My turn to use quotes as facts

http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson.asp

Written by Victor Davis Hanson (National Review Online)

These are still perilous times. But if anyone on September 12, 2001, had
predicted that 22 months later there would still be no repeat of 9/11; that
bin Laden would be either quiet, dead, or in hiding; that al Qaeda would be dispersed, the Taliban gone, and the likes of a Mr. Karzai in Kabul; that Saddam Hussein would be out of power, his sons dead, and an Iraqi national council emerging in his place; that troops would be leaving Saudi Arabia, Arafat ostracized, and Sharon seeking negotiations; that new Middle East agreements under discussion - and all at a cost of fewer than 300 American lives - then he would surely have been written off as a madman.

All that and more were no mere accidents. They were the direct result of the work of thousands of brave and astute Americans who were as likely to be slurred during their risky ordeal as they were to be third-guessed in its successful aftermath - and predictably by the same opportunistic bystanders.

So far we have lost fewer lives in Afghanistan and Iraq than we did in a
single day's butchery in the Marine barracks in Lebanon. But unlike that
terrible sacrifice, this time Americans are fighting back, winning, and
changing for the better the lives of millions in the most remarkable,
ambitious, and risky endeavor since the end of World War II.













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I agree with you, YogsVR4. I also suggest putting on a fire proof suit when posting anything in this Forum that isn't maniacally Anti-Bush and/or Anti-American.

And God forbid you to disclose any conservative tendencies.

Uh-oh. I mentioned God. Better put on asbestos undies, and leave this board for a few months.

Wonder how long before I'm banned? Bet this is my last post. :biggrin:

Don't worry. I've been on this forum since day one and have no problems staying. I am confident with my positions and I have/will voice them. But, you need to give some a break. Just because they have differing degrees of rhetoric doesn’t mean that it’ll turn into any kind of personal attack. Most people do show respect when you take the time to support your position (even if they disagree). Trolls on the other hand, are dealt with accordingly.













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Originally posted by YogsVR4
Don't worry. I've been on this forum since day one and have no problems staying. I am confident with my positions and I have/will voice them. But, you need to give some a break. Just because they have differing degrees of rhetoric doesn’t mean that it’ll turn into any kind of personal attack. Most people do show respect when you take the time to support your position (even if they disagree). Trolls on the other hand, are dealt with accordingly.
:werd:

Originally posted by YogsVR4
http://www.nationalreview.com/hanson/hanson.asp

this time Americans are fighting back, winning, and
changing for the better the lives of millions in the most remarkable,
ambitious, and risky endeavor since the end of World War II.

Or alternatively,you could see it as the most shameful attack since Nagasaki.
You could argue that the U.S. has

FAILED to find Bin Laden
FAILED to find Saddam
FAILED to find WMD.

MURDERED thousands of Iraqi civilian citizens
STOLEN land from the Iraqis
INSTALLED a puppet government in their land.

You will probably not find those arguments to be very palatable,but they are the truth to many people.Somewhere between your 'truth' and my 'truth' there is reality.But don't go trying to kid us that every foul platitude that George's speechwriters come up with to justify this apalling carnage is gospel.

Originally posted by taranaki
Somewhere between your 'truth' and my 'truth' there is reality.But don't go trying to kid us that every foul platitude that George's speechwriters come up with to justify this apalling carnage is gospel.


In the same vein that the vile bilge of Chirac, Mandela and Putin for forgiving the slaughter of the Kurds.













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Originally posted by YogsVR4


In the same vein that the vile bilge of Chirac, Mandela and Putin for forgiving the slaughter of the Kurds.

I missed the part where Mandela 'forgave the slaughter of the Kurds'

Do you have more on that or did you just believe the propogandist rubbish the American media fed you?

Originally posted by freakray
I missed the part where Mandela 'forgave the slaughter of the Kurds'

Do you have more on that or did you just believe the propogandist rubbish the American media fed you?

I offering an equally bogus statment to

"Or alternatively,you could see it as the most shameful attack since Nagasaki.

MURDERED thousands of Iraqi civilian citizens
STOLEN land from the Iraqis
INSTALLED a puppet government in their land."

I do not believe that they would forgive the slaughter of the Kurds any more then the war has murdered thousands of civilians or Nagisaki was a shamefull ack.

All news agencies publish varying degrees of rubbish but is unrelated to what I was getting at.













