1985 Grand Am

HI, I'm looking for some suggestions for my car not getting fuel or spark, I've done quite a lot of work on it so far. I went ahead and changed out the old engine,because I thought since a few bearings were burnt out I might have lost compression ,I know that was pretty big start, but the pistons were done. So after that I've replaced the secondary coil. the dist. module,pick up coil, coolant temp. sensor and other things I can't quite remember .Anyway the last time I was driving it , I was on the freeway and the engine was cutting off , I have a manual so I tried to keep it alive downshifting it was trying to keep running, but ended up dead. After that I tried cranking it and it almost wanted to go,then it started clicking like the batt. was dead. Now I have fuel going to the tbi but not out ..Not sure if it's because of no spark.Also I have no codes . So if anyone has any ideas please let me know. Thanks.

Wow.......

HI, I'm looking for some suggestions for my car not getting fuel or spark, I've done quite a lot of work on it so far. I went ahead and changed out the old engine,because I thought since a few bearings were burnt out I might have lost compression

But what does compression have to do with fuel or spark?

I know that was pretty big start, but the pistons were done. So after that I've replaced the secondary coil. the dist. module,pick up coil, coolant temp. sensor and other things I can't quite remember .

OK, I'm having a hard time remembering an '85......did this have the "Iron Duke" 2.5 4 cyl or the V6? Did it have a distributor or DIS system?

Anyway the last time I was driving it , I was on the freeway and the engine was cutting off , I have a manual so I tried to keep it alive downshifting it was trying to keep running, but ended up dead. After that I tried cranking it and it almost wanted to go,then it started clicking like the batt. was dead. Now I have fuel going to the tbi but not out ..Not sure if it's because of no spark.Also I have no codes . So if anyone has any ideas please let me know. Thanks.

So if you have no spark and no injector pulse(did you check the harness with a noid light? Do you have power on one leg of the injector harness?), it sounds like you are not getting a reference signal from the ignition module, if this has a distributor.....

http://repairguide.autozone.com/znetrgs/repair_guide_content/en_us/images/0900c152/80/25/f5/31/large/0900c1528025f531.gif


So the obvious question is, is the distributor actually turning? Do you have power at the "+" terminal of the ICM? Did you apply the dielectric grease to the back of the ICM before installation? So you have a new ICM and pickup coil installed.....if the distributor turns, with a new ICM and pickup coil, a reference signal should be created...question is, is reaching the ECM? If it isn't, then the injector will not be pulsed by the ECM....if you have an opening between "B" and "+" or "A" and "C", then the coil will not fire.....

Wow.......

HI, I'm looking for some suggestions for my car not getting fuel or spark, I've done quite a lot of work on it so far. I went ahead and changed out the old engine,because I thought since a few bearings were burnt out I might have lost compression

But what does compression have to do with fuel or spark?

I know that was pretty big start, but the pistons were done. So after that I've replaced the secondary coil. the dist. module,pick up coil, coolant temp. sensor and other things I can't quite remember .

OK, I'm having a hard time remembering an '85......did this have the "Iron Duke" 2.5 4 cyl or the V6? Did it have a distributor or DIS system?

Anyway the last time I was driving it , I was on the freeway and the engine was cutting off , I have a manual so I tried to keep it alive downshifting it was trying to keep running, but ended up dead. After that I tried cranking it and it almost wanted to go,then it started clicking like the batt. was dead. Now I have fuel going to the tbi but not out ..Not sure if it's because of no spark.Also I have no codes . So if anyone has any ideas please let me know. Thanks.

So if you have no spark and no injector pulse(did you check the harness with a noid light? Do you have power on one leg of the injector harness?), it sounds like you are not getting a reference signal from the ignition module, if this has a distributor.....

http://repairguide.autozone.com/znetrgs/repair_guide_content/en_us/images/0900c152/80/25/f5/31/large/0900c1528025f531.gif


