M45

[EuroCarGuy]

It is ridiclous to start importing this model to the U.S. when they know they will replace it for 2004. They should wait a year and bring a more modern looking car. Also, they should not put the Q45 interior in it, how do you think Q45 owners will feel about that?

[Morpheus XIII]

Simply stated, Nissan needed Infiniti to have a true mid-sized rear-wheel-drive vehicle to accomodate the gap between the G35 and the Q45. Perhaps to enthustiasts it is important to have the freshest and newest model for every car, but for the mass majority, it doesn't really matter as long as they purchased a great car in their class to fit their needs. For example, I see several 2001 Mercedes SL owners on the road and many of them are content with their decade old design, since to them the jump on the gun doesn't matter. Of course many of us would cringe with pain thinking that they didn't wait for the new hardtop convertible SL, but it's not important to them. And so we mustn't forget that the mass number of consumers outnumber the minority of enthusiasts around the globe. The M45 will make a great sales addition to the Inifiniti line, and nothing more.

As for the comment about the M45 taking some of the Q45's roles, that thought is still up in the air. It is difficult to fit a luxury car into its own niche as general space is limited, but I must say, how many new Q45 owners are there? I rarely see one on the road (although I'd love to see more), and so the much more affordable (~10 grand less than the Q) M45 could potentially be an Infiniti sales leader. I do have one query... if the M45 is successful, will it replace the I35? Both are shining examples of luxury with economics in mind, but the M45 has a rear-wheel-drivetrain, and unorthodox features such as 18" wheels and a tire pressure monitoring system. Or will the long running name of the "I" beat down its own upstart sibling? Time will tell...

In case readers have no idea what the M45 is here is a brief synopsis--
Japanese Nissan Cedric/Gloria chassis with Q45 VK45DE 4.5L powerplant producing 340 horsepower and 333 lb. ft. of torque to the rear wheels. Note the photos below for a better idea:

[XZLR8]

I'm not fond of this car at all. Infiniti has been making great strides, it seems.... but this car doesn't seem to be heading in the same direction.

Is it sized similar to the Lexus GS, Benz E, and BMW 5?

On the other subject you mentioned, I did read somewhere that the I35 is doomed, as Infiniti wants to offer all RWD vehicles in the future. In fact, in a recent Infiniti ad in one of the car mags, there are pictures of all the new Infiniti models (G35 sedan & coupe, Q45, M45, FX45) but the I35 and QX4 aren't even pictured. Coincidence?

[nahmed]

Infiniti is copying Lexus again. Why can't they just go with their own little thing, and bring cars the customers want? Instead of bringing the Cima with its weakest engine, why couldn't they bring the 450bhp 4WD boat that would knock the crap out of the competition out? The Gloria/M45 don't even get me started with that one. WHy not just rename your cars Lexus, and start with that? At least they can keep the reputation. pisses me off.
response to XZLR8's statement "In fact, in a recent Infiniti ad in one of the car mags, there are pictures of all the new Infiniti models (G35 sedan & coupe, Q45, M45, FX45) but the I35 and QX4 aren't even pictured. Coincidence?" This might be an instance of Infiniti promoting their latest cars. I think they will end the I35, based upon the fact Nissan is discontinuing the Maxima from it US lineup. The I35 should go too.
Response to EuroCar Guy. I think the Q45's interior is ugly, and extremely complicated. My father just bought one, and i have to explain most of the functions to him. He doesn't even know how to work the NAV system, and forget about hte Voice controls. My Pioneer NaV system is better and more user friendly than this one. Also, a flaw with the Voice Recognition system on my dad's Q45. It will not recognize his voice unless he is speaking directly into the mic. When he has a cold, it asks me to repeat myself several times before it does the job. I took it back to the dealer, and they replaced it with a new one. the problem is still lingering.
I wish they brought the Cedric instead of the Gloria. That would allow Nissan to rise to the top, and rattle the competition.

