs too... this is a quite complex situation.
On one hand, I think that if there are two people that won't be legally united, then they should be able to, and gender should not matter. But on the other hand, their children, whether they be adopted or 'implanted' (in case of two females), will have a non-standard biased view towards the issue of sexuality. I think a good study to conduct would be to see if children adopted by gay couples have their sexual orientation biased and are likelier to be gay than children with a standard family structure.
On one hand, I think that if there are two people that won't be legally united, then they should be able to, and gender should not matter. But on the other hand, their children, whether they be adopted or 'implanted' (in case of two females), will have a non-standard biased view towards the issue of sexuality. I think a good study to conduct would be to see if children adopted by gay couples have their sexual orientation biased and are likelier to be gay than children with a standard family structure.
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 11:33 AM
Originally posted by Hudson
Yes...just your opinion. An uneducated one...but it is yours.
Homosexuality is a "condition" you are born with...just like heterosexuality. Homosexuality is natural...happens in the human species...happens in other animals. Look around.
why is it that some people have to critize everything:rolleyes: i said it was my opnion....but noooo u had to say it was an undeucated one....what a tard
still my opnion :thumbsup:
Yes...just your opinion. An uneducated one...but it is yours.
Homosexuality is a "condition" you are born with...just like heterosexuality. Homosexuality is natural...happens in the human species...happens in other animals. Look around.
why is it that some people have to critize everything:rolleyes: i said it was my opnion....but noooo u had to say it was an undeucated one....what a tard
still my opnion :thumbsup:
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:33 AM
I don't see the problem with homosexual couples adopting....other than the fact they they may get a more rounded view of the world. Homosexual kids can come from heterosexual households...why can't a heterosexual kid have a "normal" childhood in a homosexual household? As long as the kid has a roof of its head, food to eat, and a loving atmosphere, what's the problem? I've seen plenty of bad heterosexual households.
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:34 AM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
why is it that some people have to critize everything:rolleyes: i said it was my opnion....but noooo u had to say it was an undeucated one....what a tard
still my opnion :thumbsup:
An opinion with not facts to back it up.
And the name calling doesn't make your opinion any more educated.
why is it that some people have to critize everything:rolleyes: i said it was my opnion....but noooo u had to say it was an undeucated one....what a tard
still my opnion :thumbsup:
An opinion with not facts to back it up.
And the name calling doesn't make your opinion any more educated.
TexasF355F1
08-01-2003, 11:42 AM
Originally posted by Hudson
Let's try this again. How can committed homosexual couples spread AIDS? Doesn't the spread of AIDS require multiple sexual partners?
And homosexual couples can't "help out" an orphaned kid?
I understood what was being said. Homosexual couples aren't "normal'....TO YOU! Homosexuality is gaining in acceptance among the mainstream to the point where a recent poll showed over half of Americans looked favorably upon homosexuals.
Religion evolves with time. If it didn't, we'd still be worshipping many gods or worshipping the Sun (literally) as humans did thousands of years ago. I do understand that religion is based on beliefs. How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
First off I want to say that this thread is/can get very heated b/c everyone has such a different view on this subject mainly b/c its touch to everyone in a different way. Actually in the bible it says something about homesexuality and how God frowns upon it. I don't know the verse b/c I have never actually sat down and read it. But if you want to know I can call my friend who knows the bible inside and out to get it. About worshiping different Gods, well there are different Gods in different cultures, i.e. Alah, Buddah, etc. All with different thoughts of after life. Now I think everyone can agree on the fact that religion is based on beliefs but religion is also there for you to form your own beliefs on different subject.matters. Just b/c I don't agree with gay marriage doesn't mean I hate gay people b/c thats as far from the truth as it can get. A kid I grew up with dated this girl for like 4 years and then we graduated and they broke up and then he was gay. But everytime I see him somewhere I don't hesitate to go up to him say hi and shake his hand and make convo with him. Why? B/c he is a human being and he has feelings just like you and I and he's a really nice guy. And for me to ignore him would be just plain out rude and arrogant. Now my roomate is a homophobic freak, his gf and I always tell him to shut the hell up b/c if there is a gay person around he freaks out and man is it annoying and embarrissing. And he won't even shake the kids hand we went to school with from kindergarden on up. The problem with this subject is everyone see's things like this extremely different, and there's very little room to meet in the middle. I hope this clears up any misconceptions people may have of me b/c I am not homophobic or hate gays for any reason, I just do not believe in same sex marriage and I'm entitled to my opinion just like everyone else.
