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Old 04-11-2005, 04:22 PM   #61
DRW1000
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

I would suggest that as long as it is not "melting" the plenum it should be okay.
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Old 04-11-2005, 04:52 PM   #62
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Don't forget to clean the EGR ports. I was just thinking that gasoline might be a good cleaner.

I was wondering if the reason it is suggested not to clean the throttle body have more to do with the "plastic" plenum than the throttle body itself.

When I did my isolator bolts I noticed that my EGR ports were not very dirty. About 3 months ago I sprayed throttle body cleaner into my EGR intake intake thinking it may clean it. I wonder if it did any good.
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Old 04-11-2005, 08:38 PM   #63
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thanks again drw1000 for all your help..
I got it done ....everything went fairly well I had trouble with the spark plugs what a pain....
bad design if you ask me...
taking the cowl off was easy enough...though I had a cliip snap on the splash guard....
I also had 1 bolt on the plenum seem to not tighten enough..I was scared to break it and I dont think it was stripped but I torqued them to about 10 to 15 ft lbs...I think thats what was suggested...
thanks again to pcitizen !!
without your website I dont know if I would have tried this ....hopefully it will run good for a while now....
cya
Dave
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Old 04-11-2005, 09:40 PM   #64
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Glad to help Dave from London. I'm in Mississauga so we are pretty much neighbours.

I think you are now the resident expert (having most recently done the work)

Yeah those plugs were a pain in the arse. At least they weren't seized. That was my biggest worry.

Did you replace the rubber seals too? Were you amazed at the pools of oil in the plenum? How were your EGR ports? Did you bother with the valve cover and Fuel regulator hose? (I didn't bother with the valve cover and my regulator hos was tight.)
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Old 04-11-2005, 10:33 PM   #65
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Re: Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

There was alot of oil on top of the isolator bolts...
I did replace the 6 port seals and the top half seal gasket but not the valve cover....it was around $100.00 kind of a ripoff I think....not sure if I will replace it or not...
the worst part was not knowing what to clean everything with, I didnt want to use anything that will corode the gaskets or bolts etc...
some of the vacuum lines were hard to get at also...
cya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRW1000
Glad to help Dave from London. I'm in Mississauga so we are pretty much neighbours.

I think you are now the resident expert (having most recently done the work)

Yeah those plugs were a pain in the arse. At least they weren't seized. That was my biggest worry.

Did you replace the rubber seals too? Were you amazed at the pools of oil in the plenum? How were your EGR ports? Did you bother with the valve cover and Fuel regulator hose? (I didn't bother with the valve cover and my regulator hos was tight.)
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Old 06-29-2005, 11:09 PM   #66
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tsb 03-16-1

My windstar is a 3.0. Is the TSB 03-16-1 the same as the 3.8 or does p0171/174 mean something totally different for me?
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Old 06-30-2005, 09:12 AM   #67
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Well the 171/174 means that you have a lean condition on both banks. The same as any OBD11 vehicle. However the root cause is most likely different. The TSB does not apply to your vehilce (as far as i know).

I would suspect any or all of the following:
-low fuel pressure
-faulty MAF readings
-Intake Leak
-Vacuum leak

I will double check the TSB tonight to ensure that the 3.0 is not covered but I am 98% sure it does not.
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Old 07-01-2005, 11:32 AM   #68
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