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So,you'd rather go with the cosy notion that the invasion was a clinical operation,no bombs fell where they shouldn't,no missiles missed their targets and the only people who got fired on deserved to be?

Sorry Yogs,that's a cop-out.Accepting the word of your government that nothing bad is happening in Iraq is the equivalent to your favourite character in previous times,Neville Chamberlain.He was so desperate for 'peace in our time' that he accepted the word of Hitler at face value.I would suggest that you are so keen to preserve your view of U.S. foreign affairs,that you would take any bilge fed to you by CNN as gospel.THE WAR IN IRAQ HAS NO LEGITIMATE PURPOSE.The WMD that you were told could be deployed in 45 minutes have mysteriously vapourised,Saddam Hussein is either dead or in hiding and will never regain power,and yet there are still thousands of undertrained,jumpy,and trigger-happy GI's in Iraq trying to be peacekeepers.The need for assault troops has passed,and the British forces are proving to be far more skilled at staying out of trouble than their American counterparts.There is no conceivable purpose for the U.S. military to remain in Iraq.PEACEKEEPING AND GOVERNMENT REFORM ARE THE SPECIALTY OF THE UNITED NATIONS.The only reason for America to keep the gun pointed at Iraq's head is to protect U.S. BUSINESS INTERESTS.

I have never said nothing bad has happened in Iraq. I also disagree that the war was legitimate regardless of how many times you capitolize it. As for the UN - well I disagree with you there because as we all know that the UN is only good for fucking things up and wasting time and money.













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Originally posted by YogsVR4


I offering an equally bogus statement

When you're offering your bogus statements, at least show Nelson Mandela the respect deserves, he sacrificed a great deal in the course of his life to bring South Africa out of Apartheid and does not deserve to have his name used in a manner such as yours.

Originally posted by freakray


When you're offering your bogus statements, at least show Nelson Mandela the respect deserves, he sacrificed a great deal in the course of his life to bring South Africa out of Apartheid and does not deserve to have his name used in a manner such as yours.

I would say that the fact I used his name should show the statement as bogus.

Anyway. I think I'm going to fix that typo in the title one of these days. :bloated:













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Originally posted by YogsVR4


I would say that the fact I used his name should show the statement as bogus.

Anyway. I think I'm going to fix that typo in the title one of these days. :bloated:

Hmm....just like George Bush used 'South Africa's' name in his speech justifying going to was with Iraq:rolleyes:

Originally posted by YogsVR4
I have never said nothing bad has happened in Iraq. I also disagree that the war was legitimate regardless of how many times you capitolize it. As for the UN - well I disagree with you there because as we all know that the UN is only good for fucking things up and wasting time and money.

Unless it helps the U.S. out. Then we're pals with the U.N., right?

Originally posted by Accord_Zero


Unless it helps the U.S. out. Then we're pals with the U.N., right?

nice point,well scored.Ditto for NATO.:cool:

Originally posted by Accord_Zero


Unless it helps the U.S. out. Then we're pals with the U.N., right?

No. The UN is shit. It doesnt matter where they stand on an issue, they are a fucked up usless waste of space.













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Originally posted by YogsVR4


No. The UN is shit. It doesnt matter where they stand on an issue, they are a fucked up usless waste of space.
LOL, yea they are. Their about as useful as the democrats here in Texas who keep leaving the state b/c no one can agree on a redistricting plan during this special session.

Originally posted by YogsVR4


No. The UN is shit. It doesnt matter where they stand on an issue, they are a fucked up usless waste of space.

Which brings us back to holding Iraq to the UN resolution. Why bother if the UN is shit?

Originally posted by YogsVR4


No. The UN is shit. It doesnt matter where they stand on an issue, they are a fucked up usless waste of space.


Perhaps if a few more countries who belong to the U.N. supported its objectives instead of constantly trying to use it for their own political ends,it might work more effectively.Perhaps if America ever gets a decent President,America could lead by example.Who knows?last time my car stopped working,I didn't throw it away....I figured out what was causing the problem and fixed it.

Yogs would prefer to walk

Originally posted by taranaki



Perhaps if a few more countries who belong to the U.N. supported its objectives instead of constantly trying to use it for their own political ends,it might work more effectively.Perhaps if America ever gets a decent President,America could lead by example.Who knows?last time my car stopped working,I didn't throw it away....I figured out what was causing the problem and fixed it.

Not to worry. We'll continue to have the same good president through 2008 :bigthumb:


I thought you just ditched your last car :wink:













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