America vs. Europe

[CarGuy155]

Viper SRT-10
$91,995
8.4L OHV 20-valve V-10
Front Engine-RWD
6 speed manual
600 bhp @ 6100 rpm
560 lbs-ft @ 5000 rpm
Redline: 6000 rpm
Bhp/Liter: 71.6
Curb Weight: 3440 lbs
0-30mph: 1.7 sec
0-60mph: 3.7 sec
0-90mph: 7.2 sec
0-120mph: 11.2 sec
0-100ft, 2.7 sec
0-500ft, 6.7 sec
0-900ft, 9.5 sec
0-1320ft, 11.7 sec @ 122.8 mph
60mph-0, 112 ft
80mph-0, 193 ft
Lateral: 1.01g
Slalom: 69.7 mph
Weight Distribution: 48/52
Tires: 275/345 mm
EPA: 12/21 mpg
Top Speed: 202 mph

Corvette ZR-1
$117,000
6.2L Supercharged OHV 16-valve V-8
Front Engine-RWD
6 speed manual
638 bhp @ 6500 rpm
604 lbs-ft @ 3800 rpm
Redline: 6500 rpm
Bhp/Liter: 103.5
Curb Weight: 3325 lbs
0-30mph: 1.5 sec
0-60mph: 3.4 sec
0-90mph: 6.0 sec
0-120mph: 9.8 sec
0-100ft, 2.6 sec
0-500ft, 6.3 sec
0-900ft, 9.0 sec
0-1320ft, 11.4 sec @ 129.3 mph
60mph-0, 106 ft
80mph-0, 183 ft
Lateral: 1.10g
Slalom: 73.4 mph
Weight Distribution: 52/48
Tires: 285/335 mm
EPA: 14/20 mpg
Top Speed: 205 mph

Gallardo LP560-4
$251,260
5.2L 40-valve DOHC V-10
Mid Engine-AWD
6 speed paddle shift manual
552 bhp @ 8000 rpm
398 lbs-ft @ 6500 rpm
Redline: 8500 rpm
Bhp/Liter: 106.1
Curb Weight: 3595 lbs
0-30mph: 1.3 sec
0-60mph: 3.2 sec
0-90mph: 5.9 sec
0-120mph: 9.7 sec
0-100ft, 2.4 sec
0-500ft, 6.2 sec
0-900ft, 8.8 sec
0-1320ft, 11.2 sec @ 129.5 mph
60mph-0, 112 ft
80mph-0, 192 t
Lateral: 1.00g
Slalom: 72.1 mph
Weight Distribution: 44/56
Tires: 235/295 mm
EPA: 14/20 mpg
Top Speed: 202 mph

911 GT2
$198,875
3.6L Turbocharged DOHC 24-valve H-6
Rear Engine-RWD
6 speed manual
530 bhp @ 6500 rpm
501 lbs-ft @ 2200 rpm
Redline: 6800 rpm
Bhp/Liter: 147.2
Curb Weight: 3265 lbs
0-30mph: 1.2 sec
0-60mph: 3.4 sec
0-90mph: 6.6 sec
0-120mph: 10.9 sec
0-100ft, 2.4 sec
0-500ft, 6.3 sec
0-900ft, 9.0 sec
0-1320ft, 11.5 sec @ 123.9 mph
60mph-0, 108 ft
80mph-0, 187 ft
Lateral: 1.03g
Slalom: 75.9 mph
Weight Distribution: 39/61
Tires: 235/325 mm
EPA: 16/23 mpg
Top Speed: 204 mph

F430 Scuderia
$262,306
4.3L DOHC 32-valve V-8
Mid Engine-RWD
6-speed paddle-shift manual
503 bhp @ 8500 rpm
347 lb-ft @ 5250 rpm
Redline: 8500 rpm
Bhp/Liter: 116.9
Curb Weight: 2975 lbs
0-30mph: 1.2 sec
0-60mph: 3.4 sec
0-90mph: 6.5 sec
0-120mph: 10.7 sec
0-100ft, 2.3 sec
0-500ft, 6.3 sec
0-900ft, 9.1 sec
0-1320ft, 11.4 sec @ 123.0 mph
60mph-0, 110 ft
80mph-0, 185 ft
Lateral: 0.98g
Slalom: 72.5 mph
Weight Distribution: 43/57
Tires: 225/285 mm
EPA: 10/14 mpg
Top Speed: 198 mph

[carmadbenj]

american cars are nice and good but against italians and germans europe dominates

[BlueDjinn]

Originally Posted by carmadbenj

american cars are nice and good but against italians and germans europe dominates

At the world's biggest racetrack; the 12.9 mile Nurburgring Nordschliefe in Germany; the
Dodge Viper is the only American car to win the overall event; the 24 hours of Nurburgring.
This event is one of the greatest "benchmarks" in sports cars. The Viper was so DOMINANT in
its first season that it won every single race of the German GT championship by a "wide
margin". Since then, the sanctioning body have continually restricted the Viper to "slow it
down"! The sanctioning body couldn't tolerate seeing the Viper take three overall victories
so they imposed an engine displacement limit of 6.2 litres. That meant removing two of the
Viper's ten cylinders before it was allowed to compete, which it did ,coming in second place
with class victories.

