Reeling in a SVT Focus

OK, So last night I'm out cruising (in the black Accord 5sp.)and going past the Ford Dealership near my house, a 5dr Focus SVT jumps out in front of me and cuts me off . I can see when he looks in the rearview and smiles like he's king of the world or something. So I tail him and we get to a light with me right behind him. Light goes green, he takes off and like the Jersey driver I am I take off behind him. He gets a car ahead of me (probably cause of the weight) but when the V-TEC kicks in I begin to quickly close the distance. Then we come up on traffic so we break it down back to 25mph. I know what he's gonna do when traffic opens up so I shift down to 1st which brings it up to 4500 rpm's and just as I thought he goes for it. So as I punch it I'm closing in on his tail I can't pass him cause we're in the left lane of a biway and slower traffic is in the right lane. Finally we come to a light and I jump in the right lane along side him as we stop he yells "nice run, but I didn't expect to pull on a V6." I inform him that's it's not a V6 it's a 4cyl V-TEC. He looks at me like WTF!! I didn't know the 4cyl V-TEC was that strong. I told him I don't have many mods, just a CAI, Plugs, wires, and a Ractive breather.
He said not bad and we went out separate ways

He was pretty cool about it which made it pretty good run

You put it in first at 25 MPH......do you not like your car or something?:confused:

Going into 1st at 25mph is not bad at all. It only revved up to 4500rpm's

At least for my car. I have a 2000 Accord 4dr EX

Good thing the old V-TEC kicked in or he might of had you.

you guys really don't know why is wrong to shift in 1'st at 25 mph....you guys are funny....even most car manual war you against doing it......its not about your engine is about the transmision.....


and the way you were talking about vtec i bet you don't even know what it is

OUCH! You should NEVER downshift into 1st while going 25mph! Downshifting @ 5mph is not as bad, there should be no reason for downshifting into 1st.

In that case I would press the clutch, bring the rpm's up, & then feather out the clutch for a nice 2nd gear hit.

now that i think about it... it is really bad to downshift to first at 25...i dont know what i was thinkin when i posted my first post.....
cause :iamwithst ... jk about the stupid thing

delete it and no one will ever know, well only a few

now no one will ever know... hehe:lol:

Originally posted by streetrcr45
now no one will ever know... hehe:lol:


already forgot about it.....:wink:

:iceslolan

I really don't see a problem with going back to 1st while going 25mph. It's not like I was bouncing off the rev limiter or something. It only took me up to 4500rpm's. If that's a problem, then what's the difference between that and shifting out of 1st into a higher gear at 4500 rpm's?

It's the same thing in an auto. If you're traveling 25mph in an auto and you press the gas pedal all the way down it'll shift into the lowest gear possible for that speed.....Which is 1st.

As far as me not knowing what V-TEC stands for......Are you serious???

Instead of commenting on that remark, I'll just post a link to elighten YOU on the function AND purpose of V-TEC

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/framed.htm?parent=question229.htm&url=http://www.leecao.com/honda/vtec/index.html

Originally posted by blacknight
I really don't see a problem with going back to 1st while going 25mph. It's not like I was bouncing off the rev limiter or something. It only took me up to 4500rpm's. If that's a problem, then what's the difference between that and shifting out of 1st into a higher gear at 4500 rpm's?

It's the same thing in an auto. If you're traveling 25mph in an auto and you press the gas pedal all the way down it'll shift into the lowest gear possible for that speed.....Which is 1st.

As far as me not knowing what V-TEC stands for......Are you serious???

Instead of commenting on that remark, I'll just post a link to elighten YOU on the function AND purpose of V-TEC

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/framed.htm?parent=question229.htm&url=http://www.leecao.com/honda/vtec/index.html


do you know anything?look at all the other posts.....its muder on the tranny to shove it in 1'st at 25mph...

and doind a search on howstuffworks does not prove anything.....

btw i'm not 100% sure but isn't the vtec on the 2000 4 cyl accords 4door ex more for gas economy than performance....honda guys? anyone?

Ok i've just checked the specs and a new model ex accord weighs at 3100 pounds as has 160HP

the focus svt weighs at 2500 pounds and has 170hp


and i severily doubt that your car is lighter or more powerful that the newer accords....so i'll do this:
http://www.automotiveforums.com/kris/kris/+junk/bsflag.gif


so you beat a 600 pounds lighter car while having a 10hp deficit......understand this....most honda guys on this forum are cool guys and you won't find any to believe your bulshit about vtec beating everything.....just because they drive honda's too....

