2003 Viper

[Viper 10]

Originally posted by crayzayjay
Viper 10>

you sound like you know vipers very well, but that statement just doesnt hold, im sorry. Porsche has the most successful racing history of all time, thats a fact. i wouldnt call chrysler a more dominant racing firm than ferrari either....
and for what its worth, the new viper looks ok , but not a patch on the old one... oh ya, and if someone drives a passat or regular car, it doesnt take away their right to call ANY car ugly if they think it is.. like i said, i dont think the new viper is spectacular, and i dont drive a supercar... its just my opinion

cheers,
jay

Jay:

While I consider myself a road racer more than anything else, I have to correct you on your assessment of Porsche or Ferrari's racing dominance. You can trace Porsche's success in spurts during 50's 70's and part of the 80's. Porsche was getting it's butt handed to them through the 90's and to date. They were getting beaten so badly that they rigged their own challenge series and dropped down in classes in Le Mans IMSA and dropped out of Trans Am. The dominance that was being referred to has more to do about being a dominant powerplant as compared to the dominance by a manufacturer, as much as anything else.

Ferrari is race bred engineering. They had huge successes in the 50's and 60's. They were by no means competitive in any other series other than F1. They have only returned to a dominant position in F1 because of Schumacher and the addition of EFI traction control systems (replacing their home grown Italian fuel management/ignition system). They have not dominated the F1 series or any other series like Mopar.

On the other hand, NHRA has been dominated by Mopar since its inception in the 50's. Their Hemi powerplants continue to this day as being the best and most efficient engine in the history of drag racing. Look at every famous driver and you will find a Mopar behind them. Garlits, Prudhome, McEwan, Muldowney, Bernstein, Force...they ALL run Mopar. They may run other manufacturers bodies, but they all run Mopar powerplants.

Their track record in Nascar is almost as dominant. Since the inception of the stock car (which by the way began in the South with moonshine runners) the Dodge has been the dominant powerplant of choice. Ask anyone that follows Nascar history and the will tell you that Mopar has been there and been banned in every generation of the series. Do you realize that Chevy and Ford both have tried (to no avail) to copy the Hemi designs? Ford actually got a Boss 429 to the track and raced before they were banned. No other powerplant can get more power and durability than the Mopars. Mopars had cars that were modified going well over 230 mph in the 60's with the Superbirds on bias ply tires! Only in the last 10 years has Ford and Chevy become competitive in the series (by banning much of the developments of Mopar). Even during the bankruptcy era for Chrysler of the late 80's early 90's, they were still dominating on many race series.

Check this ut Nascar Wars

I am by no means a Chrysler bigot, just because I drive a Viper. I will say that I have taken your position in the past and was shot down when someone taught me about Chrysler's racing history.

I hope that this sheds some light on Chrysler's racing history. I'll try to dig up more to add to this good debate.

Brad

[Viper 10]

Originally posted by crayzayjay
Viper 10>

you sound like you know vipers very well, but that statement just doesnt hold, im sorry. Porsche has the most successful racing history of all time, thats a fact. i wouldnt call chrysler a more dominant racing firm than ferrari either....
and for what its worth, the new viper looks ok , but not a patch on the old one... oh ya, and if someone drives a passat or regular car, it doesnt take away their right to call ANY car ugly if they think it is.. like i said, i dont think the new viper is spectacular, and i dont drive a supercar... its just my opinion

cheers,
jay

Jay:

While I consider myself a road racer more than anything else, I have to correct you on your assessment of Porsche or Ferrari's racing dominance. You can trace Porsche's success in spurts during 50's 70's and part of the 80's. During this time the factory team and the privateers were running the Porsche badge. Porsche was getting it's butt handed to them through the 90's and to date. They were getting beaten so badly that they rigged their own challenge series and dropped down in classes in Le Mans IMSA and dropped out of Trans Am.

Let's note the Chrysler dominance that was being referred to has more to do about being a dominant powerplant as compared to the dominance by a manufacturer, as much as anything else.

Ferrari is race bred engineering. They had huge successes in the 50's and 60's. They were by no means competitive in any other series other than F1. They have only returned to a dominant position in F1 because of Schumacher and the addition of EFI traction control systems (replacing their home grown Italian fuel management/ignition system). They have not dominated the F1 series or any other series like Mopar. After the 60's Ferrari all but disappeared from the road racing circuits.

On the other hand, NHRA has been almost completely dominated by Mopar since its inception in the 50's. Their Hemi powerplants continue to this day as being the best and most efficient engine in the history of drag racing. Look at every famous driver and you will find a Mopar behind them. Garlits, Prudhome, McEwan, Muldowney, Bernstein, Force...they ALL run Mopar. They may run other manufacturers bodies, but they all run Mopar powerplants.

Their track record in Nascar is almost as dominant. Since the inception of the stock car (which by the way began in the South with moonshine runners) the Dodge has been the dominant powerplant of choice. Ask anyone that follows Nascar history and the will tell you that Mopar has been there and been banned in every generation of the series. Do you realize that Chevy and Ford both have tried (to no avail) to copy the Hemi designs? Ford actually got a Boss 429 to the track and raced before they were banned. No other powerplant can get more power and durability than the Mopars. Mopars had cars that were modified going well over 230 mph in the 60's with the Superbirds on bias ply tires! Only in the last 10 years has Ford and Chevy become competitive in the series (by banning much of the developments of Mopar). Even during the bankruptcy era for Chrysler of the late 80's early 90's, they were still dominating on many race series.

Check this ut Nascar Wars

I am by no means a Chrysler bigot, just because I drive a Viper. I will say that I have taken your position in the past and was shot down when someone taught me about Chrysler's racing history.

