Tutorial for making an "open door"?

Is there a good tutorial (or even a WIP) out there for doing this? I'd really like to try my hand at it. Not sure which kit yet, either a 911 gt1 or a rally car.

I'd appreciate some help. I've read some WIPs but not many that shows exactly how to do it.

Thanks!

Daniel

Check this repository:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=215864

I was really looking for something that described, in detail, how to make the sills and lining that isn't in the kit. That's what I'm curious about. Sorry if I wasn't clear. The actual opening process is pretty straightforward.

Daniel

I`ll second this request. I was actually considering this on a couple builds I have coming up.

There is no way to make a tutorial on this, simply because all doors are different, all kits are different, and there is no easy, or uniform way to do this. I've done it several times, and every time it was different. If you check my WIPs, there will be few examples.

Check this repository:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=215864

some of those need to be updated or deleted

There is no way to make a tutorial on this, simply because all doors are different, all kits are different, and there is no easy, or uniform way to do this. I've done it several times, and every time it was different. If you check my WIPs, there will be few examples.

Again, I was thinking *in general*. Like, things to consider, thickness of styrene needed, what to watch for, etc. All are similar in those respects...:wink:

Again, I was thinking *in general*. Like, things to consider, thickness of styrene needed, what to watch for, etc. All are similar in those respects...:wink:

No they are not. That is the point. Thickness of styrene for what? I have never even used styrene when I was opening the doors. What to watch for? Depends on the kit and door construction. Its one of those things where you do it depending on the situation.

No they are not. That is the point. Thickness of styrene for what? I have never even used styrene when I was opening the doors. What to watch for? Depends on the kit and door construction. Its one of those things where you do it depending on the situation.

Hi 360,
I think what racer is asking is for a very general "starter`s guide" to opening doors by someone who has plenty of experience and can give general pointers to at least get someone started and avoid the typical beginners pitfalls. After almost 30 years, I am at the point now where I have seen just about everything as far as getting a "show car" finish. I also know that there are a myriad of factors that could affect the outcome depending on each kit, what techniques are used, and what products are used. However, it is possible to at least give a starting point, giving examples from what I have learned, to beginners so that they can avoid the typical beginner`s pitfalls so that they can learn from my mistakes/experiences. It is also possible to answer questions preemptively, because, as someone with a lot of experience in a certain skill, we know that beginners may not even know the questions that need to be asked (ie, the thickness of styrene question).
Racer, please correct me if I am wrong, but I think this is where you were going with this question. I would love to see a very general tutorial on this as well.

I too would love to see a "generalized" tutorial regarding an open door conversion. I understand that every kit and scenario is different, but there must be at least several general pointers an experienced person should look out for (to avoid costly mistakes) and/or techniques consider over others. I'd really like to see people's various ideas regarding door hinge setups (if they plan on making open/close), methods for creating the inner door sill portions, etc.

The best way was probably to browse as many as open doors WIP as you could and get some idea which method works best for you. I can't say which is the best, all are good, but some might not be suitable :lol:

Really, I imagine a search of the WIP section will throw up enough info to be able to tackle the job.

At the end of the day, no single tutorial is going to provide more idea/insights and will never replace the skill and patience required to do a good job of it ;)

Here's a search string form the Street WIP section using "opening doors" and I see that it has thrown up WIPs from some of the best-of-the-best builders here on AF.

I suggest you read through mrawl's 360 thread - a tutorial in itself - Gionc's 575 and for sure check out ALL threads by Agamo

HERE (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/search.php?searchid=3004825)

Check the WIPs of Mr obssessive. He seldom shows how he opens the doors. However, he explains in detail how to hinge them.

http://public.fotki.com/MrObsessive/projects-im-working-on/1955_ford_fairlane/page4.html

And see his 49 Mercury for the trunk.

The best way was probably to browse as many as open doors WIP as you could and get some idea which method works best for you. I can't say which is the best, all are good, but some might not be suitable :lol:

Thanks, Entau. I have read quite a few WIPs but never have seen what the people did to "fill in" the areas that were left bare in the kit. I figure there has to be at least one or two WIPs out there that has this but I have yet to find them.

Really, I imagine a search of the WIP section will throw up enough info to be able to tackle the job.

