Any tips on polishing Zero 2K clear?

My current build is coated in Zero 2K clear.

I had some gobs and dust get in during application. I have sanded some of them out but I am having trouble polishing it back up to a shine comparable to the original 2k coat.

I have tried using Maguire's ScratchX, the full range of micro-mesh cloths, Polishing wax, cleaning wax and The Treatment Wax - none of which is working for me. I am always left with a semi gloss/dull finish.

The clear coat is fully cured (applied 2 weeks ago approx.)

Any similar experiences? any tips for polishing it to a shine?

Thanks in advance :bigthumb:

Steve: I got several issues with the Lechler Macrofan, a hi-solid coating similar to the Zero 2K, having got issues (craters..) I've been in the needs of sand down and polish it. I never find troubles (despite I agree, it is too gloss indeed by itself) but I found extra strong (like glass), I ever used 2K grit plus all the mesh range, from the 3200 to the 12K, than quite a minimum of compound is needed.

One other product useful in the intermediate stage is a coarse compound, we got here one called "Arexons rimuovi graffi" , I think you'll find something there by Arexons usful for scratch: it is much more coarse (even too much, you'll easily expose the paint is the coat is thin..) but will help the work of Tamy fine compounds.

At last..... "elbow's grease " :D

At last..... "elbow's grease " :D
Yep, I think that was the missing secret ingredient :D ;)

Just tried again - with the same processes I used before - but with more elbow grease this time (and I admit, more patience :lol:) and it is much better now.

Thanks!

not much help but something to think about:
the 2K clear you guys use is pretty much what they use on 1:1 cars and they use big heavy rotary polishers on those.

Steve, I use progressively higher sandpaper grits to bring it to shine, and then 3M polishing compound, followed by tamiya fine, and then treatment wax. Seems to be working fine. Keep in mind that 2K clears polish a lot better when you generate some heat while polishing.

I've had good success using Farecla products. They are intended for 1:1 cars in the automotive trade, but they do make easy work of polishing the 2K clear which can be a little hard to polish sometimes. G3 paste and G10 Liquid Compound are the ones from their range that I have used before with good results. I also do the Micromesh sanding process, usually start at 6000, then 8000 and finally 12000, then on with the Farecla stuff....

Thanks Alex and Steve for your thoughts.

Mea Culpa I think - I really wasn't trying hard enough. I managed to sand out and polish back several places now and I am quite happy with the results considering realistically how qucikly I rusged the job :lol:

I am interested to try out these products you mention though and I will keep an eye out for them.

not much help but something to think about:
the 2K clear you guys use is pretty much what they use on 1:1 cars and they use big heavy rotary polishers on those.
:bigthumb:
:lol: I can't see me taking a full size rotary buffer to my model but I could imagine a modified Dremmel fitting on lowest speed... hmm.....

There's an idea! If you can't buy it, Make iT!

:lol: I can't see me taking a full size rotary buffer to my model but I could imagine a modified Dremmel fitting on lowest speed... hmm.....


...that's what I meant...
my dremel came with a polishing kit (like this one (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bosch-26150684JA-Dremel-Polishing-Kit/dp/B0014GV5TE)) but it's for metals I gather but there's nothing really (apart from blind fear of a buffing pad at 10,000rpm going near paint) stopping me from using it with tamiya compounds.

hmm... might have to give it a go seeing as I do have a couple of failed models sitting around.




EDIT: well, i'm not going to do that ever again.

EDIT: well, i'm not going to do that ever again.
Ouch! Sounds ominous :eek:
Care to share more of the gory details? ;)

not much really.
i put on one of the polishing pads, applied some tamiya coarse to it and set it at minimum (2000rpmish) and set to work on an old painted kit.
to begin with, it did quite a decent job of flattening it out and bringing up a shine.
however, after a while, you can feel it "grabbing" a bit more and then the friction actually actually melted the paint, through primer and to plastic where the edge of the pad caught a raised part of the kit.

that and it doesn't feel like you're really in control of it.


EDIT: since I posted this, I found out why it melted the paint/plastic so easily.
i er.... misread my dremel.
what I thought was 2000rpm was at least 10,000rp.

oops.

I'm still not doing that ever again.

Man, I almost threw my 360 spider at the wall tonight trying to polish out 2K. Its my first time using 2K. The model is black, which is already bad enough, but even with a ton of pressure, I can't get it to a decent shine.

Well I just applied 2k clear for the 1st time and hav yet to polish.. one thing to consider it sanding the base coat or primer before paint. If you are using pearls clear it. If your color is a solid you can try sanding it smooth if needed, then clear it. That should help in trying to get as flat/smooth a surface in the end, which leads to more gloss. But of course, if the clear is not applied well you will have to do a lot of polishing.

Looking at my 2 kits at the moment, I hope to have little polishing. I guess I will find out soon enough!