[Morpheus XIII]

Originally posted by nahmed
Infiniti is copying Lexus again. Why can't they just go with their own little thing, and bring cars the customers want? Instead of bringing the Cima with its weakest engine, why couldn't they bring the 450bhp 4WD boat that would knock the crap out of the competition out? The Gloria/M45 don't even get me started with that one. WHy not just rename your cars Lexus, and start with that? At least they can keep the reputation. pisses me off.
response to XZLR8's statement "In fact, in a recent Infiniti ad in one of the car mags, there are pictures of all the new Infiniti models (G35 sedan & coupe, Q45, M45, FX45) but the I35 and QX4 aren't even pictured. Coincidence?" This might be an instance of Infiniti promoting their latest cars. I think they will end the I35, based upon the fact Nissan is discontinuing the Maxima from it US lineup. The I35 should go too.
Response to EuroCar Guy. I think the Q45's interior is ugly, and extremely complicated. My father just bought one, and i have to explain most of the functions to him. He doesn't even know how to work the NAV system, and forget about hte Voice controls. My Pioneer NaV system is better and more user friendly than this one. Also, a flaw with the Voice Recognition system on my dad's Q45. It will not recognize his voice unless he is speaking directly into the mic. When he has a cold, it asks me to repeat myself several times before it does the job. I took it back to the dealer, and they replaced it with a new one. the problem is still lingering.
I wish they brought the Cedric instead of the Gloria. That would allow Nissan to rise to the top, and rattle the competition.

Where does one begin?

First off, YOU try being the COO of a doomed automaker. See how you respond, and then get down to the details.

Firstly, the statement "Infiniti is copying Lexus again" doesn't really say much because recently Lexus has been FAR more known to be emulating European marques. Then again, I feel the need to utterly refute that statement as the IS300 pales in comparison to the performance standard of the G35--not to mention the Infiniti being the sole Japanese luxury compact to be actually praised with the likes of the BMW 3-series (don't believe me? check MT and R&T and other major publications in recent months). Furthermore, the G35 is firmly slated for a coupe, something Lexus has yet no plans for. Oh, and what do you call an FX45? The only luxury department crossover from the major Japanese marques? Perhaps. In any case, it is no rip from Lexus. And the Q45? Would have done a lot better if brand awareness had been up to par...that is if the XVL-chassied models had been released before-hand. But such is not the case, and only the real scrutinizers can differentiate the quality designs from the standardized dough out there.

Secondly, you might want to mention your sources for Nissan engines, because as far as the public is concerned, the F50 Cima is only available with the standard sole 333 hp RWD V-8 associated with the Q45. Can anyone else second that bit of data confirming that there is a Cima with a "450bhp 4WD boat"..."that would knock the crap out of the competition...?"

Thirdly, your input about the Gloria being released instead of the Cedric forces me to lose all credibility for your statements yet far. As much as one would like to call them "different", the Cedric and Gloria are identical enough to mistake a GMC Yukon from a Chevy Tahoe.

[nahmed]

the site should shed some light on the subject:

http://www.nissan.co.jp/CARLINEUP/

I hope you can read Japanese, or at the least you should be able to read some of the English texts and numbers.

You're right what I should have said is, they should not be copying TOyota and HONDA. Ok Motor Trend, car and driver, road and track and Automobile magazine have on job. Promote the Nissan Brand name right now, since Toyota,a nd Honda have their reputation built in the public's eye. If you don't believe me count the Number of ads in each edition of these magazines, and multiply them by 12. Each brand name has their ads in the magazines at least once per edition. I would also suggest you read some Public Relations Communication books. You will learn something new.
I will agree with you on the Gloria and the Cedric. they are the same type of car except for the suspension on the Gloria GT is a semi-racing self-adjustable unit, and a semi-race tuned engine. The Cedric's suspension comes with an optional sport-tuned variable engine, and a luxury sport suspension, which makes it not Euro at all.

Just in case you haven't heard, Nissan has been taken over by Renault Motors. These changes on the Infiniti/Nissan Line are by the orders of the new boss. Otherwise, the old trend would have continued for a few more years. Read up on it from Nissan pages, Motorweek, and Carr magazine.