So the obvious question is, is the distributor actually turning? Do you have power at the "+" terminal of the ICM? Did you apply the dielectric grease to the back of the ICM before installation? So you have a new ICM and pickup coil installed.....if the distributor turns, with a new ICM and pickup coil, a reference signal should be created...question is, is reaching the ECM? If it isn't, then the injector will not be pulsed by the ECM....if you have an opening between "B" and "+" or "A" and "C", then the coil will not fire.....
So I have the 2.5 and I'm not to sure where to start ..I do have power coming to + and C..but no t sure how to test A and C..al the manuals I have don't have the proper layouts and are confusing. Also not sure if this would make a diff. a while back my oil press. sensor wires were caught up in my drive shaft, so I just taped off the wires.The car ran after so I don't think it would cause this right?Also I have the distributor not coil pack.

so far I've checked the following: "C" on module is 4.95. fuel injector 11.83 one leg. I don't have a noid tester. I checked the power to the coil (separate) from dist. just to be clear.So the ignition wire from the driver side harness is 11.85. I can only test the "+" and "C" out to the coolant temp. sensor which are both 11.85. then I just tested "C" @ the ignition module and have 4.95 and nothing @ the "+" side of the ign. module. Thats what info I have so far. Also I'm not even sure these messages are going thru...they look like it!

So I have the 2.5 and I'm not to sure where to start ..I do have power coming to + and C..but no t sure how to test A and C..al the manuals I have don't have the proper layouts and are confusing. Also not sure if this would make a diff. a while back my oil press. sensor wires were caught up in my drive shaft, so I just taped off the wires.The car ran after so I don't think it would cause this right?Also I have the distributor not coil pack.

Yes, I was kind of guessing you had the 2.5 with a distributor....As for the oil sensor, that has nothing to do with spark or injector pulse....

Back to a couple of checks....did you apply the dielectric grease to the back of the new ICM? New P/U coil properly connected to ICM? disconnect and check resistance of P/U coil.....should be 500-1500 ohms....
does the distributor shaft rotate during cranking?

Now let's disconnect the +/C harness..... with the key on(don't crank), both should measure BAT voltage........Disconnect coil lead from the distributor and attach a park tester to the end of the coil lead....now take a jumper wire and attach it to ground.....attach the other end to "C" in the harness.....wait a couple seconds......now remove the jumper from "C".....a spark should be created at the spark tester when you remove the ground....

If you can create a spark, then the ICM is not creating a grounding signal for the coil.......one thing you can try next.....reconnect the +/C harness to the ICM.....make sure P/U coil is connected....install rotor and distributor cap....don't reconnect the coil lead to the distributor, leave it connected to the spark tester.....disconnect the 4 wire harness to the ICM ....now crank the vehicle and see if you get spark......if you don't, either that ICM or P/U coil you got is no good out of the box.....

Ok..not finished with all rest but just wanted to let you know a few things. Dielectric grease was applied, the dist. is moving, p/u coil properly seated , resistance of p/u coil 758 ohms.. Now I'm checking "C/+" from ign. coil connector? Or the dist. connector? Just wanted to be clear..I have 11.85 on all 3 from ing. conn. "+" "C"& Ing. Only 4.95 on "C" and 0 on "+" from conn. to module. So getting ready to try this other test going ...seem like it's going to be difficult. Also needed to know if spark plug wire w/ spark plug will work , I don't have spark tester around. I just remembered I tested the 4wire harness w/key on and get power to all but 1 "B". Just wondering if ign. switch on steering column has any of the wires for this ..wouldn't mind checking out a diagram of that..just to look.

You can use a spark plug.....just run a jumper from ground to the threads......make sure the spark is nowhere near the battery......

As for the 4 wire connector, with it disconnected, and the car cranking, you should be able to create a spark.....

All that 4 wire connector does is send a reference signal to the ECM, so it fires the injector(ref hi).....has a reference ground......has a bypass signal to switch the ICM to ECM control....and the EST signal fires the ICM when the ICM has switched to ECM control....the bypass signal only comes into play after the car has started......so when that 4 wire connector is disconnected, The ICM is firing the coil with no electronic spark timing(this is varied by the ECM)....it's firing at a constant rate while cranking.....

this one seems a little difficult to get..I'm disconnecting the C/+ from the ign. part of the coil right? So the jumper wire ..I take one end to ground and the other to C? THen wait a few and pull off @ C? So C & ground are on the same jumper? Just want to be clear.
Now let's disconnect the +/C harness..... with the key on(don't crank), both should measure BAT voltage........Disconnect coil lead from the distributor and attach a park tester to the end of the coil lead....now take a jumper wire and attach it to ground.....attach the other end to "C" in the harness.....wait a couple seconds......now remove the jumper from "C".....a spark should be created at the spark tester when you remove the ground....

this one seems a little difficult to get..I'm disconnecting the C/+ from the ign. part of the coil right? So the jumper wire ..I take one end to ground and the other to C? THen wait a few and pull off @ C? So C & ground are on the same jumper? Just want to be clear.

