1979 Camaro Z28 Engine Swap

Hey guys. I'm restoring a '79 Z28. I know a guy who's basically offering to give me a 454 to put in it. What will I need to change inside the engine bay to fit the engine in place of the 350?

Tight exhaust manifolds or shorty headers, a low rise intake, and new front springs unless it's an aluminum block. The mounts will line up. I've had both a 350 and 454 in a '74 with nothing more than custom exhaust, spring changes, and a short air cleaner. The brake power booster might get pretty close to the rocker cover.

Alright, thanks. I can keep the intake if I get a cowl induction hood, yes? I haven't seen the engine, but I think it's a regular intake manifold.

Not knowing what intake and fuel system you might have, it's difficult to say. A cowl hood is very forgiving in that regard.

Shorty headers are, IMO, a waste of money. They do NOT "make power" like "real" headers (4-tube, full length). Hooker or Doug's would be my first choice for headers. The factory intake is a doorstop, too. Depending on the cam, Performer or Performer RPM would be a better choice.

Virtually everything from a '71 or '72 "SS454" Camaro will fit in the '79 chassis. Some of the fasteners are metric in the '79, so a little creative bolt-swapping may be called for. But headers, springs, mounts, etc. are all readily available for the BBC.

Changing to the BB will make the car much quicker in a straight line. It will also have a negative affect on handling, as the BB weighs about 300 lbs. more than the SB.

TH400 is the only 3-speed auto to consider behind a 454, too. The TH350 won't live long with that much torque.

FWIW

Jim

Shorty headers are, IMO, a waste of money. They do NOT "make power" like "real" headers (4-tube, full length). Hooker or Doug's would be my first choice for headers. The factory intake is a doorstop, too. Depending on the cam, Performer or Performer RPM would be a better choice.

Virtually everything from a '71 or '72 "SS454" Camaro will fit in the '79 chassis. Some of the fasteners are metric in the '79, so a little creative bolt-swapping may be called for. But headers, springs, mounts, etc. are all readily available for the BBC.

Changing to the BB will make the car much quicker in a straight line. It will also have a negative affect on handling, as the BB weighs about 300 lbs. more than the SB.

TH400 is the only 3-speed auto to consider behind a 454, too. The TH350 won't live long with that much torque.

FWIW

Jim

The guy I'm getting the motor from had it in his Nova SS, it isn't from a Camaro, and he built it himself. I'm guessing it puts out around 500 horses or so, considering he used to drag race the car, and the engine was also balanced. He swapped it for a 502 bored to be a 561 that puts out 777HP at the flywheel (he's nuts :P).

As long as the engine will fit in the engine bay I'm happy, I'll be swapping out the transmission for a 4 or 5 speed manual (unsure yet, probably a 5 speed to get a top speed without sacrificing acceleration, as well as having a nice low RPM for highway cruising).

What's the difference in weight between an aluminum and steel block?

A stock iron BBC is about 270 pounds. A Dart aluminum block is about 155 pounds. Run aluminum heads on that aluminum block and you'll weigh about the same a a cast iron SBC setup, just like the stock '79 Camaro, so no spring nor handling changes except for the lack of rear traction from the torque.

The biggest problems with aluminum are the cost can be prohibitive, durability will suffer even with sleeves, and that you can't make as much power with aluminum. Before you say "What kind of BS is that?" do some research. Aluminum blocks and heads sacrifice power for weight. It's not as big a deficit with heads, but it is with blocks.

Mmm, since the engine deal fell though, and it's motorless, would you recommend a big block or a small block, then? I want the car to have around 500 horses at the wheels before the nitrous shot (there is a dragstrip not too far away from my house).

Basically, the engine is going to be run hard and used as a daily driver in the summer, will the aluminum heads/block be able to take that?

I could probably do some work on the car to lighten it up to compensate for an iron block.

How would I compensate for the extra weight in front when it comes to cornering? (Because who isn't gonna wanna drive a muscle car like you stole it? :P)

Choices must be made here. If road "handling" is more important that straight-line performance, the "all aluminum" approach or a small block is called for. The BBC is simply VERY heavy (perhaps one of the only two real "drawbacks", valve train stability being the "other" one).

To get 500 RWHP "on motor" and be "streetable" is a tall order, even for BBC. That indicates the need for at least 650 at the flywheel, maybe 700. The 572 "crater" CAN be modified to make that much power on pump gas, but not trivial. ($$$)

For a real fun and "spirited" performer, a 383 can be the "ticket". You won't get the RWHP numbers without a blower, but it can still power a heavy car very well. It has the one thing 350 lacks, TORQUE. I would advise against a 400SB unless you "spring" for an aftermarket block.

