Taurus1997

I have a 1997 Ford Taurus 3.0L. I have had long-crank slow-start problems for years. I found a tip that works excellent for this condition. I turn the key on but not to start. At this point, I hear a whirring noise under the hood. Once this whirring noise stops, then I turn the key from on to start, and my car starts immediately! It has worked wonders. My problem is: what is this whirring noise under the hood, and more importantly, what causes the noise to actually turn off? I understand the whirring noise itself isn't keeping the car from starting, but what controls it? It's like the car needs to check out a few things before turning off this whirring noise device. Another problem is this wait is getting longer and longer when it's getting cold in Minnesota. At other times, the whirring noise stops at differnent time spans - sometimes this whirring noise stops after two or three seconds, and sometimes it takes 20 seconds to stop. Please help. Thanks.

shorod

Are you sure the noise is under the hood? It could also be the fuel pump in the fuel tank. The pump is an electric motor that runs when the key is turned to the run position to prime the fuel system at startup. If you find you need to wait for the pump to shut off to successfully start the engine, your pump may be about to leave you stranded, or you may have a fuel system restriction such as a restricted fuel filter.

If you are confident that this noise is not your fuel pump, then it may be your Idle Air Control (IAC) motor on the throttle body controlling the amount of air that bypasses the throttle plate at idle and startup. The IAC will adjust the bypass air based on intake air temperature, coolant temperature, and load on the engine.

-Rod

Taurus1997

Thanks for the ideas. The noise is definitely from under the hood. In the past week (colder outside temperatures have arrived here in Minnesota), the time it takes for this whirring noise to stop has increased from 5 seconds to around 30 seconds...sometimes. Anyway, this will give me time to turn the key on and quickly listen under the hood to where this whirring noise is originating. I will use your ideas. I will reply back to this post this tomorrow with more info and results.
I thought it could be the fuel pump going bad too so here is my idea about how I eliminated the fuel pump being the cause at this point: after driving around town for a half-hour I will turn the car off , then I will very quickly turn the ignition back to "on", but not "start", and yet that whirring noise is there and it still may take 20 - 30 seconds for it to stop. My theory here is if the car was running fine a few seconds ago then it must be getting adequate fuel pressure, so therefore, I will turn off the car and immediately try turning the key back to "on" thinking the whirring noise will stop real quick since the fuel pressure was just fine a second or two ago. But instead, the whirring noise may still run up to 20 or 30 seconds for whatever mysterious reason(s). Does this theory/test sound accurate? Or am I off target here?

shorod

A better check for if it's the fuel pump would be to unplug the fuel pump inertia switch in the trunk, then see if the the whirring is present. If the noise is still present, it is certainly not the fuel pump making the noise.

You could rule out the IAC by doing the same (unplugging the IAC motor). Be aware though that unplugging the IAC may cause a code to be set and a Check Engine Light.

Which 3.0L engine do you have, the 12V or the 24V DOHC?

-Rod

Taurus1997

The whirring noise is for sure the two fans turning while the car is doing some sort of pre-start testing step(s). As soon as the "whatever" turns the fans off, I can start the car with absolutely no problems. Otherwise, if I were to turn the key from "off" to "on" then immediately to "start", then I have the common condition of long-crank hard-start occurring. So, what type of pre-start testing steps does a 1997 Taurus 12-valve do? Whatever it is will turn the fans on until some process is completed, then it turns the fans off. I know the fans being on are NOT the problem, it's just that is a great indicator when I can then turn the key from "on" to "start" with great results when starting the engine. I also have some other information. I noticed when I was directly over the fans (key "on" - engine "off"), that when the fans did get turned off by whatever process, then there was a click noise from the big module mounted alongside the battery box called the Constant Control Relay Module which has around 20-plus wires going to it. I am not sure if this last fact means anything. Last night the car took almost a minute for the fans to turn off before I could start the car. I notice as the weather is getting colder, the delay for the fans to turn off is also getting longer. I have had the car for five years, but this is starting to become a longer delay then I can ever remember. Please reply with any ideas you may have.
Thanks again, Rick

Millermagic

The only thing they do when you turn the key to on is display all the warning lights and prime the fuel pump.