No......you disconnect the c/+ harness from the ICM.......then you take the grounded jumper and attach it to the "c" connector in the disconnected harness....then when you disconnect it a spark should be created....

So I have 4.99 on the C, grounded it for 3 sec. and no spark..we are talking about @ the spark plug right?It does seem that if the coil is getting full power @ c & + and the ign.plug in that the coil is that bad guy ? Was that the original reason for the break down in the first place was the failing ing. coil?REplacing it with a brand new bad one...man..All these test.even if there just happen to be a bad ground would've went around some way right?Every thig seems to get power just cant get spark out of the coil!

You have the coil hooked up , correct(the blk and the grey connectors)?

The two wire connector that goes to the C/+ terminals on the ICM, I want disconnected.......with the key on, If you take a voltmeter, and touch the + connector in the disconnected harness, you should get BAT voltage.....if you touch the C connector with the voltmeter, you should get BAT voltage......

Now if you take a jumper, TO A GOOD GROUND, and touch the C connector in the disconnected harness, there will be no spark.....wait a couple seconds, and disconnect the jumper from the C terminal of the harness, and a spark should jump from the spark plug you attached to the coil wire(remember to have the threads of the spark plug grounded).....

The reason there is no spark when you initially ground C in the harness, is because the magnetic field is slow to build up until it is saturated.....when you take the ground away from C, then the magnetic field, collapses instantly, inducing a high voltage in the secondary winding, creating the spark.....

I have no idea where you are getting 4.99 volts on C......

As far as no fuel out of the injector, disconnect the harness to the injector,,,,,

Key on(not cranking)......find out which lead in the harness is hot(usually pink).....now, jumper a wire from that hot lead in the harness to the corresponding connector in the injector......then get another jumper that is attached to a good ground......have someone turn the key off....wait 10 seconds, have them turn the key just to on.....when they do, take the grounded jumper and touch the other connector in the injector(careful not to touch that hot lead with the ground, you will blow a fuse)....when you touch the other injector lead, fuel should come out....just hold it there long enough to just see fuel come out, and then remove the jumper from the injector,,,,,you don't want to keep it connected long and put too much fuel in the throttle body.....

YES!!! JUst ran the fuel inj. test and it worked ..JUst exited to see something happen! I still need to run the other test.

Well not sure if my last post came up ..Don't see it . Anyway ,it's running!I'm really embarrassed to say but, this whole time I had the ecs mixed up w/the +/c conn. their the same type of plug-in! Unbelievable! It idles pretty good but the second I touch the gas pedal.It backfires ..not out the exhaust but back up the tbi. I need to get my timing light from my father house to do that..till then I have 2 codes up 1, the o2 sens. I know it's bad because it's from another car-same engine. The other code is for the IAC. I've had issues with that thing for years! It's fairly new,maybe getting the timing right and the o2 replaced will satisfy that.Let me know what you think.Thanks alot for your help. I figured most people would've gave up on me !

Hi, I was able to get the car to a rough idle,and would die if I touch the gas pedal . So after checking thru everything I could think of I went to star it back up and would not start and spit up a bunch of fuel out of the tbi. ,then I noticed the meter part of the tbi was leaking.So I went to get a fuel reg. (that's the only way to get the new gaskets ) changed it out now it will start but lopes big time,which makes it impossible to time it, but got as close as I could. The car wouldn't even star if I was to install regulator backwards right?

If you now have spark, and this thing is running rough, need to know if it's timing or fuel.......disconnect the injector.......have someone crank the car, and spray carb cleaner into the intake......if it idles ok, then it's a fuel delivery problem......if it still runs rough, then we could have a timing problem, spark problem, compression problem, etc.

