Infinity declares...

[boingo82]

I still don't get the point of this thread. Infiniti can make a muscle car if they want, and Chevy can make an econobox if they want, even though traditionally, "Domestics" make the muscle cars and "imports" make the econoboxes.
And yes, making a car faster usually uses more gas. Again, what's your point?

[focusfreak]

well, It doesn't matter now because Infiniti might be discontinuing the production of the M45 (yes I know I got the G35 and the M45 mixed up) but it's definitely the M45 which has gotten low sales. I saw it in one of the import magazines, I think it was Super Street or SCC

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

well, It doesn't matter now because Infiniti might be discontinuing the production of the M45 (yes I know I got the G35 and the M45 mixed up) but it's definitely the M45 which has gotten low sales. I saw it in one of the import magazines, I think it was Super Street or SCC

Which just goes to show that you don't know WTH you're talking about...The current M45 is actually not a new car. It has been around for several years before it came here, in Japan. It was sold in Japan as a Nissan Cedric or a Nissan Gloria. They brought this car over to North America half way through its product life, expecting for a new version to come sometime soon.....after a 3 year run they are REDESIGNING the M45....YES it has gotten low sales, but they are not discontinuing the model line...

http://cars.ign.com/articles/504/504930p1.html
http://www.auto-report.net/index.html?m45_concept.html

[BhramaBull01]

doesnt matter focusfreak

european enginnering > asian engineering > american engineering

[focusfreak]

ok, thanks for clearing up the redesign/halt on the production of it, I couldn't remember which it was boingo82. BhramaBull01, if you put that down as the order in which each comes in then ok, I agree that european engineering is first, but then when you compare american to asian, which cars are you comparing, and are you just referring to the japanese or other asian manufacturers?

[focusfreak]

plus this thread was mainly about Infiniti trying to nose its way in on a title the american car market has made and kept for as long as the era had started, I will take it as a compliment somewhat, but I, as a automobile lover, see it as a mislabeling by putting a title on a car which could never live up to a title that has been held by such great cars as the Dodge Charger, Ford Mustang, Chevy Camaro, along with other great american muscle cars. I appreciate you all educating me on the car though, I love learning new things about cars, and theres always something to learn.

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

plus this thread was mainly about Infiniti trying to nose its way in on a title the american car market has made and kept for as long as the era had started, I will take it as a compliment somewhat, but I, as a automobile lover, see it as a mislabeling by putting a title on a car which could never live up to a title that has been held by such great cars as the Dodge Charger, Ford Mustang, Chevy Camaro, along with other great american muscle cars. I appreciate you all educating me on the car though, I love learning new things about cars, and theres always something to learn.

Mustang? How is a Ford Falcon (Ford's low-end cheapo car) w/ new sheet metal and faux "speed holes" a muscle car? At least the Mustang has stayed true to its "pretend air intake" roots over the years. :sigh:

The Japanese have had a corner on the "econobox" market, after all they are the ones who INVENTED the econobox, but you don't see me bitching about Chevy trying to nose its way in with the Aveo.

Are you suggesting that each company should never try to make anything different from the products they originally made? That's kinda stupid. Competition and innovation are what drive our economy. Thanks to the Japanese "nosing in", the domestics will have greater incentive to improve their cars.

[focusfreak]

this is true boingo82, competition does bring out better ideas for companies, all i'm saying is that the title rightfully belongs to america, thats all. and by the way, infiniti is discontinuing the M45 and in its place is another M series model. check it out in the latest issue of import tuner, the article is towards the beginning. just goes to show i do know what the hell im talking about. plus, i never mentioned the falcon, just the mustang when it came to fords.

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

this is true boingo82, competition does bring out better ideas for companies, all i'm saying is that the title rightfully belongs to america, thats all.

Why? They didn't trademark it. The US is making econoboxes now, why can't the imports make muscle cars? And how do you even define domestic any more? Nissan is designing and building their cars here now, and Ford, Dodge, GMC are outsourcing to Canada and Mexico. I mean, COME ON, the Camaro is assembled in Canada! So is the Dodge Magnum! The Chrysler Crossfire (do you count that as a muscle car?) is assembled in GERMANY! Ford, GMC, Chrysler, Nissan, Honda, and Toyota are all global companies now, so your argument is moot.

Originally Posted by focusfreak

and by the way, infiniti is discontinuing the M45 and in its place is another M series model.

Huh, really, 'cause I already mentioned that a few posts up. Yes it will (supposedly) also be available with a 3.5 liter VQ, and be called the M35, but it will also be available with the 4.5 liter V8 and called the M45. A redesign, exactly like I stated.

Originally Posted by focusfreak

just goes to show i do know what the hell im talking about.

Right, you know the stuff I mentioned 2 weeks ago.

plus, i never mentioned the falcon, just the mustang when it came to fords.

The Mustang is based on the Falcon.