Let's try this again. How can committed homosexual couples spread AIDS? Doesn't the spread of AIDS require multiple sexual partners?
And homosexual couples can't "help out" an orphaned kid?
I understood what was being said. Homosexual couples aren't "normal'....TO YOU! Homosexuality is gaining in acceptance among the mainstream to the point where a recent poll showed over half of Americans looked favorably upon homosexuals.
Religion evolves with time. If it didn't, we'd still be worshipping many gods or worshipping the Sun (literally) as humans did thousands of years ago. I do understand that religion is based on beliefs. How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
First off I want to say that this thread is/can get very heated b/c everyone has such a different view on this subject mainly b/c its touch to everyone in a different way. Actually in the bible it says something about homesexuality and how God frowns upon it. I don't know the verse b/c I have never actually sat down and read it. But if you want to know I can call my friend who knows the bible inside and out to get it. About worshiping different Gods, well there are different Gods in different cultures, i.e. Alah, Buddah, etc. All with different thoughts of after life. Now I think everyone can agree on the fact that religion is based on beliefs but religion is also there for you to form your own beliefs on different subject.matters. Just b/c I don't agree with gay marriage doesn't mean I hate gay people b/c thats as far from the truth as it can get. A kid I grew up with dated this girl for like 4 years and then we graduated and they broke up and then he was gay. But everytime I see him somewhere I don't hesitate to go up to him say hi and shake his hand and make convo with him. Why? B/c he is a human being and he has feelings just like you and I and he's a really nice guy. And for me to ignore him would be just plain out rude and arrogant. Now my roomate is a homophobic freak, his gf and I always tell him to shut the hell up b/c if there is a gay person around he freaks out and man is it annoying and embarrissing. And he won't even shake the kids hand we went to school with from kindergarden on up. The problem with this subject is everyone see's things like this extremely different, and there's very little room to meet in the middle. I hope this clears up any misconceptions people may have of me b/c I am not homophobic or hate gays for any reason, I just do not believe in same sex marriage and I'm entitled to my opinion just like everyone else.
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 11:44 AM
Originally posted by Hudson
How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
1 Corithians 6:9
What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be misled. Neighter fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men
that is where it is written in the bible that everyone has...and that calling that u speak of...that is a calling to "turn from your wicked ways"
How about the belief that God loves all men/women equally? I didn't see that God hates homosexuals, did you? If that were so, then why would God put out the "Calling" to so many homosexuals to become priests and nuns and ministers and...
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
1 Corithians 6:9
What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be misled. Neighter fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men
that is where it is written in the bible that everyone has...and that calling that u speak of...that is a calling to "turn from your wicked ways"
freakray
08-01-2003, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
On the contrary. I heard the other day on the radio that new reports showed that homosexuals are spreading the virus at an increased rate compared to heterosexuals, and thats why I made my comment about that. Sorry I don't have a source of the info, I can't remember what station I heard it on.
I would like to see where your radio station got their information from too.
The spread of AIDS in Africa is at an all-time high and that is not homosexuals spreading the virus, it is the heterosexual population.
It is not hard to explain the rapid spread of the virus if you understand African culture either.
I still maintain that saying that homosexual couples are spreading the AIDS virus faster than heterosexual promiscuity is stereotypical and incorrect.
On the contrary. I heard the other day on the radio that new reports showed that homosexuals are spreading the virus at an increased rate compared to heterosexuals, and thats why I made my comment about that. Sorry I don't have a source of the info, I can't remember what station I heard it on.
I would like to see where your radio station got their information from too.
The spread of AIDS in Africa is at an all-time high and that is not homosexuals spreading the virus, it is the heterosexual population.
It is not hard to explain the rapid spread of the virus if you understand African culture either.
I still maintain that saying that homosexual couples are spreading the AIDS virus faster than heterosexual promiscuity is stereotypical and incorrect.