[Polygon]

Of the cars on the list I had to go with the Porsche and it was close between that and the F430. Had you used the ACR Viper instead of the SRT I would have picked the Viper.

Originally Posted by BlueDjinn

At the world's biggest racetrack; the 12.9 mile Nurburgring Nordschliefe in Germany; the
Dodge Viper is the only American car to win the overall event; the 24 hours of Nurburgring.
This event is one of the greatest "benchmarks" in sports cars. The Viper was so DOMINENT in
its first season that it won every single race of the German GT championship by a "wide
margin". Since then, the sanctioning body have continually restricted the Viper to "slow it
down"! The sanctioning body couldn't tolerate seeing the Viper take three overall victories
so they imposed an engine displacement limit of 6.2 litres. That meant removing two of the
Viper's ten cylinders before it was allowed to compete, which it did ,coming in second place
with class victories.

The car you're referring to is the Oreca Viper GTS-R and can't be compared with ANY production Viper.

[BlueDjinn]

I'm quite aware of what the ORECA Viper is, and I was not doing a "Viper" comparison. As you'd prefer that I should distinguish between it and "production" Vipers it will be my pleasure. Tom Coronel, the Dutch driver for Peter Zakowski's Zakspeed Viper in the last two 24-hour races at Nurburgring, drove the street legal, Detroit built, Viper ACR to a lap of seven minutes, twenty-two point one seconds, (7:22.1) around the Nordschliefe.
This is a full two seconds faster than Maserati's MC12 at 7:24.29; the Pagani Zonda at 7:24.65; three seconds faster than the Ferrari Enzo at 7:25.21; six seconds faster than the Porche Carrera at 7:28.71. This event was sponsered by Chrysler and witnessed by two guys from Motor Trend and covered by German television. I'm sure that after seeing how the American produced Viper performed at their "esteemed" raceway, certain egos weren't feeling quite so..."dominant".

[matt.J64]

Originally Posted by carmadbenj

american cars are nice and good but against italians and germans europe dominates

if this is american vs european, then you have to look at not only performance, but everything else. as for fuel effiecient and realiability, well america is the best. europeans dont do much of that.
as for working cars a.k.a. 'trucks'... america, no contest.
performance... thats the big one. its hard to say 'america v euro' that would be considered as g.b.,germany, and italy all against america. thats 3 to 1. so lets take this one match at a time.
america v the british. this ones not that hard. the brits couldnt name a single car that was faster and quicker and cheaper than say a viper srt, or better... and thats americas common supercar made by its major manufactures. not the best. the best the brits can offer is probably the v12 vanquish.
america v germany. thats a hard one. well the germans make many great cars but the only one that stands a chance in performance (not luxury) is maybe porsche. i will always respect porsche as a godfather of sports cars, but larger prices and high repairs costs will cost them the right to best cars. sorry germany.
america v italy. now this a is true match here. lambo's are cool and so are ferrari's. but this is a supercar match. so you can exclude certain cars like the mustang and charger's. those are completely different classes. ferraris and lambo's offer cars like the gallardo, mercielago, f430, 599, 458 italia, and enzo. nice selections. but the americans have the bigger one's. viper srt10, vette zr1 and z06, ford gt, sallen s7/twin turbo, gt malon, hennessey venom, cts-v coupe/sedan, camaro z28, ultimate aero, etc.if you are not a close minded fool then do the research if u want. the americans are the kings.

[Oldengineer]

Don't count the Brits out - Jaguar now has XF sedans out there packing 510 HP - 5 liter supercharged V8's.

Regards:
Oldengineer

[knightjp]

Forget track times and performance figures. I own an italian sedan. I basically have an Alfa 156 2.5 V6. I bet most of you in the North American continent don't know what that is.
What's my point, I'm biased towards the Italian. But I would count them as equal because there are cars I like from both sides and besides.... who can forget that awesome V8 rumble from those American engines????

