Who will win the Spanish GP?
Guido
05-03-2003, 05:17 AM
It's nearly saturday noon and no-one bothered starting a thread about Spain :eek: What is wrong with you guys? :D
OK, here we go.
Since MS came out on top during friday quali in the new F2003GA I think he might have a chance - IF his new weapon won't let him down of course. But to be fair and honest with myself, I think DC will take it on Sunday. McLaren knows the track very well since they test there a lot.
OK, here we go.
Since MS came out on top during friday quali in the new F2003GA I think he might have a chance - IF his new weapon won't let him down of course. But to be fair and honest with myself, I think DC will take it on Sunday. McLaren knows the track very well since they test there a lot.
freakray
05-03-2003, 12:04 PM
And I am the one who voted the last option.....
....all the BS about why Ferrari hasn't been winning and all the whinging from the fans of the red has left me with no interest in F1......
....all the BS about why Ferrari hasn't been winning and all the whinging from the fans of the red has left me with no interest in F1......
RallyRaider
05-04-2003, 05:37 AM
Here's hoping Kimi can win from the back of the grid. Is it all part of some grand McLaren strategy?
Actually it will be interesting when he catches up to the Saubers. For the last few years they have been very difficult to pass in anything other than a Ferrari. But, with a wiff of a privateer Mercedes engine deal in the air for next year, that may be about to change.
Actually it will be interesting when he catches up to the Saubers. For the last few years they have been very difficult to pass in anything other than a Ferrari. But, with a wiff of a privateer Mercedes engine deal in the air for next year, that may be about to change.
ales
05-04-2003, 09:51 AM
Not a bad race at all!!! Although things seem to ba changint - a Renault on the same pace roughly as the new Ferrari and beats one of them!! :eek: Great drive by Alonso, I enjoyed it. Toyota faster than Williams (and I don't mean the stricken Ralf's car, DaMatta was posting consistently faster laptimes than both Williams's. Kimi made a mistake IMO, the second big mistake in 2 days and paid for it. As did DC - he left Button no room whatsoever. And a good drive by Ralf, actually! During his battle with Alonso, just before he went off, his car seemed to suddenly jerk in the middle of the corner. Or am I imagining things? We'll see what Patrick/Frank say about this.
And thumbs down to the coverage. What a difference one race makes (comparing to Imola). I understand that Alonso is Spanish, but it was getting ridiculous sometimes. We were not shown some good battles!
I was expecting more from the GA. And was it me (again :o), or was the Shell logo on the left side of Schumacher's car a bit damaged? ;) That could explain why Rubens finished 3rd (although he did get the fastest lap ... go figure). Then again, F2002 had a run for its money in Brazil last year.
So has Renault suddenly made a huge leap? Or was it the superiority of Michelins (seems that way) or the genius of Fernando coupled with this being his home event? IMHO Bridgestone need to up their game, they have not been making the best tyres of the two so farthis year.
Alex
P.S. Michael did win it! :D:D:D
And thumbs down to the coverage. What a difference one race makes (comparing to Imola). I understand that Alonso is Spanish, but it was getting ridiculous sometimes. We were not shown some good battles!
I was expecting more from the GA. And was it me (again :o), or was the Shell logo on the left side of Schumacher's car a bit damaged? ;) That could explain why Rubens finished 3rd (although he did get the fastest lap ... go figure). Then again, F2002 had a run for its money in Brazil last year.
So has Renault suddenly made a huge leap? Or was it the superiority of Michelins (seems that way) or the genius of Fernando coupled with this being his home event? IMHO Bridgestone need to up their game, they have not been making the best tyres of the two so farthis year.
Alex
P.S. Michael did win it! :D:D:D
Veyron
05-04-2003, 10:57 AM
Please tell me it was one of those freak races for Renault, like when Damon placed second at the Hongaroring in the Arrows. If not, Rubens and the 2003 GA need to go away, that just isn't acceptable. McLaren who? Williams who? :rolleyes:
nornicle
05-04-2003, 11:05 AM
I just watched it.. excellent.. I didnt like how pizzonias launch control didnt work :( which screwed up raikkonen, even though raikkonen did stuff up qualifying..
great race by michael even though the new car looks abit.. less.. ermm pacey than the 2002.. its very good looking.. its the first time i've seen it.. barichello looked like he was fighting the car half the time (same with ralf though)
I think I must have been blind but I thought ralf crashed out? how did he so suddenly come back onto the track???
