SCARY Saturn problem!

[Drez7]

I don't know if I'm not warming my car up long enough sometimes, and it might be because my car is really old....it's a '95 with over 160k mileage.

Basically, my car will start to shake a LOT like I'm stalling out (it's a manual btw) and then it will just die out in the middle of me driving it. I was thinking it may be because I haven't been warming it up long enough because each time it happened I didn't warm it up for too long...it happened last night when I let it warm up for about 2-3 minutes...I usually wait about 5? But I don't think that should make my car do this!

So then it was acting weird after I barely got it home last night, and it would shake really badly while it was running and the service engine soon light came on. So this morning I was trying to see what's wrong with it and when I started it it still kept shaking. When I lightly pressed the accelerator the rpms would drop really low almost like my car was about to die and then they would recover and slightly go up...so I test drove it a bit down my block and everytime I switched out of a gear to neutral the rpm would drop really low and my car would start shaking like it was about to die out. After I barely got it home again I started it back up and had the key in the ignition for like 10 seconds when it finally started up....and it almost seemed to work like that never even happened! The service engine light was off and now I could drive it all the way around the block this time but the rpms this time were reallly high. They would stay like over 2,000 whenever I just was coasting down a hill in neutral under 20 mph.

Now, idk what's exactly wrong with it but it would appear that either the electrical power is not getting through to the engine properly..? Or the engine may have been flooded with gasoline? I'm not sure, but I don't know anything about cars. I checked the fluid levels and just had an oil change...everything seems to be fine with that. On a side note, whenever I start my car I usually rev the engine a couple times to about 2,000 cuz that seems to help it warm up faster...is that bad for your car? Cuz I'm thinking the engine might have been flooded? And when I started it this morning when it started working, I pushed the accelerator down some while it was starting...But it's really weird how it just dies out in the middle of me driving it...something else has to be wrong with it.

Well right now I'm scared to mess with it anymore....can someone PLEASE help me? Is my car possessed?!

[curtis73]

Since your car is EFI, revving it won't help it warm up and its slightly bad for it. Not terrible, but there is absolutely no reason to do it. The other things like flooding and electric would be more steady problems that would have other symptoms. You shouldn't have to do anything with the pedal to start it. Just turn the key and it should start in a couple seconds.

The problem is elsewhere. Since its just running rough its very difficult to guess what's wrong without driving it, but since you have a check engine light, the first course of action is to take it to major chain parts store and have the codes checked for free. Don't pay for it, there is always a parts store that will do it free. Since your car is OBD1, it won't be very specific but it might shed some light on what's going on.

[Drez7]

Alright thanks man....can you please enlighten me as to who would possibly diagnose my car for free though? it usually runs about $60-90 around here...at like autozone. I don't know where to look to get it done for free. The service engine light is no longer on now either. Also, how much do you think it would cost to get it fixed if the problem was a worse case scenario?

And how much longer do you think my car could last for? It's a 1995 Saturn SL 2 with about 165,000 miles on it. I was hoping it would last another good year or so...and besides the aforementioned problem, the only thing wrong with it is the struts and alignment need to be fixed.

[Moppie]

It sounds a lot like an ignition fault.

You can either pay the money to get it diagnosed, you can learn how the ignition system works and try it yourself, or you can just start replacing parts, starting with the leads, until you find the faulty part.

[KiwiBacon]

My guess would be fuel starvation.
But it's only a guess.

[curtis73]

Auto Zone, Advance, Checker, Shucks, Kragen, O'Reilys... all of them should offer free diagnostics. Pep Boys usually have a service department so they try to make you pay, but almost all big chain parts stores should offer free diagnostics in the hopes that you'll buy parts there. If you go to one and they want money, go to another one.

Worst case scenario is that you have an old tired engine and it needs to be replaced or rebuilt which is several thousand bucks. A Saturn with 160k on the ticker could be good for another 50k or it could be living on a prayer for the last 50k. Carefully consider your repair investment based on resale value and the price of a used Corolla.

[534BC]

The good news:

Although it is scary, the steering and brakes are just a symptom and will be just fine when the "engine running" is fixed. They are probably power brakes and steering and need the engine power to assist.

Warming up will not affect it any, and maybe something expensive or could also be something very cheap and easy.

A couple of questions may perhaps help people narrow it down.

How long has it done this?
Did it run great before problem started?
Was it all of sudden or gradually get worse?
How is it when warmed up?
How is it on highway?
Is it intermittent? or does it ever run good?

[UncleBob]

sounds like you have a misfire. Why its misfiring can be for a lot of reasons.

A good shop/mechanic would be able to find the problem quickly for little money.