Mark the base of the distributor shaft and where it enters the block....then loosen the hold down bolt.....re install injector harness.....turn distributor slightly clockwise, and start car.....if no improvement, try counterclockwise.....if no improvement, move distributor back to the marks you made....recheck that your wires from the distributor cap are going to the correct plug......check rotor and inside of cap for arcing at the contacts.....don't forget to tighten hold down bolt.....

Ok ,checked the distributor cap and one of the poles came out with the spark plug wire. It's not super loose, but I checked the egr. and made a quick gasket because I never put a new one on yet,and I got her running pretty good! So now the timing I can find pretty much the sweet spot , but I cant get the mark close to the timing mark, the closes I was able to get with it running good was about 3 inches away,and yes I did have the check engine plug in. Could it be possible to be off a tooth and it still run?

Man, you are asking me to remember something 30 years ago.....

Is the emission label still on the radiator support? I think it tells you how to do base timing......wasn't there a harness to disconnect? Think it was suppose to be something like 8 degrees BTDC with a timing light?

I would be replacing that cap and rotor......and wires if old....

OK, I was trying to time it with the #1 wire,insted of the coil so I switched iit ,but the timing mark doesn't seem to be much different , far from the timing marker all together. I have the ALDL connected like it supposed to for timing,and I got it running alright,but the second I disconnect it ,it dies! I did runn it down the street though couldn't help myself! So I'm still wondering if 1 tooth on the timing could be why it's off..or would it even run?

Very hard to check the timing of this engine.......I believe it has two meshed gears, that it doesn't have a timing chain......getting that timing cover off is a bear......it is sealed with RTV......and usually when attempting to remove the cover, you bend it all to crap, and you have to, more or less, get a new one.....

Sealing the new one is not easy.....have seen them leak afterwards if not properly done.......tend to doubt it would jump one tooth.....when the gear goes, you'll definitely know.....so, doing this is a last resort......

So you put the car in base timing, by grounding A to B in the ALDL?

I thought the timing light had to be hooked up to #1 wire......been a long time since I did one of these, and the memory is a little foggy on this.....do you have a manual or info with specific instructions on timing this engine?

Do you know if the Distributor was ever pulled on this engine?

Yes I have the timing gears not a chain ,and I wasn't thinking about the gears on the timing but if I installed the distributor 1 tooth off,and I bought the engine used ,but used my distributor. I thought it was supposed to time it @ the #1 too but I looked it up in the manual and it says the coil..but I'll check 2wice.Yea that would be the last think I want to do..take that timing cover off.

Alright the car is purring good with the ALDL connected . Revs good smooth , I even drove it up the street just fine , but when I unplug the ALDL it chokes and sputters then dies.I tried to send a video, but I don't think it was possible.Better to see and hear than just words sometimes.

So, what you are saying is, it runs ok in base mode, but when the computer takes over, it doesn't......you have checked for codes?

Could be a bad ICM or computer......

Well i'm not sure if codes will even show up in base mode will it?my tags are expired so going on main roads cant happen,and i need to go a few miles and get up to @ least 45 right?as far as bad ecm..i hope not i had to order this one from southern cali!no codes for bad ecm show up.EVEN STILL WHILE IT IS RUNNING IN BASE THE TIMING IS STILL OFF BY A FAR.I'VE ADJUSTED THE HELL OUT OF IT , CHECKED TDC ,MARKS LINE UP ON THE PULLEY DIST. SEEMS TO BE LINED UP TO WHERE #1 IS..

Well i'm not sure if codes will even show up in base mode will it?

I don't think it will run diagnostics in base mode....not good to run vehicle this way, anyway......seen an exhaust manifold go "cherry"....

my tags are expired so going on main roads cant happen,and i need to go a few miles and get up to @ least 45 right?

You can't run a drive cycle in base mode....

as far as bad ecm..i hope not i had to order this one from southern cali!no codes for bad ecm show up.

Did you get a new , updated PROM?

EVEN STILL WHILE IT IS RUNNING IN BASE THE TIMING IS STILL OFF BY A FAR.I'VE ADJUSTED THE HELL OUT OF IT , CHECKED TDC ,MARKS LINE UP ON THE PULLEY DIST. SEEMS TO BE LINED UP TO WHERE #1 IS..


The Pulley mark should be on "zero".....during compression......and the rotor should be spot on the #1 coil terminal.....