At the end of the day, no single tutorial is going to provide more idea/insights and will never replace the skill and patience required to do a good job of it ;)

Here's a search string form the Street WIP section using "opening doors" and I see that it has thrown up WIPs from some of the best-of-the-best builders here on AF.

I suggest you read through mrawl's 360 thread - a tutorial in itself - Gionc's 575 and for sure check out ALL threads by Agamo

HERE (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/search.php?searchid=3004825)

Thanks, klutz. I do realize that no tutorial is going to replace skill. However, it does give me the confidence that my efforts are heading in the right direction. For you that might not mean a thing. For me it means everything. I really take a lot from seeing it done once.

Hi 360,
I think what racer is asking is for a very general "starter`s guide" to opening doors by someone who has plenty of experience and can give general pointers to at least get someone started and avoid the typical beginners pitfalls. After almost 30 years, I am at the point now where I have seen just about everything as far as getting a "show car" finish. I also know that there are a myriad of factors that could affect the outcome depending on each kit, what techniques are used, and what products are used. However, it is possible to at least give a starting point, giving examples from what I have learned, to beginners so that they can avoid the typical beginner`s pitfalls so that they can learn from my mistakes/experiences. It is also possible to answer questions preemptively, because, as someone with a lot of experience in a certain skill, we know that beginners may not even know the questions that need to be asked (ie, the thickness of styrene question).
Racer, please correct me if I am wrong, but I think this is where you were going with this question. I would love to see a very general tutorial on this as well.

Exactly, Hawk. I don't care if the tutorial is on a '30 Ford (something I couldn't care less about) or on a Jag XJR9-LM (love it). I just wanted to see people's thinking and their approaches. That's what the OP was about.

No they are not. That is the point. Thickness of styrene for what? I have never even used styrene when I was opening the doors. What to watch for? Depends on the kit and door construction. Its one of those things where you do it depending on the situation.

You don't use styrene when doing the reconstruction of the door surrounds? Do you just use putty?

Nevermind. I'll ask others for help. Thanks anyway.

check this video even this is not in English. I think it still helps you a lot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkbGH1AQRxE&feature=related

You don't use styrene when doing the reconstruction of the door surrounds? Do you just use putty?

Nevermind. I'll ask others for help. Thanks anyway.

check this video even this is not in English. I think it still helps you a lot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkbGH1AQRxE&feature=related

Awesome! Thanks so much!

I just wanted to see people's thinking and their approaches. That's what the OP was about.
Try this: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=979322
and this:
http://forum.autoinscale.com/viewtopic.php?id=2082

Try with this:
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmodeliajmb.blogspot.com%2F&sl=es&tl=en

:D My 575 is a brick of resin and has closed doors :D, BUT, one of my 911 in the Poker thread has open(able.... also one other important issue... it is easy cut door panels and show open, but make them openable, with a good fitting with the body is a whole different thing), with styrene sills (not much to add: draw the required shapes on tape -scoth magic is a must- do a couple attempt and everithing would go well).

Take a look on the 36 cylinders thread, Alex and me also done openable doors on the 166s with different thech, have a look also to Alex 250 GT 64 for even more tips.

One last tip: lately I found a fantastic (and luxury...) technique to cut body panels and have a perfect fit: just do it with two kits :D, one for the body and one for the hoods/doors.... it is quick and.... superb fit.... I tried on a Rossi's '6 Focus, on the 911 and recently I'm doing it on a R89.

Try with this:
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmodeliajmb.blogspot.com%2F&sl=es&tl=en

Thanks! This helps greatly!

:D My 575 is a brick of resin and has closed doors :D, BUT, one of my 911 in the Poker thread has open(able.... also one other important issue... it is easy cut door panels and show open, but make them openable, with a good fitting with the body is a whole different thing), with styrene sills (not much to add: draw the required shapes on tape -scoth magic is a must- do a couple attempt and everithing would go well).

Take a look on the 36 cylinders thread, Alex and me also done openable doors on the 166s with different thech, have a look also to Alex 250 GT 64 for even more tips.

One last tip: lately I found a fantastic (and luxury...) technique to cut body panels and have a perfect fit: just do it with two kits :D, one for the body and one for the hoods/doors.... it is quick and.... superb fit.... I tried on a Rossi's '6 Focus, on the 911 and recently I'm doing it on a R89.

