Electric forced air induction?

[gmatov]

NO, no, no.

I don't, really, know what you are trying to say. A leaf blower has such a heavy impellor that it takes too much time to spin up?

A turbo has the lag we are talking about. It takes time for the exhaust gases to get the turbine side to move.

An electric motor, if we are talking electric, goes to the next speed with an almost indiscernible lag. Try your 3 speed fan. Push the button or turn the switch, it almost instantly goes faster.

Look, I said, way back when, that this could be called silly.

BUT, I don't care what you say, any additional air WILL help.

Christ, go back to WWII, Buzz Bombs, V2s, Ram Jets, they fired off ,gained speed, going fast meant the air in front of the engine was being compessed, since the engine was going so fast the air in it couldn't push that air aside so that it had normal air pressure for combustion.

You want to argue for argument's sake, okey-dokey, I'll argue with you all day long.

You just wanna tell the OP he's an ass, you're wrong. Period. And an exclamation point to boot!

Cheers,

George

[Hit_N_Run-player]

........if this works so great, do it then for yourself and show us a dynosheet..

[gmatov]

Dyno sheet?

Hell, I'm an old man, not into all that modding, even if my NA Audi was low compression.

Have you guys been to the site with the electric super charger, read the specs, seen the warnings that low compression pistons would have to be installed?

Some of you guys are being realistic about this, a few are just trying to throw roadblocks in the way.

I still have not said it was a good idea, but it is not implausible.

I don't think the OP wants to go from 200 to 400 HP. He wants a little more efficiency at the complete range of RPMs.

Turbos, expensive, requiring much modification, electronics, etc., you are not gonna do it without a package designed for YOUR auto.

Electric suprcharger, Knight, etc, asks a 1000 bucks for a deposit, what's the whole shmear cost? And, it runs on caps.

When some of you write that a super, turbo-charger, doesn't move air, it "compresses" it, you're being silly. It compresses it only to the extent that it is providing enough air, in some cases, more, than the engine needs, to keep atmospheric at the throttle plates.

When an engine sucks too little air, it gasps. The less air going through the carb, or through/over the mass air flow sensor, the less fuel, so your engine poops out.

Fact of life. You're not gonna change it.

Add some air, get some gain.

Cheers,

George

[nissanfanatic]

Yep, but how much air does a leaf blower flow when its blocked off? Not much. Thats the difference with a turbocharger. It compresses air when its blocked off. It will still flow air when air backs up in the manifold(boost). As long as its sized properly for the amount of air that the engine can inhale, the turbo will continue to flow air. The leaf blower on the other hand, will poop out. Most don't flow enough to keep up anyways so your $100 powertrip ends early at about 2500rpm.

Lag is the time it takes for the engine to reach the RPM where enough air is moved throught he engine to spool the turbo. A lot fo things can cause this. Rotational inertia, turbine housing size, impeller design(turbine), manifold design(believe it or not, logs acutally spool sooner tubulars just make more power), downpipe/ehxaust size, intake tracting, engine tune, ect.

What I was saying, before you continued to tell me how turbocharger impellers work/are made/out of what, is that the impeller inside a leaf blower is very large supporting decent leaf moving flow at a low RPM. It isn't spinning fast enough to create any boost or move any air. It isn't designed to either. Not balanced properly, diffuser prolly isn't designed right, and neither is the housing. Compressor impellers rest less than approx. 1/16" from the compressor housing(saabjohan could chime in here as I've never measured/read this). Last time I looked at my blower, it was approx. an inch away from the housing. So, uh, this isn't gonna work without more work/money than it would cost to use an average turbo and be happy.

[Hit_N_Run-player]

Originally Posted by gmatov

Turbos, expensive, requiring much modification, electronics, etc., you are not gonna do it without a package designed for YOUR auto.

This is very wrong. Many instances will not require any electronic tuning or buying a new ECU after turbocharging and running a basic setup. And putting togethor your own setup is more effecient and cheaper than buying a kit IMO...