I bought the ecm used out of san diego so it has the matching service # came out of a stick shift 2.5L, 85'..so as far as getting the car to run on it's own ,-without base connected- it is barely able to have an idle i would guess it was probably 300rpm?-I've gone the full range from left to right and inbetween on the dist-.Then dies fairly quick , but when i hook the base back up I have to move the disrtibutor again. I haven't mentioned this yet because i thought maybe there was no significance but there are two different wires coming from the driver side that are not hooked up 1 i found a matching color that goes back towards the ecm, the other not so sure.So I will go thru the tdc again..I know we talked about tdc on #1 or coil, my manual says coil,and like you've said you thought it was #1 and so did I,the strange thing to me is that as I test the timing that marker stays in the same exact range isn't that strange?and so no more running the car on base mode? That puts me back a little

It's ok to run in base mode for test purposes, but you should not be driving it on the road that way....

Let's get back to basics.....have you done a compression test on all cylinders?

Have you checked for a healthy spark at the end of each wire with a spark tester?

If yes to both, and you have it timed by sight......pulley mark on zero(stroke on compression).......rotor lined up with #1 terminal......wires correctly on the distributor.....in a clockwise motion, the wires should be 1, then 3, then 4, then 2.......

http://repairguide.autozone.com/znetrgs/repair_guide_content/en_us/images/0900c152/80/0a/7c/58/medium/0900c152800a7c58.gif

Disconnect injector.......base timing.....have someone crank car....spray carb cleaner into throttle body....once started, adjust spray to see if car idles ok......if it does, stop.....get out of base timing......start car again, and spray carb cleaner into throttle body....adjust spray for a smooth idle......if you can achieve this, then the problem is fuel delivery......fuel pressure should be 9-13psi......if pressure is ok, then could have a bad injector or the ECM is not pulsing the injector correctly......the ECM could be bad, the PROM could be bad(did you transfer the PROM from the old ECM into the "new" ECM?), or there is a sensor that is causing the problem(would need a scan tool to read data).......

Alright I'll get on that..but about the newer ecm i bought ,well the original ecm I thought to be bad ,so I purchased a new one from the store to then put my prom into, found out aftre that I was given a old used returned ecm, so I exchanged that 1 for a NEW one but when I went to install my prom it wouldn't take got the 15 code i think it was .. so I went back to my original ecm and had the same code come up , so in turn i'm sure my prom was fried from th e bad ecm I bought from the store . Thats why i found the ecm I bought now.Also, my comprssion checher went bad on me a few years ago , but the engine I bought used and was pressure tested, I know thats no assurance .

so i just got done with unplugging the fuel injector and spraying carb cleaner and it started to run a little , then I reconnected the inj. with base disconnected and it ran fairly but rpm,s were low..very, but it was running on it's own ,,now years ago upon desperation I had played with the" idle stop screw"is that a possible thing to play with? THat would raise or lower the rpm's right?Though I'm not sure if thats agood move.

answers to post #27?

Hey , had to do some work on secondary car..Anyway I got the thing running now ..off base and it's right on 8degrees "off base" but when i try to give gas it either stumbles or dies ..backfire type,back up the tbi. when I put it on base and im lucky to have it run at all..I moved the dist. back about 1 or 2 teeth ,so off base it's on 8 deg. but that what it needs to be on "base",and it's pretty touchy as far as moving the distributor .

EXACTLY, what did you do to this car? All the work done? Was distributor ever pulled? Follow timing procedure on the emission's label?

Yes, the distributor didn't come withe the engine so I've been doing TDC the same way over and over ,finally I decided to go back a few teeth, I'll go look at the timing procedure but I'm sure I'm doing it right ,but checking never hurts right? The question still is I shouldn't see the timing mark unless it's on base right? So maybe I'm 1 tooth off?

4(2.0 or 2.5) or 6(3.0) cylinder? Wires correctly on the right terminals of dist?

My memory is a little foggy on this.....does the emission label tell you to disconnect a line, or to jumper A to B in the ALDL connector, to be in base timing?

Once in base timing, then the dist should be rotated to the BTDC spec....

2.5 , wires are correct, ans it's the jumper from A to B. I can't get the thing to run long enough to check timing on Base mode,if at all.... I do have a question about my 89' 2.5 grand am ..there is a freeze plug between the block and the transmission huh.?

