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Old 07-17-2005, 06:26 PM   #61
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by k3smostwanted
i never said that the mustang was a bad handling car...i simply said, it will and does not handle better than any of the cars mentioned in this thread. if you find this incorrect...i think you should open your mind a little and do some comparing of your own and then come back with a valid argument.
The new Mustang isn't a sports car like the 911, Z06, or the other cars in this thread, but it still is interesting that it has won four races in Grand-Am Cup against BMW M3s, Porsche 911s, Nissan 350Zs, and other cars. I know it doesn't handle as well as those cars and Ford might make a new GT350.

Quote:
Originally Posted by k3smostwanted
the European Ford industry has a whole different line of cars that offer much much better all around performance cars than does the American market.
Which European Ford has better all around performance than the Ford GT?
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Old 07-17-2005, 07:04 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VQuick
I didn't know it until recently, but the original GT500 was the 'softer' car, while the GT350 was the hardcore car. I figured the GT500 was faster just because of the bigger number, but the opposite was true.
Sorry but this isn't true. The GT-350s had small blocks while the GT-500s had big blocks.

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Originally Posted by VQuick
Instead of offering the Shelby GR-1, a GT350 might be easier for Ford to do.
I don't think so. A 600 hp Mustang that does 0-60 around 3.3 seconds and can run 10s, that's a fast Mustang. It'd probably run really high too.

In fact, SVT thought about making a high end Mustang close to something like the GT-40 but the Ford higher ups though a lower costing GT-500 would be a better way to go.
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What?! Record sales are slumping? Must be from all those pirates. Can't be because we started sucking 10 years ago.
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Old 07-17-2005, 07:56 PM   #63
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by Jaguar D-Type
The new Mustang isn't a sports car like the 911, Z06, or the other cars in this thread, but it still is interesting that it has won four races in Grand-Am Cup against BMW M3s, Porsche 911s, Nissan 350Zs, and other cars. I know it doesn't handle as well as those cars and Ford might make a new GT350.



Which European Ford has better all around performance than the Ford GT?
yeah, i know it isnt a sports car like the 911, Z06, and soon to be GTR. thats EXACTLY what i was trying to convey to you and you went on a rave about how the mustang won 4 races in Grand-Am Cup, like that really matters.
...and when Ford might make a new GT350 we will have to discuss this but as it does not pertain to anything stated in this thread i find it quite idiotic to speak of it.

also, i was not inferring that the European cars are better than the GT...i was trying to show you that Ford dedicates its cars to selling, like any other car manufacturer. in Europe, they are not so set on 1/4mile performance...this is why ford makes different cars for them that actually have handling in mind while building the car. not an after thought...

it is the american economy that is so set on 1/4 mile performance and could care less about any other aspect of the car. so ford makes cars like the mustang for these people...they think about how well the car handles afterward. eventhough, the mustang is a good handling car for its price, throwing a larger motor in it will not make it compete with $70k sports cars around a track.

i dont even know what the problem is...you act as if i said that the mustang cant handle worth shit and the chevy aveo is on par with it. i simply stated that it cannot compete with the $70k sports cars listed above, which happen to be built for all around 'exotic, super car' like performance.
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Old 07-17-2005, 08:03 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k3smostwanted
i simply stated that it cannot compete with the $70k sports cars listed above, which happen to be built for all around 'exotic, super car' like performance.
Well a normal Mustang can't but the GT-R is a little over $100,000 so it can hold its own. It's a full fledge racing car and that's the one that has probably won all the races. I saw a thing on Discovery channel and they put a lot, and I mean a WHOLE LOT of work into the suspension on that thing.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lars Ulrich
What?! Record sales are slumping? Must be from all those pirates. Can't be because we started sucking 10 years ago.
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Old 07-17-2005, 08:16 PM   #65
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Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muscletang
Well a normal Mustang can't but the GT-R is a little over $100,000 so it can hold its own. It's a full fledge racing car and that's the one that has probably won all the races. I saw a thing on Discovery channel and they put a lot, and I mean a WHOLE LOT of work into the suspension on that thing.
yeah..i have read small portions about that car. but its a whole other car and we were referring to the normal mustang so this is a different story...

