Well I'm compiling a list of new (2007+) cars that are 4-doors and 5-speed (or 6-speed) that are the easiest to fix up Fast & The Furious style. But the catch is they have to be 4-doors. I dont have a bad list going on right now:

2007 Honda Civic SI Sedan
2007 Chevy Cobalt LTZ
2007 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Special Edition
2007 Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V
2007 Mazda6 i 5-door Grand Touring

Of course ya know that AEM, DC Sports, Skunk2 and Edelbrock are all big supporters of the Honda world. Chevy being American has a mass market of parts for, but is it worth it in the end as the mighty import? The Subaru has the symetrical AWD and the boxer engine but I dont know how they are on parts. The Nissan Sentra I've been looking at a lot here lately. And the Mazda6 I like Mazda a lot anyways but yet I dont how easy they are to fix up. Could somebody pipe in with what they know about fixing up 4-door 5-speeds? I'm really trying to find me something cause I wanna get rid of my 96 Saturn SW1. I'm trying to find something that looks like a luxury car or a "sleeper" but has the engine capabilities and the drivetrain capabilities to be something absolutely amazing. I'm talking like Need For Speed Underground stuff here. LOL I'll also throw the whole system in there too. Alpine Type-R everything. Could somebody please help me out?!?!

whats with the 4-doors?

It would help if you had a goal. X performance with Y money.

Honestly, last thing I'd do is buy a new car to modify, but if you got money to burn....let me know how much you got and I'll build something to blow the doors off of whatever you dream up :D

I'm talking like Need For Speed Underground stuff here.

Were you dropped as a child? And if so was that like 10 minutes ago?

What's y'all problem? All I did was ask a question. Could you just please answer it.

Well the 4-doors is because I got kids and they like to ride with daddy sometimes. Wh not the 4 doors though?

Sorry man you set yourself up, the way you said that sounded juvenile.

Most of the cars you mentioned are good cars, but if i had kids to worry about i wouldnt put them in any of those until i figured out what kind of safety ratings they have.

Well the 4-doors is because I got kids and they like to ride with daddy sometimes. Wh not the 4 doors though?
Typically boxier body styling that only an Aussie could love. Because of the larger opening, the body is generally more flexible. They are heavier.....

Again, a performance goal would be helpful.

If you're just looking for a loud-exhaust car, then any of them would be great.

There is some pretty quick 4 doors for not too much more money vs the cars you listed......and you can put fart cans on those too!

What the hell is a fart can?

No I'm looking to find somethin that I can really tear into the engine and fix it up as far as I can go. What's something nice to start looking towards? And you said to not go for newer cars, dont know why, so what's some nicer older cars then to go for? One car I've been looking at in particular that strays from everything that I want in a car is a 1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed twin turbo t-tops and everything. So what are some cars y'all think I should go look at?

so you don't care about perfomance (I've asked 3 times now) you just want something to play with?

If cost is no barrier, then anything will work, regardless to level of performance (asked 3 times about that too)

You have to give us info if you want any real answers

What the hell is a fart can?

fart cans are those loud exhaust cans that ricers use to make their car loud without the annoying side effects of making their car faster

LOL I'm not putting a fart can on somethin and just goin with it. I would like to have something that looks like a luxury car and has all the specs inside of a luxury car but have the engine and drivetrain of a sporty car. That's why I've said like the Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V or the Subaru Legacy 2.5i Limited Edition. Can y'all think of some that I could do some work on performance wise but when it's goin down the road it looks like a nice luxury car.

I've heard good thing about the Subaru Impreza WRX STI. If you have the money to remove the crazy spoiler and scoop (needs replaced with a low-profile one for the intercooler), they look pretty sleeper-y.

I personally would pick the Spec V, because I like Nissans (especially 300zxs), but I wouldn't go any newer than 2006, because they got heavier in '07.

I do like the Impreza WRX STI but that's way too expensive for me. I mean your talking like $600 payments. I cant afford that at all. I was really leaning towards the 2007 honestly. What's the difference between the 06 and 07? I do know that the 2007 comes STANDARD with 200 HP 2.5L motor,limited slip,higher compression,brembo brakes,bigger cam. What's the difference between the 07 and the 06? Does the 06 have all that standard?

I think the Spec does, but I'm not sure. I've heard that the newer body style is heavier than the '06, but with the same power ratings.