I never polish my kits after clearing with 2k clear, as the shine is amazing straight out of the airbrush.

I built a Tamiya Z3 not long ago and tried using some MicroMesh cloths for the 1st time, it smoothed the clear like it should but the actual shine was a little bit down from when it was originally sprayed :disappoin.

I have used 2k for years and have never bothered polishing it, so I find it strange to hear that a lot of people are having issues with it.

gpz900ra7

I had to polish due to dirt and orange peel. It's my first time using it and I need to adjust my airbrushing techniques to avoid orange peel.

Here is what i did after clear dries. You dont have to wait a week. 1:1 cars get polished next day after paint. I used 3m 1000 grit to wet sand hood. After that I used Meguiar's ultimate compount followed by ultimate polish. This is first time using those. I have used 3m plastic polish and cleaner with great results also, though not on urethane. I also have menzerna which I will use on a different part of this car or my scud to see which one helps me get done faster.

What I look for are 2 things. First how well paint reflects surroundings. Once I can clearly see myself on paint I look for the second issue. Swirls and/or scratches. Good light is essential to see all swirls. If you look at the lights reflecting off the paint you can't see scratches. Once I have that I move to the next spot. It's a pain, but when your car will pop :iceslolan

Thanks for the tips and photos! Yeah, what I need is different products, b/c MicroMesh and Tamiya compounds were not doing the trick. These products work great on a softer clear such as Tamiya.

Aside from the dust issues, you might be able to avoid polishing entirely by warming the paint to about 100 degrees fahrenheit before spraying. (Yeah, I had to check the spelling.)

I really like Tamiya "Finish" for the final polish. Tamiya "Fine" actually looks a little dull next to it.

Here is an example of a car looking ok until you put it up against bright lights. On this kit I used Menzerna products which required less effort than Meguiar's Ultimate Compound/Polish to get to the results on the last pic (excuse the fuzzies). With more elvow grease I can get to virtually no scratches, which at this point are very difficult to see anyway. Hope this helps

It does, thanks! First, I need to practice with 2K more, with the goal being to minimize orange peel, which is generally my biggest problem and why I always polish my model cars. I don't get too much dirt. I read a post in the motorsports section that a fellow modeler mists thinner onto his paint job about an hour after applying the 2K to soften and smooth it out. Thoughts?

Second, I need better products when dealing with 2K.

It does, thanks! First, I need to practice with 2K more, with the goal being to minimize orange peel, which is generally my biggest problem and why I always polish my model cars. I don't get too much dirt. I read a post in the motorsports section that a fellow modeler mists thinner onto his paint job about an hour after applying the 2K to soften and smooth it out. Thoughts?

Second, I need better products when dealing with 2K.

First off, to minimize orange peel you need to learn to put on wet coats. Second, I have heard about the thinning step by guys that laquer wood in houses, not cars. Seems risky to me. And like I said before, wet coats. And I agree with you, better products do help. I tried rubbing the red scuderia in pics with meguiar's and it left too many swirls, so I switched to Menzerna. Look at these:

Complete set
http://www.autogeek.net/menzerna-four-pack.html

This is what I got for my car. 32 oz will last for ever lol
http://www.autogeek.net/ceramic-polish-kit.html

Just look thru here if you like
http://www.autogeek.net/menzerna-of-germany.html

Now this is what I use and I dont mean to imply that this is the "only" thing that works. It's all trial and error unless someone teaches you. I figure if it's something professionals use, it can't be bad. You will find other stuff here also. Go to a local autobody shop and ask questions. They should be able to help also

It's all in the thinning with 2K. I add more thinner to each coat usually applying 2-4 light 'wet' coats. There is a difference between 'wet' and 'heavy' once you can differentiate between the two and get that magic moment where it is wet enough without running, then you will virtually have no need for polishing at all. If you are getting orange peel texture, try more thinner and spraying nearer to the surface with wetter coats. The orange peel is usually a result of the paint drying before it has had time to flow together and that is why you get the texture..

Front wing on Tamiya Lola T/93 (no polishing at all)

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/Lola%20T93/LolaT93012.jpg

Great, thanks again guys. I'll be practicing this week on a spare body and let you know how it goes! That wing is what I'm aiming for (and expected with 2k!).

It's all in the thinning with 2K. I add more thinner to each coat usually applying 2-4 light 'wet' coats. There is a difference between 'wet' and 'heavy' once you can differentiate between the two and get that magic moment where it is wet enough without running, then you will virtually have no need for polishing at all. If you are getting orange peel texture, try more thinner and spraying nearer to the surface with wetter coats. The orange peel is usually a result of the paint drying before it has had time to flow together and that is why you get the texture..

Front wing on Tamiya Lola T/93 (no polishing at all)

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/stevenoble/Lola%20T93/LolaT93012.jpg

Thanks Steve. I could not have said it better myself :)

What mixing ratio are you using when you mix the clear up for spraying?



gpz900ra7.