GREAT WORK from da matta and WEBBER! (GO AUSSIES!!! FINALLY ACTUALLY GETTING TO FINISH AND NOT TOO SHABBILY!!!! WOO WOO WOO)...
anyway good work to Alonso as well.. very well raced, he deserved to come second..
pity about coulthard, villi, trulli and pizzonia ;( hahha
oh and very nice pit times from renault!!! they owned ferrari by a second in one of the pit stops.. nice!!!
p.s did Michael whiten his teeth? im either blind or they were particularly blinding tonight!
great race by michael even though the new car looks abit.. less.. ermm pacey than the 2002.. its very good looking.. its the first time i've seen it.. barichello looked like he was fighting the car half the time (same with ralf though)
I think I must have been blind but I thought ralf crashed out? how did he so suddenly come back onto the track???
GREAT WORK from da matta and WEBBER! (GO AUSSIES!!! FINALLY ACTUALLY GETTING TO FINISH AND NOT TOO SHABBILY!!!! WOO WOO WOO)...
anyway good work to Alonso as well.. very well raced, he deserved to come second..
pity about coulthard, villi, trulli and pizzonia ;( hahha
oh and very nice pit times from renault!!! they owned ferrari by a second in one of the pit stops.. nice!!!
p.s did Michael whiten his teeth? im either blind or they were particularly blinding tonight!
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by ales
Not a bad race at all!!! Although things seem to ba changint - a Renault on the same pace roughly as the new Ferrari and beats one of them!! :eek: Great drive by Alonso, I enjoyed it.
If that was the performance of the new and long awaited so calles (Fiorano) record-breaking F2003GA? I think Ferrari has a lot of development work to do. But still MS managed it and took the win for a maiden of a race car, which is always an accomplishment. But is was not an "walk-over" as so many Ferrari-lovers predicted that it was going to be. So there is still some hope for the championship ;)
Barichello once more proved that he is never going to be a world champion. After been beaten by KR in Malaysia and now by FA... there's no hope for Rubinho, except to shine here an there...
Not a bad race at all!!! Although things seem to ba changint - a Renault on the same pace roughly as the new Ferrari and beats one of them!! :eek: Great drive by Alonso, I enjoyed it.
If that was the performance of the new and long awaited so calles (Fiorano) record-breaking F2003GA? I think Ferrari has a lot of development work to do. But still MS managed it and took the win for a maiden of a race car, which is always an accomplishment. But is was not an "walk-over" as so many Ferrari-lovers predicted that it was going to be. So there is still some hope for the championship ;)
Barichello once more proved that he is never going to be a world champion. After been beaten by KR in Malaysia and now by FA... there's no hope for Rubinho, except to shine here an there...
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by ales
Kimi made a mistake IMO, the second big mistake in 2 days and paid for it.
There was no way that Kimi could have avoided Pizzonia. So the only thing one could blame him for was screwing up qualifying.
When the hurdle gets loose, you go and when a Minardi in front of you pulls to the middle and therefor aims for the outside line, you go for the inside line and out of the blue is a car standing still in front of you? You blame him for that? I think you actually never raced a vehicle then...
;)
Kimi made a mistake IMO, the second big mistake in 2 days and paid for it.
There was no way that Kimi could have avoided Pizzonia. So the only thing one could blame him for was screwing up qualifying.
When the hurdle gets loose, you go and when a Minardi in front of you pulls to the middle and therefor aims for the outside line, you go for the inside line and out of the blue is a car standing still in front of you? You blame him for that? I think you actually never raced a vehicle then...
;)
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:38 PM
Originally posted by ales
As did DC - he left Button no room whatsoever.
Oh DC too he. Well you forget to mention Trulli who fukced up DC's fourth place after turn 2... You easily could argue that Button was diving in a gap, which wasn't there. Classifies under race accidents IMO, so no is to blame.
It was just a weekend of bad luck for McLaren. Anyway, their main target was to get as many points as possible before MP4/18 is being used and even with this BS weekend, they're still on track
As did DC - he left Button no room whatsoever.
Oh DC too he. Well you forget to mention Trulli who fukced up DC's fourth place after turn 2... You easily could argue that Button was diving in a gap, which wasn't there. Classifies under race accidents IMO, so no is to blame.
