The Nissan MID-4 Prototype

[twiceasfastasyou]

Recently, one of my fellow pupils accompanying me in CCNA2 class, knowing that I really enjoyed finding out information about Nissan's Z sportscar lineup, told me about a certain vehicle known as the MID-4 prototype. Has anyone seen one in person, or know how many have been produced and owned, since I have only heard that this particular vehicle is exceptionally difficult to find...

Just thought I'd ask, it is 12:20 AM and I have school in the morning, wanted to get a good conversation going with some Z enthusiasts!

P.S. - If you know of a good way to persuade one's mother into allowing myself to obtain the title for my 1997 Dodge Avenger ES and trading it in for a 1988 Z31 300ZX, I'm all ears. She believes Z's are total crap, and are too old for their own good, and she's asian!

[k3smostwanted]

Originally Posted by twiceasfastasyou

Recently, one of my fellow pupils accompanying me in CCNA2 class, knowing that I really enjoyed finding out information about Nissan's Z sportscar lineup, told me about a certain vehicle known as the MID-4 prototype. Has anyone seen one in person, or know how many have been produced and owned, since I have only heard that this particular vehicle is exceptionally difficult to find...

Just thought I'd ask, it is 12:20 AM and I have school in the morning, wanted to get a good conversation going with some Z enthusiasts!

P.S. - If you know of a good way to persuade one's mother into allowing myself to obtain the title for my 1997 Dodge Avenger ES and trading it in for a 1988 Z31 300ZX, I'm all ears. She believes Z's are total crap, and are too old for their own good, and she's asian!

1st is 1st...the Mid4 prototype is exactly what the title says it is...a prototype. it was never made or owned or purchased by anybody therefore you will never see one on the road. if your lucky there is 1 in a Nissan museum somewhere in Japan but even at that, i doubt it. what you'relooking at eventually turned into the Z32 300zxTwin Turbo. they started to design it to be AWD and sport 300+bhp with a mid-engine set-up only a couple years after already making the Z31 available in 1985. after several years of development they realized this would be too expensive and impractical to badge as a Nissan and put very high sticker price on it. so they returned to the somewhat norm and engineered a V6 TT to put in the front of a RWD chassis sporting HICAS and 300hp with every option available at the time plus more, this is known as the Z32 and if you look between the prototype and Z32, you can see some of the same body structure and ideas went into both cars.

i have a book that discusses this particular car for a couple of pages. if you search around my post history i posted pictures of it long ago on this forum straight from the book i own.

let me do some hunting either for the book or the thread i made a long time ago with scanned pages from the book.

[Hodo]

ahh.... MID-4.... I oddly enough didnt like the MID4 but I do love the Z32.... Its the subtle differences that drive me crazy about the MID4. And I am sorry but now its time for me to be a pain in the back. But how much do you know about cars, you seem like a good enough young man. But the Z car is not known to be the most maintaince friendly car. They take alot of time, and in some cases alot of money. I love my Z to death, and its a handful for me a ASE certified technician to keep up on. Although its alot easier now that I work for Nissan. :P

But if you are set on getting a Z a NA Z31 is a good start for you. Its a great learning platform, its just powerful enough so you can have fun, but not so powerful it will get you killed. Its cheaper than a Z32 on alot of levels and its still a Z. Hell I have been looking for a decent Z31 to have a daily driver. But whenever I have money I cant find one, and when I dont have money there are dozens of them.

[DeleriousZ]

i'd go with the z31 turbo to start... in stock form they've got some pep, but once you get to know the z's and rwd... you can bump up the performance without much fuss... get her 0-60 down to sub 6sec for under 1k...

