Windstar Engine Blown

[serge_saati]

My engine just blown . It's a Windstar 99.

I was hurry to pass this short green light, I push the accelerator a little bit (4000rpm), for a few seconds the feeling of power was very good, then suddenly the engine make an horrible sound like when 3 metal shelfs fall at ground, a very loud metalic sound.

So I reduced my speed, I stop. The big mettalic sound was still there.

I was able to return home (1 mile) but engine shake at stop and it's about to stall. It misfires also.

I'm not sure yet what is the problem. Engine still running, but very bad. Maybe it's the crankshaft, crankshaft bearing, piston, valve...?? An internal problem obviously.

Maybe the fuel didn't burn enough fast, the engine make a revolution before the gazes have finished burning? Or the crank bearings fail? Not sure.


Before that, engine running quite good.

***My advice for all Windstar/Freestar owner, don't accelerate too much, nor rev up more than 3000 rpm. If not, you may loose your engine.***

So, never put the pedal to the metal or WOT.

The van has 144K miles. It's a 3.8L engine.

I check engine code, I don't have other codes that my previous P171/174 and P136 codes. No misfires code, which is strange.

The 171/174 indicates that my engine running too lean, probably a vacuum leak. The 136 indicates a bad downstream O2 sensor, not important.


Also, my oil pressure was a little bit low, cause I've a very small leak through the lower intake manifold. I don't know if it's cause a bad lubrication and the crankshaft bearing to fail? When I had the problem, the oil level was to full range. I don't put oil often.

[serge_saati]

I just recorded a video of the engine, we can ear its sound, so if someone know which problems is related to this sound.

The sound come more from the top. So I start thinking that it may be the valve, or the valve rocker arm.

Here's the video: Engine blown.

[serge_saati]

Yahoo hosting s***.

I put the Engine blown video on another website. Click on the link to view it.

[rhandwor]

I would check the oil pressure if a bearing is bad it will be low.
http://www.autopart.com/tools/toolsmain/tool/T_2001.htm
This is a picture check Auto Zone or Advance for a loaner.

[Windywoes]

Serge- This might be a long shot. but my '99 3.8 had a similar sound at about 76,000, but the sound would come and go and not be continuous. In my case a very weird thing happened: The plastic cage that holds the roller rockers and keeps them from rotating broke off on one end. This let the roller rockers spin around in a circle, and when they (2 of them) did this the roller no longer rolled on the cam. So it was non-rolling metal rubbing on the cam. You can imagine the sound it made. But I say again, the noise would start and stop depending if the rockers were rolling on the cam or just rubbing. Again, when they did make noise it sounded just like your noise. Cost about $2,300 for a shop to repair it.

I noticed toward the tail end of your video that the noise seems to indicate two separate, but similar sounds - just like my noise since two roller rockers were involved.

Something to consider?

[glennet404]

Serge-

Sounds like a connecting rod bearing to me.

Glenn

[serge_saati]

Originally Posted by Windywoes

Serge- This might be a long shot. but my '99 3.8 had a similar sound at about 76,000, but the sound would come and go and not be continuous. In my case a very weird thing happened: The plastic cage that holds the roller rockers and keeps them from rotating broke off on one end. This let the roller rockers spin around in a circle, and when they (2 of them) did this the roller no longer rolled on the cam. So it was non-rolling metal rubbing on the cam. You can imagine the sound it made. But I say again, the noise would start and stop depending if the rockers were rolling on the cam or just rubbing. Again, when they did make noise it sounded just like your noise. Cost about $2,300 for a shop to repair it.

I noticed toward the tail end of your video that the noise seems to indicate two separate, but similar sounds - just like my noise since two roller rockers were involved.

Something to consider?

Yes, I think I've probably the same issue. At 76K miles only? How can these engines got internal problem so soon? It's crazy.

Were you a little bit hard on the accelerator like me? Or it's just a misconception of the engine? Ford really screw up anyway...

Did you get the oil pressure light? I've to check the oil pressure too.

You used new parts I suppose? I'll find reconditioned used part to repair it.

Originally Posted by glennet404

Serge-

Sounds like a connecting rod bearing to me.

