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Engineering/Technical Ask technical questions about cars. Do you know how a car engine works? |
View Poll Results: Who makes the best Muscle Cars??? | |||
Chevrolet | 11 | 78.57% | |
Ford | 3 | 21.43% | |
Voters: 14. You may not vote on this poll |
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08-22-2007, 01:35 PM | #16 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Yes, solid lifters. We put pushrods in it too many times... If revved to 5,600 in the lower gears, it was fine. Over 6,000, and it would bend a bunch of the pushrods. In 4th gear, it would go right near 7,000 without a wimper. I suspect it was catching revs too quickly for the stock valve train in the lower gears. Definitely a 3.50 gear, as well. 3310 Holley, if memory serves me.
I have a '69 Torino 428CJ in here right now. The car is white with red "c" stripes, and red interior. It's quite nice! Girl's car, though (auto trans). I have seen at least three or four '70 Mach 1s with 429s in them. They may have been transplants, I guess. MUCH stronger than the 428 cars. I drove a '71 "flat back" Mach 1 with 429 CJ. It was a GOOD running car, despite the lower compression. My favorite Mustang was always the flat back. My brother (a DIE HARD Mustang guy) hates them. He says they're just to damn big. That's what I LIKE about them... They're the most aero Mustang produced, too. When I was first getting into my own cars, I was a "Ford guy". Then, I bought The Judge. You're right! SWEET RIDE!!! Never looked back. GTO was by far, the best balanced muscle car. If you could beat it in a straight line, it would stomp you in the twisties. If you could out-handle it, you were toast in a drag race. In SoCal, there's lots of good places to road race and drag race. We had "courses" marked all over the San Bernardino area. Hwy 18 to Big Bear is an AWESOME "GTO road", at least UP HILL. Down hill? Not suicidal... Jim |
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08-22-2007, 05:23 PM | #17 | ||
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
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08-23-2007, 08:16 AM | #18 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Chad,
Nope. They weren't too expensive. They were shy a couple cylinders. Muscle cars had BIG V8s (relatively speaking, of course). Only the "Buick crowd" considers them muscle. Fast isn't in question. They have very little low-end torque, a prime ingredient for the actual driving (not racing) of a muscle car. They also have a power adder. The latter is instant disqualification in my book... ANYONE can put a blower on something and make it fast. No brainer... Lastly, they're so seldom seen (I see more '69 Camaros and '65 GTOs on the road than I do ALL Buick preformance cars combined), they're hard to include in any general "list". That doesn't mean I don't like them. I do. I've built several turbo engines, too. Lots of little things to make them "live" when they are making big power. Not unlike the big Buick V8s. Jim |
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08-29-2007, 10:14 PM | #19 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Fair enough. I would agree that low end torque would be a necessary requirement for a "true" muscle car. Re: cylinders, I always thought the power was more important than the engine configuration and figured to define a modern muscle you had to take technological advances into consideration. Because of that I didn't mind power adders for a modern muscle. If the new GTO comes with a SC LS2, it wouldn't disqualify it in my books.
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09-06-2007, 08:55 AM | #20 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Chad,
I understand. But, since GTO can stand on its own feet without an adder, it's a "moot point"! Now, what WOULD happen with say, 12 lbs. of boost? WOW!!! Jim |
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09-21-2007, 04:45 PM | #21 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
I voted Ford...my opinion my be bias.
I plan on bore/stroking my Fe when I get out of school Hopefully around 480cid at least 700hp Get this 4500-ish lb beast in the 10's.
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09-24-2007, 08:19 AM | #22 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
M3FordBoy,
You might wanna reconsider the "FE" thing. While a very good engine in its own rite, it's woefully obsolete. It's also very difficult to get to the CID you want. 427 blocks are VERY rare and VERY expensive. Unless there's an aftermarket block out there (I haven't seen one, so if there is, please point it out!), you're gonna be stuck with using a 390 or 428 as a basis. The bore simply can't go far enough to make such cubes. A "Lima" engine (429/460) would be a far better choice, IMO. Tons of good parts, no lak of power from it, either (more than any FE without overhead cams I've ever seen). FWIW Jim |
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09-24-2007, 09:52 AM | #23 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
^I have consider this, but I'd like to stick with the Fe purely for nastalgic purposes....It'll cost a little more, and be harder to find performance parts, but it's not imposible. I remember reading a while back that scat was going to or is currently make a stroker kit to get some big cid number out of the Fe's...so that's what I'll be looking for. It might not be 480ci, but at lest 466ci or something like that.
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09-26-2007, 12:23 PM | #24 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
A 428 crankshaft in a 427 block will get you to near 454 cubic inches, but as Jim said 427 blocks are not cheap. There may be aftermarket kits available.
What do you plan about cylinder heads? There are the garden variety FE heads, 2.03 1.56, valves, 428CJ (C8OE-N) and low riser 427 heads, 2.08 1.66 valves. The medium riser (C5AE-F, filled intake runners) and high riser (C4AE-F, tall intake ports) heads have larger valves. Then there are the aluminum Edelbrocks. As Jim said, a lot of relatively cheap power and torque is available with the 429/460. Besides the aftermarket aluminum cylinder head offerings, the common iron cylinder head castings are D3VE-A2A, DOVE-C and DOOE-R (429CJ/SCJ). The D2VE-A2A heads are open chamber. |
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09-26-2007, 12:45 PM | #25 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Look I'm not going to be attempting this anytime soon, probably 4 years down the road, a lot can happen between now and then. As for heads I currently have the Preformer RPM with 2.09/1.66 vavles. I may possibley use a reworked version of those: stronger springs, port/polish, maybe even some different valves.
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10-24-2007, 09:51 PM | #26 | ||
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
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11-29-2007, 08:52 PM | #27 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Between the two...I believe that Ford made a better muscle car. That may just be three generations of Ford gear-heads talking, but the Mustang, (the accidental muscle car) the Torino, and the Cougars (if we include mercury in the Ford mix) were just...more taken to.
FORD FTW!!!
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12-09-2007, 11:56 AM | #28 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
well i'm pretty rell rounded when it comes to ford vs. chevy but when i 1st got into the hobby i was ford guy so there's always gonna be that part of me that's blue oval but i think they're pretty equal with ford having a tiny edge.
there's some ford's i'd want over chevy's and some chevy's i'd want over fords. boss 429,351,and 302 over z28 z28 over gt350 and C/S
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12-18-2007, 03:39 AM | #29 | |||
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
Imo - Gm
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04-11-2008, 11:12 PM | #30 | |
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Re: Muscle Cars - Chevy vs Ford
I think that the Chevy Chevelle with the 396 and 454 porcipine (sp) heads are hard to beat. Lots of power in a small block!!
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