New guy with a few cold air questions

What up fellas im new to the site but this is tite.

ok now the questions. Im lookin to purchase a cold air induction system for my manual 94 prelude vtec. Now my first question is what performed better on a dyno test: AEM or Iceman and which has better potential?


now for the follow up: Is a bypass valve absolutely necessary for my cold air intake? my car aint turbo'd so i dont know

Thanks for the help fellas and i look forward to talkin bout the wonderful world a Honda Tuning!

PEACE-

p.s. i hate mustangs :wink:

Welcome to AF

AEM says their better, Iceman says their better, DC says their better . . .It comes down to 1HP difference maybe on a race engine

When it comes to intakes, they are all pretty much the same. The only time you need to worry about the best flow is when your pushing over 300HP & can breathe massive CFM. I have a CAI Iceman on my 91 Si, works fine & sounds good.

Bypass valve is not neccesary unless you plan on fully submerging the air inlet under water. Even on a lowered car you would need 6" or more of water to cause hydrolock. Waste of money if you ask me

Originally posted by jackasssi
Welcome to AF

AEM says their better, Iceman says their better, DC says their better . . .It comes down to 1HP difference maybe on a race engine

When it comes to intakes, they are all pretty much the same. The only time you need to worry about the best flow is when your pushing over 300HP & can breathe massive CFM. I have a CAI Iceman on my 91 Si, works fine & sounds good.

Bypass valve is not neccesary unless you plan on fully submerging the air inlet under water. Even on a lowered car you would need 6" or more of water to cause hydrolock. Waste of money if you ask me

:werd: I got the AEM but for what that sh*t costs, I'd say shop around. I was totally pleased but still. I almost got the Iceman but I just think it looks to cheaply made for what it costs and basically that's what you'd be paying for on either of the three, the way it looks in the engine bay, seeing as you would'nt be able to feel the gain difference between em.

I agree Iceman is not the nicest looking intake, but whats looks gonna do for me on the race track. Underhood looks at that . . . Maybe I should get me a clear hood:lol:

IMO $50 is too much for a plastic/metal pipe & an airfilter.

This is really a matter of what you want. I agree that Iceman arn't the best looking intakes, but at the same time AEM are a bit overpriced. I recently bought a Beltronics Accelerometer, one of those the reads power, 0-60, g-forces, etc. I found that with 3 different intakes that I tried on my civic, that the difference was +-1HP. usually the intakes added between 3-5HP. I found that even the cheepest intakes from BOMZ and other company's, performed the same as Iceman, and Weapon R.

yep the bypass valve really isnt nessacary because of what jackasssi bout the 6 inches of water, plus i wouldnt be too thrilled about having to cut your intake tube with a saw to install the bypass valve.

Originally posted by Teampurevision
This is really a matter of what you want. I agree that Iceman arn't the best looking intakes, but at the same time AEM are a bit overpriced. I recently bought a Beltronics Accelerometer, one of those the reads power, 0-60, g-forces, etc. I found that with 3 different intakes that I tried on my civic, that the difference was +-1HP. usually the intakes added between 3-5HP. I found that even the cheepest intakes from BOMZ and other company's, performed the same as Iceman, and Weapon R.

How did that Beltronics Accelerometer work?...I was looking at one of those because it seemed pretty hot. Work well?

I don't know anyone who used that new beltronics accelerometer, but I know ppl that have used the Gtech Pro. They liked that a lot.

I see your "Location" field is blank, but the reason why AEM's are so expensive is because of emission checks in some areas. From personal experience I know PA and the Virginias have them, along with CA of course. The AEM's have stickers on them showing they are 50 state legal. Bob's $40 intake doesn't... There was a page long article in the last Super Street with an STI on the cover talking about how companies have to fill out tons of paperwork and put their products through all kinds of grueling tests, but w/out that sticker you can get in trouble if a cop finds it on your car. The emission checkpoints check your muffler's exhaust gasses, and even if you pass that they can still fail you if you don't have a 50 state legal thing on your intake... go figure. Like said above, they're all about the same, but if you want to be safe get whichever one is legal. I'm unsure whether the Iceman one is legal, but if it is get whichever looks better to you.

P.S. this is my 666th post :angryfire :devil: :angryfire

I don't know how it is where he's from, but in oregon it's about emissions levels and sound deibals (exhaust). For the most part, it doesn't have to have a 50 state legal sticker or CARB #, as long as it passes the emissions test and doesn't exceed the decible limit. I know thats not the case in some states though, most notibly California.

what about short ram intakes, i heard they dont have as much gains as cold-air, but dont need as many parts. Also, if one would buy either of these (SRI or CAI), would it help to buy other parts such as a new filter to go along with it.

pretty much im trying to find out what to buy for my 96 integra GSR (VTEC), and i have no clue at the moment

Originally posted by 96GSR
what about short ram intakes, i heard they dont have as much gains as cold-air, but dont need as many parts. Also, if one would buy either of these (SRI or CAI), would it help to buy other parts such as a new filter to go along with it.

