f1 mclaren longtails dual builds.

http://i41.tinypic.com/4vo268.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/2qvvx47.jpg

two rolling chassis prepared.the flourescent wheels belong to the gulf version the steel ones belong to the fina.

molded in electronic boxs are removed and so is the extinguisher, I will work the cut out extinguishers hopefully and reuse them again.

will carbon fibre the cockpits and insides of doors.
:)

I'm tuned and will be watching closely. What colour do you intend to use for the blue of the Gulf version..?? It has a pearl finish to it. Be interested to know what your thoughts are..??

Tamiya pearl light blue looks a ringer to me at the mo but I am on my phone.i will check later today on my imac and make side by side comparissons of different pics of the car and the pics of pearl light blue.
:)

Hi

Nice project!

Sascha

I am tuned in, looking forward to this...

I'm in for watching these too Bradfordian
John

looking forward to this!

Tamiya pearl light blue looks a ringer to me at the mo but I am on my phone.i will check later today on my imac and make side by side comparissons of different pics of the car and the pics of pearl light blue.
:)

Looking good so far :)

Here are a few pics of a model painted with Tamiya Pearl Light blue to give you an idea of the colour outside and Indoors.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/obscurepizza/70%20Torino/frontleft.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v67/obscurepizza/70%20Torino/bodyresize.jpg

I hadn't even considered this colour myself before now.... It might be an OK proposition if no better alternative turns up before I'm ready to paint mine.

Hope this is of some help.

Regards, Dan

I ordered a custom gulf blue for the gt40 and 917 and pearl mix so I will see whats what when its done and recieved.the ts58 looks too dark.
:)

http://i39.tinypic.com/ddi07k.jpg

the darker grey dash is for the fina and the light grey is the gulfs.the dash boards are not all the same,some that have the faux grey dash still have differences either on the ventilation nossles (gold detail) or they have a round gold colored dial on the right side of the wheel.

:)

http://i44.tinypic.com/s45sv6.jpg

spent last 3 days on and off cf the interior, it def wont be identical to the real cars but even if I tried I still would not get it exactly the same so just plodded on and got it done.i got the electrical boxs and wiring and extinguisher to sort now.
:)

http://i44.tinypic.com/2nsv28n.jpg

the electronics are mounted onto what looks like removable panels that are bolted into place on the race car, must be easier for maintainance rather than fiddling around.so I fabricated these panels.they need carbon fibring and detailing and of course the electronic boxs and wires.

in this scale I definately wont be able to do all the wiring but I will do enough to make it more interesting rather than the plainer stock interior.
:)

http://i42.tinypic.com/2v287s2.jpg

so thats the first paint anyone mixed up for me for the gulf,incorrect color.

I am not expert where paints concerned but the gulf car uses more of a light blue to me not a gulf type.more of a simple white and blue mix.i think perhaps ts58 might be ok but without having it in front of me I cant say one way or other all I know is a standard gulf blue isnt right, comes across as too grey and not vibrant as you can see the blue tone in the real car and the white even depending on the images that yu refer to.i use my imac to check pics and paints now as it gives me better quality graphics, I learned something new in the process.
:)

So that's the first paint anyone mixed up for me for the Gulf, incorrect color.
I am not expert where paints concerned but the Gulf car uses more of a light blue to me not a Gulf type.

I'm not so sure that the blue you used is that far off of the real colour..?? In fact maybe I would say it needs to be more blue than it is at the moment..?? Don't forget that the real blue is a pearl finish so different light will affect the way it looks, making it appear lighter or darker even. I think if you over spray that with some pearl clear you would be pretty close to the real colour.
I downloaded this picture from a link someone on the forums posted. Forgot who (sorry) If there's any problem with me posting the photo please say so and I'll take it down, but it's a good example of the real car's colour..

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/DSC_0687_zps9c91b9d3.jpg (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/stevenoble/media/DSC_0687_zps9c91b9d3.jpg.html)

I'm not so sure that the blue you used is that far off of the real colour..?? In fact maybe I would say it needs to be more blue than it is at the moment..?? Don't forget that the real blue is a pearl finish so different light will affect the way it looks, making it appear lighter or darker even. I think if you over spray that with some pearl clear you would be pretty close to the real colour.
I downloaded this picture from a link someone on the forums posted. Forgot who (sorry) If there's any problem with me posting the photo please say so and I'll take it down, but it's a good example of the real car's colour..

