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Car Comparisons Compare any cars and find out what every body else thinks. Just refrain from making stupid comparos like Viper vs. Geo Metro :)
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Old 12-14-2000, 07:25 PM   #1
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Toyota and Honda have both picked up the pace in their quest to remain on top in the automotive market place of the future. While the big money maker of the future will most likely be fuel cell technology, both have released hybrid gas-electric cars as a transitional step towards the fuel cell, which is still indisposed, in a long-standing period of research and development.

The two competitors have taken different approaches the the gas-electric hybrid. Toyota has released the Prius, which aims at being a less-compromising hybrid, with four doors and the power equivalent of a small four-cylinder economy car. Honda's Insight is a much smaller two-door, with a sharp exterior that combines new edge styling with a low drag coefficient (it's so easy to tell that I am Honda-biased, isn't it? ) to aid in its excellent fuel economy stats (the Insight averages about 70 miles per gallon - roughly 50% more than the Prius).

These opposing approaches to the same problem illustrate to me it is not a simple issue, and that the right marketing approach will probably be the key to gathering a following of the hybrid, and making it a success. This will in turn get those more environmentally-conscious than the average American citizen primed and ready for the future of automotive technology, even if it means sacrificing some comfort and performance for the cause of slowing our fossil fuel depletion. And time will tell which approach has been more successful:

Toyota, who attempts the guise the hybrid as a normal car, giving it all the size and roughly the power of its hydrocarbon-consuming peer group.

Honda, who makes the statement that it is a hybrid and it is different.

While Honda's novelty approach may not collect the same token appreciation as the Prius, which minimizes the differences and therefore the transition between gas-powered to hybrid, its bold differences may give it the marketing edge it needs to come out on top.

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Old 12-14-2000, 07:40 PM   #2
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nice post JD.
but i just think that both of these hybrids are VERY ugly.
this is the UGLY Insight:

and this is the EVEN UGLIER (how far can we go?!) Prius:


if someone could actually make a Good-Looking hybrid, then they will dominate this tiny yet important for the future market.
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Old 12-22-2000, 03:37 PM   #3
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This is the Honda Spocket Concept. I don't think it's ugly...only problem is that it's a concept.


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Old 12-22-2000, 10:58 PM   #4
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Yeah I like the Sprocket. It's got potential. Nice, very effective little body design. And from what I've heard, it could actually happen. Like the S2000, a well-mated package of handling, balance... and not very much power, but ripe for engine swapping and performance tuning for the enthusiast.
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Old 12-23-2000, 04:39 AM   #5
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Hummm. It seems as though an engine swap would require quite a bit of tuning. The front wheels are powered by a small gas engine but each rear wheel has an electric motor powering it. So, in essence, it's AWD is actually a FWD, Left-RWD, and right-RWD. Changing stuff up front might mean altering each part of the rear.

It seems mildly absurd to swap an engine into a car that is designed for fuel efficiency rather than sport. I suppose if you are dead set on the looks it's not so bad, but just seems odd...like shoehorning a 427 into a Geo Metro.

But, to each his own.

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Old 12-23-2000, 09:39 AM   #6
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do you see the seatbelt??
it sure isn't supposed to be you next Geo Metro
It would be interesting if Honda themselves take this car to the racing direction
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Old 12-23-2000, 01:11 PM   #7
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Enzo

You're right that it would be a difficult hybrid to build up, but I am willing to bet with assurance that it will be done. Yes, it will defeat the purpose of the hybrid theory, but I for one really like the way it looks, and I gather that there are many others out there that do too. Especially the gull-wing doors give it a very classy image (there are Honda owners who have paid $5,000+.. even up to $10,000, to have their Civics, Integras, etc. customized with gull wing doors!).

Seems to me that this small, race-bred design will inevitably be coined as the next generation CRX, different though it may be, but as having a small, light body that enthusiasts can throw heavily blown, small engines (picture a B16A1 with forged internals and high boost turbo kit) into to make it a drag racing champion.

Who knows, it might even have the weight distribution to still handle decently with a fairly light engine up front like the B16A (and one of the beautiful things about turbos is that they really don't weigh much at all). At least while its new, this car will be much more of an attention-getter than the S2000 and slammed Honda "hoopdies." But who wants the new car that is trendy and cool-looking, but a slug in reality (think the PT Cruiser)?

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Old 01-01-2001, 09:54 PM   #8
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gull wing doors?

what are those

are u talkin about the lambo doors on the sprocket?

i've heard of ppl getting these conversions on their hondas

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Old 01-03-2001, 04:57 AM   #9
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I see the seat belts and I'm sure you could build it up. But the way I see it....

The Pontiac Aztek had big old cross drilled rotors as a concept. Goodbye in production. Concepts don't always reflect the true nature of the beast. It is being displayed as a sports car, but maybe it is just a low performance, cool looking econobox.

Of course it can be made fast. If a Civic can break into 8's, anything can be fast. But why? I just don't see any reason other than doing the work to get it there. I guess I'm just not into small displacement to the same extent as others.

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Old 01-06-2001, 02:38 PM   #10
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VTEC V6

Yeah, gull wing doors refer to those that swing upwards. I think the advent of the term was with the old 1956 Mercedes SL 600 (I think that was the name). Lambo doors are considered gull wing.
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Old 05-12-2001, 01:53 AM   #11
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Arrow

I think the term you're looking for is scissor-wing doors. they pivot at the front and swing open like scissor blades. Gull-wing doors hinge at the top and look like wings when they're open.

autofan: There's nothing ugly about 70 mpg when gas costs $3 a gallon this summer!

I like them both. Hooray for new technology!
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Old 05-12-2001, 03:48 AM   #12
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Your lucky we pay $1.21 a litre for super I think you times it by 3.98 to get a US gallon and 4.55 for our old gallon.
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Old 12-20-2001, 01:01 AM   #13
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I found this abandoned thread and decided to add my own take to it!

I personally am more partial to the Prius. But then again, I look for practicality for everyday life...

Think about it... 4 doors, 50 mpg (which far surpasses the 35mpg I get in my 5-spd on the highway!) I think that it's a great little car despite the body shape being like the Echo!

As for the Insight: 2 doors is very impractical. The 68mpg it gets for the 5-spd on the highway is spectacular, but not very comfortable for travel... damn...

Personally, if you want a SULEV (which the Insight is only a ULEV in 2 versions) I say go for the Prius, or better yet, go ZEV with GM's EV1!!!!

EV1: 2 doors, very aerodynamic, and the Gen II batteries will last you up to 130 miles on one charge!!!

Lastly, I personally am excited about Honda's Dualnote! I mean, a 4-door sports car with 17 Km/L and a monstrous 400 HP??? And the 2 rear doors are nearly invisible--almost look shaved! Now there's a little car for ya!
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Old 01-18-2003, 10:46 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by JD@af
VTEC V6

Yeah, gull wing doors refer to those that swing upwards. I think the advent of the term was with the old 1956 Mercedes SL 600 (I think that was the name). Lambo doors are considered gull wing.
actually, gullwings are from the 1955 mercedes benz 300sl, and lambo doors are not gullwing, they are considered "scissors"style
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Old 01-18-2003, 10:48 AM   #15
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so far.. all the hybrids i have seen are disgusting and make me want to puke....


exept for the.... you guessed it.... civic hybrid!!!! it has the clean lines of a civic combined with the sulev engine of an insight or a prius... the best of both worlds
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