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Old 08-08-2003, 12:36 PM   #16
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Question

Kerbie,

Thanks for your thoughts on this matter.

You are not the first one to mention that " Ferraris on the other hand are exotic italian cars made by hand".

I know that this was surely true in the past, when Mr. Enzo Ferrari was alive and leading the company.

Currently, as far as I know, Ferrari is run by some suit from FIAT, that has a piece of it (FIAT) sold to GM.

If this trend continues, don't you think that Ferraris will have the same destiny as, for example, Jaguar? Jaguar X-type uses the Ford Mondeo as the basis, is mostly done by machines, and still carries a Jaguar price tag.

I really hope that this does not happen to Ferrari, but I think there is a risk there.

Thoughts? SDSCAN
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Old 08-08-2003, 06:26 PM   #17
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In response to the Jag bit,

Jag is one of those comapnies liek BMW, Lexus, Audi, MBZ that offer something entry level and go all the way up to something that can stop you in mid stride.

The X-type is one of those cars like the C230 Kopmpressor, IS300 and even 3 series. It's easy to build, bears the comapny name and usually puts a damn good package together in general. These cars also sell extremeyl well, thus increasing their demand. If you worked otu the numbers, human labour couldn't put out these cars as fast or as well as Fujimotosaki AT-4560 car assemble, it just wouldn't be profitable.

However, a great dela of their upper models still have a number of hand made elements, and these cars are also produced in a much lower volume. I suppose to make it crystal clear about tihngs like the X-type, just think about this, Amongst other reasons, entry level luxury cars cannot be mass-produced by human labour for simple financial reasons, a company cannot afford to produce enough cars to meet the demand through means of such labour, we simply can't work fast or well enough to do it and turn a profit.

With this in mind, don't think that these cars diminish in quality, these companies only do it with machines and other platforms for the reason I said above, well that and larger profits, but the X-type is a great car, and liek Ferrari, a Jag badge can usually fatten the MSRP somewhat. It's the inescapable curse of brand loyalty.
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Any car built by "Dr. Technology" is probably not worth $5000
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Old 08-09-2003, 08:12 PM   #18
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I believe one should compare a car's warranty with it's direct competitor's. BMW, Audi (Non-Lambo) are not Ferrari's competition.
Compare the 360 to Gallardo.
Compare the 575 to the Vanquish.

Until Ferrari no longer has a long waiting list, don't expect warranties to be improved.

By using the logic that the longer the warranty, the better the car, then I suppose the Hyundai is the best of the bunch. Hyundai -- the dream car of every red-blooded american male.
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Old 08-11-2003, 10:30 AM   #19
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Red face

Good points above by Porsche and Shadow.

But, how do I know if, by buying a 360, my money is not going to a glorified FIAT/GM car?

Can someone say, for sure, that not a single component in a 360 Modena did not come from FIAT or GM?

I am having a hard time believing in that.
Again, I am talking about the 360 Modena, and not about previous Ferrari models.

Thanks, SDSCAN
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Old 08-11-2003, 02:43 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by SDSCAN
Good points above by Porsche and Shadow.

But, how do I know if, by buying a 360, my money is not going to a glorified FIAT/GM car?

Can someone say, for sure, that not a single component in a 360 Modena did not come from FIAT or GM?

I am having a hard time believing in that.
Again, I am talking about the 360 Modena, and not about previous Ferrari models.

Thanks, SDSCAN
Every part of any car isn't made in house, but you can bet the parts that matter, that make a Modena a Ferrari are.
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Old 08-11-2003, 05:02 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by Veyron


Every part of any car isn't made in house, but you can bet the parts that matter, that make a Modena a Ferrari are.
Quite true.

However SDSCAN, you seme overly concerned with what a Ferrari isn't rather than what it is. Every time I see a 360, my heart races like the V-8 tucked behind, I never understood that whole glorified FIAT bit with Ferraris. I hear it form to time time with my beloved Porsches, being glorified VW's. Some people can appreciate these beauties, some can't.