TexasF355F1
08-01-2003, 11:51 AM
See where talking about two totally different countries. Your talking about Africa and I was talking about the U.S.:icon16:
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 11:51 AM
Originally posted by TexasF355F1
First off I want to say that this thread is/can get very heated b/c everyone has such a different view on this subject mainly b/c its touch to everyone in a different way. Actually in the bible it says something about homesexuality and how God frowns upon it. I don't know the verse b/c I have never actually sat down and read it. But if you want to know I can call my friend who knows the bible inside and out to get it. About worshiping different Gods, well there are different Gods in different cultures, i.e. Alah, Buddah, etc. All with different thoughts of after life. Now I think everyone can agree on the fact that religion is based on beliefs but religion is also there for you to form your own beliefs on different subject.matters. Just b/c I don't agree with gay marriage doesn't mean I hate gay people b/c thats as far from the truth as it can get. A kid I grew up with dated this girl for like 4 years and then we graduated and they broke up and then he was gay. But everytime I see him somewhere I don't hesitate to go up to him say hi and shake his hand and make convo with him. Why? B/c he is a human being and he has feelings just like you and I and he's a really nice guy. And for me to ignore him would be just plain out rude and arrogant. Now my roomate is a homophobic freak, his gf and I always tell him to shut the hell up b/c if there is a gay person around he freaks out and man is it annoying and embarrissing. And he won't even shake the kids hand we went to school with from kindergarden on up. The problem with this subject is everyone see's things like this extremely different, and there's very little room to meet in the middle. I hope this clears up any misconceptions people may have of me b/c I am not homophobic or hate gays for any reason, I just do not believe in same sex marriage and I'm entitled to my opinion just like everyone else.
i agree with you b/c it say even in the bible that you shouldn't have hate aginst ur fellow man....as i say...do not hate the man hate his ways/sin...as for those people that go around protesting gays, bashing gays...like my first post:uhoh: :sorry: ....and claim to be stewards of God:iceslolan well they are in the wrong....i know that homosexual relationships are worng and i'lll tell anyone and try and help some get away from it....but that's as far as i'll go b/c that's not my fight....
First off I want to say that this thread is/can get very heated b/c everyone has such a different view on this subject mainly b/c its touch to everyone in a different way. Actually in the bible it says something about homesexuality and how God frowns upon it. I don't know the verse b/c I have never actually sat down and read it. But if you want to know I can call my friend who knows the bible inside and out to get it. About worshiping different Gods, well there are different Gods in different cultures, i.e. Alah, Buddah, etc. All with different thoughts of after life. Now I think everyone can agree on the fact that religion is based on beliefs but religion is also there for you to form your own beliefs on different subject.matters. Just b/c I don't agree with gay marriage doesn't mean I hate gay people b/c thats as far from the truth as it can get. A kid I grew up with dated this girl for like 4 years and then we graduated and they broke up and then he was gay. But everytime I see him somewhere I don't hesitate to go up to him say hi and shake his hand and make convo with him. Why? B/c he is a human being and he has feelings just like you and I and he's a really nice guy. And for me to ignore him would be just plain out rude and arrogant. Now my roomate is a homophobic freak, his gf and I always tell him to shut the hell up b/c if there is a gay person around he freaks out and man is it annoying and embarrissing. And he won't even shake the kids hand we went to school with from kindergarden on up. The problem with this subject is everyone see's things like this extremely different, and there's very little room to meet in the middle. I hope this clears up any misconceptions people may have of me b/c I am not homophobic or hate gays for any reason, I just do not believe in same sex marriage and I'm entitled to my opinion just like everyone else.
i agree with you b/c it say even in the bible that you shouldn't have hate aginst ur fellow man....as i say...do not hate the man hate his ways/sin...as for those people that go around protesting gays, bashing gays...like my first post:uhoh: :sorry: ....and claim to be stewards of God:iceslolan well they are in the wrong....i know that homosexual relationships are worng and i'lll tell anyone and try and help some get away from it....but that's as far as i'll go b/c that's not my fight....
igor@af
08-01-2003, 11:52 AM
Hudson, I wish the world was simple and no one had different views and everything was clear, but I have to disagree with your statement that homosexuality has a purely genetic origin. I really think environment plays a big part as do the genes.
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
1 Corithians 6:9
What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be misled. Neighter fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men
that is where it is written in the bible that everyone has...and that calling that u speak of...that is a calling to "turn from your wicked ways"
Did you read the part about how slavery's okay?