I have a 1998 windstar GL with 180000 km on it. I have had no trouble with it to now and by the sounds of it I am lucky. I am getting codes of P0171 system adaptive fuel too lean bank #1, P1131 lack of HO2S switches-sensors indicate lean, P0133 upstream heated O2 sensor circuit slow response bank #1, P0306 cylinder #6 misfire detected. I have tested EGR valve, DPFE, TPS, MAF, VSS, IAV, these tested fine to the haynes book. I have also changed fuel filter, upper intake gaskets, upstream O2 sensor bank #1, plugs, plug wires, coil pack, pcv and hose for pcv. I have brought it to two garages and they both say the head gasket. I did my own compression test and all the front cylinders read 115 to 125psi. I get good compression on the front side but #6 cylinder misfires. At idle I can pull off #6 and #5 plug wire with no real reaction from the engine (one at a time) when I pull #4 plug wire off, the engine drops idle to almost a stall. The garages did not do a leak down test so how do they know it is the head gasket. This all stared when at a stop the engine would rev up to 1200 rpm then slow down to idle and it has got to when turning a corner it stalls. I changed the O2 bank one sensor 1 the other day and the cel is still off. But I still have spark knock. I was wondering does that tsb apply to the 3.8L 1998. I have changed the gaskets for the match between the upper and lower intake but not the isolator bolts. I also borrowed a vacuum leak tester best thing invented. It pointed me in the general vicinity. So I started reaching in behind the upper intake towards fire wall. I reach along and hit the evr and the engine reved up. I don't know if it is the evr or the vacuum lines. I am wondering if I should change the dpfe, isolator bolts, valve cover if needed and the lower intake gasket. If the valve cover is the new style would the lower intake gasket be the new one or is there a way to tell. Sorry about the long post.
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Old 07-01-2005, 03:33 PM   #69
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Re: Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRW1000
Well the 171/174 means that you have a lean condition on both banks. The same as any OBD11 vehicle. However the root cause is most likely different. The TSB does not apply to your vehilce (as far as i know).

I would suspect any or all of the following:
-low fuel pressure
-faulty MAF readings
-Intake Leak
-Vacuum leak

I will double check the TSB tonight to ensure that the 3.0 is not covered but I am 98% sure it does not.
okay verified.......................The TSB does NOT include the 3.0 l engine.
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Old 07-03-2005, 11:53 AM   #70
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

I checked everything over this weekend and I am still puzzled. The TSB is there one for the 98. My valve cover has the hole in it what else has to be changed. My engine has pinging, missfire and rough idle.
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Old 07-03-2005, 12:11 PM   #71
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

1. Double check to make sure you don't have crossed plug wires. Do you have hi-voltage leaks from cables?
2. Vacuum leaks. Isolate as much "vacuum load" from the intake manifold that you can to see if idle improves.
3. Using electronics cleaner, clean the MAF and IAT sensors in the intake air stream.
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Old 07-03-2005, 12:50 PM   #72
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

I have changed plugs on that cylinder with one that is firing. I have also changed injectors with on that is working still the same missfire on #6. I have changed plug wires and coil pack. O2 sensor Bank 1 sensor 1. Cleaned egr ports check Maf, iac, tps, dpfe, egr valve, evr they are all working with in parameters set by the haynes book. I was wondering if I can close of the vacuum lines to the upper intake manifold and see if it runs better. I think I have a vacuum leak in behind I can here a faint whistle. I have sprayed carb cleaner and ether back there it changed rpm once but I can not get it to do it again to pin point the leak. I want to try isolating each vacuum line one at a time to see if I can make the whistle stop.
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Old 07-03-2005, 01:04 PM   #73
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Try plugging off the EVR solenoid valve. This device sucks in a little atmosphere to regulate a vacuum signal to the EGR valve. Could be its sucking too much atmosphere.
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Old 07-03-2005, 03:54 PM   #74
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

I ran into something very strange today. I bought oil stabilizer fuel treatment. I put all that in and when I got home I tried something. When the cel started to flash I played around with #5 and #6 fuel injector connectors. I took #6 off no difference then took #5 off engine drop a little. Then I put #6 on #5 no difference. Then I put #6 back on and was playing with it with #5 off. All of a sudden #6 started to fire after about 30 sec. Then I put #5 on the engine would run on all 6 for 15 sec then die off again. #6 missfiring again. Has anyone had this problem if so what was it.
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Old 07-03-2005, 05:31 PM   #75
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Re: Codes 171 & 174 TSB # 03-16-1 update

Have you listened to the injectors using a short length of hose? Sounds to me like you are close to finding the problem.
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