Warning about K&N

leadfootGTP · 08-24-2005, 08:21 PM

Just spent 300 on a shorted out MAF sensor, happened because i used a K&N drop in air filter and the oil shorted it out, i know someone poseted something about this earlier, but they said it usualy happened when people recoated their filters after cleaning them, but i installed my straight out of the box. Many people use thses filters without problems, but just a warning to anyone considering one of these, just know that it could happen.

Tonyr · 08-24-2005, 10:44 PM

Very sorry to hear that. I just put one in my 98 GTP and my 2000 Grand Am. Hopefully that doesn't happen...but wiht my luck both cars' sensors will go.

BLU CIVIC · 08-24-2005, 10:48 PM

well i guess you fall into that small precentile that companies make mention of...i'd try to contact them or their rep and see if you can get reimbursed for the price of the MAF sensor if you haven't already

regalfriend · 08-24-2005, 10:54 PM

im sorry to hear that about the K&N filter...soon i will be looking into a new air filter...ive heard alot of conflicting info on this....CAI will work but i was told, there was a unit inside that need to be relocated...one person stated, in this forum, that he didnt relocate it, but just let it sit on fenderwall or on the wheel well cover....ive also heard mixed things on the K&N, that when treated w/ the oil that it blows the MAF sensor....any real input would be appreciated...also can anyone tell me why the MAF sensor is expensive to relace....$300? ..is the part alot of money?....it looks like an easy job from the location

leadfootGTP · 08-25-2005, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regalfriend

im sorry to hear that about the K&N filter...soon i will be looking into a new air filter...ive heard alot of conflicting info on this....CAI will work but i was told, there was a unit inside that need to be relocated...one person stated, in this forum, that he didnt relocate it, but just let it sit on fenderwall or on the wheel well cover....ive also heard mixed things on the K&N, that when treated w/ the oil that it blows the MAF sensor....any real input would be appreciated...also can anyone tell me why the MAF sensor is expensive to relace....$300? ..is the part alot of money?....it looks like an easy job from the location

Thanks for all of the kind replies!

Generally speaking, most people only have the problem when they coat the filter with oil improperly (ie soaking it/ applying it heavily) most people do not have problems when they lightly brush it on, as they are supposed to. Installation of the MAF sensor is fairly simple, it is the part, its self that adds a lot to the price, it was actualy a bit over 300, but there was also some cleaning which had to be done, as the oil had to be removed, and since i didnt know what the problem was at first, they spent time looking for the problem

phaelax · 08-25-2005, 03:05 AM

I use the filter in my '00 GP. Oiled it about 2 months ago, haven't had any problems. I also left the filter sitting for a couple hours before putting it back in, so any excess oil it had probably would've drained out by then.

GMMerlin · 08-25-2005, 06:55 AM

Let me add something to think about here in regards to oil bath air filters.

The oil residue from the filter could enter the MAF sensor and cause some driveability concerns.
Now here is a point to ponder...if your vehicle is under factory warranty and you have a MAF concern caused by your choice of air filter (oil on MAF sensor) then the cost of the repair will not be covered under warranty because the failed part (MAF sensor) did not fail because of a factory defect but because of a componant (oil bath filter) YOU installed on the vehicle.

Me personally, I run an oil bath air filter on my engines with carbs, but I will not run one on my engines with MAF sensors..

BNaylor · 08-25-2005, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regalfriend

im sorry to hear that about the K&N filter...soon i will be looking into a new air filter...ive heard alot of conflicting info on this....CAI will work but i was told, there was a unit inside that need to be relocated...one person stated, in this forum, that he didnt relocate it, but just let it sit on fenderwall or on the wheel well cover....ive also heard mixed things on the K&N, that when treated w/ the oil that it blows the MAF sensor....any real input would be appreciated...also can anyone tell me why the MAF sensor is expensive to relace....$300? ..is the part alot of money?....it looks like an easy job from the location

Regalfirend, I have a K&N drop in filter in my Regal GS and no problems so far. Here's some info that may help:

There are 2 recharge/maintenance kits available. I use the aerosol spray oil.

K&N Part # 99-5000 with the aerosol oil spray and filter cleaner

K&N Part # 99-5050 with squeeze bottle of oil and filter cleaner

Both cost around $10.00. However, do not use the one with the squeeze bottle oil. Its a mess and will most likely cause a MAF sensor problem due to improper oil application. Also it doesn't hurt to clean the MAF sensor with electronics cleaner say like every 3 months as a preventive measure and the ducting/air box.