Thanks for the tips. This will help! I really appreciate it!

i'm with alex on this; i can't see how a general method woud help because of the dependence on the kit/car in question.
i also can't help but think of the very general method:

cut door out with p.e saw
fill in gap between body and chassis
cut out door inner panel
mate door skin with door inner panel, adding neccessary detail
make some sort of door jamb detail out of styrene and/or putty
make some sort of hinge

it isn't really rocket science in terms of what you have to do but it is about practice which no one can help you with.

besides, as pointed out, we have a fair number of builds here where opened doors are done well and documented well.
what more can a person tell you that isn't in those threads?
what more do you need to see that isn't shown in this recent thread (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1049686)?

trust me, once you make the first move by cutting out the doors, you will learn something new :lol:

:D My 575 is a brick of resin and has closed doors :D, BUT, one of my 911 in the Poker thread has open(able.... also one other important issue... it is easy cut door panels and show open, but make them openable, with a good fitting with the body is a whole different thing), with styrene sills (not much to add: draw the required shapes on tape -scoth magic is a must- do a couple attempt and everithing would go well).

Take a look on the 36 cylinders thread, Alex and me also done openable doors on the 166s with different thech, have a look also to Alex 250 GT 64 for even more tips.

One last tip: lately I found a fantastic (and luxury...) technique to cut body panels and have a perfect fit: just do it with two kits :D, one for the body and one for the hoods/doors.... it is quick and.... superb fit.... I tried on a Rossi's '6 Focus, on the 911 and recently I'm doing it on a R89.
In this way, I opened the dors of my Focus WRC 10 years ago when I have no idea of the photoetched cutting tuls that I use today:
http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fmodeliajmb.blogspot.com%2F&sl=es&tl=en

i'm with alex on this; i can't see how a general method woud help because of the dependence on the kit/car in question.
i also can't help but think of the very general method:

cut door out with p.e saw
fill in gap between body and chassis
cut out door inner panel
mate door skin with door inner panel, adding neccessary detail
make some sort of door jamb detail out of styrene and/or putty
make some sort of hinge

it isn't really rocket science in terms of what you have to do but it is about practice which no one can help you with.

besides, as pointed out, we have a fair number of builds here where opened doors are done well and documented well.
what more can a person tell you that isn't in those threads?
what more do you need to see that isn't shown in this recent thread (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1049686)?

DM--that's what I needed, silly as it sounds. It does help, just that little list you made. It would also be nice to have something like this in one place (ilke the FAQ section). It would be a great resource.

There's really not going to be a tutorial or FAQ for opening doors. Not to be unduly flippant, but it is kinda one of those kinds of modifications that if you feel you have to ask how to do it, you're probably not ready to try it. Everyone who has done it pretty well agrees that there is no universal set of techniques to be applied to this sort of modification. It's like lowering a build. People who haven't done it expect/hope/want it to be easy and straightforward. Yet its deceptively difficult, and even more difficult to do well. And the techniques used on one build will be entirely different than those used on another.

A wise man once said:

Practice on scrap. Always try something new. Less is more.

Truer and more applicable words for this are hard to find. But I will attempt to amplify them a bit here.

-Don't do it for the first time on a kit you like and want to come out well. Do it on something cheap that you don't care about. And then do it again on something cheap that you don't care about.

-Be prepared for any build you do this on to never be finished. Also, be prepared for it not to come out well if you do someday finish.

-If you feel confident enough in your skills that you could cut up the body of a kit into several pieces, and then reassemble it, fix the damage, and make it look like it never happened, then you're probably ready to mess with doors. These are exactly the sort of skills that you will need. If not, keep building and keep learning....

-Do it on cars with the simplest designs of doors that you can. It's hard enough on a conventional design. Gullwing doors or the cockpit hatches on prototype cars get even nastier.

-Build a Tamiya Enzo. See for yourself how well a world class kit manufacturer handles this problem. And then ask yourself, "does this feature really make the build better?" Or are you a bit frustrated by the fact that the doors don't actually close perfectly? Do you see how you would improve Tamiya's design? Do you see how you would recreate it? Is this maybe just one of those concepts that sounds cooler in concept than in execution...?

-If you really want swinging doors, are you sure you wouldn't be happier with a diecast?