It was just a weekend of bad luck for McLaren. Anyway, their main target was to get as many points as possible before MP4/18 is being used and even with this BS weekend, they're still on track
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:41 PM
Originally posted by ales
Toyota faster than Williams (and I don't mean the stricken Ralf's car, DaMatta was posting consistently faster laptimes than both Williams's..... And a good drive by Ralf, actually! During his battle with Alonso, just before he went off, his car seemed to suddenly jerk in the middle of the corner. Or am I imagining things? We'll see what Patrick/Frank say about this.
Ralf a good drive? He was under such a pressure all the time, smoking his tires up along the way. First MS, then JPM and I think DaMatta didn't push towards the end really hard, cause they needed to give way to MS and Alonzo. I was certainly not impressed. The Williamses were invisible, as were the Saubers
Toyota faster than Williams (and I don't mean the stricken Ralf's car, DaMatta was posting consistently faster laptimes than both Williams's..... And a good drive by Ralf, actually! During his battle with Alonso, just before he went off, his car seemed to suddenly jerk in the middle of the corner. Or am I imagining things? We'll see what Patrick/Frank say about this.
Ralf a good drive? He was under such a pressure all the time, smoking his tires up along the way. First MS, then JPM and I think DaMatta didn't push towards the end really hard, cause they needed to give way to MS and Alonzo. I was certainly not impressed. The Williamses were invisible, as were the Saubers
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:44 PM
Originally posted by ales
And thumbs down to the coverage. What a difference one race makes (comparing to Imola). I understand that Alonso is Spanish, but it was getting ridiculous sometimes. We were not shown some good battles!
We must have seen a different coverage, although mine is public TV as well. I've seen a lot of good mid-field action. Sure Alonso was in the picture a lot :D but I watched the whole race, even after DC crashed out. So I thought it was good.
And thumbs down to the coverage. What a difference one race makes (comparing to Imola). I understand that Alonso is Spanish, but it was getting ridiculous sometimes. We were not shown some good battles!
We must have seen a different coverage, although mine is public TV as well. I've seen a lot of good mid-field action. Sure Alonso was in the picture a lot :D but I watched the whole race, even after DC crashed out. So I thought it was good.
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:46 PM
Originally posted by ales
I was expecting more from the GA. And was it me (again :o), or was the Shell logo on the left side of Schumacher's car a bit damaged? ;) That could explain why Rubens finished 3rd (although he did get the fastest lap ... go figure). Then again, F2002 had a run for its money in Brazil last year.
There is a difference between the left hand side and the right hand side of the car. In the left hand side, there is only a water radiator and in the right hand side, there is another water radiator and the oil cooler, which explains the cooling ribs present on the rigth and not the left of the car.
I was expecting more from the GA. And was it me (again :o), or was the Shell logo on the left side of Schumacher's car a bit damaged? ;) That could explain why Rubens finished 3rd (although he did get the fastest lap ... go figure). Then again, F2002 had a run for its money in Brazil last year.
There is a difference between the left hand side and the right hand side of the car. In the left hand side, there is only a water radiator and in the right hand side, there is another water radiator and the oil cooler, which explains the cooling ribs present on the rigth and not the left of the car.
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by ales
So has Renault suddenly made a huge leap? Or was it the superiority of Michelins (seems that way) or the genius of Fernando coupled with this being his home event? IMHO Bridgestone need to up their game, they have not been making the best tyres of the two so farthis year.
Renault is making the most out of their test-session-day on friday. They don't do private testing, but they test as much as they want on friday, which gives them an awfull lot of track-data, which allows them to set-up and fine-tune their cars so much better.
As far as Michelin is concerned, I think they're doing a great jbo so far this year. To bad, DC's run was destroyed at the second corner. Otherwise we could have seen how his Michelins were doing. Now it's a bit of a guess, I think
So has Renault suddenly made a huge leap? Or was it the superiority of Michelins (seems that way) or the genius of Fernando coupled with this being his home event? IMHO Bridgestone need to up their game, they have not been making the best tyres of the two so farthis year.
Renault is making the most out of their test-session-day on friday. They don't do private testing, but they test as much as they want on friday, which gives them an awfull lot of track-data, which allows them to set-up and fine-tune their cars so much better.
As far as Michelin is concerned, I think they're doing a great jbo so far this year. To bad, DC's run was destroyed at the second corner. Otherwise we could have seen how his Michelins were doing. Now it's a bit of a guess, I think
Guido
05-04-2003, 02:50 PM
Originally posted by ales
P.S. Michael did win it! :D:D:D
ps. Kimi and McLaren are still leading the Championship :D :D :D :D
Question is: For how long...