we could start a new comparison when the Infiniti GTR becomes a reality and compare it to the Mustang GT-R...if you feel it is necessary. if nissan makes this car like some are speculating, this thing could be competing with $100k+ cars like the Ford GT and cars of the such. just a matter of time before we actually have some information about the car...
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Old 07-17-2005, 09:23 PM   #66
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by k3smostwanted
yeah, i know it isnt a sports car like the 911, Z06, and soon to be GTR. thats EXACTLY what i was trying to convey to you and you went on a rave about how the mustang won 4 races in Grand-Am Cup, like that really matters.
...and when Ford might make a new GT350 we will have to discuss this but as it does not pertain to anything stated in this thread i find it quite idiotic to speak of it.

also, i was not inferring that the European cars are better than the GT...i was trying to show you that Ford dedicates its cars to selling, like any other car manufacturer. in Europe, they are not so set on 1/4mile performance...this is why ford makes different cars for them that actually have handling in mind while building the car. not an after thought...

it is the american economy that is so set on 1/4 mile performance and could care less about any other aspect of the car. so ford makes cars like the mustang for these people...they think about how well the car handles afterward. eventhough, the mustang is a good handling car for its price, throwing a larger motor in it will not make it compete with $70k sports cars around a track.

i dont even know what the problem is...you act as if i said that the mustang cant handle worth shit and the chevy aveo is on par with it. i simply stated that it cannot compete with the $70k sports cars listed above, which happen to be built for all around 'exotic, super car' like performance.
So people who buy Mustangs could care less about handling?

Anyways, the following is from Motor Trend May 2005:

"Drag racers prefer that old solid rear, and many have reinstalled them in last-generation IRS Mustang Cobras for reliability. But Thai-Tang didn't develop the new Mustangs--Shelby 500s by SVT or otherwise--to be straight-line performers."

"Hau Tai-Tang, the 2005 Mustang's chief program engineer, was handed the reins at SVT last fall."


Last edited by Jaguar D-Type; 07-17-2005 at 09:58 PM.
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Old 07-17-2005, 09:24 PM   #67
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by fairladyz_gt-r
Yea u should, the offical importer of BMW need a good kick in the ass. oh and ppl here don't go to anything but offical BMW service centre. and as for the bluebirds and cefiro, i don't what ur talking about but i have both the A32 and the A33 they run perfect (these car goes 50+km per day) we never having broken before. the only time that the A32 went in for a un-schudle service was when my cousin crash.

Hey, i never knew they were plenty of Skyline GT-R R34 in italy too

The only country that get them offically in Europe is The U.K.
There isn't, but I came from New Zealand, where there is a lot of them.



As for Cefiro's I generally meant the A31.
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Old 07-17-2005, 10:52 PM   #68
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaguar D-Type
So people who buy Mustangs could care less about handling?

Anyways, the following is from Motor Trend May 2005:

"Drag racers prefer that old solid rear, and many have reinstalled them in last-generation IRS Mustang Cobras for reliability. But Thai-Tang didn't develop the new Mustangs--Shelby 500s by SVT or otherwise--to be straight-line performers."

"Hau Tai-Tang, the 2005 Mustang's chief program engineer, was handed the reins at SVT last fall."

for the most part, people who buy mustangs do not have handling as the first thing on their mind.

and this confirms that people like the inferior solid axle and people who buy mustangs care more about drag racing than any other type of racing.

i never said that it is a strictly straight line performer...once again, i simply said it will not out handle $70k sports cars. i do not know what you are trying to prove anymore...as we both have came to the agreement that the mustang/gt500 will not out-handle the $70k sports cars listed in this thread.

the mustang handles rather well...but once AGAIN, it will NOT out-handle $70k sports cars. these cars are built to handle exceptional...not have decent handling thrown in the mix of good straight line performance.
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Old 07-17-2005, 11:23 PM   #69
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Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

I have no more argument, they did just what I wanted. Call me a typical american but I like the solid axel and I like that it will outhandle most cars without loosing the solid rear. To me its the closest you will get to 500 hp stock south of $40000. I don't think anyone will dislike this car, even if its not their favorite.
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Old 07-18-2005, 12:24 AM   #70
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You guys are really wrapped up in the handling of the GT500. I don't see how having a solid rear axle is such a downfall on the design. It has its strengths and its weaknesses in its design. It may be inferior if your putting it on a track, but not when its on the strip (as where most people will bring it).