As many people have (mostly me) in this thread, it is passion and a lot of money that sells these cars, most people don't buy them with the fear of them being a glorified product of their parent company, they buy them for thier love of the marque.

I don't know know if you're a prospective buyer or not, but you just seem very concerned about a Ferrari not being a Ferrari. Although the days of Enzo and Le Mans are gone, Ferraris are still ferraris, ask any owner.
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Old 08-12-2003, 09:13 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Porsche
...I never understood that whole glorified FIAT bit with Ferraris. I hear it form to time time with my beloved Porsches, being glorified VW's. Some people can appreciate these beauties, some can't.

As many people have (mostly me) in this thread, it is passion and a lot of money that sells these cars, most people don't buy them with the fear of them being a glorified product of their parent company, they buy them for thier love of the marque....
People who say things like Ferraris being glorified Fiats or being related in any way to GM products don't understand the automotive industry.

Fiat Auto and Ferrari SpA are both owned by Fiat SpA and this is a bit confusing to the average person. The people who get confused by this are the same folks who think Mitsubishi TVs and Mitsubishi cars have any connection beyond the same parent company. It's all in the same names being used for different companies. You never see people wondering if GE aircraft engines are being assembled by the cast of NBC's TV show Friends...even though they're both owned by the same company.

Fiat Auto has no direct connection to Ferrari SpA. If Ferrari SpA uses any of the same parts as a Fiat car, it's because Ferrari SpA bought them from the same supplier.

General Motors owns 20% (although this percentage is now in debate) of Fiat Auto. Fiat SpA owns 5% of GM. GM has no direct relation to Ferrari SpA at all. Fiat SpA owns about 80% of Fiat Auto and about 60% of Ferrari SpA. GM owns NONE of Ferrari SpA.
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Old 08-14-2003, 12:49 PM   #23
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Cool

Quote:
Originally posted by Hudson


People who say things like Ferraris being glorified Fiats or being related in any way to GM products don't understand the automotive industry.

Fiat Auto and Ferrari SpA are both owned by Fiat SpA and this is a bit confusing to the average person. The people who get confused by this are the same folks who think Mitsubishi TVs and Mitsubishi cars have any connection beyond the same parent company. It's all in the same names being used for different companies. You never see people wondering if GE aircraft engines are being assembled by the cast of NBC's TV show Friends...even though they're both owned by the same company.

Fiat Auto has no direct connection to Ferrari SpA. If Ferrari SpA uses any of the same parts as a Fiat car, it's because Ferrari SpA bought them from the same supplier.

General Motors owns 20% (although this percentage is now in debate) of Fiat Auto. Fiat SpA owns 5% of GM. GM has no direct relation to Ferrari SpA at all. Fiat SpA owns about 80% of Fiat Auto and about 60% of Ferrari SpA. GM owns NONE of Ferrari SpA.
Hudson, thanks for the clarification.

I agree when you state that this is confusing to the average person, myself included. You need at least a PHD to figure all this out.

So, I heard that Parmalat (or was it Danone?) was planning to buy a piece of FIAT SpA. Just kidding, of course.

Regards, SDSCAN
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Old 05-02-2004, 04:00 AM   #24
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Re: Ferrari: a piece of junk behind an expensive badge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SDSCAN

I'd like to know if any of the forum members could help me.
First, the facts about Ferrari, BMW, and AUDI Warranties (taken from public Web sites):

Given the pricetag for a Ferrari, I think a 3 year warranty is just pathetic (not to mention the 2 year for the 456 and 550). If their cars are so great, why not go beyond the 4 years that BMW and AUDI offer?

I think the phrase taken from the AUDI site tells a lot: "Only those who build cars this well dare to back them so comprehensively."