P.S. Michael did win it! :D:D:D
ps. Kimi and McLaren are still leading the Championship :D :D :D :D
Question is: For how long...
ales
05-04-2003, 04:02 PM
I have to disagree about Kimi. While the collision could be classified as unavoidable (Wilson had other ideas though), but he should have taken it easier when starting from the back of the grid. There's always a chance that there'll be a stalled car, and there almost always is! So His mistake was not thinking about that beforehand. My opinion.
As is my opinion about DC/Button. I have no doubt it was DC's fault, Button was almost alongside him, as for Trulli, then yes, he was to blame, IMO, for the 2nd corner cometogether with DC.
And I meand the Shell logo on Schumacher's car, and what I was trying to say is that I think that there was some contact between Schumi's sidepod and RB's rear wheel at the first corner. ;)
As is my opinion about DC/Button. I have no doubt it was DC's fault, Button was almost alongside him, as for Trulli, then yes, he was to blame, IMO, for the 2nd corner cometogether with DC.
And I meand the Shell logo on Schumacher's car, and what I was trying to say is that I think that there was some contact between Schumi's sidepod and RB's rear wheel at the first corner. ;)
Guido
05-04-2003, 08:25 PM
it's good that we can disagree on things ;)
Kimi would have been to blame if the yellow flags were out on the pitwall and if Pizzonia would have waved his arms - which btw is standard procedure in F-1 starting policies. I didn't see any flags and didn't see any Pizzonia arms. So you could blame him for being all fired up at the start of a GP, but hey, who isn't! Before Pizzonia realised that his Jaguar "shoot-away-software" let him down and that he should wave, Kimi already ran into him. I start to believe why Jaguar wants to get rid of the poor fellow...
race accident.
And DC, oh well, like I said I believe there was no room for Button - like you said: "Almost". When someone is along side you, you have to give way in F-1, not when someone is "almost" alongside you - but does it really matter now? It was a bad weekend for the McLaren fans the world over and like Norbert Haug said "We're looking forward to Austria" :D
Kimi would have been to blame if the yellow flags were out on the pitwall and if Pizzonia would have waved his arms - which btw is standard procedure in F-1 starting policies. I didn't see any flags and didn't see any Pizzonia arms. So you could blame him for being all fired up at the start of a GP, but hey, who isn't! Before Pizzonia realised that his Jaguar "shoot-away-software" let him down and that he should wave, Kimi already ran into him. I start to believe why Jaguar wants to get rid of the poor fellow...
race accident.
And DC, oh well, like I said I believe there was no room for Button - like you said: "Almost". When someone is along side you, you have to give way in F-1, not when someone is "almost" alongside you - but does it really matter now? It was a bad weekend for the McLaren fans the world over and like Norbert Haug said "We're looking forward to Austria" :D
freakray
05-04-2003, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by Veyron
McLaren who? Williams who? :rolleyes:
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
McLaren who? Williams who? :rolleyes:
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
Veyron
05-04-2003, 11:17 PM
Originally posted by freakray
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
Chill! Just poking fun, not serious jabs at all! The luck will turn many times this season for sure, I just want good racing no matter who wins. :)
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
Chill! Just poking fun, not serious jabs at all! The luck will turn many times this season for sure, I just want good racing no matter who wins. :)
djmr2
05-04-2003, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by huudo
it's good that we can disagree on things ;)
Kimi would have been to blame if the yellow flags were out on the pitwall and if Pizzonia would have waved his arms - which btw is standard procedure in F-1 starting policies. I didn't see any flags and didn't see any Pizzonia arms. So you could blame him for being all fired up at the start of a GP, but hey, who isn't! Before Pizzonia realised that his Jaguar "shoot-away-software" let him down and that he should wave, Kimi already ran into him. I start to believe why Jaguar wants to get rid of the poor fellow...
they said it was a Launch Control failure, and at the rate of acceleration on a F1 car, i don't think he would have even had the chance to raise his arms before he was nailed.
it's good that we can disagree on things ;)
Kimi would have been to blame if the yellow flags were out on the pitwall and if Pizzonia would have waved his arms - which btw is standard procedure in F-1 starting policies. I didn't see any flags and didn't see any Pizzonia arms. So you could blame him for being all fired up at the start of a GP, but hey, who isn't! Before Pizzonia realised that his Jaguar "shoot-away-software" let him down and that he should wave, Kimi already ran into him. I start to believe why Jaguar wants to get rid of the poor fellow...
they said it was a Launch Control failure, and at the rate of acceleration on a F1 car, i don't think he would have even had the chance to raise his arms before he was nailed.