Yeah but the 07 has that Rockford Fosgate premium sound system dont it? Does the 06 have it also? I went and looked at some today but they didn't have any spec v or 5-speed for that matter and none at all had the premium sound.

if u want sporty, luxery, and room for kids, the 300zx is really not the way to go, kids arent gonna fit past the age of like 5 or 6. i would say maybe a mitsubishi 3000gt vr4, but again no room for kiddies.
the subaru is probably the best bet. well respected in that not everyone goes for them as fast and the furious bs. but they have awd, and upgrades for engine, exhuast, and body are easy to find.
the si is a lil obvious for fast and the furious, u buy one, u dont have to do nething to it for that look.
i know this would b wierd but what about a new mustang gt. 300hp, rwd, manual, bold-ish looks, cheap as hell for wat they offer. and number one in class initial quality testing.

Mustang? My wife loves Mustangs but they would absolutely kill me in insurance. So you honestly think the Subaru Legacy 2.5i Limited Edition in a 5-speed would probably be more rewarding to drive around and make look nice than the Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V? I'm not into racing or none of that crap although I do like to watch NOPI on TV. I do like to have modifications done to my engine,exhaust,suspension,tires,brakes and the whole nine yards. Some of the body kits I get into but they have to be right for the car and the car has to be right for a body kit. I'm not into ya know the neon green paint job with orange flames on it and blue and red stripes down it either. I just like a solid like metallic silver or something with some nice blacked out rims with Toyo Proxes Z1R on them. I've had sports cars before and didn't like how they was inside. I'm real picky about how my inside is. If I'm not comfortable while I'm driving down the road then I dont wanna drive period. Like for example, I like to have the center console for the arm rest and then have my gear shift right connected to the end of the center console. Thats why I dont like the Honda Civic at all. Some of the Nissan Sentras have seen aren't like what I like either. Like I said before ya know my cousin has a Subaru Legacy 2.5i Limited Edition and it's nice and comfortable when he drives so I might look into one of those. We've actually looked at one before and she said she liked it but it was up to me. My cousin was telling me that the reason he picked the Subaru was because they're saftey ratings are really good in them. The AWD system they have is phenomanal. They must be really awesome cars because he traded in his Audi A6 for it.

By the way I've been considering this car (among others LOL) for a while now. Does anybody know any good sites I can go to to look at performance mods for that Subaru?

u can google "subaru legacy/impreza modifications"
for wheels check out tirerack.com
i drove my friend 07 legacy 4dr. it was pretty good. resonsive and all. i had just gotten done driving my 320hp stealth, so power to me, felt like nothing, but it's a good car. his had 165hp. there's another above that with turbo and intercoller, has 227hp. his is auto, but from where his shifter was, it's a good feel it it was a manual.
the stealth has that feel to it, arm rest, and elbow rest for shifting. it's also not a sports car(persae) it's a gt. upgrades for the non tt r cheaper than that of the tt. but the tt is an exciting car, great handling, responsive, very independant exhaust note(not like other 6cyl tt). leather, and damn they r sexy. take a wonder over to the mistu section, under the 3000gt/stealth section and post the cars(i'd suggest getting rid of the fast and furious idea, they wont answer u) just say u want an opinion.
i dont know how much a stang gt on insurance would b, but for me up over 1000(i'm 20, and have a history)
or u could wait till nxt yr. that's when the challenger and camaro come out, camaro will b nice, and i can imagine people will make parts for the mquickyl.

but from the list u gave, i say the subaru hands down.

Mk. 4 Golf FTW!

don't weigh a lot; my 2.3-litre V5 weighs in at ~2,600lb.

good strong reliable engines and drivetrains. the 3.2-litre V6 can make some very nice numbers, but the 1.8-litre turbo can be tuned to make some mad numbers too.

i didnt even think about the golf...that's right cause the base model has like 120hp, something even my neon can outrun(and has). the turbo is ok.
there's always the r32 golf. 2dr, but a good car. i think it has back seats

fart cans are those loud exhaust cans that ricers use to make their car loud without the annoying side effects of making their car faster

Oh, now I KNOW that was directed at me.... ;) just wait till my new thing catches on. I ziptied a NOS Energy Drink bottle to my radiator grill (right next to the Subaru emblem)! You wouldn't believe how people think "Dude, he has NOS? On that POS??"... leading to my car's new nickname: NosPos.

Personally, I don't feel that any given car can be quantified as the right project car. It has to be the car you want. Unless you're being payed to undertake the project, the energy to see it through to completion has to come from within... This seems to work best when you pick "your dream car"... and who can decide that, except you?