[nissanfanatic]

I run 9.5:1 compression ratio(comes out to be 180psi compression) on my car. 6psi from a T04B Garrett turbocharger(about to be 9psi and prolly 13psi for dyno runs after a tuned ECU with 615cc injectors). Pump gas.

[nissanfanatic]

My kit is completely pieced together.

Most recent engine shot



and all the photos. You can kinda tell the most recent ones from the old.

http://nissaninfiniticlub.net/photop...0&ppuser=19378

lol, I'm a young guy. Clocking in at a rather high 18 years old. But I rate people on what they know and nothing else. I won't even use expirience as a factor in an arguement.

[Hit_N_Run-player]

i was hoping you would chime in on the not piecing togethor a kit comment thats what im doing..slowly

[gmatov]

Nissan,

Do you refuse to understand what I am trying to say?

NO centrifugal pump, whether air or liquid, can build pressure when it reaches its max. I do not care whether it is a vac or a super duper Garrett Turbo. Unless it puts out more than any normal centrifugal air compressor can, or is multi stage, you are stuck.

A centrifugal pump on a firetruck will go to 100 PSI and churn. You will have 100 PSI available, but you have to open the nozzle to get any work out of it, ie, move water.

Take your turbo, disconnect from the intake, put your hand over the delivery end, the output, and you will most likely shut it down, unless you are a wump.

It will put out X PSI, and stop, keeping the pressure in the plenum at X PSI, because it is still trying to push air, and not allowing any air to get back past the impellor.

Are ye all daft? Can you not understand this? The pressure in the discharge does not fall to Zero because you stuck your mitt over the discharge. You had 2 or 3 or 167 PSI, it is still there. Take your hand off the discharge. It doesn't take time to build pressure up again, or volume.

Nissan, believe it or not, a 16th of an inch is unacceptible in turbos, or air compressors.

If you had said 2 thousandths of an inch clearance, I would have given you a little of the benefit of the doubt.

You obviously know little of air compressors.

You THINK you know much about air movers, but, again, anytime you move air, you are compressing it into either a reservoir, or a restriction, such as an air intake, or an air nozzle, with a trigger.

Lag is the time for the turbo to spool up to where it can feed the engine enough air to get boost, not for the engine to get to high enough RPM to SPOOL the TURBO. Where the hell you been, boy? Get your nomenclature right, at least.

Those who buy a kit that does not require any of the following:

"Many instances will not require any electronic tuning or buying a new ECU after turbocharging and running a basic setup. And putting togethor your own setup is more effecient and cheaper than buying a kit IMO"

are buying a pig in a poke.

Do as you will. No skin off my nose.

Cheers,

George

Better you should buy a 100 buck leafblower, IMO.

[nissanfanatic]

You're right, I don't know anything.

[nissanfanatic]

Lag is the time for the turbo to spool up to where it can feed the engine enough air to get boost, not for the engine to get to high enough RPM to SPOOL the TURBO. Where the hell you been, boy? Get your nomenclature right, at least.

So, uh, what do you consider what happens when you punch the gas in 5th gear at 2k and no boost, but when you hit 4k, you reach full boost? What do you call that RPM range between idle and 4K?

And you just explained why a leaf blower will not make any power on a car...

You're right, I shoud just pull all the shit off my car and accept that I know jack about cars. I have been reading on this stuff, listening to non-A hole people like Hypsi, Saabjohan, Formula, and the rest of the "decent" people on here for a little bit. But I should just accept it was all in vein because some douche comes on here and has a hard time trying to explain his point of view to someone about a subject with absolutely dick relevence as he knows it has no potenital to work in the first place.

Cheers...

BEtter you should stick to not modding cars.

[gmatov]

Watch your tach, next time you punch it at 2k in 5th.