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/DSC_0687_zps9c91b9d3.jpg (http://s17.photobucket.com/user/stevenoble/media/DSC_0687_zps9c91b9d3.jpg.html)

Hey thats my picture Steve :) No worries mate. About the blue color. I've seen the real car at the 2013 24 Hours Of Spa where the Rofgo Collection was on diplay. it didn't look pearl to me.

Best regards,
Lesley

Hey thats my picture Steve :) No worries mate. About the blue color. I've seen the real car at the 2013 24 Hours Of Spa where the Rofgo Collection was on diplay. it didn't look pearl to me.

Best regards,
Lesley

Thanks Lesley for the picture. Are you sure it's not got a light pearl effect to the paint..?? I also have this picture that convinces me it does have a very light pearl effect to the blue paint and also the MFH instructions tell you to mix silver into the blue paint to give it a flaked effect..?? Now I'm confused :frown:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/mclaren-f1-gtr-longtail-gulf-left-engine-compartment-1_1200_zpsa45a3f44.jpg

Its near but its not right, I cant keep spraying the body so I stripped It this time and plan to get ts58 mix and try on a random piece of styrene.it needs more blue but I also get the impression of white in there, I am not a color expert so dont know what gulf blue is made of but I hold the bottle to the imac and the pic is the one of the rear fender posted and you can see there is a difference in the depth.its not blue enough and comes across as washed out like a dull grey or something is washing the tinge of blue out.i used white sprue dipped in it and same and thats the body painted I hold that to it and remember its the quality of my phone cam it is still too noticable thr difference.

My phone can only present the pic as ut catchs the model I took pic of, if you see with eye and compare the body to the imac its very noticable.i think the paint guy did a great job but I can only go by my ref I have here.after all we all got different gear and settings.

I talk to hiroboy and see if he can do the ts58 and try it, I can only give feedback.

I posted the pic and made comment so people know I am still working the project and it might help them also.

I am just worried that the ts58 might be too in the face with vibrance, it looks very unique color indeed to nail for me.
:)

Have you looked into Scalefinishes Gulf Blue?

I'll be very interested to see what the Tamiya Pearl Blue looks like. It seems to be quite close or at least a good starting point for getting a match to the real colour..

Have you looked into Scalefinishes Gulf Blue?

Sadly they don't ship to the UK..

I don't think its pearl. I can be wrong, but i don't a pearl finish in the paint.

http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l501/eyckles/Rofgocollection/DSC_0689.jpg

http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l501/eyckles/Rofgocollection/DSC_0698.jpg

I don't think its pearl. I can be wrong, but i don't a pearl finish in the paint.

http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l501/eyckles/Rofgocollection/DSC_0689.jpg

http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l501/eyckles/Rofgocollection/DSC_0698.jpg

love the photos, they are real nice as ref material, I am of the opinion that the color is more like the lower picture rather than aiming for a darker shade a lighter shade of powder blue.
:)

The orange is very fluorescent in the top picture but not so much in the bottom picture. The light is playing tricks with it..

Thanks Lesley for the picture. Are you sure it's not got a light pearl effect to the paint..?? I also have this picture that convinces me it does have a very light pearl effect to the blue paint and also the MFH instructions tell you to mix silver into the blue paint to give it a flaked effect..?? Now I'm confused :frown:

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/mclaren-f1-gtr-longtail-gulf-left-engine-compartment-1_1200_zpsa45a3f44.jpg


http://www.scaleproduction.com/pictures/reference-pictures/mclaren-f1-gtr/


Mike

The cars at Le Mans in 97 were a light pearl blue and the black (fine metallic) on the sides also has a bronze cast at certain angles.

JB

The cars at Le Mans in 97 were a light pearl blue and the black (fine metallic) on the sides also has a bronze cast at certain angles.

JB

Thanks, you have confirmed what I thought. I did notice the slight bronze/brown cast on the sides as well. It's very noticeable on one of the photos in the link that Mike posted too. How to achieve that look on the model..?? Maybe over spray with a bronze tinted pearl clear perhaps..?? This colour scheme gets trickier by the minute..