Oh, and my initial smartass answer to the Subject question: "What's the easiest 4-door 5-speed car to fix up?" That would be, the one that's the least broken.

i didnt even think about the golf...that's right cause the base model has like 120hp, something even my neon can outrun(and has). the turbo is ok.
there's always the r32 golf. 2dr, but a good car. i think it has back seats

there are 4-door R32s. and all Golfs can seat 5.

there are 4-door R32s. and all Golfs can seat 5.

comfortably?

yes, very.

4-door and 2-door Golfs share the same wheelbase. so despite having less doors, space inside is the same.

my Mk. 4 is more comfy and spacious than many 4-door saloons.

yes, very.

4-door and 2-door Golfs share the same wheelbase. so despite having less doors, space inside is the same.

my Mk. 4 is more comfy and spacious than many 4-door saloons.

first one that comes to mind is the maserati quatroporte(spelt horribly) and i dont think a golf is bigger. but i get ur point

I've noticed the new Mitsubishi Lancer not the Evo it's an ES. They're relatively cheap too. I dunno I think but I'm not positive that my closest Mitsubishi dealership has them. What do people think about them vs the Subaru Legacy? I've been reading about them and they're supposed to be really safe cars. The only difference I'm finding out so far is that the Lancer isn't AWD except for the Evo which I'm not paying out the ass for the car and out the ass for the insurance.

I've narrowed it down to either the Subaru Impreza 2.5i Special Edition, not the WRX cuz it's too expensive or the Subaru Legacy. But I think the Subaru Impreza, does anybody know any big differences between the two?

have you considered a mitsubishi evo?
they are 4door cars and imo, look better, and are easier to modify than subarus because of better aftermarket support.
also, one of the cars in F&F was a mitsubishi lancer.

they are incredibly fast to begin with, so it wouldnt take much to get in a lot of trouble really fast...

Yes I have considered a Mitsubishi Evo. I've really considered it. But for one it's like a 30,000 dollar car to begin with. Which from what I've seen I dont think the comfort level in it is too high also. I haven't looked it up but I'm sure it's outrageous on insurance. That's what I'm looking for a luxury/sporty 5-speed car. I'm having such a hard time finding something. Guys I'm really fearing here that insurance is gonna be the sole factor holding me back from getting a new car. I'm really afraid that I'm gonna be stuck with my 96 Saturn SW1 SOHC 5-speed for a while.

a nice 96 or so mitsubishi evo shouldnt cost 30,000.
if it were me, i'd get a car with a clean exterior and interior, and plan on spending money on the engine.

oh, and i wouldnt do it on anything that still has a warranty, because that means its too new.

to bad the evo wasnt in america in 96. hell the lancer wasnt even here.
as for insurance, not that bad i'd imagine, its a 4dr family sport compact

I've noticed the new Mitsubishi Lancer not the Evo it's an ES. They're relatively cheap too. I dunno I think but I'm not positive that my closest Mitsubishi dealership has them. What do people think about them vs the Subaru Legacy? I've been reading about them and they're supposed to be really safe cars. The only difference I'm finding out so far is that the Lancer isn't AWD except for the Evo which I'm not paying out the ass for the car and out the ass for the insurance.

Over here we've got a whole slew of 4wd mitsubishis and subarus.
If I wanted a car for modifying or going fast, I wouldn't touch either of them.

The subarus drivetrain kills a lot of the acceleration and the power and torque per litre they get is nothing flash.
The turbo ones have a reputation for blowing up. A mate has had his engine rebuilt twice under warranty (first time piston slap, second time it spat big end bearings). Both well known problems.
The weight distribution on them is wrong too. The entire engine is in front of the front axles. Not sideways in front either.

You're probably talking about the new generation mitsubishe lancer (not on sale here yet), but the old one had a 2 star crash rating.

I also don't see the point in 4wd for most street cars. Unless you've got more power than you can realisticly put through two wheels (i.e worked up skyline) then the extra weight will just slow you down and kill your fuel economy.

um the skyline...3600lbs, 330hp(do the math, it's still quick) and u dont go out and buy a car like a skyline and expect great gas milage. and last time i checked the evo X isnt out yet, and the evo IX has 290hp with awd not 4wd(theres a big difference) i dont know about u, but i'd rather have awd with 290hp over fwd with 290hp.