There's really not going to be a tutorial or FAQ for opening doors. Not to be unduly flippant, but it is kinda one of those kinds of modifications that if you feel you have to ask how to do it, you're probably not ready to try it.

I appreciate the advice. However, I really strongly disagree with your statement. I learn by watching and then doing. In the recent past, I've won several "Best (fill in the blank) of show" at contests with my latest works. (Shows of 300+ cars...not huge, but not tiny, either.) So, I'm not the best out there but I'm no novice. I've just never tried to open a door (I've cut off bodywork, just not a door with a sill.)

The short of it is please don't make glittering generalities like this. There are those of us that learn differently and learn by seeing what others do and then branching off from there rather than going out on our own from the get-go. Capiche?

Daniel

-If you really want swinging doors, are you sure you wouldn't be happier with a diecast?

Are you serious? :screwy::shakehead

There are those of us that learn differently and learn by seeing what others do and then branching off from there rather than going out on our own from the get-go.

the problem with that statement is that you are pretty much saying that you lack the imagination to think of solutions of your own.

Doors...they are meant to be opened....and closed...locked and unlocked. They keep people out or in, depending on the situation. anyway you look at it, you need it to function properly, so look at a design that is proven then emulate it or incorporate aspects of it in your next build/test run.

I have opened only a hand full of doors in my meager career of about 20 or more years of building models. NONE of them were easy. Most of them ended up back in the box for several years, only 2 ever got finished. but what I've learned from my experience is this...

Look at a REAL car door. See how it operates and I mean really study how it works. look at the way the front edge tucks into the body and the pivot of the hinge is on the door, not the fender. look at the way it latches shut, the way the glass sits in the frame. all of this stuff is what needs to be considered when opening a door.

I hate to just repeat what everyone is saying, but there is no "WAY" to open a panel on a model. Each kit will have it's own limitations and challenges. Some kits would be easy to open doors, like hot rods, where the doors outer skin to inner skin is relatively thin and most of the time these hinges are on the outside of the vehicle (think a fence gate hinge) and require very little work to get the door jambs filled in properly, where as a lamborghini countach would take a cubic yard of putty to fill the gap.

The one thing that I can tell you is USE YOUR IMAGINATION! look for things around the house to use in scratchbuilding. Old credit cards, broken hotwheels, radios, all sorts of things.

The one thing that I can tell you is USE YOUR IMAGINATION! look for things around the house to use in scratchbuilding. Old credit cards, broken hotwheels, radios, all sorts of things.

that reminds me of someone here who couldn't easily get hold of sheet styrene where he lived so he did use what he had at hand which were old store cards and plastic packaging.
some people would just keep on hunting for sheet styrene.
he chose to find a way to keep building.

the problem with that statement is that you are pretty much saying that you lack the imagination to think of solutions of your own.

:1:

Even worse is that although they lack imagination they don't even know how to use a search engine in order to find something to copy.

the problem with that statement is that you are pretty much saying that you lack the imagination to think of solutions of your own.

No, you misunderstood (not surprisingly) what I was saying. I wanted to see their modus operandai before moving ahead. I knew that it would be styrene, putty, etc., correction, styrene, putty, correction, etc. But I wanted to try and avoid any pitfalls I could.

I wish this could just be helpful and not devolve into a OP-bashing fest. I think it's just freaking rediculous.

And to jano, *I DID* search and found not much about what I was searching. If that was the case, what would you do? Also, I've had run-ins with you before. Take it this way--leave me and my threads alone if you have nothing helpful or nice to say. Thanks.

Daniel

The one thing that I can tell you is USE YOUR IMAGINATION! look for things around the house to use in scratchbuilding. Old credit cards, broken hotwheels, radios, all sorts of things.

Thanks, rsx. It's not that my imagination is lacking. It's that I learn by watching. Others might be more visual-spatial oriented, but my mind isn't. Some can learn on their own, some by being taught (I'm the latter). The human mind just works that way.

