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Old 12-03-2003, 02:24 PM   #16
Ace$nyper
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The 04 accord V6 coupe i've driven smooth ride nice handling good good power. I liked it plus allmost every car mag can't be wrong to agree.
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Old 12-03-2003, 02:30 PM   #17
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Re: Honda/Acura HP vs Torque

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Originally Posted by Ace$nyper
The 04 accord V6 coupe i've driven smooth ride nice handling good good power. I liked it plus allmost every car mag can't be wrong to agree.
Once again your command of spelling and grammar failed you my friend.
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Old 12-03-2003, 05:00 PM   #18
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Re: Honda/Acura HP vs Torque

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Originally Posted by GP2K
I was just wondering about something. For some reason, Honda/Acura cars almost always have a much higher horsepower than torque. For example, Accord(240,212), S2000(240,161), TL(270,238), etc..Now this is not a knock on these particular brands, rather a curiousity. Does anyone know the reason(s) why?!

Hello GP2K,

It appears that your thread started as a question regarding engine architecture and its effects on torque ratings but then was hijacked into many unrelated topics. Good Luck.
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Old 12-03-2003, 10:45 PM   #19
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Re: Honda/Acura HP vs Torque

Torque is the the meansurement of a tortional energy in a mass(twisting force). Horsepower is a function of torque and engine speed. With a given torque the higher the engine speed the higher the horsepower. Engines are designed with limits. The average honda has a much higher rpm range than say a domestic counterpart, they also have a really sloppy torque curve, FAR from flat.

You missed the key point of the specs on those cars. @ what RPM
A few examples.
2004 Accord V6 240hp@6250rpm 212lb-ft@5000rpm
2004 Mustang V6 190hp@5250rpm 220lb-ft@2750rpm
2004 focus SVT 170hp@7000rpm 145lb-ft@5500rpm
2002 S2000 240hp@8300rpm 153lb-ft@7500rpm
2004 H1 205hp@3400rpm 440lb-ft@1800rpm
2004 Phaeton W12 420hp@6000rpm 406lb-ft@3250rpm
2004 Maybach 64 543hp@5250rpm 664lb-ft@2300rpm(threw that in for s$%ts and giggles)

Notice something with those numbers?
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Old 12-04-2003, 08:35 AM   #20
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Re: Re: Honda/Acura HP vs Torque

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Originally Posted by illusionv6
Torque is the the meansurement of a tortional energy in a mass(twisting force). Horsepower is a function of torque and engine speed. With a given torque the higher the engine speed the higher the horsepower. Engines are designed with limits. The average honda has a much higher rpm range than say a domestic counterpart, they also have a really sloppy torque curve, FAR from flat.

You missed the key point of the specs on those cars. @ what RPM
A few examples.
2004 Accord V6 240hp@6250rpm 212lb-ft@5000rpm
2004 Mustang V6 190hp@5250rpm 220lb-ft@2750rpm
2004 focus SVT 170hp@7000rpm 145lb-ft@5500rpm
2002 S2000 240hp@8300rpm 153lb-ft@7500rpm
2004 H1 205hp@3400rpm 440lb-ft@1800rpm
2004 Phaeton W12 420hp@6000rpm 406lb-ft@3250rpm
2004 Maybach 64 543hp@5250rpm 664lb-ft@2300rpm(threw that in for s$%ts and giggles)

Notice something with those numbers?
I noticed that Hondas make/reach their torque peak at higher RPMs than others. Also the horsepower is reached further up the RPMs. See that's what I don't like, is the sloppy torque curve as you said it.
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Old 12-04-2003, 10:37 AM   #21
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It's just how honda tunes them. Tune it for peak torque at some absurd number and you get fuel economy and emissions when you're not in the gas. Like my little V6 accord. I've run a 15.13, but on a recent trip got 32mpg, so it's kind of peppy, but when I drive nice I get pretty damn good fuel economy. I think honda's specific goal is the best emissions ratings, as well as some of the best gas milage for the horsepower they claim, but it comes at a sacrifice. I've had a hard time explaining to my best friend why I barely take him in his 98 maxima v6 since he's really not much into cars(he designs semiconductors, and has a hard time getting matching socks on, so I give him a break). The concept of torque escapes him. He's into the HP number which means a little, but not as much as torque to me. Off the line he murders me, then I play catchup in second gear, and finally leave pull away from him in 3rd gear, and I dyno with almost as much hp to the ground as he has to the crank, but his car is making peak torque before my torque convertor even thinks about engaging, and LONG before my Vtec is even considering switching cam profiles, so by the time my slow pig gets out of the hole, he's pulling like a mother. Aside from the piss poor auto transmission in a 6th gen V6 accord, the torque just makes for a gutless car off of the line, however it's pretty strange that from a roll(30mph on) I can keep up with one of my other friend's Autotragic 96 Mustang GT Ragtop, even though his torque is much better than mine my HP pulls me but along just fine after I get to a decent rpm. Off the line he rapes me. By the time I can feel my car start pulling he's already 3-4 cars ahead, and it takes me to about 80 to finally get even with him.


I noticed someone else here mentions it in this thread, but the old concept of push pull really plays a strong part in the performance of a car. The torque pushes a car off of the line, and the HP pulls it through the rest of the trip. If you get a superb hole shot because of massive torque you're already up in a higher ramp letting your hp pull you through. If you have a torqueless wonder like my accord I have to rely on the HP on the high rpm to let me catch up.
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Old 12-04-2003, 03:35 PM   #22
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Re: Honda/Acura HP vs Torque

Quote:
Originally Posted by illusionv6
It's just how honda tunes them. Tune it for peak torque at some absurd number and you get fuel economy and emissions when you're not in the gas. Like my little V6 accord. I've run a 15.13, but on a recent trip got 32mpg, so it's kind of peppy, but when I drive nice I get pretty damn good fuel economy. I think honda's specific goal is the best emissions ratings, as well as some of the best gas milage for the horsepower they claim, but it comes at a sacrifice. I've had a hard time explaining to my best friend why I barely take him in his 98 maxima v6 since he's really not much into cars(he designs semiconductors, and has a hard time getting matching socks on, so I give him a break). The concept of torque escapes him. He's into the HP number which means a little, but not as much as torque to me. Off the line he murders me, then I play catchup in second gear, and finally leave pull away from him in 3rd gear, and I dyno with almost as much hp to the ground as he has to the crank, but his car is making peak torque before my torque convertor even thinks about engaging, and LONG before my Vtec is even considering switching cam profiles, so by the time my slow pig gets out of the hole, he's pulling like a mother. Aside from the piss poor auto transmission in a 6th gen V6 accord, the torque just makes for a gutless car off of the line, however it's pretty strange that from a roll(30mph on) I can keep up with one of my other friend's Autotragic 96 Mustang GT Ragtop, even though his torque is much better than mine my HP pulls me but along just fine after I get to a decent rpm. Off the line he rapes me. By the time I can feel my car start pulling he's already 3-4 cars ahead, and it takes me to about 80 to finally get even with him.


I noticed someone else here mentions it in this thread, but the old concept of push pull really plays a strong part in the performance of a car. The torque pushes a car off of the line, and the HP pulls it through the rest of the trip. If you get a superb hole shot because of massive torque you're already up in a higher ramp letting your hp pull you through. If you have a torqueless wonder like my accord I have to rely on the HP on the high rpm to let me catch up.
Excellent post! Thank you for some honesty regarding Honda and an Accord in particular.
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