I would compare the GTR with the type of cars that are more in its class for instance: the Z06, 997, 430, etc. Hell it may be totally different, but I guess it is just to early to really know what the GTR will pack. Call me biased, but I think the Z06 is going to blow them all away especially considering its base price being under 70k!
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Old 07-18-2005, 01:14 AM   #71
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Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by Kurtdg19
You guys are really wrapped up in the handling of the GT500. I don't see how having a solid rear axle is such a downfall on the design. It has its strengths and its weaknesses in its design. It may be inferior if your putting it on a track, but not when its on the strip (as where most people will bring it).

I would compare the GTR with the type of cars that are more in its class for instance: the Z06, 997, 430, etc. Hell it may be totally different, but I guess it is just to early to really know what the GTR will pack. Call me biased, but I think the Z06 is going to blow them all away especially considering its base price being under 70k!
wow...thank you for confirming what i have been preaching this entire last 2 pages. jeez...

the solid axle is fine...but it is inferior when it comes to comparing it to $70k performance cars. ford is doing a dandy job of building the car to suit the public but they are not building it to beat a corvette around a track. they are building it to give a cheaper alternative for those wanting straight line performance. it is rather innovative and a very smart marketing move if you ask me and i think it will sell very well in the US market.

i thinkt eh mustang GT is a rather mistifying car myself...how ford has used and professionalized the solid axle for so long and so many times, that they can get it to compte with such cars as the 350Z with far superior technology. its either embarassing that ford has been using it that long or it is rather impressive that a company is able to to do this...

anyways, bottom line has been stated over and over: the GT500 will not beat or even come close to a Z06, 911 or the upcoming GTR around a track. in 1/4 mile performance we can have a comparison...in any other, the GT500 is not being built for it.
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Old 07-18-2005, 04:38 AM   #72
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by Jimster
There isn't, but I came from New Zealand, where there is a lot of them.



As for Cefiro's I generally meant the A31.
I see what u mean.....

the A31 that are sold in new zeland are mostly the late 80's model with milage way way above 100,000, these car are mostly gather from lot in japan where they were sitting for age since no one in japan will buy a second hand car above 100,000km mark. same with the skyline
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Old 07-18-2005, 05:16 AM   #73
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by fairladyz_gt-r
I see what u mean.....

the A31 that are sold in new zeland are mostly the late 80's model with milage way way above 100,000, these car are mostly gather from lot in japan where they were sitting for age since no one in japan will buy a second hand car above 100,000km mark. same with the skyline
Yeah, the A31 was a bad car to start with in the first place, it was Nissans first real attempt at stuffing gadgets into a car but keeping it down to a price. Didn't work, at all.


I suppose A31's would be thin on the ground in NZ now days, partly due to them being illegal to import and partly because the drifter-lads have taken a particular liking to them.
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Old 07-18-2005, 05:22 AM   #74
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by Jimster
Yeah, the A31 was a bad car to start with in the first place, it was Nissans first real attempt at stuffing gadgets into a car but keeping it down to a price. Didn't work, at all.


I suppose A31's would be thin on the ground in NZ now days, partly due to them being illegal to import and partly because the drifter-lads have taken a particular liking to them.
Na...they are great car, in Thailand we have them all over the place they run fine. they are cheap to run and to maintain because they are plenty of part to swap from. the later model was basiclly a 4 door S13/R32. and i just love the look

I can understand why u have pretty bad opion on them, but u got to try have a new one or one that was kept nicely. these car then will really shine

Never buy a second hand car exported from Japan, beacuse these car are the one that no Japanese want soo they are basiclly a non-cut 1/2cut (u get what i am getting at?)
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Old 07-18-2005, 02:41 PM   #75
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Re: Re: Too early for GT500 vs '07 Skyline GTR?

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Originally Posted by k3smostwanted
i thinkt eh mustang GT is a rather mistifying car myself...how ford has used and professionalized the solid axle for so long and so many times, that they can get it to compte with such cars as the 350Z with far superior technology. its either embarassing that ford has been using it that long or it is rather impressive that a company is able to to do this...
I don't see why it would be embarrasing considering you forget this new chassis that the 05-up Mustangs sit on was designed around an IRS read-end.

But the public outcry about having a straight-axle was so great that Ford mid-stream went and spent more time and money to actually create a whole new solid-axled to fit into this chassis.

So as long as sales are up which they are 70% increase from 04 to 05. And the customers who buy the cars get what they want.... What does Ford have to be ashamed of?
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