What mixing ratio are you using when you mix the clear up for spraying?



gpz900ra7.

Not sure if that question was directed at me or the original thread starter..?? But for me I mix as per the instructions on Zero 2K bottle but I always add more than the recommended thinner. Usual mix would be 10ml of clear, 5ml of hardener and 5ml of thinner. I think the recommended thinner amount is 2-3ml, so I add just a couple of mls more at 5ml. It just helps it to flow out better with my airbrush..

Hi Steve, sorry it was aimed at the thread starter but you have basically said what I was going to suggest anyway, :rofl:.

I tend to make the final coat of clear very diluted with thinners so as to make it flow better thus making polishing a thing to leave out of the equation.



gpz900ra7.

Hi Steve, sorry it was aimed at the thread starter but you have basically said what I was going to suggest anyway, :rofl:.

I tend to make the final coat of clear very diluted with thinners so as to make it flow better thus making polishing a thing to leave out of the equation.



gpz900ra7.

No problem.. I do exactly as you do, plenty of thinner in the final coat and it really does seem to flow out beautifully and leave no 'orange peel' texture and a minimum of polishing work..

...that's what I meant...
my dremel came with a polishing kit (like this one (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bosch-26150684JA-Dremel-Polishing-Kit/dp/B0014GV5TE)) but it's for metals I gather but there's nothing really (apart from blind fear of a buffing pad at 10,000rpm going near paint) stopping me from using it with tamiya compounds.

hmm... might have to give it a go seeing as I do have a couple of failed models sitting around.

Great suggestions all-around. To comment on the quote above. I use my dremel to polish 2K, but you do have to be careful.

Not so much from the speed of the tool, but I wouldn't recommend anything faster 7500 rpms, if you keep the tool moving it won't burn through. The velocity of the polishing pad on a low speed moto-tool as it touches the model, is less than that of most full size orbital polishers, so there is less chance of damage. I've been very aggressive at times just to see what would happen, but have had no problems with burn through.

What you have to be careful about is the pad "grabbing" the model causing your tool to slip scratching your paint. (This happened to me last night!) Handle the tool firmly but loosely, keep as much of the stem holding the pad away from the tool to give you more clearance, and gently work the 2K.

Use the wool polishing pads that are available for the Dremel. I use the large disk, the bullet-shaped pad, and the drum-shaped pad, both wet and dry. Also, don't mix your pads. Use only one polishing compound per pad.

Also, let's remember, one of the biggest advantage of 2K is its ultra-quick cure time. If there is a scratch that is hard to polish out, give a shot of 2K and start that spot over. This may actually take less time. (My damaged car from last night is already fixed.) Applied correctly, 2K will go on thin enough to take several more coats without a large build-up of paint.

Hope this helps.

Great suggestions all-around. To comment on the quote above. I use my dremel to polish 2K, but you do have to be careful.

Not so much from the speed of the tool, but I wouldn't recommend anything faster 7500 rpms, if you keep the tool moving it won't burn through.



Most car body shop polishers/buffers only go as high as 2600rpm. 7500rpm is much too high for polishing paint. I am not saying you can't do it, just that it's very, very risky, especially on plastic. I think an angle grinder spins at about 10,000rpm, so at 7500rpm you're not that far behind it...

I recently bought a dremel 8,000, then I have tested at the lower speed of 5,000rpm with extra extra care and ensuring that i just "touch the model" and it worked superbly.

Most car body shop polishers/buffers only go as high as 2600rpm. 7500rpm is much too high for polishing paint. I am not saying you can't do it, just that it's very, very risky, especially on plastic. I think an angle grinder spins at about 10,000rpm, so at 7500rpm you're not that far behind it...

Indeed you are correct about the rotational speed of the body shop buffers, but its the linear speed of the buffers that make the critical difference.

The small 3/8" buffing wheels on a dremel at 7500 rpm speed across the paint at about 8.4 miles per hour. However, a shop polisher with a 6" polishing wheel at 2600 rpm will speed across the paint at 46.4 mph. So, while the dremel is spinning faster, the much smaller buffing pad results in a slower and safer polishing rate than the shop polisher.

At least this is the science that went through my head giving me the courage to try to use the dremel on my 2K for the first time. Of course, everything in my heart was telling me I was making a big mistake. But, I did it and have had no problems except for the occasional slip of the dremel tool. Hooray for science!

All that being said, I generally use polishing cloths all the way to 12000 grit and finish with a wax -- all by hand. But, if there are deep scratches still remaining, then I'll pop out the dremel and give that a go a few times until the scratches are out. If that still doesn't work then I'll re-apply 2K to that area and start the process over.

Also, I only recommend this for 2K and automotive grade paints. I have not attempted this on "softer" hobby paints from Testors of Tamiya.