oil pan cooling

johnny2quick · 01-28-2005, 09:25 AM

as i'm [still] designing an oil pan for the '00+ celicas, i had a revelation...
the old aircooled VWs have finned blocks to increase engine cooling. why not try that on an oil pan? that's easy and not too expensive. then a guy told me about a guy that ran a coolant line inside the oil pan, using the coolant to cool the oil. it's not so much for the regular ol' daily driver, but more for the autocrossers and turbo guys. has anyone ever heard of doing this or have any ideas on how to have a metal coolant line AND baffles in the pan? thanks

383PhoenixAm · 01-28-2005, 09:31 AM

I don't see a reason to keep fins off of it if you really want em. It seems logical..As for the coolant lines..after the coolant warms up its probably not going to do much, and running it through the oil may just warm the coolant.

curtis73 · 01-28-2005, 01:20 PM

I agree. Oil is typically only a few degrees hotter than coolant. I would help to warm up the oil faster and them stabilize its temperature as a reliability thing, but probably not too much benefit for racing.

I have seen pans with tubes that run right through them. They are typically for transmissions, but if you can clear the pickup they'd work well on oil pans too.

Here's one from Derale for a 700R4

johnny2quick · 01-29-2005, 11:12 AM

cool. that tells me what i need to know about the coolant lines. what about the fins. do you guys think they should be molded onto the bottom or should i have the bottom of the pan contoured?

MagicRat · 01-29-2005, 01:29 PM

Good posts. I was thinking of the same cooling holes, for airflow as in curtis' transmission pan.
As posted earlier, coolant to oil would be mostly useless.
Are you making the pan out of steel or aluminum?
Aluminum is a much better heat conductor and is a better material, although fabrication and manufacturing is a bit more difficult.

johnny2quick · 01-29-2005, 01:44 PM

the pan will be made from aluminum. i think that the air holes will hike the price of the pan too much. probably the same with the coolant lines, but i'm just seeing what options there are. i do like the air holes though...

curtis73 · 01-29-2005, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnny2quick

cool. that tells me what i need to know about the coolant lines. what about the fins. do you guys think they should be molded onto the bottom or should i have the bottom of the pan contoured?

If you just add fins, you are increasing the surface area of the pan to the air. If you contour the pan, you are increasing both the surface area to the air, but also to the oil. But, fins create greater surface area than contours do.

Thicker material transfers heat better than thinner. I know it sounds backwards, but it has to do with a physical characteristic in chemistry known as specific heat capacity. Most metals have a greater SHC compared to their masses so they transfer heat better when thicker. The opposite is true of things we would consider insulators like plastic and glass.

My point in saying that is this. If you use thin enough aluminum to contour it, you're negating that SHC property. You could therfore maybe incorporate the two; use a thick base and increase the oil's surface area by machining contours in to the inside. Then you could TIG weld fins on the outside. Or for that matter, use a medium thickness plate and weld fins both inside and out.

Another thought that may trip your trigger. You could use the tube idea, but weld or braze them on the outside of the pan instead of running them through the oil. The aluminum in the tubes would act like fins wicking away heat, but the tubular construction would dramatically increase surface area to the air.

johnny2quick · 01-30-2005, 05:43 PM

you're a pretty fart smeller, curtis. thanks for telling me everything i need to know about this.

now i don't have to go bother the guys on the vw forums. i'll be adding fins on the outside, this will get the job done and won't bother my baffle design any. thanks!

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