[twiceasfastasyou]

i originally wanted to go with the Z32, but i grew fonder towards the Z31, its overall looks, its comparison to so many other cars back in the day. I'm not even kidding you, car manufacturers just don't make cars like they used to. The 1970's to mid 1990's was THE age of cars, it was when I personally think manufacturers made some of the hottest, craziest cars. Now, being 2006, we have the typical SUV/Van era. I can't stress enough how I'm not impressed on Ford's Mustang series, especially the 90's style, very nasty in my opinion, as well as Chevy's late 90's camaro. I tell everyone how I am always dying to see a nice Z31, Supra Mk III, Z32, 3000GT VR-4, Challenger R/T Super Bee, Nova SS, Corolla GT-S, RX-7, 240SX S13, Datsun 240/280ZX, etc., and everyone that knows anything about cars at my school always remarks,"Why don't you just get a mustang/camaro/firebird formula?" Because I really believe that those cars are made to the aspect of any Cavalier, Civic, or other economy car driving around. Everyone has one, and everyone says theyre the better than my 'ricer' choices. Sure, mustangs, camaros, firebirds, daytonas, galaxies, all have great power, but I really look at the style of the car, the quality all-around. People say the camaro Z28 has what I'm looking for, I personally hate the look and the layout of the camaro Z28. Then, I get 10 or more people from Best Buy coming up to me, telling me when I get a Z31, they "would totally waste my Z" with their Firebird Formula's, with the perpetually ridiculous "Ram Air Technology" - Jesus, Pontiac makes me sick when I hear people adding an extra $1000 to get a custom Ram Air intake installed, when I truly believe the intracicies of a Ram Air intake don't really have any effect on N/A performance. I'm more for imports, but there were some great cars made by domestics of USA. But, sorry to say...

Nissan forever.

... and i HATE dsm's. i HATE them.

*whew, just relieved some stuff about cocky domestic owners I kept talking to at DMACC, my high school, work, meeting other new people at various other places, thank you

[mwolvin]

If I remember correctly, the ram air option added 10 HP. Not very good bang for the buck, if you ask me. Still, 315HP from the factory wasn't too shabby.

Still would rather have a Z though.

[k3smostwanted]

Originally Posted by twiceasfastasyou

i originally wanted to go with the Z32, but i grew fonder towards the Z31, its overall looks, its comparison to so many other cars back in the day. I'm not even kidding you, car manufacturers just don't make cars like they used to. The 1970's to mid 1990's was THE age of cars, it was when I personally think manufacturers made some of the hottest, craziest cars. Now, being 2006, we have the typical SUV/Van era. I can't stress enough how I'm not impressed on Ford's Mustang series, especially the 90's style, very nasty in my opinion, as well as Chevy's late 90's camaro. I tell everyone how I am always dying to see a nice Z31, Supra Mk III, Z32, 3000GT VR-4, Challenger R/T Super Bee, Nova SS, Corolla GT-S, RX-7, 240SX S13, Datsun 240/280ZX, etc., and everyone that knows anything about cars at my school always remarks,"Why don't you just get a mustang/camaro/firebird formula?" Because I really believe that those cars are made to the aspect of any Cavalier, Civic, or other economy car driving around. Everyone has one, and everyone says theyre the better than my 'ricer' choices. Sure, mustangs, camaros, firebirds, daytonas, galaxies, all have great power, but I really look at the style of the car, the quality all-around. People say the camaro Z28 has what I'm looking for, I personally hate the look and the layout of the camaro Z28. Then, I get 10 or more people from Best Buy coming up to me, telling me when I get a Z31, they "would totally waste my Z" with their Firebird Formula's, with the perpetually ridiculous "Ram Air Technology" - Jesus, Pontiac makes me sick when I hear people adding an extra $1000 to get a custom Ram Air intake installed, when I truly believe the intracicies of a Ram Air intake don't really have any effect on N/A performance. I'm more for imports, but there were some great cars made by domestics of USA. But, sorry to say...

Nissan forever.

... and i HATE dsm's. i HATE them.

*whew, just relieved some stuff about cocky domestic owners I kept talking to at DMACC, my high school, work, meeting other new people at various other places, thank you

thats easy to solve...just get a Z32 or MKIV supra or VR4 or Z31 and modify the living hell out of it. and totally destroy those formulas and mustangs. if my goal was to prove a point with a car i would personally try and find a supra or get a Z32 and swap in a RB26 or 2JZ and start from there. 800rwhp on pump should be able to take about any domestic car you are gonna come across. just make sure the car isnt set up for peak HP and make sure it makes big power and has a nice power curve and any of those imports will destroy your typical cobra or SS. most that have modified domestics are pushing no more than 500rwhp and they dont know how to drive.

[twiceasfastasyou]

Originally Posted by mwolvin

If I remember correctly, the ram air option added 10 HP. Not very good bang for the buck, if you ask me. Still, 315HP from the factory wasn't too shabby.

