aerio knocking/pinging

I have a relatively new 2003 suzuki aerio s model that has just over 12,000 miles on it.

The car ran great up until about 11,000 then it started pinging or knocking upon hard acceleration on the flats or going up a grade of any sort. There is no engine service light on and the dealer has scanned it and it shows no service codes. The service dept. at the dealer where I bought the car has driven it and they say they don't hear anything. They say with no error codes being displayed on the scanner, that there's not much they can do. Nice, huh?

It would also be important to mention that I have tried different grades and brands of fuel and I also added a bottle of octane booster to one tank of gas to try and rule out any issues that might be related to bad gas or incorrect timing. The end result was the same and the engine continues to ping/knock on acceleration or going up a grade.

Any help from anyone would be greatly appreciated. It seems that a lot of the mechanics in the service departments at the dealers really don't know much about these cars.

The car is definately pinging/knocking, regardless of what the dealer said about not hearing it.

Thank you kindly

try a better grade fuel

I work on suzukis and i am going to go out on a limb and say that you are hearing the normal noises of that engine. Im not saying for sure. But I know for damn sure those things are pingy sounding to begin with.

What the dealer did is right. If you cant hear it and have no history codes. ISnt much you can do. I ran a tech bulletin search and found nothing.

Just a thought . .
double check to make sure that none of your vacuum hoses have become disconnected.

cheers,
John

i've read about this alot on the suzukiaerioforum, but it's always been associated with low grade fuel.

Its not the gas quality in question here. I tried 4 different brands. No luck…. Only changing to either mid-grade or high-grade will reduce (not end) the knocking/pinging. Let’s face it folks, the 2003 Aerio has a serious pinging problem. The service technician at my dealer says there seems to be a problem with high mileage Aerios.

My Aerio will not run on regular unleaded. I have one with 50,000 miles (80,000 Kms) and yes its pings....badly ... The ERG valve has been changed twice. Oh yes, The pinging gets much worse on hot days.

UPDATE: I have just encountered a car with this exact same problem and it happened at the same mileage you said it happened.

What ever came of this? Did you get it fixed? Im going to get on the horn with Suzuki and see what I can figure out.

Another UPDATE: I FIXED IT! All it was is the timing was off 3 degrees too much advanced. I talked to Twan at Suzuki and this is the process he said to go thru to fix it.

1.First check timing and make sure it is exactly 5 degrees advanced.

2. Check operation of EGR system

3. Check for what type of fuel is being used and have them use a quality fuel with an octane of 89 or more.

4. Run a quailty carbon remover thru system, preferably a chemical that is sucked in thru the intake system.

All I know is this damn thing was LOUD. I adjusted the timing that 3 degrees and its totally fixed. I hope this works for everyone else.

Another UPDATE: I FIXED IT! All it was is the timing was off 3 degrees too much advanced. I talked to Twan at Suzuki and this is the process he said to go thru to fix it.

1.First check timing and make sure it is exactly 5 degrees advanced.

2. Check operation of EGR system

3. Check for what type of fuel is being used and have them use a quality fuel with an octane of 89 or more.

4. Run a quailty carbon remover thru system, preferably a chemical that is sucked in thru the intake system.

All I know is this damn thing was LOUD. I adjusted the timing that 3 degrees and its totally fixed. I hope this works for everyone else.
Mine was VERY LOUD TOO!!!!so ....the enigine was opened ....all the carbon buildup was removed (there was a lot)...and the pinging has stopped .....for now ..... reducing the timing will cost you big time in gas mileage ...and your NOX and Hydrocarbon numbers with soar .... If your State / Province requires a regular emmissions test.... you may not pass .....The Suzuki technician suggests I run a can of carbon remover through the engine every 10,000 Kms. .... (6250 Miles) other than that .. nothing more they can do.

5 degrees is the spec. It was out of spec. Im wondering if this is why some people are bitching about bad mileage.

Fix your timing and youll be fine.

5 degrees is the spec. It was out of spec. Im wondering if this is why some people are bitching about bad mileage.

Fix your timing and youll be fine.
My mileage is great ...6 litres per 100 Kms ...about 46 miles to the Canadian gallon on the highway ... timing isn't the problem .... carbon build up is the problem .... The new upgraded EGR valve (did you get one?) may solve that problem ....we'll see ... going to check the engine advance tomorrow

Hey, all. This is my first post here, as you may see on the side. I just bought a 2002 Aerio a few weeks ago, and love everything about it except the gas mileage. Granted, the fuel gague acts funky, dropping 3 bars sometimes from time to time, then going back up, but on average, I am guessing that I am getting maybe 20 miles to the gallon.

Even more interesting is that I'm driving it EXTREMELY SOFT. We're talking slow start ups, neutral as often as I can, I anticipate lights and let off the gas coasting all the way to the light hoping to not have to brake and accelerate (annoying, I know, but for the test).