[aas5]

Originally Posted by aznxthuggie

well the japanese dont need muscle cars, think about where all your gas is going if you get a muscle car? my friends uncle has an old z28 camaro (i think) and he gets like 6mpg WOW man ur guna get places with that thing, if japan was the size of the US then their cars would own already, but theri whoel friggin country is just a little bigger then ca

I think you are missing the point. Stating that only an american car can be a muscle car doesn't really give you much credit these days, may be 10 years ago this would fly. Have you tried looking at M5, either the new one just produced or the 2000 model - dude, it will blow off the doors of most of your american muscle cars in no time. Instead of making nonsense statements like you did, why don't you come back to reality and start treating cars not on their origin but by their power - you will be pleasantly surprised.

[focusfreak]

aas5, I do notice all cars. And yes, the M5 is one of the best cars ever produced from europe. But no, it will not smoke most AMERICAN muscle cars, at least in the 1/4 mile. put it against a '70 charger like in fast and furious, and it will get blown, but up against most stock muscle cars (like a '65 mustang) and it will win. I believe the definition of a muscle car (a true one) is a loud, unrefined vehicle that sounds like a monster on the road, not a quiet refined car like the M45 or M5. And boingo82, the mustang at least in 1965, was NOT based on the falcon. I don't know where you got that idea, but its wrong as far as I know. Also, the M45 is being discontinued, that means NOT COMING BACK. the M45 title will not be seen. It will have a new name and design like you said, but not "M45".

[boingo82]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

...And boingo82, the mustang at least in 1965, was NOT based on the falcon. I don't know where you got that idea, but its wrong as far as I know. Also, the M45 is being discontinued, that means NOT COMING BACK. the M45 title will not be seen. It will have a new name and design like you said, but not "M45".

Popular Hotrodding said.....
In its earliest incarnations, the Mustang was actually a re-skinned Falcon, and utilized a great deal of the former econo-box's platform.

http://www.popularhotrodding.com/fea...405phr_shelby/





From NissanNews.com, who obviously knows what the hell they're talking about since it is Nissan's OFFICIAL PRESS RELEASE SITE,

The Infiniti M45 Concept vehicle not only gives a look at the next generation M45 sedan,

Spoken by the Vice President and General Manager of Nissan's Infiniti division

"most of which will appear in the new 2006 M45, which is scheduled to arrive in spring 2005."

From Automobile Magazine

The production version of the 2006 M45,

Here is where you are getting confused, also from Automobile mag:

Power will come from either a 4.5-liter V-8 producing an estimated 340 horsepower, for the M45, or the familiar 3.5-liter V-6 in the M35.

Funny you claim to get your info from an actual magazine article, but can't provide a link, a direct quote, or the same info substantiated elsewhere.

[carrrnuttt]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

put it against a '70 charger like in fast and furious, and it will get blown.

Well, yeah...a blown, and worked drag car...duh.

http://www.autofacts.ca/classics/fast.htm

You might wanna check where the Charger stacks up on that list. Besides the ungodly Ramcharger, all the other "Charger" badged Mopars on that list fall WAY below the M5, and in fact, below the inline-6 powered M3.

As a matter of fact they have a 4-banger, soda-bottle-displacement-having, S2000 quite a few rungs above the exact year and model you are speaking of (1970 Dodge Charger R/T).

I bet, "Focus fan" that you are, you didn't know that the quickest production Ford EVER is not only a 4-banger, but was never sold in the US (1985 Ford RS 200 EVO), as it would have destroyed the image Ford was trying to build for the Mustang. This is still true to date, even with the production of the Terminator ('03-'04 Cobra).

Here's some actual time-slips from an RS200 EVO: http://www.preromanbritain.com/gwem/...0/performa.htm

0-60 mph: 3.06 secs
0-100 mph: 7.16 secs
1/4 mile: 10.8 secs @ 128 mph.

Also, with the right gearing (they were designed to have "rally gears", and "street gears"), they top-out past 205 mph.

Although that blurb may say "tuned" to 600HP, that car is completely stock, and that's the factory tune they are talking about: http://www.europeancarweb.com/features/0309ec_fords/

If that's not "muscle" I don't know what is.

I think you are confusing actual "muscle" with the perception of what "muscle" is (or supposed to be)...otherwise called "classic muscle".

Lastly, I probably shouldn't mention the outcome of my race against my friend's Dodge Charger (non-R/T, stock), against my old car (1990 Acura Integra, tuned b16, all-motor). I beat him by a little over a car. He ran that car a month earlier to consistent 15.1's, with one 15.0 at the track.

Quit trying to drive image and perception, and see each car objectively, and your view of the world changes.

Basically, quit being a narrow-minded, automotive ass.

[tazdev]

What a dumbass.



that is all

[taranaki]

Originally Posted by focusfreak

Is it just me, or is Infinity stupid?

It's just you.

You are getting all wound up about someone who defines 'muscle car' differently to you.Pretty much every auto building nation has cars that have the characteristics of a muscle car,it's not an 'American' thing....but then neither is a ford focus,really.