Like I said before guys I'm really fearing here that I'm gonna end up with my POS Saturn SW1 which I dont wanna end up with. Can you guys give me some suggestions on what I should go test drive? My wife told me "hunny it's your car you get what you want", but y'all know how that ends up? I'll get what I want yes, but it still better please her standards also. Which really, her standards are pretty reasonable, hence the 4 doors because of the kids. Another reason why I'm wanting nice safety ratings cause of my kinds. I've never in my life and I'm 23 owned a brand spanking right off the showroom floor car, but why do y'all say not get anything brand new? I know nothing with a warranty because of modifying this and that with the engine and voiding the warranty out but I'm not concerned of the warranty. The big thing I gotta remember is the insurance. I'm 23 with 2 tickets and not a consistent insurance policy, so....With that said lemme have it y'all! Anything y'all think is reasonably priced but bad ass when fixed up. Has to be comfortable inside when going down the road. Also something that has potential to have a bad ass sound system too. Please some suggestions!?!?

an rx8 technically has 4drs. it's sporty with 232hp/159tq(ouch) and of course the rotay high rpm redline.
when u buy a new car, yes mods do void the warrenty, but not always, if it's likea turbo car, and u up the pressure, then ur engine has problems, then ur sol, but if u just replace like the valve cover with a chrome one or something, it's fine.

um the skyline...3600lbs, 330hp(do the math, it's still quick)


I said (i.e worked up skyline).
Yes they do get good gas mileage. Better than a 2.5 litre subaru if driven at the same speed.

Big difference between AWD and 4WD.:grinno: :shakehead

Well you really should give a horsepower goal and/or specified budget to get good answers. All the cars mentioned are good options but if you want luxury, well, I dunno if I would classify any of those cars luxury except the Golf and possibly skyline (which you can't get anyway).

You want sporty and luxury. Two brands that come to mind are Saab and Audi. How mechanically inclined are you? You will save money doing your own work versus taking it to a shop since they are european makes (though Saab owned by GM) and labor work is pretty high, let alone some parts. Both have their issues that impede their reliability ratings but generally Saabs are more reliable. Both are gonna need extra TLC to stay running right. However both makes own a chunk of the luxury/sporty market like BMW and Lexus. Many of Saabs cars are turbocharged and they can be made to go fast and I mean fast. Many people don't know that so it may make a nice luxury/sleeper for you. Audi is the same way with the 1.8 turbo. I'm told the stock internals can handle up to 600 horses and they do have a big aftermarket. Both vehicles benefit from a chip and/or ecu upgrades from certain companies to give a cost-effective power boost. Saabs are known for having safe cars also. Really safe as in good crash ratings. Check out these two brands. Price/cost of ownership is something to think about however. These really aren't cheap cars to own and maintain and insurance could go either way, but you get sporty and luxury stock plus can be fixed up to go much much faster, so research and see if its something worth looking into. :wink:

um the skyline...3600lbs, 330hp(do the math, it's still quick) and u dont go out and buy a car like a skyline and expect great gas milage. and last time i checked the evo X isnt out yet, and the evo IX has 290hp with awd not 4wd(theres a big difference) i dont know about u, but i'd rather have awd with 290hp over fwd with 290hp.


Your an idiot.
There are lots of different models of "the" skyline with a whole range of different engines to suit.

With in the context of a 4 wheeled vehicle there is no difference between 4WD and AWD. They both mean exactly the same thing.
If you were talking about 6 wheeled vehicles then there would be a difference, but I'm not aware of very many 3 axle passenger cars.

Your point about 290hp being to much for a FWD set up does have some validity though.

olk the difference between 4wd and awd is 4wd can b shut off, awd cant. other than that, yes they r the same thing.
i know there are many different skyline models, i had an r32(11 days of it were great). but all of em have very respectable power.
by good gas milage, i mean 27mpg or more. i never got better than 20mpg with the r32. maybe lower models do tho, idk.
eh fwd has one advantage over awd, with 290hp to the front tires, i'd take that in a rolling race over the awd. other than that torque steer is a bitch

With in the context of a 4 wheeled vehicle there is no difference between 4WD and AWD. They both mean exactly the same thing.

Well I agree with this and then I don't really agree with this. They are different drive systems in my eyes. As vector said, I see 4wd as part time 4wd where the extra traction can be shut off. AWD is where you cannot turn it off. This is not really true though cuz its not just part time out there, you also got full time 4wd and auto 4wd and yada yada yada. Are these AWD just because they can't be shut off or they work automatically? Not really. Also, these systems have different uses too. AWD isn't made for extreme off road. Its just all wheels going and some gets more traction than others in slippery conditions. full time 4wd pretty much works the same way, but all the 4wd systems have options to give you traction/power off road as well as on the road (4hi, 4lo). Basically, you have setting options in a 4wd system so that can be considered a difference I guess. All in all they are different but really aren't all that different. They work differently but ultimately achieve the same goal.

yada yada yada.