Jim

The last '76 Camaro I worked on in depth made 650HP at the end of the crank with 358 cubes and a POS Holley. It used a Sterling Engines (Illinois) 358 factory block and 2 BBL Holley short track carb. It probably wasn't very street friendly. It also used a quick-change Strange axle and tube chassis.

The short story is that lots of HP can be made with a SBC on no boost, but as Mr. Fiero advises the pocketbook will get emptied fast and it's not going to be very well-mannered.

Having had both, a BBC in an F-Car is a tight squeeze, and unless you want to hack the inner fenders you might be stuck with shorties (with all their foibles) or iron manifolds and tubes. The weight is a detriment with iron blocks as previously advised.

If your budget is less limited, a 434-454 SBC in a Dart block would be the ultimate sleeper and fit with no real special effort - Other than the work you'll perform prying paper out of your wallet.

heres one I did you might like...small block 350...punch it 30 over...use 6inch rods instead of the 5.7 find you a set of good 327 66cc heads use small dome pistons original crank and a 280/510 cam or somewhere close you'll find the 13;1 compression will force you to use a high torque starter...it'll hit a pretty good lick and off the line you wont be touched...I used a holley mid rise intake and ....get this..... a quadrajet carb....the carb had some work and a few goodies but I never had a problem with it....my transmission...700R4 ....but I've got a good tranny guy who put in some long hours on it for me....off the line I can make the front wheels of my 72 camaro jump a 20 oz bottle of coke....not drinkable after the rear wheels get done with it tho.....oh yea horses....we dyno'd it at the rear wheels at 573HP I dont drive it in the highway much because I dont have the gears for it but I do drive it to ork sometimes about 35 miles and it rides nice and has plenty of punch even at 60 and hit it...it'll still throw you back in the seat.....anyhow just a suggestion...have fun...thats what it's all about!

I am a die-hard BBC man, but in an F-Body, I would have to suggest a SBC, (Unless you are building a drag race car that will see little or no street action). For drag racing, (or even a stout street runner), you definitely need frame connectors. For a strip-only car, lose the inner fenders, add a rollbar or cage, and go with a BBC using long-tube headers, and a Turbo-400 with a Trans-Go shift kit, or a race-built Powerglide, and a good torque converter.
You can make a BEAST of a car using a cast-iron 454 truck engine from the early to mid 70's. The blocks are all plenty strong. Just pull a valve cover and look for a head casting # ending with 781 or 049. These are open-chambered, oval-port heads with good-sized ports from the factory and they make great street heads, and very respectable race heads. I'm getting 673 HP out of mine, and it's under-carbureted. Started life in a 74 Chevy pickup. Comp solid-lifter cam, (.637" lift, 270* duration), TRW 12.5:1 pistons, stock steel crank, stock truck rods with ARP bolts, Edelbrock Victor Jr manifold, Holley 850 Double Pumper carb. Had the heads mildly ported, and reworked for the larger valves, (2.19" Int, 1.88" Exh). That's pretty-much it! The BBC was really the first American car engine that was designed first to be a race engine, yet also destined to be built in high-volume, for use in many thousands of production vehicles, (Not like the ultra-rare Hemi's, and SOHC Fords of the day).

HEADER NOTE: Camaro's were offered with 396 BBC engines in 1968 & 69, and 402 CID (396 +.030 overbore) BBC's from 1970-74. These engines are virtually identical to 427 & 454 BBC's, other than bore & stroke. So you'll find headers listed for them, I don't know that Chevrolet ever actually sold a factory SS454 Camaro. They had a corporate limit of 400 (+/-6) cubic inches on F-Bodies until the mid 70's, by then emission controls had killed the high-performance big-blocks. Anyway, these 396/402 headers are perfect for use with a 454. Just an FYI, as you may not find any headers listed for a 454 Camaro, because in reality I have never seen any evidence that such a car was available from Chevy.
Oh, BTW, do NOT build a 13:1 compression engine for a street car! Unless you have a lot of extra $$ and a trailer hitch behind your Camaro to haul fuel jugs in. I pay $8.00 per gallon for 110 Octane leaded race fuel, and you SURE won't find that stuff at many gas stations anywhere...
Good luck with your project! It is sure to be fun no matter WHAT engine you put in it, as long as it is a CHEVROLET engine, not some stupid Nissan motor like some numbskull on these boards was thinking of putting in his '67 Camaro... Any other questions, just ask! Lots of knowledgeable folks on here.