However, I would agree that the Europeans know how to build better cars... Who builds the most powerful naturally aspirated V8 engines???.... Mercedes..
I wish it was Ford or GM though...

[Oldengineer]

Knightjp:

I agree with you. I know about Alfas. The Europeans know how to build 4 Cylinder, V6 and V8 engines that have nice flat torque curves that are a joy to drive, and, get really decent fuel economy. I've owned 3 Jaguars, and, now, a Benz GLK350. My last Jag, a S Type with the NA 4.2 V8, and, the Benz GLK SUV are both quicker that the Oldsmobile 442 with its 325HP engine that I owned back in 1969.

Regards:
Oldengineer

[knightjp]

Originally Posted by Oldengineer

Knightjp:

I agree with you. I know about Alfas. The Europeans know how to build 4 Cylinder, V6 and V8 engines that have nice flat torque curves that are a joy to drive, and, get really decent fuel economy. I've owned 3 Jaguars, and, now, a Benz GLK350. My last Jag, a S Type with the NA 4.2 V8, and, the Benz GLK SUV are both quicker that the Oldsmobile 442 with its 325HP engine that I owned back in 1969.

Regards:
Oldengineer

Are you sure that your Jag had a NA 4.2 V8??? How much BHP did it have... 'Cos I know that Jag the S-Type R had a Supercharged V8 bring out over 400 BHP....

However in terms of engine noise... I bet nothing beats your Olds.... Who can forget that American V8 rumble...

You've got to understand that the Olds too had to lug around a huge heavy body than the Jag or the Mercedes would... Naturally the Euro boxes are quicker.
There must be something the Germans are doing with their engine designs that gives them extra bhp.... Maybe its tuning... Perhaps the American engines are tuned more for torque than BHP....

[Oldengineer]

Originally Posted by knightjp

Are you sure that your Jag had a NA 4.2 V8??? How much BHP did it have... 'Cos I know that Jag the S-Type R had a Supercharged V8 bring out over 400 BHP....

However in terms of engine noise... I bet nothing beats your Olds.... Who can forget that American V8 rumble...

You've got to understand that the Olds too had to lug around a huge heavy body than the Jag or the Mercedes would... Naturally the Euro boxes are quicker.
There must be something the Germans are doing with their engine designs that gives them extra bhp.... Maybe its tuning... Perhaps the American engines are tuned more for torque than BHP....

Yes the Jag was NA. Mine was the VDP model with the 300 HP 4.2. It did 0 - 60 in about 6 seconds. The "R' models are a good bit quicker with the supercharged engines. While I was shopping for the GLK, and, reading road tests, I was amazed that this little SUV apparently will do 0 - 60 in 6.5 seconds. Also - yes the rumble that the 69 Olds made was nice. However, the hair - raising howl that the Jag made at full chat was nice too.

Regards:
Oldengineer

[knightjp]

Originally Posted by Oldengineer

Yes the Jag was NA. Mine was the VDP model with the 300 HP 4.2. It did 0 - 60 in about 6 seconds. The "R' models are a good bit quicker with the supercharged engines. While I was shopping for the GLK, and, reading road tests, I was amazed that this little SUV apparently will do 0 - 60 in 6.5 seconds. Also - yes the rumble that the 69 Olds made was nice. However, the hair - raising howl that the Jag made at full chat was nice too.

Regards:
Oldengineer

You may not believe this, but that engine in the Jag was a Ford V8 designed and tuned by Cosworth. A supercharged 4.8 version is used in the Range Rover.
How do I know this??? I once saw a guy give a Jag a bit of gas and I recognized the engine rumble..... If I'm honest, it sounded like a well tuned and sophisticated Mustang GT...
I later did a bit of research online and my thoughts were correct.

TVR used a Ford V6 in their S2. That engine note is simply heavenly if you count engine noises....
Frankly I think, if a company from Europe get their hands on an American V8, they could manage to get more BHP and give it a well tuned and lusty sound.

[Oldengineer]

Look up the Jaguar AJ series engines. The Jag V8 started life as a 4.0 Liter engine, and, later grew to 4.2 - the size that was in my car. It's not a Ford engine, but, after Ford bought Jag, they used it in the small Lincoln for a while, but, minus some of its get up and go goodies. The V6 that Jag used in the X Type and S Type 3.0 was a Ford Duratec derivative, but, Jag extensively modified it both internally and externally. In the S it made 236 HP.

Regards:
Oldengineer

[rehashmorkal]

I would love to go with Gallardo LP560-4.
0-30mph: 1.3 sec
0-60mph: 3.2 sec
0-90mph: 5.9 sec
0-120mph: 9.7 sec
simply awesome....