Michael Schumacher
05-04-2003, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by freakray
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
No because there wasnt much to celebrate since they were beating the boys in red.
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We're just trying to make ourselves feel better after seeing them loose :). It wasnt that McLaren had a bad day that we're excited (not me anyways) its that Michael won.
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
It was a racing incident, no ones making fun of him beacause of what happend. The samething could have just as easily happend to Michael. I will admit I wanted Kimi to finish low but I didnt want to see him go out like that.
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
There isnt much to be happy about when you favorite team isnt winning. Therefor, not to much to talk about, nothing positve anyways :D.
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....
Its not :confused: But why are you getting so mad at what was said? When someone says something like "McLaren who? Williams who?" there usually just joking.
what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
That is the ultimate goal for Ferrari fans :D.
You Ferrari boys weren't saying that when you were losing to the Mclarens.....
No because there wasnt much to celebrate since they were beating the boys in red.
Isn't it amazing how Ferrari fans make excuses for their favorite drivers when their drivers fail them, but when the other teams have a bad day it is almost impossible to shut the Ferrari fans up......
We're just trying to make ourselves feel better after seeing them loose :). It wasnt that McLaren had a bad day that we're excited (not me anyways) its that Michael won.
We all saw the same race, we all saw what happened to Kimi and David.....to me Kimi followed instinct, Wilson went left and he dove right....right into Pizzonia....racing incident.....whoop-dee-frigging-doo....
you Ferrari boys got what you wanted, Kimi to not score any points, so now you can shut up and go gloat to yourselves in the mirror.....
It was a racing incident, no ones making fun of him beacause of what happend. The samething could have just as easily happend to Michael. I will admit I wanted Kimi to finish low but I didnt want to see him go out like that.
Tell me, were you lot so vocal when Mclaren were dominating? (except for you whinging that is:rolleyes: )
There isnt much to be happy about when you favorite team isnt winning. Therefor, not to much to talk about, nothing positve anyways :D.
This forum has got so frigging lame.....it's motorsports, not a frigging religion.....
Its not :confused: But why are you getting so mad at what was said? When someone says something like "McLaren who? Williams who?" there usually just joking.
what's next, Ferrari fans going on a crusade to rid the world of non-Ferrari fans?
That is the ultimate goal for Ferrari fans :D.
ales
05-05-2003, 02:08 AM
Guido, watch the replay, there were yellow flags ;) And in F1 you have to leave room when someone is indeed almost alongside you. Button's front wheels were on front of DC's rear wheels.
And Ray, I'm sorry to say this, but it's you who's making the forum lame at the moment. Stop, chill out and have fun. I have not seen anyone whigning :confused: And isn't it normal for supporters of a particular team to be happy when their team is winning and not so happy when it's not? Do you want us to cheer when our team isn't winning? I don't see you cheering :rolleyes: All of your posts in this thread have been very negative, read through them and see waht I mean. Try to enjoy the sport and exchanging views with other F1 enthusiasts. And don't take this too personally or make it personal either.
And Ray, I'm sorry to say this, but it's you who's making the forum lame at the moment. Stop, chill out and have fun. I have not seen anyone whigning :confused: And isn't it normal for supporters of a particular team to be happy when their team is winning and not so happy when it's not? Do you want us to cheer when our team isn't winning? I don't see you cheering :rolleyes: All of your posts in this thread have been very negative, read through them and see waht I mean. Try to enjoy the sport and exchanging views with other F1 enthusiasts. And don't take this too personally or make it personal either.
Guido
05-05-2003, 05:25 AM
Originally posted by ales
Guido, watch the replay, there were yellow flags ;) And in F1 you have to leave room when someone is indeed almost alongside you. Button's front wheels were on front of DC's rear wheels.
Oh well, I'm not going to watch the replay, but instead believe you, that's easier :D Then you have a point, but still I think it's human for Kimi to be fired up aand again, blame him for that? As long as the McLaren fans don't blame him, it's OK.
Still as long as I follow F1 (since 1985, which is nearly 20 years - are we getting old and grey :smoka: ) my understanding is that you give way when someones front wheels are level with the middle (cockpit area) of the opponent. Not almost and ceretainly not when your wheels are just before your opponents rear wheels. oh well, I've never liked Button in the first place. :rolleyes:
Guido, watch the replay, there were yellow flags ;) And in F1 you have to leave room when someone is indeed almost alongside you. Button's front wheels were on front of DC's rear wheels.