The G35's goal was to compete with the Acura/Honda CL class. The IS300 is behind, and yes, it was also scheduled for a Coupe version too. Check out Car and Driver magazine from a couple of years ago. The release date skips my mind, but they were supposed to bring it with the station-wagon version. If they don't, chances are they will rethink their approach, once they see their customers buying the G35 Coupe. They will probably want to increase their HP soon too. Otherwise they just have an ok car. They may do that within a few years, since Nissan's the last manufacturer to update their cars. Honda is usually the next one to update.

I also suggest you purchase a G35 coupe once it comes out, and report back to us with what you really think of the car. Then I'll buy your story of it being a badass car.

[Morpheus XIII]

Thanks for providing such a generic universal site. I'm sure everyone and their mother already has it bookmarked.

And it was Carlos Ghosn's intention to shake things up--something Nissan really did need--in order to stir some, if any public awareness. I am glad all the major rag publications are working hard to promote a product which has been overlooked for far too long. Nissan has made quality performance products for ages, but they never really made a really successful cash-cow, to place them on the map. The conservative styles never allowed them to be noticed by the mass majority. I know Renault's 40% stake in Nissan is pushing them away from their origins, but hell, any Nissan is better than no Nissan. It's is a simple problem, with a simple solution. The old Nissan has way too many platforms/chassi, and not enough product diversity. Ghosn's restructuring strategies ask for a reduction in platforms and powerplants, while increasing the number of available models, even venturing into foreign areas. And even then, economize as best as possible. For example, the upcoming FX45 was originally supposed to use the F50 chassis, but was redesigned from the ground up to utilize the more abundant XVL body to cut costs, while competing in all areas of the market, even niche.

And by the way, illuminate me on where you discovered that the RWD G35 sedan was originally intended to compete with the FWD Acura/Honda CL coupe. Not only does this not make sense by powertrain configuration, but also by body dimension. The G35 has more in common with the 3-series than any other Japanese marque to date, and if they are "copying" as been so boldly put, who really cares? A good car is still a good car, and to the victor go the spoils. The Japanese have always been about perfection, NOT innovation, and this combined with some European influence could prove to be more worthwhile than a complex, expensive and unreliable European product. Former European VP Ghosn knows how successful the 3-series is, and I wouldn't be surprised if he kept tabs on their future plans for the course of his career as COO of Nissan.

You of all people should know of Nissan's continuous row of failed attempts at popularity Stateside, being that you own a G20. I know about the almost perfectly balanced chassis of the P-series, the wonders that the SR20 holds, but the rest of the WORLD doesn't know. Be THANKFUL that Nissan is trying something...anything to hold on, rather than sell out completely, as went the ways of Mazda. And yes, the G35 sedan (until the coupe is released) IS a definite competitor in the RWD sports sedan ring. Before you tell someone to experience it first hand, do it yourself first. I already have.

In business, money comes first. Let them build what they think will sell. Then expect more.

[nahmed]

In regards to your first observation, "you asked"
I was in Japan last month, when G35 coupe was tested by Sokoria Motor Industries, and Calsonic. It has a high possibility of being a Racer at the IHRA Stock car competition or any other street racing competition, if Calsonic or another specialty tuner picks up the tab.
Yes I have had the opportunity to test the car, and I am impressed with its suspension, and road handling capabilities. "Sweet" is the word that comes to mind. I'm wondering if they will bring the semi-racing suspension.
I wanted Nissan to improve their own image by themselves, and not by paying someone money for ad space. they are dulling their image in the eyes of Honda/Toyota owners, who still think their brandname is better than Nissan. Bad Campaigning techniques in my opinion. They need to hire better managers who know who to target, and how. They should have used Audi's technique of a gradual image changer, for each model, and allow the magazines to critique the cars. This would allow Nissan to improve their US image where sales are crutial to remain in the game. Remember, Nissan has developed the Asian Markets with cultural attachments. If they did that with the current US market, they could improve the image of the cars, and the corporate image. Honda did that with the Civic and the Accord, followed by the CRX in the late 80s. Anyway, you're not a Nissan exec, so me wining isn't going to work.