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
1 Corithians 6:9
What! Do YOU not know that unrighteous persons will not inherit God's kingdom? Do not be misled. Neighter fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men
that is where it is written in the bible that everyone has...and that calling that u speak of...that is a calling to "turn from your wicked ways"
Did you read the part about how slavery's okay?
Hudson
08-01-2003, 11:57 AM
Originally posted by igor@af
Hudson, I wish the world was simple and no one had different views and everything was clear, but I have to disagree with your statement that homosexuality has a purely genetic origin. I really think environment plays a big part as do the genes.
I like the world having different views. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. But homosexuality is, for the most part, a naturual condition. Environment plays only the most peripheral part in allowing it to surface...instead of being hidden.
Hudson, I wish the world was simple and no one had different views and everything was clear, but I have to disagree with your statement that homosexuality has a purely genetic origin. I really think environment plays a big part as do the genes.
I like the world having different views. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. But homosexuality is, for the most part, a naturual condition. Environment plays only the most peripheral part in allowing it to surface...instead of being hidden.
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 11:59 AM
Originally posted by Hudson
Did you read the part about how slavery's okay?
i'm not answering that question b/c it has nothing to do with the subject at hand....which is gay marriage....stay o/t:wink:
Did you read the part about how slavery's okay?
i'm not answering that question b/c it has nothing to do with the subject at hand....which is gay marriage....stay o/t:wink:
igor@af
08-01-2003, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by Hudson
I like the world having different views. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. But homosexuality is, for the most part, a naturual condition. Environment plays only the most peripheral part in allowing it to surface...instead of being hidden.
So do you think that if a study were conducted to compare the percentage of homosexuals with heterosexual parents with those that have homosexual parents the split will be pretty much the same?
It could be higher with homosexual parents because that would create an environment that is highly accepting of the homosexual behavior.
You know.. this is a really interesting topic...
I like the world having different views. It would be a boring world if we all agreed on everything. But homosexuality is, for the most part, a naturual condition. Environment plays only the most peripheral part in allowing it to surface...instead of being hidden.
So do you think that if a study were conducted to compare the percentage of homosexuals with heterosexual parents with those that have homosexual parents the split will be pretty much the same?
It could be higher with homosexual parents because that would create an environment that is highly accepting of the homosexual behavior.
You know.. this is a really interesting topic...
YogsVR4
08-01-2003, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by Hudson
I don't see the problem with homosexual couples adopting....other than the fact they they may get a more rounded view of the world. Homosexual kids can come from heterosexual households...why can't a heterosexual kid have a "normal" childhood in a homosexual household? As long as the kid has a roof of its head, food to eat, and a loving atmosphere, what's the problem? I've seen plenty of bad heterosexual households.
As I said before - anything is possible. However the claim of "may get a more rounded view of the world" is wholly unsubstantiated.
As for AIDS – that’s a non started to the question of legalized marriage between gays. Shouldn’t matter one bit just like having cancer isn’t.
You’ve seen bad heterosexual households – I’ve seen bad homosexual relationships. So what?
It’s a fact that having a mother and father in a loving household is what’s best for a child. Anything else is not as good. Be that a single parent. A parent that is abusive. Same gendered parents. Parents doing drugs and a plethora of other things. When it comes to adoption – the kids should be given the best chance. That is not in a same gendered household.
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I don't see the problem with homosexual couples adopting....other than the fact they they may get a more rounded view of the world. Homosexual kids can come from heterosexual households...why can't a heterosexual kid have a "normal" childhood in a homosexual household? As long as the kid has a roof of its head, food to eat, and a loving atmosphere, what's the problem? I've seen plenty of bad heterosexual households.
As I said before - anything is possible. However the claim of "may get a more rounded view of the world" is wholly unsubstantiated.
As for AIDS – that’s a non started to the question of legalized marriage between gays. Shouldn’t matter one bit just like having cancer isn’t.
You’ve seen bad heterosexual households – I’ve seen bad homosexual relationships. So what?
It’s a fact that having a mother and father in a loving household is what’s best for a child. Anything else is not as good. Be that a single parent. A parent that is abusive. Same gendered parents. Parents doing drugs and a plethora of other things. When it comes to adoption – the kids should be given the best chance. That is not in a same gendered household.