Since you're in overdrive, in most vehicles, you don't have the power to build RPMs quick enough to get the exhaust spinning the turbo fast to get much boost, although it is still building turns, and it is providing more air.

But you are also sucking that air in, so it doesn't show on your BAR guage.

Put it in 3rd at 2k and punch it, you'll raise the revs so fast that in a second or 3 you'll be at maximum boost, since you DO now have the muscle to spin your tires. RPM rises fast, exhaust rises even faster, turbo spins faster, so fast your wastegate opens.

Back in 5th at 80 MPH on the level, your guage will probably drop back down to about 1 BAR, since you're not working the engine hard, just cruising, even though it IS still pushing air, not compressing it, as per your definition.

I'm gonna stick to not modding cars.

Better than pictures, though, and yours are nice, how about some dyno sheets on your Nissan project. I doubt you have any "pre", but "after" stats should compare favourably with an un-modded engine to see if you have made much difference.

I didn't start the leaf blower chat, kiddo. I just added comments and figures on , them, and tried to educate you on the principle of moving and compressing air.

What's the name and model of your turbo? I'd like to see the spec sheet on it.

Cheers,

George

[nissanfanatic]

It runs at like 1-2psi all the way until I hit 3.5k and then its hold on.

1/4 times were with 5psi unintercooled with a stock coil that was going out. It sputtered like crazy toward the end of the track. I ran a 15.3@93mph. Sorry I don't have any dyno sheets. As I said before, I'm about to buy a Jim Wolf Tech ECU so I don't really see any point to spending $100 for a couple dyno runs right now plus I don't wanna spend the money right now.

Turbo model is a Garrett T04B .60ar S-Trim compressor/.69ar P-Trim turbine.

I know it has made a massive difference. Wheelspin is an issue up to 45mph whereas it wasn't really an issue at all before. I say its making at least 200whp and about the same torque.

Air/Fuels are 12.5:1 so its running decent. Timing is handled via MSD BTM with 3/8* of retard per psi starting at 3psi.

I'm only doing 6psi now. Mods include...

Revhard log manifold
Turbonetics evolution 35mm wastegate
Boostdesigns FMIC kit
greddy type S
IAP oil lines
Custom 3" Stainless downpipe fabricated by me
3" Apexi exhaust
K&N filter
ACT clutch
PLX M-300 wideband
Vortech 8:1 Fuel Management Unit
Walbro 255lph fuel pump
and some more I'm sure.

But the turbo won't even spool unless I'm at 3.5K and I push the pedal at least 50%. Obviously less if I'm at a higher RPM. I wanted exactly that because it drives so smooth this way. I never hit boost unless I want to. But when I do, it hits hard.

Thank you for being much more polite.

[Hit_N_Run-player]

i doubt you would be able to put your hand over your compressor outlet, if thats what your trying to say. That would mean you would have enough force to hold your exhaust from leaving your manifold, since that same force creates the inertia and power to move the compressor blade... yeah, sure....thats not what you were trying to say was it gmatov? And when i stick my hand over my leaf blower it dies out, if a weak guy like me can stop the pressure, i doubt it will be enough to sufficiently add power to your engine..

[gmatov]

"Where the hell you been, boy?"

Nissan, if you are refering to the above, which is the only post I have made that I think could have pissed you off, it's an anachronistic question that an old guy would ask a young guy. Kinda like a "jag", if you understand that.

Good on you that it is working for you.

I have been to other sites stressing turbos that do not give the best results for aftermarket "add-ons".

Unfortunately, they promise the sun and stars, and are barely able to deliver the moon, and at a really, really, high cost, like 10 grand, plus.

"I ran a 15.3@93mph." Is this supposed to be a 1/4 in 15.3 seconds?

If that's so, performance has gone to hell. I used to run a '65 Merc Monterey convertible, all 4500 pounds of it, faster, with a 400 cid carbureted engine. 3 speed auto, to boot.

Cheers,

George