I think you may be off a tooth......

Find the compression stroke on number 1, by having someone bump the starter, with your finger over hole of cyl #1(spark plug removed)......when you start to feel compression, stop bumping the starter, you know you are on the compression stroke, and the mark on the pulley should be close to zero on the timing mark.....now manually rotate the engine so the mark is on zero(should not be far away).......mark the side of the distributor, where the #1 terminal is on the cap.....remove cap......does that mark line up exactly with the tip of the rotor? If it doesn't, you are off a tooth or two.....

oK zero top dead has been done , went and marked where #1 should be on dist. and it was off , fixed that. Now I can start it but I have to adjust it back to start then slowly get it 8 degrees with it in base mode( while its running)..but when i turn off the engine It wont start unless i back up the dist. and forget about it running on its own..

I've had this car for a long time now and want to be sure how the dist. sits as far as are the 2 connectors supposed to be on the firewall side or next to the block? I can't find any clear pics anywhere . I feel I've been right though...near the block.

I've been looking all over for anything to help...and I found somewhere that the timing should be around 10 degrees with the aldl disconnected .Does that sound right ? I did get it to run in that degree. Revved pretty clean ,unless I bump the gas then it shuts down quickly.Also when I do have it run..one way or the other i can hear some pops (too rich?) from the muffler,the spark plugs arent new but are not old either.

Hi, I'm back, recently got it running in base mode runs great..as soon as I take it off in order to get it to run is to readjust the distributor , the timing is dead on. I do have a few loose wires ,but I'm sure there from my oil pressure sensor.

Hi, realized I had purchased an ecm for a dis system. I have a distributor, it's been looking for a crankshaft sensor. RE installed my original pcm only starts in base, chip doesn't have effect whether it's installed or not. If I purchase the right service number and make sure it's not for dis will it matter if it's manual or automatic? Thanks

Wow, over two years?

Do you have the original emissions label on the radiator support(sometimes on the strut support)?

It should tell you how to set the timing...... I can't remember that far back, if it was a wire harness that had to be disconnected or if you just jumper A to B in the ALDL connector......in either case, you set the timing(usually 8 degrees BTDC) with a harness disconnected, or the ALDL jumpered......loosen distributor bolt, adjust distributor to timing set on emissions label, and then tighten bolt......then reconnect harness or remove the jumper from the ALDL......now if you look at the timing, it will NOT be the same as the base timing, because now the ECM is controlling the timing....

You must have the correct ECM and PROM for your vehicle.....

Yes I can get timing correct, it's the chip that is faulty and I replaced it with another, it'll run good but won't drive, and just the same without a chip, like it'd be on base.

Have you checked for codes?

Have you looked at data with a scan tool?

Sure you have the correct ECM and PROM numbers? This can easily be checked out at any GM parts department...

Yes no codes, I think because it runs with or without chip it's basically on base the whole time. I can't imagine a getting any info for this old pcm from GM. Just ordered one off eBay, same service number and it's silver not black like the last one I bought, which was looking for a ckp sensor, that's why that didn't work.

You can go into any GM dealership....bring your VIN #.....on the computer, they can look up "vehicle build" with your number...it tells them the ECM number for your vehicle and also the latest PROM # for the ECM, based on your VIN....

Ok thanks, I'll check it out, hope it goes good.

Purchased a ecm from eBay, problem solved, thanks for your help.

Good for you....you kind of lucked out....mid 80's to early 90's ECM's were a real pain.....

Back in the day, when you had a bad ECM, you had a yellow tag, and were suppose to write down all the symptoms and codes(if set), and return the ECM with the tag, and SUPPOSEDLY, the symptoms/codes were fixed, and then the unit was "refurbished" and sold as a rebuilt.....

During that period, I had rebuilt's, right out of the box, that wouldn't even start the car.....in some cases, the rebuilt ECM took care of the original problem, but created a new problem.....so consider yourself lucky.....