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BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 12:07 PM
i'm not sure haw a child would grow up while having gay parents...i personally think he'd grow up to possibly be gay (having gay parents from infancy instead of starting from like age 3) b/c that is the emotion of his household, no matter what the parents say b/c itz all in what the child sees....but...i dunno...even more so now with them trying to have a school for children of gay parents:confused:
Graphik Styles
08-01-2003, 12:23 PM
honestly i dont agree that homosexuals should be allowed to adopt a child, because kids are animals while growing up. Life would be a complete hell for him, especially if the kids found out he had gay parents. Also through so much stress on the kid, from being made fun off, it would be really hard for him to succeed academically.
my :2cents:
my :2cents:
Hudson
08-01-2003, 12:32 PM
Originally posted by igor@af
So do you think that if a study were conducted to compare the percentage of homosexuals with heterosexual parents with those that have homosexual parents the split will be pretty much the same?
It could be higher with homosexual parents because that would create an environment that is highly accepting of the homosexual behavior.
You know.. this is a really interesting topic...
I'm sure the study's been done. In order to do it properly, you'd have to have make sure all of the people who have repressed homosexual tendencies can admit them. Many people are raised in families or communities which do not allow people to be themselves. A person in a small rural town, for example, will not be able to readily admit their homosexuality. Many of these people must grow up "heterosexual," marry, have children...even though they are naturally homosexual. It happens quite often.
The whole genetics thing shows in families with brothers and sisters who are homosexual. The "environmental" thing comes into play when someone "experiments"...but unless you're actually homosexual, it'll just remain an experiment.
A child is best cared for when he or she is raised in a loving TWO PARENT household...homosexual or heterosexual.
So do you think that if a study were conducted to compare the percentage of homosexuals with heterosexual parents with those that have homosexual parents the split will be pretty much the same?
It could be higher with homosexual parents because that would create an environment that is highly accepting of the homosexual behavior.
You know.. this is a really interesting topic...
I'm sure the study's been done. In order to do it properly, you'd have to have make sure all of the people who have repressed homosexual tendencies can admit them. Many people are raised in families or communities which do not allow people to be themselves. A person in a small rural town, for example, will not be able to readily admit their homosexuality. Many of these people must grow up "heterosexual," marry, have children...even though they are naturally homosexual. It happens quite often.
The whole genetics thing shows in families with brothers and sisters who are homosexual. The "environmental" thing comes into play when someone "experiments"...but unless you're actually homosexual, it'll just remain an experiment.
A child is best cared for when he or she is raised in a loving TWO PARENT household...homosexual or heterosexual.
Hudson
08-01-2003, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
i'm not answering that question b/c it has nothing to do with the subject at hand....which is gay marriage....stay o/t:wink:
This is complete on topic. So if the Bible states that slavery is okay...and I'm assuming that we can agree that it isn't....then the Bible isn't infalible? Or, perhaps, we can assume that religious beliefs evolve over time? I'm good either way.
i'm not answering that question b/c it has nothing to do with the subject at hand....which is gay marriage....stay o/t:wink:
This is complete on topic. So if the Bible states that slavery is okay...and I'm assuming that we can agree that it isn't....then the Bible isn't infalible? Or, perhaps, we can assume that religious beliefs evolve over time? I'm good either way.
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 12:53 PM
didn't read anywhere that it saId slavery was ok....i know it said that there was slavery but nowhere have i read that it said that it was ok...
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
Galatians 5:1
For such freedom Christ set us free. Therefore stand fast, and do not let yourselves be confined again in a yoke of slavery.
New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures
Galatians 5:1
For such freedom Christ set us free. Therefore stand fast, and do not let yourselves be confined again in a yoke of slavery.
freakray
08-01-2003, 01:10 PM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
Galatians 5:1
For such freedom Christ set us free. Therefore stand fast, and do not let yourselves be confined again in a yoke of slavery.
Thanks Blu, I was just looking for that scripture myself.
Galatians 5:1
For such freedom Christ set us free. Therefore stand fast, and do not let yourselves be confined again in a yoke of slavery.
Thanks Blu, I was just looking for that scripture myself.
YogsVR4
08-01-2003, 02:02 PM
[Hijacking thread]
For those who like scripture and its references to slavery. I do not condone slavery. It was/is a barbaric practice but because of the prior reference to the bible – I give you these. Places where the bible does not condemn slavery and seems to be endorsing the act.