No, you misunderstood (not surprisingly) what I was saying. I wanted to see their modus operandai before moving ahead. I knew that it would be styrene, putty, etc., correction, styrene, putty, correction, etc. But I wanted to try and avoid any pitfalls I could.

any pitfalls that you may come across will not be anything that is exclusive to the process of opening a door and detailing a door frame.
problems will be because of the material you use and the thing you are trying to build.
forget that it's a door, it is before that, a bit of modelling and as Andy says, if you have to ask about any problems that arise from doing a body mod then maybe you really shouldn't do it if you aren't willing to just dive in for yourself.
i mean, you have reference photos right?
and you know you have to make whatever you're doing look like the photo, right?
what else do you need?

put it this way and this is something i used to tell my martial arts class:
you can ask all the questions you like and read all the books you want and practice moves in the air for as long as you like but nothing will teach you more than when you have a guy standing opposite you who is going to really hit you to make you really learn.

Look, DM. All I was trying to do was to get all the pertinent info about something like this before I started it. It's not like I don't inherently *know* how to do it. As you point out, yes, it's pretty straightforward. But, others more experienced than me might have some tips and tricks I can apply to my projects.

Again, I reject your invalid assumption that if I have questions I shouldn't attempt this. That's quite condescending and just wrong. My modeling skills are probably above average. I just couldn't find much about the actual process that people took (thankfully helpful modelers here pointed out threads they knew of) so that I could have a direction. That's where I thought an FAQ (very general) would help those with the same initial question I had about the construction of an open-door car.

Daniel

PS--I wasn't talking about making it opening and closing. Just opened.

the problem with that statement is that you are pretty much saying that you lack the imagination to think of solutions of your own.

Did you miss the point about "branching off"? You must have if you think I lack imaginiation.

if you have to ask about any problems that arise from doing a body mod then maybe you really shouldn't do it if you aren't willing to just dive in for yourself.
Whilst I agree that the best way to learn about doing something like this is to try it for yourself, I am having trouble agreeing with the view that if you have to ask about the risks involved, you're not really ready to take the plunge. If there weren't so many posts about the risks of using TS-13 for example, a lot of people may have ruined their decals by not taking the appropiate steps.

There's such a wealth of knowledge on these forums that going through just some of the opened up WIP's has given lots of ideas and help to when I tackled opening doors myself. Take note of how people have shaped the hinges, where they have attachment points and the materials and techniques they used.

Although I've only opened a body's doors once, the best advice I can give you is to plan everything beforehand meticulously...consider everything.

One thing I learnt when doing mine was that the hinges had to have a slight arch around the pivot point. This should help make the door open out and slightly extend away from the body to clear the front arch, otherwise it would just jam. Also, take into consideration the size of your hinge mechanism. Make sure you can still put the bodyshell onto the chassis after painting.

Whilst I agreee that the best way to learn about doing something like this is to try it for yourself, I am having trouble agreeing with the view that if you have to ask about the risks involved, you're not really ready to take the plunge. If there weren't so many posts about the risks of using TS-13 for example, a lot of people may have ruined their decals by not taking the appropiate steps.

that isn't exactly what i said.
my point is that modelling a door hinge is the same as modelling anything else on a car kit, be it a new bumper or wing or even just a lowly fuel filter.
if he is asking about pitfalls of doing an opened door, he is essentially asking about how to scratch build/mod but for some reason he's differentiated it as if it requires a different skill set.
the ts13 problem isn't exactly the same as this either but i see your point.
however, sticking with the painting example, how can you tell what someone is doing wrong if they haven't done it yet?
anyway, i think enough has been said.
either he's going to do it or he isn't.
maybe he'll show us when he does so more relevent/useful info can be given.

...how can you tell what someone is doing wrong if they haven't done it yet?
Yes that's true. I find it hard to believe with the amount of quality opened-up WIP's on here that there aren't any sufficient enough to inspire you to get out there and build. Even this thread alone has made me consider opening up a lot more of my builds than I would otherwise.

Yes that's true. I find it hard to believe with the amount of quality opened-up WIP's on here that there aren't any sufficient enough to inspire you to get out there and build. Even this thread alone has made me consider opening up a lot more of my builds than I would otherwise.

They have. I mainly build motorcycles lately and am looking at a good candidate for a open door (CF test version of the 911 GT1) version.

As Kev said, I just like to have my ducks in a row before "taking the plunge". That means studying what others have done, what they used, how they used it, and what they ran into in a general sense, not just about the kit I'm doing. I do this with most of my builds. Call me methodical....

Again, I reject your invalid assumption that if I have questions I shouldn't attempt this. That's quite condescending and just wrong.