Hoping that someone can prove me wrong, SDSCAN
SD,

Why do you think that Ferrari even cares about what BMW and Audi are doing with their warranties? As it has been stated before there is no comparison. Someone stated that if you were to buy a car or consider its quality based on warranty, then a Hyundai would be the best car on the planet.

The simple fact is that a Ferrari costs more to make because of the way its built. It costs more to maintain because of the way the parts are made, the relative rarity of the parts and the technology that goes into them.

If you want to know how reliable the cars are I would be happy to enlighten you...

I have a 2000 360 Modena. It has 75,000 miles on it roughly. I have driven it hard at times and easy at others but really no different than I have driven my past Porsches or BMW. The overall cost of maintenance as a percentage of the original cost of the car is about the same. The big difference is the overall driving pleasure I get from the car. I have enjoyed my other cars but nothing is like owning a Ferrari. You are not paying money for a badge, but for a piece of automotive art!!

Every car has a niche that it fills. They all have a cost and to the true car afficionado, its worth every penny spent.

Oompa
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Old 05-04-2004, 09:05 AM   #25
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Old 05-07-2004, 02:37 PM   #26
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Re: Ferrari: a piece of junk behind an expensive badge?

and well, if you're worrying about the costs then i don't think you should even be thinking about buying a ferrari.

i always dream about buying a 365 boxer one day but everytime i hear about exhaust problems and the costs related to those six lovely pipes....
my heart tremors.
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Old 05-15-2004, 02:13 AM   #27
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Re: Re: Ferrari: a piece of junk behind an expensive badge?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiley_Oompa
SD,
I have a 2000 360 Modena. It has 75,000 miles on it roughly. I have driven it hard at times and easy at others but really no different than I have driven my past Porsches or BMW.
Oompa
Damn that's quite a few miles for a Ferrari. btw is it an F1 or a manual?
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Old 06-08-2004, 03:14 PM   #28
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I would think that when you buy a Ferrari, you are not too much worried about the cost of up keep. You already have money in the bank for those things.
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Old 06-13-2015, 07:45 AM   #29
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Re: Ferrari: a piece of junk behind an expensive badge?

I would like to get my 2 cents worth of rather $2.00. I have owned many cars(20+) over the years from my current 2013 Mustang 5.0 to my first 1962 Impala station wagon. I have never bought a used or new car based on warranty. Hyundai and KIA both sell cars with 10year warranties. This isn't because there bad cars there far from the Excell's and Sephia's of the 90's. The Ferrari's of today have come a long long way also. There not the finicky unreliable break down prone car that needed a mechanic on the payroll to own car of yesterday. Ferrari comes with just a 3 year unlimited mileage bumper2bumper,power train and roadside assistance but also comes with a new for 2015-7 year maintenance (what it includes not sure) warranty.The quality,reliability and technology makes cars today the most advanced,most powerful and cleanest running ever.Today we have 400hp-700hp muscle cars super cars pump out 700hp-1000hp the family sedan has 250hp-300hp. The Mustang,Corvette doubled horsepower in the last 20 years from 215hp-430hp for the Mustang 300hp-650hp for Corvette and Ferrari went from 350hp v8 to there 600hp v8. What's up next 500hp family sedans? 750hp pickup trucks? 1500hp super cars?? The warranties haven't got longer because the cars have become better. Where will it end???
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Old 07-02-2016, 02:49 AM   #30
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Re: Ferrari: a piece of junk behind an expensive badge?

I have been detailing exotic cars for years. One thing I can tell you is many race cars' engines are rebuilt very often. Ferraris are race cars. Most owners floor it and race it whenever they can, we are talking high tolerances. See how long any car lasts when you floor it often. I understand that the maintenance cost of Ferrari ownership has been reduced and are more reliable machines than they used to be.
But it is a race car, and bought to be used as so. I'm surprised they offer the warranty they do, knowing how the cars will be driven. I understand that Porsche, Mercedes AMG, and M series BMW's are all engineered extremely well and are highly reliable, and the best sport cars for the road and city driving, but they are not Ferraris'.
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