I'm kinda new to learning about cars, so I'm interested in finding out about the four things Aerio In Canada posted. Anyone have any reading or advice on this kinda stuff so I can fix my mileage problem? Thanks in advance,

--Vic--

Hey, all. This is my first post here, as you may see on the side. I just bought a 2002 Aerio a few weeks ago, and love everything about it except the gas mileage. Granted, the fuel gague acts funky, dropping 3 bars sometimes from time to time, then going back up, but on average, I am guessing that I am getting maybe 20 miles to the gallon.

Even more interesting is that I'm driving it EXTREMELY SOFT. We're talking slow start ups, neutral as often as I can, I anticipate lights and let off the gas coasting all the way to the light hoping to not have to brake and accelerate (annoying, I know, but for the test).

I'm kinda new to learning about cars, so I'm interested in finding out about the four things Aerio In Canada posted. Anyone have any reading or advice on this kinda stuff so I can fix my mileage problem? Thanks in advance,

--Vic--
3 months after getting mine (2003 Aerio) the dealer replaced the level/fuel temp sender in the gas tank. Its a 1 hour job. I have never had that kind of problem with the quirky digital dash board. No wild fuel level swings here.

Ok ... further to the sting of comments posted here .... Got the 2003 back from the dealer ... engine was "decarboned" .. I have the "new and improved" EGR valve installed and after 800 miles ....no pinging on 87 octane unleaded!! ..... so far so good ....We'll keep you posted.

Oh yeah ...if you're looking to replace your tires ..the Yokohama AVID T4s are an excellent choice. I just bought 4. ... handling is great .... ride is ...sporty ....and the don't have that low rumble sound of the OEM Geolandars.

Hey All!

I own a 2004 Aerio 11,000 km and it rattles...I don't want to call it "the ping" but that what it seems to be. I have put in higher octane fuel and still it rattles on acceleration. The deal I bought it from basically told me that they don't want me to bring it in anymore ...as "they can't seem to find the problem"-- so I tried another dealership, a little more helpful saying Suzuki has had other complaints but not much they can do.

I've done a lot of research into the "detonation" problem, as it's called, and eventually it does cause things such as the head gasket and pitsons to wear out earlier then normal.

I am going to keep trying to have the problem properly analyzed, as I don't feel that a brand new car should sound like a jalopy. Doesn't look good for Suzuki either having everyone stare at my shiny brand new car when it drives noisily by.

Good tip about the EGR valve, my next attempt!!
Cheers

This issue does seem to be carbon related.. The new EGR valve does not seem to help on the Aerio..

Try using a Snap-On Moto Vac on the car, that should remove all the carbon on the pistons and valves.

Tim

One of the pervious posts asked what the pinging could (will) do to the engine. Well .... a lot. ....serious pinging (detonation) will burn a hole through the top of the pistons. Sound bad yet??? ... Moderate pinging can cause compression ring failures, head cracking, burned valves and in weird cases .. bearing failures .... Oh just a pile of fun stuff, eh!!! And for those with environmental concerns ... a pinging engine is a dirty burning engine. Thats all we need ... pinging motors and the Sierra Club chasing us.

Basically it all comes down to this folks ...

Either Suzuki gets it fixed ... or we'll all be taking about what we were doing when we experienced our first catastrophic engine failure. Everyone has a fire extinguisher in their car?? If not. You may want to get one.

Aerio in Canada,

There is a major difference between pinging and detonation. The Aerio is equipped with a knock sensor, not a ping sensor. If there were pre-detonation, the knock sensor would kick in and back off the timing… The pinging is not going to break pistons, ring, or burn the valves. Your car will still pass Air Care (or Drive Clean), so you know the combustion temps are not too high causing more NOX.
I had an ’89 Honda Civic LX that pinged on regular gas from the day I bought it new (was a very common complaint this model). It had over 220,000km’s on it when I traded it in (still pinging). It had over 300,000km’s the last time I saw it in Kelowna and the motor was still going strong.

My point is, don’t start worrying about it damaging the motor, it might annoy you, but the odds are pretty slim that it will cause any damage…

Tim

Aerio in Canada,

There is a major difference between pinging and detonation. The Aerio is equipped with a knock sensor, not a ping sensor. If there were pre-detonation, the knock sensor would kick in and back off the timing… The pinging is not going to break pistons, ring, or burn the valves. Your car will still pass Air Care (or Drive Clean), so you know the combustion temps are not too high causing more NOX.
I had an ’89 Honda Civic LX that pinged on regular gas from the day I bought it new (was a very common complaint this model). It had over 220,000km’s on it when I traded it in (still pinging). It had over 300,000km’s the last time I saw it in Kelowna and the motor was still going strong.

My point is, don’t start worrying about it damaging the motor, it might annoy you, but the odds are pretty slim that it will cause any damage…

Tim

OK .... lets get this straight .... The dealers admit this is a serious problem ...Suzuki Canada is working on it offering various fixes .... It's VERY LOUD ... and you think this is acceptable???? I suggest you are dead wrong.