That bit made sense, the rest did not.

Whether you can select 2wd or not, you've still got to accelerate and carry the weight of the 4wd drivetrain. It offers no advantage in traction, fuel economy or acceleration. Which is why almost all 4wd cars are full time 4wd.

sickcallawayc12 (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/member.php?u=177819) has been the only person to really give me the answer i was looking for. I'm not really looking to spend a lot of money (i.e. 20,000+) for the car in the beginning. Maybe not even a brand new car as my insurance record wont agree with full coverage (if u know what i mean). However the aftermarket aspect of it does not limit myself personally to money problems meaning it probably wont be an option down the road. I'm just needing some more suggestion like the above mentioned. Thanks for any information anybody offers me though, sincerely.

sickcallawayc12 (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/member.php?u=177819) has been the only person to really give me the answer i was looking for. I'm not really looking to spend a lot of money (i.e. 20,000+) for the car in the beginning. Maybe not even a brand new car as my insurance record wont agree with full coverage (if u know what i mean). However the aftermarket aspect of it does not limit myself personally to money problems meaning it probably wont be an option down the road. I'm just needing some more suggestion like the above mentioned. Thanks for any information anybody offers me though, sincerely.
2.2 straight six actually had a good suggestion with a GTI on page 2. Its a more roomy and upscale compact. It seems like Audis/Volkswagens have good engines, but are plauged with electrical issues. I don't know of anyone who has owned these brand of cars with any electrical problems though.

Hey all I've been looking at 1991 body style Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR-4. First off lemme say bad ass cars from the factory. Looked up insurance and everything and for me still pretty cheap which pleased me a lot. But I've been reading the 3000GT/Stealth forum and I've been finding out that you cant get good gas mileage with them which saddens me deeply. But I think I'm on the right path y'all are leading me towards - STAY AWAY FROM NEW LOL I convinced my little lady into letting me get whatever it is that I want. I have to have a daily driver with decent to moderate gas mileage. Also I'd kinda like to stay away from the rice burners if u know what I mean.

I'm so intent on getting rid of my Saturn because for one it's not me and now my wife is like "well u get what u want to" I'm like oohhh I've already bought this damn car. And also that Saturn is only the SOHC motor and u cant do hardly anything to it. Plus both of the O2 sensors are going out and I need to get my TPS sensor replaced too and it's just too much work than I would really like to do to it.

Nissan Altima 3.5 has 245hp. 20/26 mpg. A Golf 1.8T is a nice car too as was mentioned. The Impreza 2.5 RS is a good choice. You just have to go out looking and see what you like. We arent going to know what you want.

Well that's just the point though I really dont know what all is out there and I'd kinda like to have a little bit of research done before I go and test drive the car. I dont know if I like the Altima or not but if I was to go with a Nissan I think it'd be a Sentra SE-R Spec V. I have looked at the Impreza's and went back in my head back and forth so many times. I think that's the car I'm considering the most. I've spent the better part of this morning since about 8:00 AM online looking at probably 50-60 different cars,years,body styles,motors etc.,etc. And I think I've got it narrowed down to a 2000 Honda Civic SI, 2002 Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V or a 2000 Subaru Impreza 2.5 RS

The Sentra should be a little quicker than the other two. The Civic probably has the most aftermarket. b16 is a great little motor. But the lack of torque might put you off. Ive always liked Imprezas too.

Just curious as to why you want the Sentra SE-R instead of the Altima? The 3.5 is within your range and the few grand more you'd most likely have to spend will be well worth the extra power, room, and features you'd get. The Maxima is also a worthy consideration for you too even though its got a little less power with more luxurious features.

I dunno why it's just the Nissan out of them all I got so struck by for some reason. But I'll definately go take a look at the Altima's and the Maxima's too. Is there anything else off the top of your head that you suggest I look at?

Nothing with a 5 speed available. Lots of good vehicles have been mentioned already. Maybe the Mazda6 but I dunno how sporty it is.

Hey all I've been looking at 1991 body style Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR-4.

Didn't you want 4 doors?

Didn't you want 4 doors?


I think he wants to talk a lot of BS, look at a lot of cars online, listen to a lot of BS, and generally waste time.

Anyone actually serious about buying a new car would be out testing driving different ones and seeing what best fits their needs.
Not talking about it on a car forum.




Anyway,

This thread is way off topic from anything related to an engineering discussion so it is now closed.