pretty much im trying to find out what to buy for my 96 integra GSR (VTEC), and i have no clue at the moment

Parts wise, the Short Ram and Cold Air Intakes have the "same" parts, a metal intake tube (or plastic is some cases) and a conical filter. The difference is in where the conical air filter lies. In a Short Ram, the filter resides in the engine bay, in a Cold Air Intake, it resides outside the engine bay in the front wheel well area, usually between the wheel well and front bumper. This is achived through longer intake tube piping. Some Cold air intakes , like AEM's, have a "Bypass Valve," that keeps water out of the engine when the filter is submerged, preventing hydrolocking. This is really only an issue if you plan out completly sumerging the filter on the CAI, which generally requires at least 6 inchs of standing water, so this is really not a required product, but more of a safty precaution. A CAI makes more power than a Short Ram intake, because cold air is denser. The colder air from near the wheel well is denser air than the warmer air in the engine bay. This is why the CAI is placed there, and why it gains more power. This is also why Turbochargers have intercooler, to cool the intake charge, creating denser air. Sense denser air equals more air molecules, this equals more power in both cases. In general, you get a 1% gain in HP for every 11 degrees F you lower the intake air temperature. For example, if it is 120 degrees under the hood, and 80 degrees outside, a CAI results in a 40 degree cooler intake charge, or 3.6%. On a 142 HP engine, this is a 5.1 HP increase, or 147.1 HP. Of course, the cooler the air outside, the cooler the intake temp, so you will get more power from a CAI (or air-air intercooler) on a 34 degree day than a 95 degree day. I hope this helps explain the difference to you. But as far as parts go, both have a conical air filter (in general) and both have metal (usually) air intake piping running from the filter to the throttle body. The difference is in the filter placment, achived throw difference is the length of the air intake piping. The Shorter Short Ram Intake piping places the filter in the engine bay, the longer Cold Air Intake piping places the filter in general in between the bumper and front wheel well, where it can suck in the cool outside air, creating more power (through the principles discribed above).

wow, that helps

so pretty much, if im willing to pay for the longer tubing of the cold air, i should?

Originally posted by 96GSR
wow, that helps

so pretty much, if im willing to pay for the longer tubing of the cold air, i should?

I would if it was me (I have a CAI myself), it will never be any worse than a Short Ram, if you think about it. Chances are the air on the outside will not be hotter than under the hood, even in the middle of summer. The Short Ram will provide better airflow than the sotck plastic box, less restrictive. Thats where the 1-2 hp increase comes from, although I know of a few cases a short ram really didn't even add that (though on the RSX it get about 7-8 more). A CAI will give you the better airflow, plus the cooler, denser air. It's a win-win sitaution. So if you want my advice, if you are willing to pay extra for the Cold Air, do it. I feel it's worth it.

what about brand names? any suggestions or just go generic

Originally posted by 96GSR
what about brand names? any suggestions or just go generic

generic.

don't pay for the colored tube an the stickers if ur state isn't too picky about all those things. (yes i do agree w/ obeying the law, but in washington, it isn't illegal to have them w/ out the sticker as long as they aren't over the legal decibal limit an can still pass emisions.)

Originally posted by 96GSR
what about brand names? any suggestions or just go generic

My CAI is a custom made one, made by a guy I know who owns a shop near seattle called Performance LAB. It works great. If you live in Cali, though, you'll need a CARB exemption number to pass the visual inspection, so that might not work there.

Other than that, I think a Custom made one, or "generic" one will good, just get a good tubing and a K & N concial shaped filter to put on the end. Plus it may give you a little bit of $$ to save or put towards somethng else. If you decide to get a brand name one, AEM is a good brand for CAI, and I belive they come with the "bypass valve" if that worries you, though as I said earlier it's not necessary. Injen also makes a decent intake. Some people like Iceman, but I personal don't like the look or the fact it's plastic.
In all Honesty, I would go with a custom make (generic) one if you arn't in need of a CARB exemption number. The HP increase should be the same. And it will be a fraction of the cost. Like I said, a good peice of piping, a K & N filter, and the silicion boot and clamps to fit it to the throttle body. You'll be set. A good custom CAI at a fration of the cost of a brand name. If you really like the colored tubing versus the polished chrome look of the custom one, you can also powder coat the piping black or the color of your choice, or spray it a high heat spray paint. That might add the visual color the brand name my provide on the tubing. and it still costs less.

Originally posted by eckoman_pdx
If you decide to get a brand name one, AEM is a good brand for CAI, and I belive they come with the "bypass valve" if that worries you
Nope they don't, you have to buy them separately. I think they cost $15-$20?

Originally posted by Ricochet

Nope they don't, you have to buy them separately. I think they cost $15-$20?