I know what engine knock sounds like ... just put an Aerio under any load on a hot day ond open the windows ....you'll hear it loud as HELL!!!! ....removing all the carbon seems to fix the problem for a short while .... and you still think its acceptable???? Are you a Suzuki employee?

One of the technicians mused that this could be a worse problem than Suzuki's defective timing chair problem on their V6 engines ... that one, he claims is a real nightmare.

I Know 2 people who have had their timing chains replaced under warranty ... one of them is on his 3rd chain ... both Vitara's are leased ... and neither is willing to buy the vehicle now because of this problem.

Aerio in Canada,

You missed my point.. I was not trying to say that the pinging is normal, or acceptable (that's another issue :smile: ), I'm just saying it's not going to damage anything...

Tim

My engine was making sort of a knocking noise... Then it blew up... (No really, it spun the #2 rod bearing :( )

-Ian

Engine - Ticking Noise
Section Title: Engine
TSB No. TS 02 12112

Division: Automotive
Category: General

SUBJECT
ENGINE TICKING NOISE

MODEL(S):
VITARA (SQ 420), GRAND VITARA (SQ 625), GRAND VITARA XL7
(JA627), ESTEEM (SY418), AERIO (RH 420)

YEAR:
1999-2003

CONDITION:

A condition may exist of a tick noise that is heard during cold or hot engine operation. The condition is most noticeable in a vehicle where the engine has not been run for extended periods of time. This condition also is noticed following lifter or camshaft repairs.

CAUSE:

This condition may be caused by oil drain down in which air may get trapped in valve lifters not allowing for proper lifter adjustment.

CORRECTION:

Perform the following procedure to purge air trapped in the valve lifters before any major engine repairs.

REPAIR PROCEDURE:

1. Apply the emergency brake and place the transmission in park or neutral.

2. Run engine at 2,000 RPM for approximately 20 minutes. After the 20 minutes has elapsed the air should be purged and the noise should stop.

3. Every 5 to 10 minutes check coolant temperature and instrument panel indicator lamps during the run time.

4. After the specified run time recheck for lifter noise at idle.

^ Note : If the noise is still present after performing above procedure locate the defective lifter(s) by using a listening device and replace it (them). Or remove the valve cover(s) with engine stopped and push lifter down by hand with a force less than 20 kg (44 lbs.) when camshaft is on the base circle. If clearance exists between the camshaft and the lifter the lifter is defective and should be replaced.

Vic i have the same problem with my 2002 Aerio, have you gotten an answer or solution yet?

Hey, all. This is my first post here, as you may see on the side. I just bought a 2002 Aerio a few weeks ago, and love everything about it except the gas mileage. Granted, the fuel gague acts funky, dropping 3 bars sometimes from time to time, then going back up, but on average, I am guessing that I am getting maybe 20 miles to the gallon.

Even more interesting is that I'm driving it EXTREMELY SOFT. We're talking slow start ups, neutral as often as I can, I anticipate lights and let off the gas coasting all the way to the light hoping to not have to brake and accelerate (annoying, I know, but for the test).

I'm kinda new to learning about cars, so I'm interested in finding out about the four things Aerio In Canada posted. Anyone have any reading or advice on this kinda stuff so I can fix my mileage problem? Thanks in advance,

--Vic--
Vic i hav

I changed the air filter, and that seemed to cure my low gas mileage problem. The gas guage is still funky, but oh well.

--Vic--

My wife has a 2000 Esteem with the 1.8L which I think is the same as the Aerio engine. Anyway, the car has 67k and has been a great car. Since new, it has always seem to ping just a bit, but over the past few months, it is getting worse. The car has always been maintained by Suzuki. I don't want the pinging to damage this car and was wondering what I need to do to remove the carbon? I have seen that seafoam works great, but I have no idea which hose to use to suck it into the engine. Has anyone tried any of these carbon cleaners on their suzuki?

I am curious how adjusting the timing of these engines (5 degrees advanced) is a fix, considering I just began researching these vehicles and stumbled across the below info.

"Low-maintenance features ensure that the Aerioís engine will be easy to live with. (Self-adjusting high-strength timing chains run in a continuous oil bath and never need routine service or replacement.) Compared to rubber timing belts used on most competitorsí engines, the Suzuki system saves their costly replacement. The valves adjust themselves automatically"

I'm wondering Particularly about the self adjusting timing belt design.

If you advanced the timing to where its supposed stay in the first place then would it eventually readjust itself out of whack again? Or did it just happen to be in the process of correcting itself when the dealer checked it? How much does it drift out before self correcting?

My point is if the timing truly self adjusted then it should never be out (unless its in the process of correcting itself) or need adjusting unless its design, or some mechanical component, fails.

Does anyone know how often the the dealer recomends replacing timing chains for this vehicle?

The quotation above found at the following link claims never.
http://www.hispanianews.com/archive/2003/05/15/06.htm

Does anyone know if Suzuki also makes this claim? If so then why are Suzuki mechanics making timing belt adjustments? Wouldn't they be aware of this.

Am I missing something?