Oh well, I'm not going to watch the replay, but instead believe you, that's easier :D Then you have a point, but still I think it's human for Kimi to be fired up aand again, blame him for that? As long as the McLaren fans don't blame him, it's OK.
Still as long as I follow F1 (since 1985, which is nearly 20 years - are we getting old and grey :smoka: ) my understanding is that you give way when someones front wheels are level with the middle (cockpit area) of the opponent. Not almost and ceretainly not when your wheels are just before your opponents rear wheels. oh well, I've never liked Button in the first place. :rolleyes:
ales
05-05-2003, 06:16 AM
Originally posted by huudo
Still as long as I follow F1 (since 1985, which is nearly 20 years - are we getting old and grey :smoka: ) my understanding is that you give way when someones front wheels are level with the middle (cockpit area) of the opponent.
Well, my understanding is that wherever you opponent is, you don't give way! :silly: You do give some racing room though :)
Originally posted by huudo
oh well, I've never liked Button in the first place. :rolleyes:
Me neither... I like DC and JV less though :)
Still as long as I follow F1 (since 1985, which is nearly 20 years - are we getting old and grey :smoka: ) my understanding is that you give way when someones front wheels are level with the middle (cockpit area) of the opponent.
Well, my understanding is that wherever you opponent is, you don't give way! :silly: You do give some racing room though :)
Originally posted by huudo
oh well, I've never liked Button in the first place. :rolleyes:
Me neither... I like DC and JV less though :)
ales
05-05-2003, 06:21 AM
freakray
05-05-2003, 08:08 AM
Alex,
My whole point is I was coming to this forum to have fun and enojoy the comraderie of fellow F1 fans, but in the last couple of months it has become more frequent for people to attack other teams rather than constructively discuss the race.
I enjoy reading the debates about the race and the strategy, sometimes I get involved and most times I don't.
We all get excited when our favorite driver or team wins, that is the human nature, but making comments to incent a reaction is plain immature, gets right under my skin, and you saw my reaction.
When I started frequenting the F1 forum, it is was interesting and fun, but as this season has progressed and things have happened, I don't enjoy it anymore.
The only person I think gave any sort of respectable response to my previous post was MS, the rest of you just responded like I expected.....
Basically Ales, if you think I am making the forum lame, I don't give a damn, if you want me to show you the whinging......fine....
My whole point is I was coming to this forum to have fun and enojoy the comraderie of fellow F1 fans, but in the last couple of months it has become more frequent for people to attack other teams rather than constructively discuss the race.
I enjoy reading the debates about the race and the strategy, sometimes I get involved and most times I don't.
We all get excited when our favorite driver or team wins, that is the human nature, but making comments to incent a reaction is plain immature, gets right under my skin, and you saw my reaction.
When I started frequenting the F1 forum, it is was interesting and fun, but as this season has progressed and things have happened, I don't enjoy it anymore.
The only person I think gave any sort of respectable response to my previous post was MS, the rest of you just responded like I expected.....
Basically Ales, if you think I am making the forum lame, I don't give a damn, if you want me to show you the whinging......fine....
ales
05-05-2003, 09:08 AM
Originally posted by freakray
Alex,
My whole point is I was coming to this forum to have fun and enojoy the comraderie of fellow F1 fans, but in the last couple of months it has become more frequent for people to attack other teams rather than constructively discuss the race.
Then why not start constructive discussions. Look at your first post of this thread. I meant to answer to Guido's post but changed my mind after reading yours and just voted.
Originally posted by freakray
We all get excited when our favorite driver or team wins, that is the human nature, but making comments to incent a reaction is plain immature, gets right under my skin, and you saw my reaction.
I honestly have no idea what you mean. The "Williams who?" thing? It was a light an friendly poke, nothing more. Me and Guido throw these at each other all the time and have a nice laugh when one of us manages a good poke. And it is your taking it so seriously and personally and then making it personal that sort of gets under my skin and you've seen my reaction. Are you havin a bad week or something?
Originally posted by freakray
The only person I think gave any sort of respectable response to my previous post was MS, the rest of you just responded like I expected.....