Im asuming it's the fujimi kits ?
Im just about to start the lark one. Got the paint. First build in 7 years so looking forward to it

Bradfordian - I thick what you are seeing in the "pearl" effect is just the light bouncing off the paint and dispersing through the clear - just my thoughts
John

Theres not very much room for manouvering these decals! Never built a fujimi kit before so no idea what the decals are like.i got the body sprayed up etc and decided to decal and I messed up all the flag that runs down the back of the car! So I kinda got use to them a little bit after doing most the front but lost all the spine of the cars decals,3 in total!its the fina livery car I am doing.so I will either have to source decals or buy another kit in the future.

I started cf decal on the indide of the doors today.

I update the thread within next couple of days with pics etc.

http://i61.tinypic.com/10h6rdv.jpg
http://i60.tinypic.com/t8w8qp.jpg
http://i60.tinypic.com/r20wly.jpg

Tamiya ts58 shot from the tin.hiroboy mixed up some zero paint version on his site but hes away till monday.would like to try his mix but personaly I think the gulf still uses more blue in the mix.like its a gulf blue but more vibrant blue with a pearl clear coat.i dont think a pearl color mix is right but I could be wrong I would shoot more for a pearl clear coat on a solid paint?
:)

Tamiya ts58 shot from the tin.hiroboy mixed up some zero paint version on his site but hes away till monday.would like to try his mix but personaly I think the gulf still uses more blue in the mix.like its a gulf blue but more vibrant blue with a pearl clear coat.i dont think a pearl color mix is right but I could be wrong I would shoot more for a pearl clear coat on a solid paint?
:)

That TS-58 is way off. It just looks like metallic silver with a shot of blue. Honestly I can't see the Zero one being any better.
There's a few ways to do a pearl. You can spray a base colour, in this case the blue. Then a mid colour with the pearl in it. Then a clear top coat. Or you can spray the base blue and use a pearl clear over it. Or you can mix a pearl into the blue base colour and clear over that. My feeling on the best way to do this one is to spray it regular Gulf Blue and shoot over that with a pearl clear. That will give you a perfect match in my opinion. I've tried it on a spoon and it works great..

Who's carbon sheets do you use ?

http://i57.tinypic.com/i422l4.jpg

decanted the ts58 tin into a jar, threw in a custom mix of light gulf blue I had mixed (was light gulf, white and a dark blue I had) created new color.i think at end of day I stick with this as its not too dark and not too light.like you say steve its a case of the right base coat with pearl threw in it and clear top of right color base with s pearl clear.its a realy tough blue to nail!

so was gonna suggest gulf with ts58 mix or gulf with a pearl coat as you suggested.
:)

Who's carbon sheets do you use ?

scale motorsports.
:)

http://i59.tinypic.com/zmhxz6.jpg

this is where the gulf body is currently.first thing I should mention which is pretty obvious is that the border for the black that gos round the lower body is sprayed and due to the lack of any guide bar pics after spraying the orange transfer line dosnt quite fit, ends up short.
:)

Looking really good.

But I realy feel like throwing in the towel with these builds.i messed up a decal on the gulf so now it has a decal on one side of the rear and the other nothing.the fina I am building now as the emi version but I got to get red paint as I messed the decals up on that one realy bad.i dont like the fujimi decals, they dont seem to want to slide on the model.

now I feel like dunking the gulf in isopropyl then repainting it as the lark or something else I can get the second party decals from.

trust me the body work on both of these is becoming taxing now!

I have to make my descision soon also as I dont see the point of buying another £30 kit for just decals that I dont like, might as well repaint it and use decals like tabu and see how that gos.

these are my dilemas now.
:(

You can get new decals for the Gulf version from Tabu as well. I always scan the decal sheet and cut the stripes out and temporarily fix them to the body so I can use that as a guide for the masking. It saves all the guess work. Don't give up because that Gulf version is looking very good..

The fina will become the emi and the gulf will become the lark now.i wont be modifying the front ends though as they both have different vane setups on the front end.just straight from the box with the decals.i already have the emi decals here and am waiting on the larks decals.i didnt go with the gulf davidoff for simple reason of paint.i have stripped it down and its primed, just got to sand it ready for top coat.i dont fancey buying £20 odd worth of decals with stripes to find out I didnt get the border right again.i dont have a copier/printer.