__________________

Taurus1997

My fuel pressure is right on according to the books specifications. I hooked a fuel pressure gauge onto the fuel rail for an accurate reading. Any other ideas? I have a feeling there are some pre-diagnostic computer programs or checks that the PCM (or other components) check or run through before other conditions are met that brings my car to this point where the fans also turn off. It also seems my entire problem gets worse with the outside temperature becoming colder too. Again, any more ideas? Thanks.

Taurus1997

Hey everyone, I have more detailed facts, test results, and what-ifs for those of you that have your "thinking caps" on.

Here’s what I found out when I connected an inline spark tester on one of the plugs, connected a noid light on one of the injector harnesses, and connected a fuel gauge to the fuel rail on the car all at the same time during which time I had an assistant turn the key from "off" to "on" and immediately to "start" to turn the car over. (I know the car will not start due to the "fans being on", but I will at least see if I'm getting spark, injector pulse and fuel pressure during this brief time before the fans turn off.)

What I found out was absolutely no injector pulse, there was absolutely no spark at all, and the fuel pressure was perfect at 42psi while the car was cranking over just fine.

As soon as those "fans did turn off", then all of a sudden I had injector pulse, spark at the plugs, and the car started right off.

What would cause a 1997 V6-3.0L Taurus GL not to have injector pulse and not to have spark at the plugs while "the fans are momentarily on" when the key if first turned on from "off" to "on"?

After the above test was complete, I did some experimenting (or being desperate). Here’s some more interesting facts. Fact 1: I was troubleshooting my car during this time in a warm garage. Fact 2: The delay for the "fans to turn off" so I could actually start the car was about 5 to 10 seconds. Fact 3: The delay for the "fans to turn off" did not shorten or lengthen with the ECT (engine coolant temp) sensor disconnected, with the MAF (mass airflow) sensor disconnected, with the IAT (intake air temp) sensor disconnected, with the IAC (idle air control) sensor disconnected, and with the oil pressure sensor (feeds the dash board oil light) disconnected. Fact 4: this was very discouraging, but this morning when the garage was cold again, I went to start my car to go to work and the delay for the "fans to turn off" was back around 20 - 25 seconds. Fact 5: Once my car starts, ever, it has always ran fine. It has never stalled during driving conditions. My only dilemma is getting the car to start.

If anyone has any ideas, please let me know.

I have a OBDII code reader/scanner that can read generic and factory proprietary codes, individual sensors, and captured and live data.

I’m hoping all this detailed information above will mean something to someone that can help with this 1997 Taurus with its starting problems.

Thanks, Rick

shorod

Try turning the key to "run" and connecting with your scan tool. Will it connect while the fans are running, or only get communication once the fans stop?

I'll have to check on the 1997, but Ford used to use a Constant Control Relay Module (CCRM) which contained the relay for the PCM, fuel pump, cooling fans, and A/C compressor clutch.

If your Taurus uses a CCRM, I wonder if you maybe have a faulty ground to the CCRM. When the ignition is first turned to "run" the CCRM gets a ground through an incorrect path, turning on the cooling fans initially. After some time, the relay kicks out for whatever reason and then the PCM relay closes, allowing spark, fuel, etc. If your scan tool cannot connect to the PCM while the fans are running, that might indicate this is on the right path.

-Rod

Taurus1997

Rod,

It's interesting you asked will I "only get communication once the fans stop?". That is EXACTLY what happens with my OBD-II reader. I get no data from the OBD-II connector until the fans stop. Is this a good clue about what may be happening?

Hmmmm... it seems you might have seen/heard of the above condition before. :-) I sure hope so.