I'm sorry that you see it this way. But it is neither invalid, condescending, nor wrong. It is actually a very good indication of where you are with your skills and confidence. But if you choose to feel condescended to, that is really your option.

You are either ready to jump in and do it, or you are not. But if you are not, you are going to have very little success finding what you feel you need from others. In this type of operation, there is only one teacher- your own experiences. You seem to not want to accept that, again your option. But yet unfortunately you will learn it no other way. Descriptions of what others have done are nearly meaningless. You can only truly make sense of them once you have done what they describe- and by then, you don't really need them. And people who have done it all seem to recognize this- so they don't waste their breath trying to describe something that they can't easily put into words, and that you won't be able to interpret.

Cut it apart with whatever method you most like. Find pictures of what you want to build. Make what you're building look like the pics. That's how it's done....

I'm sorry that you see it this way. But it is neither invalid, condescending, nor wrong. It is actually a very good indication of where you are with your skills and confidence. But if you choose to feel condescended to, that is really your option.

You are either ready to jump in and do it, or you are not. But if you are not, you are going to have very little success finding what you feel you need from others. In this type of operation, there is only one teacher- your own experiences. You seem to not want to accept that, again your option. But yet unfortunately you will learn it no other way. Descriptions of what others have done are nearly meaningless. You can only truly make sense of them once you have done what they describe- and by then, you don't really need them. And people who have done it all seem to recognize this- so they don't waste their breath trying to describe something that they can't easily put into words, and that you won't be able to interpret.

Cut it apart with whatever method you most like. Find pictures of what you want to build. Make what you're building look like the pics. That's how it's done....

What is wrong with gathering all the information possible before starting a build? Why does that deem me to not have the confidence or ability to do a project like this? Of course I'm ready to "jump into this". I wouldn't even consider it if I wasn't. I just wanted to get input from others that have been there and done that. I just assumed that would be prudent. Speaking of wasting breath...

If you read the thread, you'll see that I have found (thanks to some very helpful members of this forum) some great sites, threads and things that have given me a lot of ideas. So, I guess by your measure I'm ready.

If you read the thread, you'll see that I have found (thanks to some very helpful members of this forum) some great sites, threads and things that have given me a lot of ideas. So, I guess by your measure I'm ready.

we can only be helpful if you ask good questions.
there is a difference between asking, for example, if something you thought of would work and asking for someone to show you how it's done.
one is a dialogue where we can expand on what you might be thinking, the other is simply you asking to be spoon fed.

there is still the point that I still don't quite understand that if you know the rough process
i.e
cut door, fill gap, make door etc etc
what else is there for you to know?
you say you know the rough process and what materials you're likely going to use so what's missing?
as said before, your aim is to make what you got look like your reference photo.

job done.

any hints and tips i might be able to give would not be ones relating to opening a door; they would be general modelling tips.
it would be things like how to make a pattern to fill akward body gaps, the best way to shape putty, how to transfer a 3 dimensional shape etc etc and these are modelling tips.

When i first read your intial request, my gut said you were pretty much asking us to show you how to make models and scratch build and this is what Andy meant by the "if you have to ask..." statement.

Take the started and still in the queue 550 in my sig.
I knew that I had to seperate the bonnet.
I had a PE saw.
I put 1 and 1 together and sawed off the bonnet.

I had to make the under bonnet detail of one kit fit the body of the other.
There was a gap.
I have putty.
I put a different 1 and 1 together and used putty to fill the gap.

It seriously isn't rocket science and much of what you do in an operation like this is decided on the fly as the situation arises.
This is what we're trying to tell you.
How you open a door and fill detail depends entirely on what you've got to work with and what you know how to work with and what level of detail you'd be satisified with.

If you had just dived in and cut the door out and was left with a gap and then asked for ideas of how to fill the gap you'd have gotten a much better response because at least then we would have an idea of the problem.
Right now, until you have something done, we are literally talking about maybes.

Please document what you do with lots of nice photos.
If you feel that there isn't a good enough thread for this sort of thing then why not take this opportunity to make one?
That way, when you ask questions there about things that come up all of the relevent answers would be in one place.


ok, that really is it from me.
running out of daylight in my part of the world and it's only 14:45.

we can only be helpful if you ask good questions.

If you look at my OP, it was about a good tutorial (here on AF or anywhere else on the web) for building a car with an open door. The discussion devolved from there.