I will be wary when I buy fujimi kits and try not to buy the more decal heavy versions of cars.i had no trouble with studio27 on the same top coat and clear but the fujimi kis are realy tough to move and thats led to two cars being stripped to do different color/livery.

I update hopefully end of week as I now have to order zero paints sgain.
:)

I can't believe you stripped that Gulf version, it was looking pretty good and you'd got the colour pretty much nailed too. Most Post Offices or libraries offer a photo copying service where you could produce a copy of the decal sheet..

Trust me steve, on the front end I had to cut up a decal to patch up little gaps and the number 41 ripped when I cut it for the vent openings.the pic just makes it look good (depends what you view it on) the body job was done well although it can always be done better but I aint experienced automotive model builder, so I can only learn.

I take what I have learned from my mistakes and move onto the next color/livery.both cars are primed and waiting on paint (hopefully have tomoz) and I get them painted up and cleared for decals.
:)

Well good luck with the repaint and new decal, hope it works out well in the end :)

It's strange that you had so much trouble because the decals are printed by Cartograf, which is arguably the best decal printer in the model industry. Many kit manufacturers and aftermarket suppliers from Tamya, Hasegawa, Fujimi, Revell and Italeri to Studio 27, Hiro and even Tabu often boast Cartograf decals as a premium item, and they charge extra money for the brand recognition and quality.
If the aftermarket decal is printed by Cartograf, it won't improve your situation, so be careful.

I used studio27 on the r89 I have going (nearly finished it) I used zero paints and zero clear coat and had no probs moving the decals around but these two fujimi kits with zero paint and the same clear coat out the same bottle are not being complient at all.
:)

Do you use Micro-Set and Micro-Sol decal solutions ? I've built 5 formula one kits made by Fujimi, using their decals
and TABU decal set once. Had no issues and they've worked for me just fine. I've placed them over gloss Tamiya TS
paints or Zero base paints clear coated with Zero 2K. My final clear coats over decals are always Zero 2k clear. Not
sure why you're having troubles with them.

I use warm water. Depending on complexity of the shape decals would go over, I put little or quite a bit of Micro-Set,
so decals could slide around and can be easily put in place. If set solution dries, I add more using brush. I even put
some Micro-Set over decals to soften them and help them conform. As soon as I'm happy with decal placement, I press
out and wipe off water and set solution. Then I apply Micro-Sol, if I want decals to soften more and conform even better.
Micro-Sol could melt decals though, so must be applied lightly and carefully. I do wipe it off very carefully, as I'm done
with conforming decals in place, using cotton swabs and paper towels. Don't leave paddles of Micro-Sol on decals, that
could lead to damage. Sometimes, if decals are too firm for complex shapes, I would use heat from my fingers or even
hair drier. But, again be careful with too much heat from heir drier, it could lead to decal's damage as well.

Hope this info will be helpful. Good luck !

I have been using microsol on the model before placing the decal.i did think that perhaps the microsol was making the decals act the way they did although I did use microsol on the r89 with no probs.i used water with some detergent in it slso but that didnt improve the situation so threw that idea away.

Am also wandering if its perhaps because I should gave hiven the paint and clear more time to cure, I cleared coated the model 24 hrs after the top coat was applied but applied the decals 24 hrs after the clear was appled.perhaps I should have waited around 3 days there might have been sone stickiness u couldnt feel or the microsol reacted somehow with the clear?

Studio 27 uses several decal suppliers from Cartograf to UMi and a few Japanese domestic printers, and the type of decal can be silkscreen or offset printed. Based on your description, the R89 decal could have been offset printed, which tend to have a thicker carrier film, or maybe its adhesive was weaker than the Cartograf's.
Also, IIRC, Zero's base color turns out flat, which causes some surface resistance. One type of decal might be thick enough that such resistance is negligible, but another type might be sensitive to it.
Just use a different amount of water according to the thickness of the carrier film, strength of the adhesive, and surface roughness/smoothness, and you should be able to handle any type of decal.

I have been using Microsol on the model before placing the decal.