I've seen em priced seperate as low as $20 and as high as $40-$45. Ah well, $20 isn't much extra if you can find the low end price. I've seen AEM CAI's for sale at shops around here with the bypass valve included, thats why I figured it was included. Must be like a shop special I guess. But he doesn't really need one with a CAI anyway, unless someone plans on taking his car through at least 6 inchs of standing water to sumerdge the filter and hydro lock the engine, lol. But I doubt that's in his plans for the car.

I have a short ram intake, I can live without that 1hp. Also my intake is for a Prelude (hacked up a bit) and there's no carb# crap on it. We don't have strict emissions checks anywhere so I can deal with it.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?postid=1114315

i live in california, so im thinking about going with the AEM to be safe, should i get a K&N filter to go with it?

Originally posted by 96GSR
i live in california, so im thinking about going with the AEM to be safe, should i get a K&N filter to go with it?
All AEM's whether short ram or cold air come with K&N's as part of the package. AEM short rams can be bought new for $100-$120, cold airs for $150-$170. The AEM V2 intakes (about 3-5hp more than the regular AEM's, so about 7-12hp gains total) cost around $265 and are carb legal also.

For the price of AEM, it better come with a K&N filter . . . .not some cheap wanna-be K&N. Good lord AEM intake & K&N air filter = $300 intake:iceslolan $300 for a couple un-noticeable HP, no thanks.

Originally posted by jackasssi
For the price of AEM, it better come with a K&N filter . . . .not some cheap wanna-be K&N. Good lord AEM intake & K&N air filter = $300 intake:iceslolan $300 for a couple un-noticeable HP, no thanks.
My buddy has an Integra LS (140hp or so) and installed an AEM cold air, and his car sounds badass and is fun to drive now. He probably gained about 10 horsepower, being a 1.8 dohc, and you can definitly feel it over the stock pos he had on before.

Yeah, I have an LS, and in my civic, and I sure as hell noticed the difference. If you live in cali, the CARB # is important, go AEM. AEM does come with a K & N style filter, although I belive now AEM uses there own AEM filter (like a K & N). It might even be a K & N they call their own. Like K & N, it's reuseable. You don't dump it and buy a new one, you wash it with the cleaning or recahrge pack, and it's good to go again. The AEM V2 (Version 2) intake does cost more, and is CARB exempt. All AEM intake's are CARB exempt or pending CARB approval (CARB exempt generally means 50 state legal too, so no worries). I know several magazines that tested the V2 and showed an improvement over the venerable origanal AEM CAI, however I have never actually seen one used myself, so I can't tell you first hand. I apparently has something to do with the V2's 2 different sized and length piping, which is suppose to hell gain power over the entire RPM band better due to better/mutliple fequency soundwave (and resulting airflow) resonense. This is the thoery behind the V2 at any rate. Here's AEM's link to the intakes it you want to see what we are refering to.
http://www.aempower.com/product_intake.asp

i made mine from the same tubein' use on tractor intakes (the part before the turbo). It has a twisted metal runnin' in the plastic to keep it from folding when air is bein' sucked. It so happens that the one on tractor has a 5" core, but they also have 2'and 4' ones that they sell, i used the 2' on my Vti, ran it to the hole where the stock intake passed in the wheel well and placed a K@N filter there. The Shit works, and it is loud, you can hear air runnin' inside, and it makes a low rumble when Vtec kickin. my house is the 7 house from the main road, and you hear the intake more than the muffler.:biggrin: from the main road.
Note i have to clean it every weekend and the motor revs slow under 1300RPM, then she is rev happy, cost me $25 us

Originally posted by Ricochet
I have a short ram intake, I can live without that 1hp. Also my intake is for a Prelude (hacked up a bit) and there's no carb# crap on it. We don't have strict emissions checks anywhere so I can deal with it.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?postid=1114315

I am getting up to the plate again...
I noticed your EGR looked disconnected? Can that help out performance or was that something you did for show?

I may feel like a retard here in a minute, but what's an EGR? :bloated:

I think you disconnected it to put on the intake

Oh that little sensor plug? On the B16B it goes into the intake manifold.

Originally posted by Ricochet
I may feel like a retard here in a minute, but what's an EGR? :bloated:

Exhaust Gas Recirculation - i think he was meaning the breather tube:confused:

yeah, when I disconnected that plug, my revs seemed to sustain for a second longer than normal.

took out the cheap $20 CAI I got from eBay and put back the stock box. I think the acctuator in the prelude resonator box helps reduce back pressure.

What are these things?

My intake had a total of 3 tubes going into it: breather, and two other ones which I don't know

http://student.ucr.edu/~huangm08/files/temp/DSCF2.jpg
http://student.ucr.edu/~huangm08/files/temp/DSCF3.jpg
http://student.ucr.edu/~huangm08/files/temp/DSCF4.jpg

on the underside of your hood you should have a sticker that shows the schematics of the vacuum lines..egr..and those goodies. Maybe that will help you figure out all those hoses.