Still would rather have a Z though.

I believe that's 10HP to the crank, which translates to almost nothing to the wheels. Ram air has no effect until your going about 100+ mph, and that point, the hose connecting to the air filter from the outside air is limited by the air filter, and the intake vacuum, it would make a difference if there was no air filter, and that the air was really being crammed into the intake manifold, but even at 100MPH, it isnt near as much as forced induction, so in reality, the beauty of a turbocharger is the real RAM AIR. the ram air intakes i see on so many civics and cavaliers at my school are sad. people are drilling massive holes in their bumpers, cutting slits in their hoods, its ridiculous. that kind of money could go to a nice T3/T4 or a T04E, and then eventually the whole setup.

And yes, I would still rather have a Z, than a formula or camaro.

[ExTrEmEDrIfT]

found some info on the mid-4




The Nissan MID4 Prototypes
Contributed By: Jos� Mar�a Alonso Garc�a, in Valladolid, Spain.

The Purpose of this page is to share the informaton that I have gathered related to the Design Prototypes known as the MID4s. This design exercise contributed to the evolution of the Z Car in general and directly to the development of the 1990 Z32 - 300ZX. The MID4 and the MID4-II which followed it, should both be viewed as a styling exercise and a working prototype, used to test various technological advancements for Nissan in general, as well as the Z Car line.

Created 06 Feb.99, last update 15Dec01....cjb

The NISSAN MID 4 was first unveiled in the Frankfurt Auto Show , September 1985.

The MID 4 was intended to show the world what Nissan could do with their technologies focused on the development of advanced automotive designs.



The first car, (because at least two were manufactured) was a pearl white, left-hand drive model - pictured above. The second car produced - pictured below was red. The car was mid-rear engined, and had the 3 liter , V-6 (VG30)engine of the Z31 - Fairlady Z/300ZX , except with four cams , 24 valves and a power of 230hp @6000r.p.m. This evolution was later introduced in the domestic (Japan) `86 Fairlady 300ZR , producing a quite good performer .




But that wasn't the most impressive thing. The car was four-wheel-drive, dividing the power transmitted 33% to the front and 67% to the rear, with the aim to achieve good balance and road behavior at speed. This system was the first development of the following ATESSA - Nissan's 4WD system, adopted later for production models such as the Skyline, the Bluebird, the Cefiro, and some others.

The first MID 4 also had the "first stage" HICAS four-wheel-steering system, that looked for a better lateral roadholding, taking on account the lateral acceleration and the pass-through bends speed. This system, was adopted, once reworked, in the Z32 Fairlady-Z/ 90+300ZX, and middle /top Nissan's coupe and sedan ranges.

Finally, the car had four disk brakes with an antilock break system, and the bodywork was designed to be aerodynamically efficient. A bit of the MID-4 style influence, was seen in the `86 restyling of the Z31.

The second car:, the red one pictured in this article, with right-hand drive, I believe must have been shown at the `85 Tokio Motor Show, in October.

The 1987 MID 4- II:


October, 1987 Tokio Motor Show: Nissan introduced to the public a dream car they called the MID4-II, following the main points of the previous one, but this time in a shape that one could think it was ready to be released to the market. The bodywork, was even more beautiful than the 1985's, with a soft mixture between the Porsche 959, the Ferrari Testarossa, and their own Nissan styling, very nice and balanced. This car was tested on a track of the U.S. and demonistrated immediately its advanced qualities.

When It Introduced The MID4-II In 1987: Nissan knew that this evolution would take a bit longer to refine, and the 1987 Z31 300ZX was the beginning of the change. The Japanese maker began to put in practice all the technology available for them in the form of prototypes, in order not only to amaze the public with the electronics technology they had, but additionally for the purpose of putting them under test conditions. So that they could be used later in production models. That was the main principle in the MID4 prototypes, the technological "key" for Nissan's aspirations of building an outstanding sports car.

The engine was basically the same as the one the Z32 300ZX would use in 1990, but having 330hp. thanks to a pair of turbos and their intercoolers. The suspensions were directly used in the 90 Fairlady-Z, but not the complex 4WD system, developed with the help of the Austrian producer Steyr-Daimler-Puch.