Glenn

I thought about that, but I just remember the misfire symptom. Check engine flash. So i think it's more likely the valves. If the valves are broken, fuel/air doesn't enter in the engine properly, and misfire. It reduces the compression also. The noise coming more from the top.

Tomorrow, I'll make a full diagnosis to be sure.

[glennet404]

Serge-

Still say it sounds very much like a connecting rod bearing. Here is a test you can perform to narrow the issue down.

With the engine running - one at a time remove the spark plug wires. If it is a connecting rod - you will hear a noticeable drop in the volume of the noise when the plug wire on the offending cylinder is removed. This is caused by the lack of pressure in the cylinder when no combustion occurs. If it is the roller cage issue - removing the wires should make no difference in the volume.

Good Luck-
Glenn

[serge_saati]

I remove all 3 fronts plugs wire, but sound was still there.

What is funny, is when I removed the 2 first wires, the rpm hasn't dropped. So the engine still had torque w/ only 2 cylinders working.

So I think it's the valves. I tried the hose test, to ear the sound of the valve, there wasn't a big noise difference between each valve, maybe it's at rear of engine.

I'll try the oil treatment to cure the valve lifter to see.

I also notice a small oil flake under the oil pan. It's the first time. Before I had oil leak only between intake manifold and valve cover. This flake may be related to the problem.

[Windywoes]

When I first heard my engine sound I thought it was on the bottom end, but I was confused why it would come and go. When I took it to the shop and we put it on a lift it was very obvious then that the noise was not coming from the bottom, but on the top side. This led us to question the valve train.

I am not saying what it is, but I am offering my episode as a possible consideration. The fact that it is continuous might indicate lower problems. If the van is on a lift you can hear the bottom end much better.

[serge_saati]

I just ear the bottom of the engine, and the sound is very loud, louder than the top.

If it's a piston/crankshaft related problem, why disconnecting plugs wire didn't reduces the noise? And why it misfires sometime?

I've also noticed water spill under the catalytic converter, muffler and exhaust pipe.
And oil under the oil pan (~4 ounces). I never had these symptoms before.

I don't know yet where the oil leak the most.

[serge_saati]

I start thinking that running too lean at 4000rpm as caused the destruction of the engine.

[serge_saati]

It's possible to let the engine work with only 2 or 4 cylinders, instead of 6?

Because if I have a bad valve or piston, and I remove the spark plugs of these cylinders pairs, engine should work w/ making less noise, right?

[serge_saati]

It's funny, I let the engine idle during 5 minutes, I rev up at 2000rpm sometime, the noise have reduced a lot.

Then I make a test drive, at cruise speed in city (30-40mph), the engine didn't make noise at all! It's strange, but good. Maybe the valve stop moving?, I don't know.

But when I come to stop light, the engine want to stall, I put in Neutral, I push gas so it keep that way, when it's green light, I push brake and accelerator in same time, I put Drive and I release the brake. So it go w/o stalling. But it jerks.

The engine misfire alsmost 90% of the time in this 10 miles (30 minutes) test drive.
I check the code, I got only the P0301 code and also the old classic 171/174 code which is normal for a Windstar 99-03.

So only cylinder 1 misfire???? Very strange.


So my question is: It's possible to make the engine run with only 4 or 5 cylinders, instead of repairing the valve? Well, I guess it's a valve problem.

So the engine will not stall anymore.

When I removed the plugs n° 1, there's oil deposit in it. So I guess, oil leaking through the valve to this cylinder, it's why it misfires.

So if I make the engine works with the plugs n°1 removed and connect the plugs wire to GND, so that current will flow to plugs 5, engine should work fine?

because I can't afford a valve or piston reparation, it's more than the car value.

I really feel like in 60s decade working with old combustion engine. Exept that I have automatic transmission. I wish I could have a clutch, it'll be easier to drive, instead of put N and D at each red light. It'll stop jerking.

[tomj76]

It might be worth pulling the rear valve cover (over cylinder #1) to check the valve movement, valve spring, etc. At least you'd know what is the problem and if the repair is going to cost a lot or a little. Valve springs can crack or break, which is a relatively simple repair.