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Car Comparisons Compare any cars and find out what every body else thinks. Just refrain from making stupid comparos like Viper vs. Geo Metro :)
View Poll Results: The better track car??
Viper 23 58.97%
Nsx-r 16 41.03%
Voters: 39. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-20-2004, 10:55 AM   #46
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Though Iíd rather own the NSX, the Viper is the superior track car.













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Old 07-20-2004, 10:13 PM   #47
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Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

I think it does come down to better equals faster and cheaper... we are talknig about a consumer product here, I wouldn't buy a hand-made T.V. when the one next to it gives superior picture/sound quality, and top it off is CHEAPER. This is the nature of economics and consumerism.
And you can't compare Casio to Rolex, that's like throwing a Geo Metro into the comparison... both cars are fairly equal status symbols, more like Movado vs. Rolex, in which case price is a factor.
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Old 07-20-2004, 10:39 PM   #48
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Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

but errr, the viper isn't technically as good as the nsx...
it goes faster but then that is only because it has a bigger engine.
should point out that litre for litre, the nsx produces more power than the viper.

it is like comparing two boxers from different class weights.
the heavyweight will win
but only cos he is twice the size of the featherweight.
the featherweight might still be the better boxer.

unless of course you are saying that the viper can handle better than the nsx...
in which case i'll let the professionals argue the case for the nsx.
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Old 07-21-2004, 03:07 AM   #49
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Re: Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

Quote:
Originally Posted by drunken monkey
but errr, the viper isn't technically as good as the nsx...
it goes faster but then that is only because it has a bigger engine.
should point out that litre for litre, the nsx produces more power than the viper.
True. But is this extra technology really practical?
I mean their determination to make a N/A 3.8L compare with a 8L V10 is admirable, but when you invest so much time and resources into engineering precision only to have youíre rivals get the better of you by them simply increasing the displacement of their engine, you sometimes wonder if it is necessary. It seems like the NSX is more of a technical demonstration of Honda's engineering then a car to win over the consumers.
I know you could say, "If Honda made a 8L V10..ect". And yes if they did make a large engine utilising the same technology it would probably be unbelievably powerful but hell just imagine how much the engine would cost to produce.

Donít get me wrong Honda are 4-stroke wizards. Their insistence of not taking the easy and far more common way of using turbos in their engines is extremely admirable if a bit stubborn.
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Old 07-21-2004, 03:59 AM   #50
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hey, Honda's philosophy, to make LEVs (low emission vehicles).

So I think they're good at technological refinement, who knows, in another 7-10 years, they'll get more than 600 horses out of a stock, natural aspirated 4 banger. lol.
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Old 07-21-2004, 09:12 AM   #51
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Re: Re: Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

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Originally Posted by Vettribution87
True. But is this extra technology really practical?
I mean their determination to make a N/A 3.8L compare with a 8L V10 is admirable, but when you invest so much time and resources into engineering precision only to have youíre rivals get the better of you by them simply increasing the displacement of their engine, you sometimes wonder if it is necessary. It seems like the NSX is more of a technical demonstration of Honda's engineering then a car to win over the consumers.
I know you could say, "If Honda made a 8L V10..ect". And yes if they did make a large engine utilising the same technology it would probably be unbelievably powerful but hell just imagine how much the engine would cost to produce.

Donít get me wrong Honda are 4-stroke wizards. Their insistence of not taking the easy and far more common way of using turbos in their engines is extremely admirable if a bit stubborn.
Wow good post, totally agree with you.
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Old 07-21-2004, 10:58 AM   #52
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

The new nsx is supposed to have alot more displacement and much more cylinders ...
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Old 07-21-2004, 12:27 PM   #53
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Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

I mean their determination to make a N/A 3.8L compare with a 8L V10 is admirable....
it seems like the NSX is more of a technical demonstration of Honda's engineering then a car to win over the consumers


well, that's exactly it.
they want to make the most advanced pieces of engineering they can.
it isn't their aim to simply make a superfast car.
i mean, take a look at their take on a diesel engine.
they don't just make a 'copy' of an existing good diesel, the go and change the rule rulebook...
and yes, the nsx IS their ultimate expression of engineering.

again, i mention that the best engineers/drivers in the world have all raved about the nsx and how it handles (set up by senna remember...)

in their eyes and in the eyes of the press, the viper isn't one of their rivals.
it is only a rival in the states which is not their biggest nsx market anyway.
in their home country, the rivals are gt-r, gto, rx-7 (again, remember the car IS ten years old...).

and well, yes....
i've also heard about a honda v8 in the pipeline.
only thing is, with the japan 300 bhp thing, what good is it?
unless of course they are only making it for outside japan, which seems highly unlikely.
who knows?
it might happen.

anyway.
we need guys like honda who don't take the easy route.
would an M3 be the same if it used a turbo or two?
how about if lamborghini ditched their V12 for a turbo V8?
what if ferrari hadn't given in to pinninfarina and made the 365 boxer (mid engined 12)?
what if audi didn't bother with aluminiuim.
what if honda didn't bother with aluminium (which can be said was the catalyst for ferrari to use aluminium for chassis in the 360...)?