You're absolutely correct here. He has been taking hits like no other, I'm thoroughly impressed with his calmness, maturity, and good spirits. No matter what you, Guido or Phil threw at him in several threads (in good humour or not) he took it all in a matter that left me very impressed. Both you and me could probably learn from that, don't you think?
Originally posted by freakray
Basically Ales, if you think I am making the forum lame, I don't give a damn, if you want me to show you the whinging......fine....
Well, Freakray, you have shown it to me 3 times in this thread only. Again, are you having a bad week, Ray? Try to take things easier.
Alex,
My whole point is I was coming to this forum to have fun and enojoy the comraderie of fellow F1 fans, but in the last couple of months it has become more frequent for people to attack other teams rather than constructively discuss the race.
Then why not start constructive discussions. Look at your first post of this thread. I meant to answer to Guido's post but changed my mind after reading yours and just voted.
Originally posted by freakray
We all get excited when our favorite driver or team wins, that is the human nature, but making comments to incent a reaction is plain immature, gets right under my skin, and you saw my reaction.
I honestly have no idea what you mean. The "Williams who?" thing? It was a light an friendly poke, nothing more. Me and Guido throw these at each other all the time and have a nice laugh when one of us manages a good poke. And it is your taking it so seriously and personally and then making it personal that sort of gets under my skin and you've seen my reaction. Are you havin a bad week or something?
Originally posted by freakray
The only person I think gave any sort of respectable response to my previous post was MS, the rest of you just responded like I expected.....
You're absolutely correct here. He has been taking hits like no other, I'm thoroughly impressed with his calmness, maturity, and good spirits. No matter what you, Guido or Phil threw at him in several threads (in good humour or not) he took it all in a matter that left me very impressed. Both you and me could probably learn from that, don't you think?
Originally posted by freakray
Basically Ales, if you think I am making the forum lame, I don't give a damn, if you want me to show you the whinging......fine....
Well, Freakray, you have shown it to me 3 times in this thread only. Again, are you having a bad week, Ray? Try to take things easier.
freakray
05-05-2003, 09:39 AM
No Ales, I am not having a bad week, I am frustrated.....
What makes it bad is the fact that my frustration has nothing to do with any of the teams or the racing, it is the attitude of some of the fans that is frustrating me.
What makes it bad is the fact that my frustration has nothing to do with any of the teams or the racing, it is the attitude of some of the fans that is frustrating me.
RallyRaider
05-05-2003, 09:43 AM
Okay here is my take on the two incidents that took the good guys out of the race.
First of all Kimi. He really had very little chance in the fraction of a second that his race lasted. He was unsighted by the Minardi in front of him, simply saw it go left figured he'd go right and bang that was it. Remember also that the McLaren launch control is much more effective than Minardi' so Kimi was closing much faster than Wilson was.
Have to give the blame to Button on the Coulthard incident. He took the inside line, Coulthard gave him room perhaps figuring he could keep to the outside and have the inside line for turn two. Button either just didn't give him enough room or went in too hot and slid wide into DC. Button wasn't far enough ahead to make any claim to the corner.
Didn't really get a good look at the Trulli incident so can't comment on that one.
How 'bout them Renaults! Without Ralf holding Alonso up (not his fault as the marshalls didn't wave the blue flags) Micheal could have really been pushed at the end there.
First of all Kimi. He really had very little chance in the fraction of a second that his race lasted. He was unsighted by the Minardi in front of him, simply saw it go left figured he'd go right and bang that was it. Remember also that the McLaren launch control is much more effective than Minardi' so Kimi was closing much faster than Wilson was.
Have to give the blame to Button on the Coulthard incident. He took the inside line, Coulthard gave him room perhaps figuring he could keep to the outside and have the inside line for turn two. Button either just didn't give him enough room or went in too hot and slid wide into DC. Button wasn't far enough ahead to make any claim to the corner.
Didn't really get a good look at the Trulli incident so can't comment on that one.
How 'bout them Renaults! Without Ralf holding Alonso up (not his fault as the marshalls didn't wave the blue flags) Micheal could have really been pushed at the end there.
RallyRaider
05-05-2003, 09:53 AM
I understand where Ray is coming from but I'm afraid that is the nature of any sport with it's share of fair weather fans and bandwagon jumpers. F1 has them in droves. The winners always attract the type of fan who likes to simplify things down to "4re ownz U" and "Williams who?".