Pictured above is the chassis for the 1987 MID4-II - note the twin turbos with intercoolers! (330hp with all wheel drive!).

Nissan management thought that the new Z32 with good tires and suspensions would have good enough roadholding without that all wheel drive system. Of course they considered putting it on the car, however the weight would increase and exterior design would be changed, resulting in rising the car about 2 inches (5 cms.) while changing the line of the hood. So the lucky car that got the system was the Skyline GT-R, a sports car icon in Japan.

Nissan had its doubts weather making the MID4 or not, being the successor of the Z31, but finally they considered that it was too expensive to build. Curiously, three years later, as it happened with original Z's development, Nissan recovered their interest in the project, but this time they were considering making a Supercar, powered with the Infiniti's 4.5L V8, although that is another story ( I even have spy photos of the test mules).




Returning with the 1987 MID4-II, at least three prototypes were built, one ivory white (shown in the Tokio Show), one medium metallic red , and another in titanium metallic gray used for track testing. All of them were left hand drive. I don't have many more details, but I suppose that the car had many electronic gadgets. As a detail, the man responsible for the MID4-II project was Takoya Noguchi.

Technical data: longitudinal mid-rear Engine, V6 , 2960c.c. (60�), bore+stroke:87+83mm.;24 valves, ECCS injection system with two turbochargers. Compression ratio, 10:1; 330hp. @ 6800rpm ; Torque 39mkg @3200rpm.

For the traction: permanent 4WD system with viscous central coupling. The gearbox was a 5 speed manual. The body was a unit frame with fiberglass panels. It had also the HICAS 4 wheel steering and four disk brakes with ABS. Tires measured 225/50 VR 15. ITs dimensions : 416, 178, 120mm.Wheelbase 244mm.Track f/r :147/154mm. Fuel tank 65 litres. Weight: 1400 kilos. Performances: 295 k.p.h., and 0-100 k.p.h ( 0-62 mph) 4.9sec.




Hope this gives you some insites and information related to the evoluation of the design of the Z Cars and a better picture of the MID4 Prototypes their applications and uses.

hers the link --http://zhome.com/History/MID-4.htm

[Broke_as_****]

That would have been a sweet ride, especially given that it would have only weighed ~3100 pounds. I wonder if the specs on the motor are off or if they did mean a twin turbocharged 10:1 engine. If so, that ****er would have midrange power like a LS1.

[DeleriousZ]

interesting design on the intercoolers... you think they could have rotated them a bit or something to promote better flow... i'm sure the 90's sports cars could have been a VERY different scene had these been produced and brought to north america...

[Broke_as_****]

I think it would have been hard to have more impact than the Z32 did. And you have to remember that any MID4-II based car would also be more expensive.

[k3smostwanted]

Originally Posted by DeleriousZ

interesting design on the intercoolers... you think they could have rotated them a bit or something to promote better flow... i'm sure the 90's sports cars could have been a VERY different scene had these been produced and brought to north america...

intercoolers probably had a duct getting fresh air from the huge rear fender openings.

wonder if the engine compartment would have more room in this design than the Z32 design.

[Yaggus]

Originally Posted by ExTrEmEDrIfT

Nissan had its doubts weather making the MID4 or not, being the successor of the Z31, but finally they considered that it was too expensive to build. Curiously, three years later, as it happened with original Z's development, Nissan recovered their interest in the project, but this time they were considering making a Supercar, powered with the Infiniti's 4.5L V8, although that is another story ( I even have spy photos of the test mules).

Now this I am interested in. Got any more details / pictures on this??

Would have been quite the beast had they decided to go for it...

[twiceasfastasyou]

Wow, very informative article! I've never heard of the MID4-II, and yes, that car would've been a dream to drive. Yes, it would be expensive, but so is the new Skyline GT-R, Camaro, Challenger R/T, etc. thats coming out, but I'll guarantee that those cars are going to get good sales, based off of looks, performance, reputation, etc. That would be one thing I would get worried about for the MID4; the reputation. A vehicle that wasn't ever streamlined before by Nissan, which is probably another reason they didn't go through with producing and selling the vehicle. But, I would still love to see it in person, and drive it altogether...

...but I cant just forget about a nice TTZ...