Wait a minute....Don't flame me ok. Friggin 10hp really doesn't make a difference. And I NEVER said VTEC beats everything. I do know the limits to my car. Now take into consideration he had a passenger, I have plugs, wires, an intake, and my torque is a little higher than his will definitely benifit me.

And to correct you, the 5dr focus weighs in at 2,750...not 2,500 lbs

http://modelreports.cars.com/modeldata/trim_report.jsp?makeid=14&modelid=3277&year=2003&myid=3907&acode=USB30FOC126A0&grp=specs&dtl=X&aff=national

Originally posted by Neutrino



do you know anything?look at all the other posts.....its muder on the tranny to shove it in 1'st at 25mph...

and doind a search on howstuffworks does not prove anything.....

btw i'm not 100% sure but isn't the vtec on the 2000 4 cyl accords 4door ex more for gas economy than performance....honda guys? anyone?

1) According to the Honda technician in my area, as long as the RPM's are matching the the speed of the car when you downshift and as long as you don't redline, shifting into 1st while going 25mph will NOT harm the clutch, tranny, or engine. Just make sure everything is matched as close as possible.

You make it sound like I'm stepping on the clutch, putting the car in 1st and taking my foot off the clutch and letting the RPM's jump from 2,000 all the way up to 4500. That's just plain Insane!!! The only time I would do that is if I was renting a car

2) You made a comment about me not knowing what V-TEC is, so that's why I posted the link instead of explaining it to you

3) V-TEC's main goal is to offer excellent gas mileage at high RPM's while still getting good performance. Regardless if it's SOCH or DOHC. Although, DOHC does offer higher performance than SOHC

Whoa, calm down folks, this is getting pretty heated. Children you need to play nice or else goto your rooms! :sunglasse


:lol:

I drive the same car as you bud. (except mine is LX, whatever, no diff) If I even think of shoving that stick left and up when doing more than 5-7mph, I get resistance in the shift gate. And whenever my car acts like it doesn't really want me to do something, I listen.

I don't know what Honda tech guy you talked to, but he's losin it. What exactly do you mean by "matching your RPMs and speed"???
Engine speed (which is referred to in RPMs)???
Velocity??? Your velocity and RPMs are related, yes. But I don't see how you would "match" them unless you mean making sure that you are at a reasonable RPM for the current velocity???

I'm thoroughly confused.:confused:

But anyway, first gear was not intended to handle that sort of sudden demand. It's meant to get you goin and then move on. I've never heard of anybody downshifting to first gear. Plus downshifting to first is rather worthless because you have to shift out in a second anyway! I don't really off the top of my head remember what first gets me to in my accord (30+ish), but if you shifted to first going 25 and punched it, you shifted to second about 1.5 seconds later. You spent as much time rocking forward with the clutch depressed as you did accelerating. Worthless. You couldve had a nice run in second gear.

BTW: I didn't know there was a SVT ZX5. I thought it was SVT ZX3. I believe you, I'm just stating my own ignorance.

First off, I am one of those people that believe that anything can happen on the streets...but the way you described the race...I dunno.

I beat a stock SVT Focus with my SE-R by about 1 car. On the other hand, I can beat my friend's 2002 V6 with full-dual exhaust and CAI, by about 2 cars.

Also, if you know anything about the Focus SVTs, their disadvantage is at the launch (stock), because they have an undefeatable traction-control system (stock).

So, pulling on one that is already rolling...I dunno.

For reference, my car has 140HP/132TQ, almost like your F22...except mine comes in a 2350lb car with aggressive gearing as opposed to a 2900lb car with "economy" (read: tall) gearing.

2003 Ford Focus SVT 5dr hatchback

Check it out

http://modelreports.cars.com/modeldata/trim_report.jsp?makeid=14&modelid=3277&year=2003&myid=3907&acode=USB30FOC126A0&grp=specs&dtl=W&aff=national

You're right. This is childish to continue. I know what I did and I'm well aware of my car's capabilities. I cannot see the problem of shifting back into 1st at 25mph when my RPM's will only go up to 4500.

If that's the case we should never raise our RPM's up to 4500 because going out of 1st at 25mph raised at 4500rpm's or going into 1st at 25mph raised at 4500RPM's Is basically the same thing...correct??