Hi, I've got the car running great. Except the o2 sensor will go on as I start to drive, not at idle, even if I idle around the block a few times. I'm thinking the wiring could be the issue. I've replaced the o2. Same results as when I put the other one back as well. The wiring is pretty ugly, some loose,crappy repairs. I'm trying to find a colored wiring diagram, I don't think there is one for this car in particular. I've done qiute a bit of searching. I'm going to school in automotive so I have access to ALL DATA and Mitchel and still not detailed. I know there might possilbly sites that I can spend money on, I am on budget. I'm sure finding a wiring harness is probly near impossible. If I was to be lucky enough to find a harness that is auto would I be able to use it and just close up auto wiring? Except there is 2 wire sensor coming out of manual. PLease let me know, it's been 3yrs. and I'm ready to roll! Thanks.

Hey Tech II , still working on my Grand Am 2.5 run great except high idle. I've checked the IAC for function, works fine. TPS seems to be ok. Fuel injector cone seems good. My professor thinks it may be myTB throttle plate is worn, loose, meaning from return spring side to the tps. I do have a body with all of that in tact. The whole thing is I've ran it for a while before I took it on the road, to get some miles on it and to pre smog.The thing just decieded to high idle since. I've delt with this before but all my "fixes" hasn't worked.It's been 4 years, I've got 460,000 going for 500,000. My next is to change out TB. Hope to hear from you. Thanks.

If you are sure, the IAC is working correctly, a high idle is usually caused by a vac leak.......

I don't know if you have access to a scan tool that reads OBD I data......you would look at IAC counts......at normal idle, should expect to see 10-15 counts......if the idle is too high, the ECM would be commanding the counts low(closing the IAC), to almost zero....if this is the case, and Idle is still too high, check for a vac leak with carb cleaner.....spray around the base of the throttle body(gaskets are known to leak).....also around the intake gasket....if you spray, and there is a change in idle, you have found your leak....

That worn throttle shaft could be causing the plates to stick in the bores when they close. The symptom of never getting the idle to repeat reliably is as old as carburetors, and can be solved by bushing the shaft. Short of that, a replacement (i.e., not worn) TB could solve it.

The procedure will be similar to this:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=966191

Well I went to replace my tbi, and the first thing I went for was the fuel lines. First was nice and tight , second was a little loose so I figured I should tighten it before I go any deeper, even after I had spayed around tbi a few days ago and no change in idle. After the tighten it's running great! THanks again for the help!

Hey, new problem has arised..I recently replaced my TBI because of vacuum leaks in between shaft/blade.So the engine runs fine , idles great drove it for almost 2 weeks and now the code 35 is showing up I believe it's IAC valve. I've ckecked the ohms and are within spec , replaced connector just cause the old one was in bad shape. It only comes on when at idle ,stop light, traffic. I've takin the valve out of tbi and connected dlc to see movement and the thing moves. This code did not show up with other old tbi. Please let me know if you have any ideas..thanks

Relearn?

Blue, should have relearned(just by driving), by now, 5 months later.....but I guess it couldn't hurt to try, since it is a simple procedure....

Most techs had a tool, that attached to the IAC connector and you could manually open and close the IAC to check idle operation.....

Was this problem there before you replaced the IAC connector or after?

E brake(parking) issue. my ebrake handle no longer engages. It has barely been working for quite some time, and now I have nothing, I've replaced my rear brake shoes, new hard ware, the kit didnt have those little kind of flat springs for the bar that goes on the one side so what I have there is broken springs and are completly gone.I've adjusted cable, shoes...worked for a few days now nothing.Its a manual so ebrake is pretty importantIf the cable is streched and needs replaced I,ve never replaced one of these so if any one has some info on that I'd appeciate it. Thanks.

Well, can you see the main cable move when the ebrake is applied?

Actually you can just grab each secondary cable going to each drum, jack up a wheel, and just pull on the cable into the drum, and then try and rotate tire.....

If the tire still rotates, the problem is inside the drum.....

If the tires lock when you pull on the cables going into the drum, and the main cable moves when you pull on the lever/or push ebrake pedal, then the cable could be stretched......based on your year, you might not be able to move the adjuster because of age/corrosion....and it might have to be replaced....but you can try soaking the adjuster with something like PB Blaster, to try and loosen the adjuster.....

Ok, so I did pull on each cable and the main, i was able to adjust cable I maxed it out. One side kind of works. the other does nothing. I also puled on main and not to much happend. I have recently replaced hardware for drums, one problem with that is it didn't come with the springs for strut, those were toast, I was told that wouldn't be the problem.