What would be some ideas to try next, or tests to conduct at this point?

thanks, Rick

wrightz28

From my experiences (non-Ford) this would be indicative of a problem in the engine coolant temp sensor (CTS) circuit.

shorod

Fortunately for me, I have not experienced symptoms such as you describe. However, I do recall the older Taurii had a CCRM which contained the relays for the cooling fans, fuel pump, as well as the PCM power. Unfortunately, I don't have a service manual for the 1997 Taurus. My manual for the 1998 shows discrete relays for the cooling fans and PCM power. I'm not sure if 1997 was the same as '98 or if the 1997 has the CCRM.

Typcially the CCRM was mounted to the radiator core support. It has a bunch of wires (about 20 wires) connected to it. Don't mistake the airbag sensor for a CCRM (the airbag sensor will only have a couple of wires to it).

If you do have a CCRM, I would suggest tracing the ground wires and make sure it has good grounds. Unfortunately, since I don't have the service manual, I cannot tell you which wires should be ground.

In either case (CCRM or not) the PCM drives the relay coils for the cooling fans (high and low speeds). During normal operation, the PCM should have power in order for it to turn on the cooling fans. That along with your tool not being able to communicate while the fans run would suggest to me a ground issue or a PCM fault.

However, checking the coolant temperature sensor (not the sender) would be worthwhile. It is certainly less expensive to replace than the PCM and should be quick to either narrow down or rule out.

-Rod

Taurus1997

Rod,

What do you mean to check the "coolant temperature sensor" but not the "sender"?

thanks, Rick

shorod

On many cars there are two devices in the coolant path, a coolant temperature sensor and a coolant temperature sender. Both devices look nearly identical. The sensor typically provides the temperature data to the Powertrain Control Module (PCM). The sender typically just drives the temp gauge/light on the instrument cluster.

Taurus1997

Rod,
I have done some more tests.
1) check the grounds: the grounds seem very good, I also checked the ground at pin-15 in the CCRM harness and it showed a good ground although it had more resistance at key-on than key-off. (See table below)
2) disconnect the PCM to confirm the fans will come on: I disconnected the PCM and the fans did come on
3) check for power at the red wire at the injectors: the red wire does have 12volts at the injector harness while the engine is cranking but not started.

I also have some more extra information to help solve this situation.
The tach does not move at all during the time the key is turned from "on" to "start" during the no-start time period.
The ECT sensor had 64ohms while the outside temperature was 58degrees. The ECT also checks out fine with my OBD-II scanner (which can display real-time data readings) from engine start-up to proper engine temperature during test driving.

Why/how would a faulty ECT sensor tell a car not to provide spark to the plugs and not to provide electrical pulse to the injectors while the engine is cranking over?

I also tested some of the terminals at the CCRM harness when I had it disconnected from the CCRM with the key-on engine off, and during key-off.

Note: Terminal-13 seemed very suspicious with 0 volts at key-off
Terminal-15 has more resistance at key-on than key-off

Terminal-1 (cooling power low) had 0volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-2 (cooling power low) had 0volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-3 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-4 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-5 I did not test
Terminal-6 (cooling power high) had 0volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-7 (cooling power high) had 0volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-8 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-9 not used
Terminal-10 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-11 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and key-off
Terminal-12 (battery power to PCM) had 7mVolts at key-on and 1mVolts at key-off
Terminal-13 (battery power) had 12volts at key-on and O volts at key-off
Terminal-14 I did not test since I didn’t know what type of signal to check for
Terminal-15 (ground) 60ohms at key-on and 2ohms at key-off
Terminal-16 no pin
Terminal-17 (high speed fan signal from PCM) - 3mVolts at key-on and 0volts at key-off
Terminal-18 did not test
Terminal-19 not used
Terminal-20 not used
Terminal-21 did not test
Terminal-22 did not test
Terminal-23 did not test
Terminal-24 did not test

Overall, I am asking myself what situation would tell a car not to provide spark to the plugs and not to provide electrical pulse to the injectors while the engine is cranking over and the fans are on, BUT once the fans turn off and the engine is allowed to start...this "whatever keeps the engine from starting while the fans are on" never interferes with the engine running at an idle or while driving once it has started (in other words the engine has never QUIT running once it has started)???

thanks, Rick