[Drez7]

Man Idk where you guys live but finding a place that does diagnostics for free around here is a joke. Most are $80-90, I luckily found one that does it for $40. And I've asked if they could look at my car but they said they would have to do a diagnostics and the problem wouldn't be easy to figure out...also since my car is OBD1 the codes likely didn't save so it'd only be a waste of money to diagnose it unless the check engine lights are on for good. I wish someone here would have told me that sooner! I don't even know how I'm gonna get it to the store once that problem happens again though....

How long has it done this? On and off a total of about 3-5 times over the last...4 months?
Did it run great before problem started? Yes. It still does...it's like nothing ever happened!
Was it all of sudden or gradually get worse? Both? The first time it happened my car didn't die, but the rpms were acting weird and getting really low as well as the check engine light coming on, then it started dying, and just last time it died and almost wouldn't start working normally.
How is it when warmed up? Fine.
How is it on highway? Don't usually go on the highway, but it's been fine.
Is it intermittent? or does it ever run good? Like I said, it almost randomly happens....although it's from what I can remember mostly happened when I haven't warmed it up for as long as usual. Now I'm so paranoid I warm it up for like 10 minutes!

Yea seems to be a ...missfire or whatever. or something. My dad and I have come to the conclusion it's likely something with the fuel injection. My dad thiks something is getting "stuck" ....but Idk.

Man the major problem here is that my inspection is dead and I need new tires to pass...but this happened at the worst time cuz my car may not even be useful enough to have anymore if it's having engine problems...so if I get tires to get state inspection it may just be a waste...!!

[turtlecrxsi]

Sounds like you need a tune up. Spark plugs, Ignition Wires, Distributor Cap and Rotor button. These items are relatively inexpensive to acquire and are basic. Also, a fuel filter might be in order. I don't know if that's what you need or if your engine is being starved of fuel but it never hurts especially if you're riding on the original fuel filter and spark plugs.

BTW, those major chain stores will scan your ECU for free. Go to one without a garage. Those are the ones that just sell parts and will do it for free. I'm sure you've seen them out at the curb testing people's batteries etc.

[Drez7]

Kay....I didn't think autozone did it for free but they do apparently...I don't know how it's possible though...I don't think it's the same kinda engine diagnosis that other people do cuz it's free!! compared to most others charging $90....but I'll see what's up with that. Thanks...I just didn't think they'd do it because their not really a mechanic shop kinda place....but I don't know how helpful that "diagnosis" will be...

[UncleBob]

all they do is scan codes. It being a 95, I doubt its OBD2, so they probably won't scan it.

[INF3RN0666]

Ok look man. This is simply a fuel starvation problem like someone said before. If the car is fine when it's warm, then you know there's no big problem with the engine. It's definately NOT a spark plug and wire problem because it would run bad in general. I'm thinking that you have a problem with your fuel pump when it's cold. It could be a dying pump or it could be gas that is starting to freeze, or a clogged fuel filter. For all you know, it could be a fuel pressure regulator problem. Just get it checked out by some cheap mechanic, and you'll realize that it aint too expensive. Your symptoms sound like something between $50 and $300 (for a new fuel pump + installation).

You only need to let your car idle for about a minute before you should start driving it. Otherwise, you're wasting gas, it causes carbon buildup on exhaust components, and apparantly it's bad for the engine (who knows). People think that if they let their car warm up for 15 minutes, they're doing it a favour. The reality is, your transmission fluid is still cold because the transmission is not moving when the car is in park. So when you pop it in gear, and floor the gas, you're destroying your transmission. Now most manual cars don't have trans fluid, so this isn't as big of a deal. But your bearings are still cold, and so are your breaks, etc. So you should warm up the car for 1 minute and start driving slowly for the first 2-3 km. I know the car will be cold, but it's not worth wasting your money and damaging the car for a little bit of cold weather.

[Drez7]

Aright, thanks man...I think your right. You sound like you know what your talkin about and it definitely seems to be the case because when I pushed the accelerator when that happened it was almost as though the fuel wasn't getting through properly or whatever. Are you sure I should only warm it up for a minute? That seems like it wouldn't be long enough...the weather around here now is in the teens just about and I noticed as I let the car warm up over a good 5 minute period the rpms which start at a bit over 1,000 slowly drop a bit. I will get this looked at....now I just need to find a "cheap mechanic" ....not sure where to look but thanks for your help!

[KiwiBacon]

Originally Posted by INF3RN0666

Ok look man. This is simply a fuel starvation problem

That's what I mentioned earlier. All the symptoms fit.
Engine bogging when the throttle is just opened and fuel demand suddenly increases. Exactly what happens when an engine is running too lean.
Shakes happen when the revs drop, your check-engine-light also comes on.

The only part that doesn't fit was the engine idling at 2000rpm.

A code scan might pick up lean mixture, but a code scan is not a replacement for real mechanic work.