Carrrnuttt, why did you make my other post go bye bye?

Not mad, just wondering why, there was no flaming in it. Unless my computer messed up and it never posted in the first place. Oh well, it wasnt important.

Also:
For reference, my car has 140HP/132TQ, almost like your F22...except mine comes in a 2350lb car with aggressive gearing as opposed to a 2900lb car with "economy" (read: tall) gearing.

The 98-02 Accord 4cyl run with F23 engines. F22 was 4 and 5gen if I remember correctly. The "econotall" gearing is 100% correct tho.

all the info i posted was from the offcial websites and i belive those more than some internet website......


so bottom line is that you beat a car with more horsepower and way less weight than you.....

second if you want to keep shifting at 25 in 1'st go right ahead buddy....its your car.....


and as you said about vtec you're wrong.....on performance oriented hondas is not as much to save gas as it is there to asure both bottom and top end end torque




carnutt....i belive you could take down an SVT but as you said.....you have a lighter car plus more agresive gearing

Originally posted by 00accord44
Carrrnuttt, why did you make my other post go bye bye?

Not mad, just wondering why, there was no flaming in it. Unless my computer messed up and it never posted in the first place. Oh well, it wasnt important.


Sorry, wasn't me if that did happen. I don't remember ever deleting/moving any of your posts, and trust me, I remember these things.


Originally posted by 00accord44

Also:


The 98-02 Accord 4cyl run with F23 engines. F22 was 4 and 5gen if I remember correctly. The "econotall" gearing is 100% correct tho.

You are absolutely correct. I shouldn't have forgot about the F23, since I just saw one last week in my friend's shop. It was about to go into a 1994 Accord sedan...

Anyhow, that changes the specs to 150HP/152TQ, but it is still in a 2900lb car.

2003 Ford Focus SVT:
Curb Weight: 2750lbs
Horsepower: 170HP
16.2 pounds-per-horsepower

2000 Honda Accord 4-dr EX:
Curb Weight: 2888lbs
Horsepower: 160HP (Assuming your mods)
18.1 pounds-per-horsepower

Lastly, that SVT has a close-ratio six-speed compared to the "econotall".

Originally posted by Neutrino
all the info i posted was from the offcial websites and i belive those more than some internet website......


so bottom line is that you beat a car with more horsepower and way less weight than you.....

second if you want to keep shifting at 25 in 1'st go right ahead buddy....its your car.....


and as you said about vtec you're wrong.....on performance oriented hondas is not as much to save gas as it is there to asure both bottom and top end end torque




carnutt....i belive you could take down an SVT but as you said.....you have a lighter car plus more agresive gearing

1) Correct me if I'm wrong. but I was the one who posted information AND LINKS to official websites

2) you're right. It is my car and I can do what ever I want. BUT, you have yet to explain to me why it ISN'T safe to downshift to 1st while going only 25mph. Maybe you just don't think it's safe, I don't know, but you haven't even acknowledged my point of an automatic driving at 25, depressing the gas all the way and leting the tranny automatically downshift to the next lowest gear....FIRST!! Or why is it ok to shift OUT of first at 4500RPM's but not ok to GO BACK to 1st and up to 4500RPM's. You are avoiding all of the points I'm making....WHY?

3) No look at the spec on the focus again. Remind you this is a 5dr wagon. That means it has 4 doors and a hatchback. But in case you forgot here's ANOTHER link
http://modelreports.cars.com/modeldata/trim_report.jsp?makeid=14&modelid=3277&year=2003&myid=3907&acode=USB30FOC126A0&grp=specs&dtl=X&aff=national

The car has 170hp and 145ft lbs of torque. Remind you, this car weighs in at 2,750lbs now compare that to my car. Once again, in case you forgot, here's the link

http://modelreports.cars.com/modeldata/trim_report.jsp?makeid=18&modelid=212&year=2000&myid=1201&acode=USB00HOC011E0&grp=specs&dtl=X&aff=national

Now let's compare, my car (with Mods) is around 160hp and 156ft lbs of torque weighing in at only 3,000lbs

Now the focus only has only 10 extra horses and is lighter by only 250 lbs. I won't even mention the fact that he had a passenger or that my torque (156 vs 145) is higher than the focus
Now why is it so hard to believe that I can slowly walk a Focus wagon??