On the CAI issue, they were probably referring to the PCM module. If you get a Thrasher or some other brands it has a place to mount and secure it. You are limited on PCM relocation due to the wiring harness. And since you you have a '97 Regal GS, you will need to remount the coolant recovery bottle to the passenger side strut tower. You will need a bottle off a '99 and up.

The MAF sensor can be expensive depending on where you purchase. Even Autozone carries them but they are re-manufactured not new. I got one for my wife's Regal LS at a salvage yard for $40.00 when we had MAF sensor problems on it. BTW - It failed due to a defect not because of filter oil. We only use a Fram dry air filter in it.

Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

leadfootGTP · 08-26-2005, 12:41 PM

Any suggestions for the new filter? I just have a disposable one in right now...i might just go for an aftermarket CAI, does the thrasher/ msp come with an oil bath filter?

BNaylor · 08-26-2005, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leadfootGTP

Any suggestions for the new filter? I just have a disposable one in right now...i might just go for an aftermarket CAI, does the thrasher/ msp come with an oil bath filter?

Glad you got her going.

Both the Thrasher and MSP CAIs come with a K&N style 9 inch cone filter. Meaning its washable & reusable just like a brand name K&N. Yes, they are the oil type. However, they are not made by K&N. Its made by a company called S&B. They are classified as hi-flow. Thrasher offers two types of S&B filters when you order one, the "Absolute" and the "Powerstack" (optional). Good luck in your decision.

Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

leadfootGTP · 08-26-2005, 03:31 PM

if i didnt get an aftermarket cai, could i clean the k&n filter and put it back in without oil, or would this cause problems?

BNaylor · 08-26-2005, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leadfootGTP

if i didnt get an aftermarket cai, could i clean the k&n filter and put it back in without oil, or would this cause problems?

Thats a very good question. However, there is a warning not to use these type filters unoiled. The filtering efficiency will degrade.

Here's a link to K&N's web site FAQS. Just about every question asked about the filter has been answered.

http://www.knfilters.com/faq.htm#26

In my area we get too much fine dust from the environment so oiling is a necessity. I'd recommend using your drop-in K&N. Clean it first and then apply a thin coat of the aerosol oil and let dry for one hour. I posted the K&N part numbers earlier. About every 3 months perform an inspection of the MAF sensor and rubber ducting going to the throttle body just to make sure. Clean, if necessary.

Hope the info helps and good luck!

Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

axle182 · 08-26-2005, 06:32 PM

Sorry for the newbie post, but to clean the MAF sensor, can u give a quick run down on how? I can get some electrical cleaner, and attempt to clean it this weekend. Fixing the MAF is one of the possile solutions ive heard to my problem with my 98 gt.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=315659

BNaylor · 08-26-2005, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by axle182

Sorry for the newbie post, but to clean the MAF sensor, can u give a quick run down on how? I can get some electrical cleaner, and attempt to clean it this weekend. Fixing the MAF is one of the possile solutions ive heard to my problem with my 98 gt.
http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbul...d.php?t=315659

Here's a pic of the spare MAF sensor for my GTP. You clean only the botton half (pen pointing to it) after it is removed from the throttle body. Only two Torx safety screws hold it on. Use electrical or electronics spray cleaner and let dry. The botttom half detects air flow via hot wire elements (like a thermal resistor) to control fuel injector pulse width. Before re-installing, its a good idea to coat the metal bottom part where it mates to the throttle body with dielectric silicone grease sparingly. The top half is the sealed module which contains electronics components.

Thrasher CAI, DHP v1.0 PCM, SLP Headers,
3.25 SC pulley, CAIT GMAF, 2.5 DP/Hi-Flow CAT,
u-bend delete, 160 TS, ZZP Stage 1 72mm TB,
TB spacer, MSD 8.5mm wires, Autolite 103,
Goodyear Gatorback Serp. & SC Belt,
Nitto NT555R Drag Radials
1/4 ET: 13.210 sec. @ 104.490 mph
0 - 60 ft: 1.945 sec.

richtazz · 08-27-2005, 09:43 PM

remember, that with any oil/cloth filter, only oil the side exposed to the incoming air, and like Bnaylor said, use the Aerosol oil, less waste, and more even coverage. Even though its against our Y chromosome, read the instructions first, or make sure you have an extra 3 bills for what your going to ruin by not doing so.

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