Techventure

Replaced water pump and timing belt, plugs, wires, dist. cap & rotor on my 1992 V6 , 3zve engine. I lined up the timing marks. The rotor should point to the #1 cyl. & TDC when crankshaft timing mark is checked. Bolting on the distributor cap with the 3 screws lines up the #1 wire location as marked on the cap @ about 1 o'clock and the rotor points just to the left of #2 wire location at 10:45 o'clock as marked on the cap. The rotor doesn't point to any definite wire location. I attached the wires and the engine cranks but doesn't fire. I checked for spark and fuel and both are present. According to everything I've read the rotor should point to the #1 wire location on the dist. cap when the engine is at TDC for cyl. 1. Should I adjust the distributor to line the rotor up with the location of #1 wire as marked on the cap ? If so, how do you adjust the distributor on this engine.

We're walking right now as my little B2200 pick-up has just now lost its brakes. I could really use some help!
Thanks.

augie7071

Sounds like you know what your doin'. to insure that you indeed have the #1 cylinder at TDC carefully run a long rod down the spark plug hole,notice that the timing mark is on TDC? Us a rod long enough that you don't lose it down the cylinder. If not start over with the timming belt

Techventure

Thanks for your reply Augie.

I did what you suggested and the #1 cyl. is at TDC when the timing mark notch on the pulley is lined up with the zero mark on the timing plate. The rotor still points to a location where there isn't any terminal on the dist. cap.

Toysrme

I'll just assume you timed everything correctly by the book. You simply used the wrong cam alignment & the right distributor alignment.

Doesn't matter which TDC the cams are at on the 3vz-fe as long as the distributor is on the opposite stroke.


Pull your distributor off, spin the rotor 180*, bolt it back in - problem solved, Set your base timing to 10*btdc, or see the FAQ where I say lean the AFM a few clicks & set the timing to 17*btdc for a little better throttle transision & more mid-high rpm punch.






If it runs really funny when you do it, you've fudged cam, and distrubor timing. Take everything off & start again.

__________________
Toysrme257th - AIM about anything, anytime; including v6 turbos.
World's second ES 300/3vz-fe Turbo.

Techventure

Toysrme...Thanks for your input.

I admit to being confused.
I'm going to do the 180* change but I don't understand what is meant by using the wrong cam alignment and the right distributor alignment.

When I turn the distributor 180* do you use the same numbers on the cap for the wires ? e.g. #1 terminal is now at 6 o'clock or do I put the #1 cyl. wire into the #5 marked terminal on the cap which would be located where the #1 terminal should be as shown on the diagram in the manual ?

You say I may have to take everything off and start again. Do you mean right back at reinstalling the timing belt ? If I have to do this what do you do different ?

Thanks.

augie7071

I would take Timming belt off,insure cam marks are at the top,crank pully at TDC mark, reinstale belt & double check marks. sounds to me like the cam marks are off. its easy to slip a notch during instilation. I know what a bear it is with no room to see much less manuver. Bill

Toysrme

No... What I'm telling you is the printed directions don't work.

Forget everything about the pistons. It doesn't matter if it's on itnake, or exhaust top dead center. The reaosn is because the bottom end of the VZ blocks do not have any sensors to confuse. Those are located in the distributor (Cam & crank angle sensors i.e. NE & G1 G2 G-). The Computer cares what the distributor says.


If you don't understand that, just forget it. The bottom end needs to say 0* & that's it.






Printed directions tell you to set the cams at the sets of 2 alignment dots & then set the distributor alignment marks together.

That is 100% incorrect. You will have spark at exactly the opposite time that you want it.





You need to do either of the the things I'm telling you & it DOES NOT matter which one you do (Cause like I told you first, the computer doesn't care what the bottom end says, only the distributor).



1) Take everything off & do it 100% correctly. Align the cams by the SINGLE alignment dots & align the distributor dots.


OR
2) Simply take the distributor off, turn the rotor 180* & reinstall it.

It doesn't make a shit to the computer, it's the same end result either way.

















Take the distributor off, turn the rotor 180* & reinstall it. it'll fire right up. Then put a timing light on it. Correct timing when you're in diagnostic mode is 10*btdc. If you want a little more performance read the FAQ where I talked about it.

__________________
Toysrme257th - AIM about anything, anytime; including v6 turbos.
World's second ES 300/3vz-fe Turbo.

Toysrme

You need to understand... The instructions can't be taken literally when it comes to alignment.