Exodus 22: 1-4 "In case a man should steal a bull or sheep and he does slaughter or sell it, he is to compensate with five of the herd for the bull ....he is to make compensation without fail. If he has nothing, then he must be sold for the things he stole".
Col 3:22 "Slaves, be obedient to those who are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in the sincerity of your heart, as to Christ;" 6 not by way of eyeservice, as men-pleasers, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart. 7 With good will render service, as to the Lord, and not to men, 8 knowing that whatever good thing each one does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether slave or free. 9 And masters, do the same things to them, and give up threatening, knowing that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no partiality with Him.
Joel 3:8 God warns that, "I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hands of the Judians, and they shall sell them to the Sabeans, to a people far off."
Titus 2:9-10 slaves are ordered to, "Be submissive to your master and give satisfaction in every respect".
Or
Paul's letter to Titus tells slaves in no uncertain terms that: "Slaves are to submit to their masters and please them in all things. They must not answer them back or steal from them. Instead, they must show that they are always good and faithful, so as to bring credit to the teaching about God our Savior in all they do." 2: 9-10.
[\Hijacking thread]
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For those who like scripture and its references to slavery. I do not condone slavery. It was/is a barbaric practice but because of the prior reference to the bible – I give you these. Places where the bible does not condemn slavery and seems to be endorsing the act.
Exodus 22: 1-4 "In case a man should steal a bull or sheep and he does slaughter or sell it, he is to compensate with five of the herd for the bull ....he is to make compensation without fail. If he has nothing, then he must be sold for the things he stole".
Col 3:22 "Slaves, be obedient to those who are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in the sincerity of your heart, as to Christ;" 6 not by way of eyeservice, as men-pleasers, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart. 7 With good will render service, as to the Lord, and not to men, 8 knowing that whatever good thing each one does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether slave or free. 9 And masters, do the same things to them, and give up threatening, knowing that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no partiality with Him.
Joel 3:8 God warns that, "I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hands of the Judians, and they shall sell them to the Sabeans, to a people far off."
Titus 2:9-10 slaves are ordered to, "Be submissive to your master and give satisfaction in every respect".
Or
Paul's letter to Titus tells slaves in no uncertain terms that: "Slaves are to submit to their masters and please them in all things. They must not answer them back or steal from them. Instead, they must show that they are always good and faithful, so as to bring credit to the teaching about God our Savior in all they do." 2: 9-10.
[\Hijacking thread]
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2strokebloke
08-01-2003, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Hudson
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
I didn't mention heterosexual couples because the topic at hand is gay marriage. If you did indeed read my post, then you'd know that I don't think it should be illegal or banned - but rather that it doesn't make too much sense (to me) for two people incapable of having children to get married (and this also holds for heterosexual people in my opinion as well - yours may differ) I'm not saying it's wrong or should be condemned, I'm just saying that to me it isn't logical - that is all.
As for the AIDS comment - does anybody remember way back when (stupid) people thought AIDS was God's way of punishing gay people? :lol:
It is true that throughout the eighties and into the nineties it was the homosexual population which seemed to be most at risk (and it's possibly out of date information that you were fed to believe that AIDS is more likely to attack somebody who is gay than is straight) But as time went on, more and more cases of heterosexual people getting AIDS came up, and as I understand it now - there are more heterosexual people than homosexual people afflicted with the disease today.
EDIT: right as I posted this I found this little bit of information:
"The first case of AIDS was reported in the U.S. in 1981. Originally, public perception was that AIDS was a homosexual disease. However, 90% of HIV infections worldwide are due to heterosexual intercourse."
source: http://www.osearth.com/resources/recall/aids.shtml
Many heterosexual couples can't have natural children either. Perhaps they shouldn't be able to take advantage of each other's health insurance either.
I didn't mention heterosexual couples because the topic at hand is gay marriage. If you did indeed read my post, then you'd know that I don't think it should be illegal or banned - but rather that it doesn't make too much sense (to me) for two people incapable of having children to get married (and this also holds for heterosexual people in my opinion as well - yours may differ) I'm not saying it's wrong or should be condemned, I'm just saying that to me it isn't logical - that is all.
As for the AIDS comment - does anybody remember way back when (stupid) people thought AIDS was God's way of punishing gay people? :lol:
It is true that throughout the eighties and into the nineties it was the homosexual population which seemed to be most at risk (and it's possibly out of date information that you were fed to believe that AIDS is more likely to attack somebody who is gay than is straight) But as time went on, more and more cases of heterosexual people getting AIDS came up, and as I understand it now - there are more heterosexual people than homosexual people afflicted with the disease today.
