2005 cavalier 2.2ecotec cranks no start (until it does, then repeat)

[kenman1717]

Car was brought in, no information was given by customer except starting problem. I went to start it to see what the problem was, cranks but won't start. Tried 5 or 6 times, even in clear flood mode(pedal to floor to shut fuel off) nothing then on like the 6th time fired right up and ran great. Drove it around, then into shop and shut it off, same thing then it started after like the 6th key cycle. I tried checking fuel pressure, but got 0, but I think its my gauge, have been having problems. fuel does spray out port when pressed. When I was scanning it and had the key on the fuel pump relay was going nuts under the hood, so I swapped it for the a/c relay and it stopped going nuts. but now it only cranks and occasionaly kicks a bit. No codes except for a loss of class 2 serial data and loss comm with cluster. Not sure if that has anything to do with it.

[Tech II]

See if it starts with carb cleaner sprayed into the throttle body......if it starts and runs while spraying, you either have a fuel pressure problem, or the injectors are not firing(Security problem)......check for B2958 or B2960....

[kenman1717]

My boss had me take the car out to do another job I had parts for. Anyway, I found that if I cycled the key about 3 times without trying to start it, priming the fuel pump it would fire right up, and I noticed if I tried to restart it as soon as I shut it off it would fire right back up, but if I waited 30 seconds or more, just cranking like crazy. I monitored everything I could on the scan tool while it was running, injectors seem to be working fine electronically, o2 sensors working, short term fuel trim around 0, long term bounces between -4 and -7, temp seems to match up, timing about 6degrees, cam and crank sensor reading about the same. No codes other than the no serial communication, a couple history codes for the shifter and cluster. Fuel pump turns on when key turned on, but I'm wondering if its bleeding down on pressure.

oh and I did notice that when cranking the security light stays on about 10 seconds then goes out, but isn't on any other time and definitely no security codes.

EDIT: ok I'm really confused, I tried another fuel pressure gauge, same thing when about the 3rd time I cycled the key it shot up to 58psi and the car fired right up and didn't drop below 55 while cranking, spec is 50-60psi according to alldata. but I found that if I shut it off, gauge would not drop but it wouldn't restart until about 5 key cycles then the gauge would drop to 30 and come back to 58 and start right up. Tried my gauge again which is snapon, other one is napa, just to see if any difference, about 1 psi but it acted the same. I think there is a check valve in these gauges so the pressure didn't bleed off. even after I unhooked both gauges they stayed at 55psi, had to hook up the hose that had that fuel release button for the gauges to drop.

[Tech II]

Try replacing the fuel filter?

Also pull vac line off f/p regulator, checking for fuel.....

[harleyguy]

I always pull the valve you will never know if psi holds witth it in there. To me it sounds like the hose on the fuel pump is cracked and bleeding out psi.

[kenman1717]

Customer didn't want to do anything I quoted the pump, filter, regulator and relay, but the customer decided they didn't want to do anything, apparently the car has a bunch of other problems and it has about 250 000kms. I mean honestly when I started diag I knew it wouldn't be worth it. I mean its an old cavalier and in the rust belt, even when those cars are in great shape are only worth $500 or less, so any repairs to them are not worth it, I guess that's why people use them as winter beaters. thanks anyway.