a slight exaggeration
but
any tom dick or harry can slap a turbo in a car.
not many can get more than 100bhp per litre from a n/a engine....
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Old 07-21-2004, 02:41 PM   #54
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That 280HP gentlemen rule should end with the next generation R35 Skyline, and good riddance. I know plenty of Japanese cars have passed the 280HP rule already, but they're either A) sold only outside of Japan or B) Incognito, meaning the rule is barely pushed and not openly admitted to in Japan, example Skyline R34, 280HP my ass. When the R35 Skyline comes out it will be the first time a manufactuer openly admits to breaking the 280HP rule, and breaking it by a lot.
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Old 07-21-2004, 04:49 PM   #55
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Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

i like one article about the r34 gt-r
had an interview with one of the chief engineers.

it went something like this.
reporter: "revs+torque=power (or something like this... don't quote me...)
so the new r34 revs higher?"
nissan guy: "yes"
reporter: "and it has more torque?"
nissan guy: "yes"
reporter: "so the r34 gt-r has more torque and at higher revs?"
nissan guy: "yes"
reporter: "so the r34 gt-r has more power than the r33?"
nissian guy: (pauses and smiles) "no...."
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Old 07-22-2004, 01:45 AM   #56
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Umm, officially the Gentlemen's Agreement was breached with the most recent Japanese market generation of Infiniti Q45 which makes an advertised 330hp as I recall.

Again, though, as far as the handling of the Viper I need only point to its sterling competition record. Beyond being a tool for massacre (in capable hands) in SCCA track days, the Viper has handily been the dominant car in Speed World Challenge competition, at the Nurburgring 24hours/1000km, and the Oreca factory Vipers retired undefeated in Le Mans GTS competition as well as being the first GTS cars since the factory Nissan 300ZX's to win the Daytona 24hours outright (and they did it against a full crop of WSC/LMP cars).

Furthermore, yes the Viper has a big engine. SO FREAKING WHAT? Look at the number of cars over 5L these days. Lots of big 5 and 6 liter and up engines popping up, V8, V12, V10 and otherwise. From engines as exotic as Bugatti's 8.0L quad turbo W16 in the upcoming Veyron to engines as utilitarian as the Chevy Vortec truck engines. A large engine equals a more inexpensive power source that can be made reliable and fuel efficient through careful engine management.

Even Honda, king of the mighty mites, realized that the 2.0L four in the S2000 was too peaky to be useful, so they swelled the displacement to 2.2L to gain torque and a broader powerband.

You have to be a really REALLY foolish person to point to a performance car having a smaller, less power friendly engine and then saying it's a benefit.
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Old 07-22-2004, 02:02 AM   #57
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In this case i choose the viper too. Its a tremendous track car. I used to make the same mistake a while ago thinking that vipers are drag cars, only to realise that i was completelly off. if anything they stink at very serious drag racing due to their purely track oriented suspension setup.

True the NSX is a very good track car but as mentioned by now its rather oudated, but even when it was a new thing it never particularly inspired me. Why? Because it was far to bland, and I like cars with personality that inspire passion and slap your hand if you're being stupid (mosler, viper gts, noble, stradale ETC....)


About the HP to displacement ratio, remeber this for handling hp to engine weight ratio is more important(one of the main reasons nissan is ditching the anvil aka rb26). Also if you have ever raced you'll realise the importance of a powerband (there are corners in autox when my little engine drops so badly out of the powerband that I have time to read a book till the power comes back on - there is nothing more frustrating) and here is where big displacement engines come in.
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Old 07-22-2004, 10:06 AM   #58
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Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Layla's Keeper
Umm, officially the Gentlemen's Agreement was breached with the most recent Japanese market generation of Infiniti Q45 which makes an advertised 330hp as I recall.
Like I said before, it has been breached plenty of times, but openly admited to it in Japan, I doubt that. Advertised 330HP in US or Europe, but not in Japan. The Supra Twin Turbo, 300ZX Twin Turbo, 3000GT VR4, NSX, and many other examples all lay down over 280HP, yet in Japan, they are rated at 280HP. Also I stated this rule has been passed plenty of times, but not by too much, why, well if you create a car that has 450HP and try to claim it only has 280HP, I don't think that would fool many people. Name a Japanese car that has over 350HP? With the introduction of the 400HP+ R35 Skyline Nissan knows there is no way that they can fool anybody into believing this car only has 280HP or maybe Nissan doesn't care anymore about the 280HP rule, so yes the car will supposidly be rated at it's true HP everywhere including Japan. What's the big deal, the big deal is that I hope that this could perhaps cause a HP war in Japan and put an end the 280HP rule, finally more powerful Japanese imports and perhaps maybe one day we will be comparing a 500HP NSX to European and American supercars.
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Old 07-22-2004, 08:00 PM   #59
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Re: Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

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Originally Posted by 3000ways
What's the big deal, the big deal is that I hope that this could perhaps cause a HP war in Japan and put an end the 280HP rule, finally more powerful Japanese imports and perhaps maybe one day we will be comparing a 500HP NSX to European and American supercars.
I would be worried about a HP war between companies. This is what happened in the muscle car era. Cars became more and more powerful to the point that the public got concerned about safety and the government came down to ruin the party.
The backlash of a horsepower war would probably cause the government to institute a strict 200HP agreement, which would frankly stink.

About the R35 Skyline. That was the V8 one wasnít it?
I thought Nissan axed that project in favour of the Q45.
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Old 07-22-2004, 09:46 PM   #60
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Re: Re: Re: Nsx R vs Viper Srt 10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vettribution87
About the R35 Skyline. That was the V8 one wasnít it? I thought Nissan axed that project in favour of the Q45.
Haha Not exactly they probly still workin on it. The R35 will have to be released if the new nsx comes out (my opinion) which it will. No the new sky if produced will have a flat six. As far as im concerned the r34 does it for me.
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