EDIT: right as I posted this I found this little bit of information:
"The first case of AIDS was reported in the U.S. in 1981. Originally, public perception was that AIDS was a homosexual disease. However, 90% of HIV infections worldwide are due to heterosexual intercourse."
source: http://www.osearth.com/resources/recall/aids.shtml
BLU CIVIC
08-01-2003, 02:49 PM
as far as the bible saying that slavery is ok....it not....in the bible says that we have to follow the law of the land...way back when slavery was a ok
as far as God delivering their children into slavery....God's punishment....remember all those people that drowned for their disobediance
but i still don't see what this has to do with gay marriages:dunno:
as far as God delivering their children into slavery....God's punishment....remember all those people that drowned for their disobediance
but i still don't see what this has to do with gay marriages:dunno:
YogsVR4
08-01-2003, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by BLU CIVIC
as far as the bible saying that slavery is ok....it not....in the bible says that we have to follow the law of the land...way back when slavery was a ok
as far as God delivering their children into slavery....God's punishment....remember all those people that drowned for their disobediance
but i still don't see what this has to do with gay marriages:dunno:
It doesn't have anything to do with gay marriages. I even put the hijacking of the thread in there. I will leave the topic to another thread after saying - the bible does condone slavery - read the passages indicated in the thread.
As for gay marriages. I still say "NO" to adoption, but aside from that I say go ahead.
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as far as the bible saying that slavery is ok....it not....in the bible says that we have to follow the law of the land...way back when slavery was a ok
as far as God delivering their children into slavery....God's punishment....remember all those people that drowned for their disobediance
but i still don't see what this has to do with gay marriages:dunno:
It doesn't have anything to do with gay marriages. I even put the hijacking of the thread in there. I will leave the topic to another thread after saying - the bible does condone slavery - read the passages indicated in the thread.
As for gay marriages. I still say "NO" to adoption, but aside from that I say go ahead.
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freakray
08-01-2003, 03:08 PM
The Bible is open to interpretation in any many we see fit.
If I were to read the 5 passages posted here, I would say that 1 openly condones slavery, one clearly says it is not right and 3 seem to say that if you're a slave then you should obey your master, not condoning slavery itself, but telling slaves the manner in which to carry themselves as 'Children of Christ'.
Note that the one which openly condones slavery is an Old Testament passage, whereas the rest are New Testament.
If I were to read the 5 passages posted here, I would say that 1 openly condones slavery, one clearly says it is not right and 3 seem to say that if you're a slave then you should obey your master, not condoning slavery itself, but telling slaves the manner in which to carry themselves as 'Children of Christ'.
Note that the one which openly condones slavery is an Old Testament passage, whereas the rest are New Testament.
ugly kid jon
08-01-2003, 11:20 PM
I don't read the Bible anymore, I say if it feels good do it, as long as you don't squirt it on me.
Some gay guys are respectable, the guys from that new show 'queer eye for the straight guy' they look odd but legitimate.
Then theres those fowl gays :mad: there's this park I used to cut through to get home from school, and I don't know what happened but I can't walk through that park any more, for the last 3 years a vast generation of dirty old men have been hum...using the park for recreational love making. Its so disgusting, they leave used condoms behind and they are mostly active during the day. You don't know how traumatizing it is to catch a couple of these guys erm...wreching the tailpipe, if you know what I mean. Those are people that have no business having kids. Imagine if they bring a new um...play pal every weekend to play with dad 1 and dad 2. What will the children learn?
Some gay guys are respectable, the guys from that new show 'queer eye for the straight guy' they look odd but legitimate.
Then theres those fowl gays :mad: there's this park I used to cut through to get home from school, and I don't know what happened but I can't walk through that park any more, for the last 3 years a vast generation of dirty old men have been hum...using the park for recreational love making. Its so disgusting, they leave used condoms behind and they are mostly active during the day. You don't know how traumatizing it is to catch a couple of these guys erm...wreching the tailpipe, if you know what I mean. Those are people that have no business having kids. Imagine if they bring a new um...play pal every weekend to play with dad 1 and dad 2. What will the children learn?
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