It is quite amusing because they are obviously too limited in intelect to realise that by putting the other teams pereformance down they are also belittling their "own" team. If all the other teams and drivers are incomptent then Schumi doesn't need to be anything special to beat them then does he? He must be just as big a clown as the rest of them, minus a few tenths of a percent.
It is quite amusing because they are obviously too limited in intelect to realise that by putting the other teams pereformance down they are also belittling their "own" team. If all the other teams and drivers are incomptent then Schumi doesn't need to be anything special to beat them then does he? He must be just as big a clown as the rest of them, minus a few tenths of a percent.
Guido
05-05-2003, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by ales
Me neither... I like DC and JV less though :)
I've met all of them - not that I talked to all of them, but seen them in the pit-lane, watched them from a close distance. To DC I talked very shortly once and regardless what people say or think about him, he's a very open and relaxed guy. Taking his time for the fans, to chat, to sign etc. etc. All this during private test session, where there is not really a "perofrmance-race-weekend-pressure" on their shoulders. At 5 o clock they also call it a day you know. JB didn't give a shit about his fans. DC was available for more then 20 mins which afterall is also part of F-1 business.
Me neither... I like DC and JV less though :)
I've met all of them - not that I talked to all of them, but seen them in the pit-lane, watched them from a close distance. To DC I talked very shortly once and regardless what people say or think about him, he's a very open and relaxed guy. Taking his time for the fans, to chat, to sign etc. etc. All this during private test session, where there is not really a "perofrmance-race-weekend-pressure" on their shoulders. At 5 o clock they also call it a day you know. JB didn't give a shit about his fans. DC was available for more then 20 mins which afterall is also part of F-1 business.
Guido
05-05-2003, 11:23 AM
I can also see Ray's point of view. But like Phil is saying, as long as there will be a competition on this planet, there will be people who will get all fired up about situations and statements. But like Alex is saying, I can handle a good poke. Cause afterwards I go upstairs and do some good modeling :D
I know guys - McLaren fans - who have the same strong attitude. Don't get me wrong, I have flags, caps, polo-shirts, T-shirts, mugs, paintings - you name it :D , and when we discuss races - they know how devoted I am :angel: - they never can understand why I can take it a bit easier then them. I will "think" what a #$@#%$ this or that driver is, but there is no use shouting that out loud.
It's like in football, you have decent fans - the vast majority - and 0.5% hooligans, who fuck up everything in the stadiums.
So it's not really about specific fans of certain teams, maybe we are just unlucky that on this forum those fans are just supporting the same team.
just my 2 cents ;)
I know guys - McLaren fans - who have the same strong attitude. Don't get me wrong, I have flags, caps, polo-shirts, T-shirts, mugs, paintings - you name it :D , and when we discuss races - they know how devoted I am :angel: - they never can understand why I can take it a bit easier then them. I will "think" what a #$@#%$ this or that driver is, but there is no use shouting that out loud.
It's like in football, you have decent fans - the vast majority - and 0.5% hooligans, who fuck up everything in the stadiums.
So it's not really about specific fans of certain teams, maybe we are just unlucky that on this forum those fans are just supporting the same team.
just my 2 cents ;)
kaoru-tochiro
05-07-2003, 09:20 AM
I watched the Spanish GP twice, so here's what I saw.
Kimi- I didn't see any yellow flags, I think if he had more years of experiece, maybe he would have asked himself why the car in front swerved like that. He reminded me of Hill punting Schumi at Monza in 95.
Trully- I saw Coulthard passing him on the outside on curve 2, Trully did to DC what Schumi did to Trully in Malaysia. His front right tire touched DC's rear left tire. But I trully don't think Trulli should have let him by.
Button- He did "Schumi's Malaysia pass" on DC and knocked him off. Whenever I see a driver's front wheels touch the rear wheels of an oponents car, the driver behind should be blamed for any contact. Passes should be side by side.
Alonso- who the hell is this kid?
Kimi- I didn't see any yellow flags, I think if he had more years of experiece, maybe he would have asked himself why the car in front swerved like that. He reminded me of Hill punting Schumi at Monza in 95.
Trully- I saw Coulthard passing him on the outside on curve 2, Trully did to DC what Schumi did to Trully in Malaysia. His front right tire touched DC's rear left tire. But I trully don't think Trulli should have let him by.
Button- He did "Schumi's Malaysia pass" on DC and knocked him off. Whenever I see a driver's front wheels touch the rear wheels of an oponents car, the driver behind should be blamed for any contact. Passes should be side by side.
Alonso- who the hell is this kid?
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