The thing I was the most unsure about are the sills and constructing the door parts in between the outer skin and the interior door. Not hinges, not making it moveable, etc. I just wanted to see what people used, ie/ putty vs styrene and why people used what they did. In the end, it helps me make a decision for my situation. The threads you pointed out, the challenger thread and others that have been referenced above have showed me different techniques to attack this problem. No, they weren't talking about the exact subject I am considering but I still take away information that is very useful to me in this project.

If I can get a decent photo booth made up, I'll take pics of my process. I am in no way "afraid" of this. Again, I just want to have all my ducks in a row before starting. Would any good modeler start a car without having all the detail parts and pieces they need? Nope. Same thing here. Just my style.

Would any good modeler start a car without having all the detail parts and pieces they need? Nope. Same thing here. Just my style.

I do.
Regularly.
That's in part why I have about 8 various kits around my desk in various stages of being built.
I never know what I'll need or need to make until I'm in there moving things around.
That is also why I get nothing finished until way later.
I guess that means I'm not a good modeller.


And you don't need a photo booth to take photos.

I do.
Regularly.
That's in part why I have about 8 various kits around my desk in various stages of being built.
I never know what I'll need or need to make until I'm in there moving things around.
That is also why I get nothing finished until way later.
I guess that means I'm not a good modeller.


And you don't need a photo booth to take photos.

Call me a boy scout but I like to be prepared. ;) I'm not saying anything about your skills, DM. Nothing at all. Just about my style.

I've tried to take pics without one and with what I thought was good lighting (both indoor and out) and got flamed hard for the "poor quality" of pics. That's why i'm waiting until I can build a decent box (just a small light box) to take pics. No fancy set up, just something so that others can see what I'm doing.

Not sure if this has been mentioned or not?(I was only able to skim the postings!)

But one critical issue is to determine if the door swings relative to the body or relative to the hinge?

First you have to make sure you understand this statement!

1) Door swings relative to the body: In this case the hinge pivot point is fixed the chassis and when the doors open the leading edge of the door swings out from the body panel line.

2) Door swings relative to the hinge: In this case the hinge pivot point is fixed to the door and when the door opens the leading edge of the door swings in from the panel line.


If you are replicating something you may not have a choice. However if you have the option then this choice can be very much influenced by the vehicle design, the way the kit is designed and the available space for mounting the hinge and door mechanisms.

This is an example of type 1) which was required due to the space limitations of the vehicle and kit design.

http://members.shaw.ca/millersbrm/PorschecarerraGT1.html

See the third picture down and you can see on the lead edge of the right door(left one does it too) how the door swings out from the body

Stephen

Thank you very much, Stephen. I appreciate the help.

No, you misunderstood (not surprisingly) what I was saying. I wanted to see their modus operandai before moving ahead. I knew that it would be styrene, putty, etc., correction, styrene, putty, correction, etc. But I wanted to try and avoid any pitfalls I could.

I wish this could just be helpful and not devolve into a OP-bashing fest. I think it's just freaking rediculous.

And to jano, *I DID* search and found not much about what I was searching. If that was the case, what would you do? Also, I've had run-ins with you before. Take it this way--leave me and my threads alone if you have nothing helpful or nice to say. Thanks.

Daniel

I agree, whats with everyone being so negative and rude about this. This forum used to be much more helpfull. Now it seems like people are only helpful or friendly if they are responding to somewhat who has superb skills and are rude to people who have less than superb skills but are doing their best to get to that level (I myself am in this category) and it is worth noting that I dont post much WIP of my own builds because I am not at the level of many of the great builders here and the response is far less positive. Sorry to go off on that tangent but how hard is to give basic pointers on getting started with opening a model. All it takes is describing past problems you may have run into or things youve come up with that went well. I would give you pointers but I to have no experience doing so, which is why I clicked this thread to begin with hoping there would be some POSITIVE responses and ADVICE. One thing I feel like would be helpful (if you have the money) is buy a kit that has a some of the parts already resin casted so there are less parts to manually scratch build and work from there, then you can try to manually replicate that on future builds...I have one of these to attempt but I am still hesitant lol. Also maybe practice on cheaper kits to get some of the kinks hammered out (cutting the doors out smoothly, making and mounting hinges etc.)