As for the V-TEC thing. I'm not saying.....I'll say it again. I'M NOT SAYING that V-TEC is the shyt but I am saying that V-TEC, IVTEC or even VVTI does help in a high rpm situation. Why do you think other car manufacturers are starting to offer in their 4cyl engines?

Now, here's another DIRECT QUESTION. Since you say I'm wrong about this VTEC thing:biggrin: why don't you tell me the purpose of DOHC VTEC.
I was under the impression that it's ONLY operated at top end but still gets good fuel economy at low RPM's. Of course 4cyl. DOHC honda engines (Integ. GSR, Type-R, Civic SI's,S2000) are produced for performance, but are still made for excellent gas mileage.

If I'm wrong then don't just tell me....SHOW ME:cheers:

ok wise ass...those are official numbers not the crap you posted....those are straight form the manufercturer......


honda 4door accord ex----newest model

http://www.hondacars.com/models/specifications.asp?ModelName=Accord+Sedan

curb weight----3109/3166

svt focus
http://www.svt.ford.com/flash/bottom1focus03.html

curb weight 2,593 lbs. (3-door), 2,675 (5-door)

this is what i call offcial sites.....from the manufacturers


about you question regarding the vtec read this:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/t77265.html


you can read there about vtec implementations geared just for economy....

about the gear shift look at all the post that tell you the same thing.....but hey what we all know....maybe we are all stupid....


bottom line is......i got you all the official info and you have less power and more weight and less agresive gears.......so you are full of it....you were not gaining on anyone unless he was not racing.....or it was not a real svt

C'mon. How many times do I have to post it. I have a 2000 Accord, Not a 2003. The 2003's are heavier than my Accord.
And I wasn't being a wise ass, I was just making my points as clear as possible


But let's just leave it alone. I know what I ran with and I know what I did. So, we'll leave it as that.

Now take into consideration he had a passenger, I have plugs, wires, an intake, and my torque is a little higher than his will definitely benifit me.

Ok so you have 161.5HP - WATCH OUT!

Yeah, im just having trouble believing this kill.... and for the downshifting into first.... why bother? You wouldnt get much more speed starting from first than you would from second, save the time and hassle of shifting TWICE to be where you could have just started from.

Originally posted by jackasssi


Ok so you have 161.5HP - WATCH OUT! :lol:

While we're on the subject I'd just like to add that I smoked a Lamborghini earlier by 4 car lengths, :spit:
:bigthumb:



:cwm27:

J/k this is kind of pointless to argue whether or not he beat a fuckus, whether he did it not really doesn't matter at this point, so let's all play nice eh?

just a question on shifting in to first, i can't really do it either, i think there's some sort of safety on my car the locks the gateway until 15mph and down, do you guys get anykind of resistance when shifting into first at higher speeds?

to try and end this on a good note. . .

nice reel in blacknight, :bigthumb:

DO NOT SHIFT INTO 1st GEAR WHILE MOVING! its that simple. There are no synchro for down shifting into 1st. This is why its difficult & after a while of doing that becomes easy because you done fucked up your tranny!!!!!!!

Shift into 1st all you want, that brings me business. Thanks in advance

Now if you beat the V8 RWD Focus, that would be something to talk about.

:werd:

The only thing stupider than shifting into first while at speed is shifting into reverse at speed. Just because your car CAN do it doesn't mean it should happen. just like doing tranny drops in automatics. (Throw it in neutral, rev up 3k-6k and throw it in drive to get a quick launch) Its easier than you think to murder your tranny after repeated abuse.

Well now if you have a Manual can't you get a new tranny that perhaps can handle that abuse? Or that is atleast more resistant to it? When driving a Manual I've never had to do that. When I was learning I did it once and I felt the car did NOT like it so I never did it again above 5-7 MPH...

I'm just wondering if you can get a tranny like that and perhaps about what it will cost?

I'v enever heard of a tranny with a "tougher" first gear. I guess it all depends on the material they use in the construction of the parts. But I'm assuming they "tougher" they make it though, the heavier it will be and the harder it will be to shift.:frown:

well i'm not an engineer but i guess there is a posibility they could bulild a transmission that will allow you shift in first......or maybe there is something in the basic design of the transmissions that forbids that period......i'm not an engineer so i wouldn't know


all i know is that if you shift in first while moving is bad for the tranny of any normal car and the faster you go the worst is going to be......

as jackasssi said its related to the syncros....he probaly knows more details than me though