I think I just solved your decal 'problem' Microsol is to be used after the decal is on the model and pretty much dried to melt it into curves and creases etc. You should be using Microset onto the model first which will help the decal to slide around on the surface and be easier to position. The Microsol will make the decals wrinkle and curl up and can pretty much destroy them if you try to move them after you've applied it. That's why you had so much difficulty placing the decals, now I understand :)

I have basicly used It all the time and only had few probs but the first fujimi kits I am building are these 2 and had probs with both.i will order me some microset straight away, I dont fancey probs but I think this time the microsol is a bit stronger or something cos I did start a new bottle.
:)

I have basicly used It all the time and only had few probs but the first fujimi kits I am building are these 2 and had probs with both.i will order me some microset straight away, I dont fancey probs but I think this time the microsol is a bit stronger or something cos I did start a new bottle.
:)

Yes you need the Microset (blue bottle) the Microsol (red bottle) is for applying onto the decals so that they will bend around complex curves and into holes in the body etc. Use the Sol with caution as it can be quite strong on certain decals..

I make it official and I am terminating these builds.i have definately taken far too much work on even though I made good progress everywhere bar the bodys.

I got the r89 build drawing to a close and thats only my second ever car but the f1 mclarens are my third build and I def dived in far too deep.basicly I set my standards high which I always got criticised for in the scifi I do but if I cant please myself and be happy even if you lot like it I cant.

I broke one door proper good and I just cant get to grips with the masking amd being happy with the way it comes out, I nicked a body while polishing it and to put it right it needs some spray so I basicly said $/^& *( and put the models in their boxs and I am moving on.

So realy my only gripe with automotive is overcomplicated paint schemes amd decal heavy car liveries.i think I tackle other more straight forward builds and not do two at a time.

sorry for ranting on I just want you to know cos I think you deserve an explanation.

Long ago, one of my builds didn't turn out right, and the unfinished body became a canvas for practicing airbrush. :)
When I was learning the basics of car modeling, there was no social media to ask for help, so everything had to be trial and error.
Mistakes happen all the time, but as long as you believe in yourself and keep trying to improve, you'll eventually reach the level you can be satisfied with. Good luck with your next build.

I know at least one of them can be still finished but cos I been painting the bodies 3x now and still not happy I want to back away from them and do something that I can build virtualy oob and hopefully do better paint job on.so I think one of them will be finished the other will become a donor for parts for another project.
:)

I know at least one of them can be still finished but cos I been painting the bodies 3x now and still not happy I want to back away from them and do something that I can build virtualy oob and hopefully do better paint job on.so I think one of them will be finished the other will become a donor for parts for another project.
:)

Never give up..!!! That's always the motto..!!! Doesn't matter how bad you mess up a paint job it usually can be salvaged, stripped and re-painted. Take some time out from these builds and put them aside. Make something easy, something that's one colour overall, with simple decals and it will give you a lift and boost your confidence. Then later, when you have a few builds under your belt, return to the McLaren's and you'll be better equipped to build them. I think the Fina version is the easier of the two. The Gulf is, due to the nature of the two tone scheme and the precise masking needed for the border between the two colours where the orange stripe fits, much harder, but still possible. You've got to copy the decal sheet and make a masking guide to do it right just my :2cents:
But to be good with decals and masking precisely takes time to learn properly. Practice makes perfect. But as they always say, a change is as good as a rest :)
Good luck with whatever you choose to build next and post it on here so we can follow along. If you need any help just shout out and you'll get it. Remember you only learn when you make mistakes. Hell, I've made loads along the way, but I've learnt a lot too. If I told you that I probably trash one out of five bodies and end up stripping and re-painting them would it cheer you up any..?? It's a true fact...

I'm in complete agreement with Steve - Bradfordian
"never give up" - that's Churchill's prophetic statement from WWII
These F1 GTRs were obviously a bit more difficult than you are used to, but as Steve says - take some time away from them and come back to them latter.
I am currently building 5 different models - and each time I reach an impasse I go to the next one and then eventually I come back around to the first one when I've had a chance to think of solutions.
You did a great paint job on the "Gulf" but as Steve pointed out for a scheme like that you have to copy the decals and make masking templates so that things will line up.
Best of luck to your Bradfordian - but don't give up!!!!!!!
John