I agree, whats with everyone being so negative and rude about this. This forum used to be much more helpfull. Now it seems like people are only helpful or friendly if they are responding to somewhat who has superb skills and are rude to people who have less than superb skills but are doing their best to get to that level (I myself am in this category) and it is worth noting that I dont post much WIP of my own builds because I am not at the level of many of the great builders here and the response is far less positive. Sorry to go off on that tangent but how hard is to give basic pointers on getting started with opening a model. All it takes is describing past problems you may have run into or things youve come up with that went well. I would give you pointers but I to have no experience doing so, which is why I clicked this thread to begin with hoping there would be some POSITIVE responses and ADVICE. One thing I feel like would be helpful (if you have the money) is buy a kit that has a some of the parts already resin casted so there are less parts to manually scratch build and work from there, then you can try to manually replicate that on future builds...I have one of these to attempt but I am still hesitant lol. Also maybe practice on cheaper kits to get some of the kinks hammered out (cutting the doors out smoothly, making and mounting hinges etc.)

Let's not exaggerate.
What happens, IMO, is that people are fed up that even though so much information is available, people still keep asking the same questions without using the built in search engine. In my case this is a sign of little inters in the subject unless someone does half the work in advance.

In my case it's because I'm British.
If I don't insult at least 10 people a day, I'll get deported.



You muppet.

Let's not exaggerate.
What happens, IMO, is that people are fed up that even though so much information is available, people still keep asking the same questions without using the built in search engine. In my case this is a sign of little inters in the subject unless someone does half the work in advance.

What the guy said above is no exaggeration. Just look at my initial question and see who turned this into what it is now.

Also, I *DID* search! I didn't see what I was wanting, thus I posted. Do you not believe me? I'm really not that desperate to hear from you that I posted my question. It was an honest thing that some here (not you) helped out with by posting some links that, all together not individually, answered most of my questions. As I have said above, my thanks go out to those that have helped.

In my case it's because I'm British.
If I don't insult at least 10 people a day, I'll get deported.

Stiff upper lip there, old chap.


What is wrong with gathering all the information possible before starting a build? Why does that deem me to not have the confidence or ability to do a project like this?

It is because modeling is an intensely and inherently individual pursuit. There is no "right way" to do anything. There are many ways. Some ways may be "better" than others for some people. But the only way that matters is the way that works best for an individual. And that can only be learned by doing, and done by learning. You must learn you own way. People who know how to do it have all figured it out themselves, by doing it. And for whatever reason, it tends to be irritating for people who have figured it out themselves when someone who doesn't have the chutzpah to learn it himself demands a guide. We have what, 4 pages now to prove that? It brings to mind the 4 year old who constantly asks "why?", and follows every offered answer again with "why?". The ultimate answer very often is "figure it out yourself, kid". And that's how we really learn. Take your best guess and try it. If it doesn't work, then try something else. But we can't really spoon feed you this stuff. You must find it yourself.

Trust me, I'm a flight instructor. I know a bit about the learning process. Yes, people learn in all different ways. But no one has ever learned to land an airplane by asking "how is it done?". Everyone learns it in exactly the same way- by doing it, again and again and again. You start off (like everyone) not knowing how to do it. Then you do it- and as you do it, you learn how to do it. Everyone learns in their own way how do do it their own way. But they all learn it the same way- by doing. And if you don't get that, you will learn nothing.

What the guy said above is no exaggeration. Just look at my initial question and see who turned this into what it is now.

Also, I *DID* search! I didn't see what I was wanting, thus I posted. Do you not believe me? I'm really not that desperate to hear from you that I posted my question. It was an honest thing that some here (not you) helped out with by posting some links that, all together not individually, answered most of my questions. As I have said above, my thanks go out to those that have helped.

What a hypocrite. You post flaming statements like this one and then you expect people to treat you like a queen.

PS: No I do not believe you that you searched before asking, as there were at least two How to's and 10 memorable builds that you would have found with everything that one needs to know in order to attempt opening a door.

In my case it's because I'm British.
If I don't insult at least 10 people a day, I'll get deported.



You muppet.

I think I'll joint you on this bandwagon for a day Kermit! ;)

I can't believe we are still arguing about this.

I can't wait till this tread dies down so I can post a new tread with the original posters question again just to get the forums in an uproar again, and get everyones panties in a bunch.

Steve