In regards to your last comment about image changing, I've lost faith in Nissan after I bought my G20 back in 93, and it will take time for me to better it.

[enginerd]

Infinity is a copy of a copy. Don't get me wrong, I like them but I feel they should strike out on their own with a new design team. You gotta be faster, different or better in order to win and I don't see any of those traits in Infinity.

[nahmed]

All Japanese cars are copies of other copies. I know the FX45, doesn't share the design with another Xover. The Q45/CIma, and the 03 Altima's are also their own design. The others could be called shared design. I believe when Ghosn joined Nissan Motors, he hired a new design team. I might be wrong there, but I'm guessing Morpheus will be able to tell us more about that.
PS. Infinity is spelled Infiniti. I've seen a lot people writing it your way, and it pisses me off, so I do ask that you not join them. Thanks.

[CHaserTourv]

2 all of u M45 haters/dislikers, not 2 go against u guys/girls/whatever/both, but i reely luv the M45, nd is 1 of my dream cars, so im not going against u guys/girls/whatever/both, its jus my opinion, nd theres nutin u can do 2 change it

[Jason B]

Our Q45's interior:



The voice recognition works prefect, even from the back seat. There is a voice training mode that you must do that most people forget about. It's a one time thing and it learns your voice so it won't ever get confused. Try running through this program first.

[1SICKLEX]

I think the M45 has sold like 3 cars here, battling the Q45s 5 cars for last place.

Well people you have to give the M45 a chance. Afterall, its sole purpose is to give Infiniti a product to battle the AMG E class Benz, BWM's 5 series, Lexus's G series, and of course the Audi A6 (rumor had it that a S6 was in the works.)

I like the M45. I have not test driven one thus far, but from sitting in the vehicle and examining it, I like what I see so far. (Plus the great thing is like the FX's & Q45, its exclusitivity.) Thats Infiniti's edge. Their products are not designed to attract massive crowds (deme de le Lexus & Acura). Their products are to attract those who want to be exclusive. (i.g. Audi & Jaguar.)

[MattBG20t]

Originally Posted by nahmed

Infiniti is copying Lexus again. Why can't they just go with their own little thing, and bring cars the customers want? Instead of bringing the Cima with its weakest engine, why couldn't they bring the 450bhp 4WD boat that would knock the crap out of the competition out? The Gloria/M45 don't even get me started with that one. WHy not just rename your cars Lexus, and start with that? At least they can keep the reputation. pisses me off.
I wish they brought the Cedric instead of the Gloria. That would allow Nissan to rise to the top, and rattle the competition.

Copying Lexus? Let's see...the G35 is larger yet comparatively priced to the IS and has more power, AWD as an option, and a six-speed gearbox vs. the IS' 5-speed. The G35 kicks the crap out of the IS in every comparison test. The G35 coupe. Lexus doesn't have an IS coupe. It's coming out though. So is Lexus copying Infiniti now? You metion the "Weak engine". 340hp is weak? The Y34 M45 can do 0-60 in 5.2 seconds, the same as the BMW M3 convertible and the Mercedes C32AMG. Unless you drive a BMW M5 or some other super sedan, you can't say that the VK45DE is weak. And the Cedric and Gloria are THE SAME CAR. The Y34 M45 has not been a commercial success because it has been so overshadowed by the G35 and FX. And personally I think the "Muscle car with brains" ad campaign was dumb. The current M45 is going to be one of those cars (like the G20 that I drive) that has a loyal following of enthusiasts who know and love the car. In a few years I am going to count myself as one of them when I purchase a 2003-04 M45 to replace (or perhaps go along with) my G20. The next M45 is gorgeous and will eat the Lexus GS' lunch in the market. The Fuga concept is getting rave reviews already. Does Infiniti go after the same market as Lexus? Yes. But I wouldn't consider that copying Lexus....