You can either align the cams to the pair of dots & have the distributor rotor 180* off, or you can align the cams to the single dots & align the distributor like the manuals tell you.



You can't do both, or else you get spark in the opposite time you want it. (180* of crankshaft rotation off)

__________________
Toysrme257th - AIM about anything, anytime; including v6 turbos.
World's second ES 300/3vz-fe Turbo.

Techventure

I took the distributor out and rotated the rotor 180* but I could not reinstall the distributor. Rotated back and the distributor would go back in. How do you rotate the rotor 180* and reinsert. It seems there is a difference. What do i do now ?

Thanks.

Techventure

I haven't heard back from Toysrme regarding turning the distributor 180* and reinserting it. He probably has not seen my reply or an email I sent.
I have the distributor out and would like to put it in as Toysrme has instructed. As you see above it won't go back with the rotor turned 180*.

Has anyone else out there performed this operation?
I have been trying to get this car back to operation for a quite awhile !!!!

Your help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Techventure

I sent an email to Toysrme. In addition the info. should be available for everyone.

I tried to rotate my distributor 180* and the tabs on the end of the rotor that fit into the end of the camshaft are NOT interchangable on my engine.

I have a 3ve on a 1992 camry. If they are interchangeable on all other engines of this model I have one that is unique. There is an offset of 2 mm from one side to the other lined up on the centreline on the tabs.

Can anyone tell me if the small oin is removeable from each side that holds the tab piece ? If it can be remove the tab can be reversed and then the rotor can be rotated 180* to set up the timing.

Has anyone else ran into this ?

Brian R.

I don't understand the issue Toysrme is bringing up with the reversed distributor, since I don't have the instructions he is referring to in front of me.

To get this straightened out, I suggest you go back in and remove the timing belt (or at least remove the tension on the belt so that you can change the cam timing). Set the #1 piston at TDC and rotate the cams to line up the timing marks, as written in the manual.

At this point (with clockwise rotation as facing the front of the engine) both the exhaust and intake valves for #1 cylinder should be closed and the intake cam lobe having just allowed the valves to close (at ~270 deg of rotation from cam lobe opposite valve lifter, since it closed ~180 degrees of crank rotation prior to TDC on compression stroke) and the exhaust cam lobe should be somewhere around 90 degrees of rotation (since it will open the exhaust valve somewhere around 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation from TDC on ignition stroke).

When the distributor is installed, the rotor should be around the firing position for #1 cylinder.

The above approximation should give you some confidence in the correct timing marks on the cam sprockets. Some engines have more than one type of mark on the valve sprockets or head and this can be confusing.

Then install the timing belt to align the timing marks approximated by the above guestimation. Recheck the valve timing at #1 TDC compression stroke after you have rotated the crank two revolutions with tension on the belt. Recheck the distributor rotor alignment.

Be consistent about which timing marks you use on both banks.

If after all this, the timing marks line up and your distributor rotor is way off of firing #1 plug, there are only two possibilities I can think of. One is you are still using the wrong timing marks or you are not installing the distributor cap in the correct orientation.

There are timing belt installation instructions at:
http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiBr...3d8013e607.jsp

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Toysrme

^
3vz-fe.

Keep trying. Like Brain said, if it comes down to it, strip the whole thing apart & start with #1 pistons @ tdc & re-align the cams.

__________________
Toysrme257th - AIM about anything, anytime; including v6 turbos.
World's second ES 300/3vz-fe Turbo.

Techventure

I stripped everything down and started over.

Lined the crankshaft pulley notch with 0* on the cover.
Put the belt on took it up to the Left Hand cam sprocket, lined the sprocket up to the mark as described and had a bit of tension on the belt between the LH cam sprocket and crankshaft.

Looked at Left Hand cam sprocket and found 2 sets of marks. The one I used was marked "E3" on the sprocket. Put the belt on with tensioner. Looked at rotor and it was pointing to the #1 terminal on the cap. Rotated the crankshaft the 720* and all the marks lined up including the rotor. Put everything back together ( the right side motor mount cast bracket is really tough to put in....finally left one bolt out.... lower bottom right )

Took the IAC valve off and cleaned it. Turned the ignition and it fired up. Finally success.

One small problem to solve.. The idle speed is high....over 2000 revs and as it warms.... idle drops down to normal then kicks back up and keeps doing this.

Thanks Toyserme and Brian for your help. It's much appreciated.

Brian R.

You're welcome. For the high idle, check your ECT sensor and it's circuit.

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