I hope that this sheds some light on Chrysler's racing history. I'll try to dig up more to add to this good debate.

Brad

[87AccordsterLX]

Brad definitly knows his shit... lol... heys hows the engine work coming??? :alien:

[crayzayjay]

Im not going to pretend to be a racing history dictionary. in fact, i will state now that i know very little about Chrysler

anyway.....
Success for Porsche in part of the 80's?
OK then, lets just take a look at porsche wins at Le Mans:
'70
'71
'76
'77
'79
'81
'82
'83
'84
'85
'86
'87
'94
'96
'97
'98
16 wins... not too bad.. apart from that barren spell in the 80's of course... 7 Le Mans wins in a decade... i mean really... thats just shameful... they could have tried a little harder, no?
10 wins in the gruelling targa florio, 18 at Daytona 24hrs, 17 at Sebring (12hrs), 2 Paris-Dakar Rallye wins, 4 Rallye Monte Carlo wins as well wins at laguna seca, carrera panamericana, European GT championships, Sports Car and Makes world championships, CanAm, IMSA wins.... and oh yeah, throw in 25 wins powering McLaren in F1 and one without.. no you're right.... porsche's racing success came in spurts..

Ferrari have over 100 wins in F1, so what if their recent success can be (in part) attributed to Schumacher? the point is not valid whatsoever. 9 wins at Le Mans, the majority achieved in the 60's? so youre wrong again when you say they werent competitive in anything other than F1.

OK i understand that Chrysler powered many many victories using their HEMI engine. But have they achieved success in such a wide range of racing fields? i dont think so

cheers,
jay

[87AccordsterLX]

lol... this is getting good... Let me tell you something... I'll take anyone of those races on in my speed machine...LOL... so whats a 300 hp difference anyway....???? Porsche... Ferrari... they dont have anything on my 2.0l SOHC... LOL!!!! OK Im sure Brad is going to reply still but lets just put it like this... Porsche... Ferrari... Viper... all beautiful cars... all different in there own look, style, and so on... Ok so some people dont like the new body style of the 2003 Vipers... thats ok.. some people do like it... whos to say that Dodge wont put out a 2004 or 5 and adopt the older body style... you have to admit that the HP incrase throughout the years has been one to talk over... a 500hp /500lb/f-t roadster that starts in the low 70k's is something special... all I know is that I wouldnt want to see them put out the same thing over and over again like most imports.. you cant just change the look of the cup holders and say its the 2002 verson of the 2001's model.. change isnt always good but you have to learn someway or another...

[Holyterror]

I'm not fanatical about the body, but...
It would great if they were going to resurrect the Stealth, and put a big motor in it. A twin turbo inline 6 would be perfect. But, alas, that's not happening.

I love the old Viper's aesthetics. I'd take the body and chassis and put my own motor in. But Dodge has to stay on the cutting edge, I guess. If you ask me, almost all 2000+ styling is ugly compared to that of 10 years ago. Of course, I have a lot of unpopular opinions.

Whatever the final output, this is going to be a fast car. I've always thought the Viper would be perfectly accentuated by a 500+ ci Hemi. I guess that's not as exotic as a Lambourghini powerplant.

[Concorde OwNz Jo0!]

This viper has lost its Exclusvity! It looks like an extended S2000. The current viper has all the dips and curves which makes it look different than all the rest of the sports cars on the road.:bandit:

[Audio_1]

i had to register here to say something. What on the lords green earth did they do to this beutiful car!!! it looks like a s2000. it used to be the most beutiful car i have ever layed eyes on. now its like puke. it makes me want to cry.:cry:

[Holyterror]

Most current styling trends make me ill. Jewel lights on a Dodge Ram? WTF?! And I constantly find myself in the minority when people start talking about how great the new Celicas look. Blah. I am superficial enough about my cars that I may never buy a new car again.

[sheuisha GT]

i cant say that there isnt any one on the earth that doesnt like vipers.Vipers are the best cars,they run,look and,everything the best.And if your readin this and you dont like Vipers,read it.

[sheuisha GT]

zup,

yo VIPER 10,thats a tight picture of a viper.My favorite viper is the 19996 viper GTS. :badass: blue

[sheuisha GT]

YO Concorde OwNz Jo0! How in he hell could you say that.Vipers are the tightest fucking car ever.If ya dont like Vipers,dont come to a section like this,i hope everyone agrees with me about what you said.Vipers r the best.:stormzap:

[kidrocket]

lets be realistic. the viper isnt the best at everything. ever seen a viper pulling a horse trailer, or offroading? Hell im sure that some stock cars are faster through the 1/4 or the slalom. Whats so great about the viper is that it performs quite well in mostly all road performance conditions

Its a great car, but to say its the best at everything is a ludicrous statement

[kidrocket]

and to say it looks best is opinion only. I love the styling of the viper, but personally, i think a C5 looks sexier, and both of those get trounced in the looks department by the porsche 911. argue with me, and youre only proving my point. its all opinion

[Polygon]

Personally I think they could have done much better with the SRT-10 Viper, but it doesn't look like an S2000. I don't see where you people are getting that. Just because it has a long hood makes it automatically an S2000 rip off? I don't think so. Granted it is not the best looking Viper ever, but it is not that bad looking either. I like the looks of the new roadster. What irritates me is that the coupe is being held off for two years or so.

This question is for Viper 10 since he is the guru in this forum. Is the Viper coupe the GTS-r pictures I have been seeing, you know the concept GTS-R? Because that is one gorgeous car.