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Old 12-28-2010, 05:16 PM   #1
happydog500
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Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

I am trying to fix my rear defogger, hopefully before the cold weather is over. I read somewhere on this forum, there is a module that has the antenna and rear defogger that sometimes is the problem. It was located on the "C-Post".
My Official, GM service manual for my car doesn't show it there for the rear defogger. It mentions that one is at the RH I/P.
When I go to the antenna module in the book, there is a picture of it (C-Post). Nowhere does it show it having anything to do with the rear defogger. Shows the module, plug-ins, and wires.

Why do people say it's together (with Antenna), in the C-Post, when my Official, GM Service Manual says its behind the instrument panel? (or why does the manual say that, when people have it together).

I'm not at my car now, but I don't remember plastic being on the C-Post, but fabric (Probable is). How do you get the plastic off? Just get behind it and pull? any secretes I should know about before I go yank it off?

Never knew how important a Rear Defogger is until you go through a cold, snowy winter without one.

Chris.
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Old 12-28-2010, 05:42 PM   #2
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Quote:
Originally Posted by happydog500 View Post
I am trying to fix my rear defogger, hopefully before the cold weather is over. I read somewhere on this forum, there is a module that has the antenna and rear defogger that sometimes is the problem. It was located on the "C-Post".
I'm not at my car now, but I don't remember plastic being on the C-Post, but fabric (Probable is). How do you get the plastic off? Just get behind it and pull? any secretes I should know about before I go yank it off?
.
On my 1998 there is a module behind the passenger side C panel. The lead from the grid on the glass goes to it. The C-cover is upholstered like the roof. The panel pulls out. It has friction pins like a the trim on the dash panel has. Two of them. Just pull hard enough and it comes off in your hand.

The module has contacts that burn where the wires push onto them. The relay for the power to the rear module is in the passenger side fuse and relay group on the A-pillar area below the dash. Take off the hush panel under the dash and the list of which relay and fuse is which is on top of the panel.
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Old 12-30-2010, 05:14 PM   #3
happydog500
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

OK, thank you. What make it easier for me to work on cars is if I can go over it before I do it. This way it gives me more confidence. Plus I don't get into it and get stuck, with it all torn apart.
I did pull on it a little. Felt like the headliner was ripping. I kind of knew it was there, just my manual doesn't show it there.
The real thing that pisses me off is, the Offical GM Shop Manual says, in order to get that panel off, you need to take off the plastic around the window and the door trim. It also adds that to take off the door trim, you need to remove the rubber door seal.
I usually think GM knows what needs to be done. They wouldn't put in a manual something that's not true.

Sounds easy what you say, I trust it, but why doesn't the Shop Manual say that? That's the thing that gets me.

I will go pull it off. It also says it will break the fasteners, so maybe I'll have to tape it back on.

Chris.
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Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
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Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
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Trek 8000
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Old 12-30-2010, 08:58 PM   #4
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

The inside door trim does need to be pulled forward to allow the rear pillar panel to be removed, just the rear portion. In addition, you need a "trim tool remover" to pull the serrated fasteners out, otherwise you could destroy the bonding on the panel. Use the trim remover behind the fastener for best results! Click Here for a 3-yr old thread on this subject.
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Old 12-31-2010, 07:55 PM   #5
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Thank you for the replies.

Been going through depression for about a year or two. Usually have a friend help, if just to be there to help me keep going. After two lies, I finally got the message.

Sitting in my apartment, I decided, I don't need someone else. I can go out there and do this myself, without having to have someone else there.

I went out, pulled off the cover. I could see the module right there. It looked like it had been hot.

One plug was fried (looked just like my fan blower motor connector I replaced resonantly).

The module has a little round spot on it where it's melted a little. The main problem is the plug.

It's 6* out, freezing! I had to do this without gloves and my hands got numb quick.
Here's what I did. Turned on the Defogger. Checked with my little light thing. I had power from the plug, but not the window. Since the plug is fried, the one mettle part inside the plug was all by itself without any plastic around it. This made it bend instead of plugging back into the tab. Hands froze before I could do anymore.

When I was tightening the bolt, the wrench came in contact with the wire (plug is melted so it has exposed wire). I saw a little current, so I checked again. This time there was no light when I touched the plug wire.

Question: When I did my turn signal return plastic thing, it was "dealer only." On this forum, someone gave me a company and part number. When I went back to the parts store with that number, they all of a sudden had it.
Does anyone know if I can get the plug (that goes into the module) at an auto parts store? If yes, any part #?

Since I'm here, any chance the module can be bought from the parts store? I would just call, but there closed now and since it's a holiday, maybe not for a couple days. Also, someone knows that its available, I can go in with a #, since sometimes THEY don't know they have the part.

Any help would be appreciated,

Chris.

P.S. I did it!!!!!!! I did it without any help. I can do this. Another thing, before I got this car, I read the reviews and one thing that got surprising low reviews was, "wiring". I didn't understand what they where talking about until now.
The melted plug/wire/module is just like the melted fan blower. The Lesabre has wiring/electric parts that are not made good enough for this application. When I did my fan, I thought all the times I was driving around with a wire/pug hot enough to melt. This makes me wonder what other parts are melting as I drive down the street in my GM car?
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Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
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Old 01-01-2011, 08:10 PM   #6
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

You probably blew the fuse for the rear window defrogger.

There's a relay on the A-pillar panel but no fuse in there for it.

Check under the hood in the relay maxifuse center to see if that one burned.

I don't find the antenna/defogger connector box on Rockauto.com or advanceautoparts.com.

You might get one from a junkyard.

I cleaned up the contacts on mine.
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Old 01-03-2011, 12:54 PM   #7
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Without any current at the plug, I turned on the Defogger yesterday morning. It worked.
Looks like the plug is the only thing I need. I can plug the new one in the melted module.
I need to somehow find if GM used that plug on any other part, to increase the odds of finding one. Also I'll try and figure out what models and years have that plug.

Chris.
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1998 Buick Park Avenue (best car GM ever made)
Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
152,000 - Motor R.I.P.
Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
New Balance 662
Trek 8000
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Old 01-03-2011, 02:27 PM   #8
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Found one on the internet for $20 + Shipping. One on ebay for $30. Man, $25 for a little plastic plug. What a ripoff.
We're down to one wrecking yard in my area. They got rid of the one Lesabre they had. Plus they charge about the same price as new.

Chris.
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1998 Buick Park Avenue (best car GM ever made)
Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
152,000 - Motor R.I.P.
Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
New Balance 662
Trek 8000
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Old 01-05-2011, 04:14 PM   #9
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Wish I would have known that... I was in Daytona Yesterday and they had a 98 LeSabre Limited exact same color as yours and Loaded...
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Old 01-06-2011, 03:06 PM   #10
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

OK, I "fixed" the problem (kind of). I have some important questions I would like, or need to find out about.

Right now, I can't go over the other side of the mountains and search the yards over there to get a plug or module (over 300 miles RT not counting going to yards). Plug is melted bad enough that it can't be used.

Here is how I fixed it.
The module is a little melted, but it works good. I have a question later, so here is the melted part.

I need the plug. I went down to the autoparts store. He looked up that part, and found clips (not the plug) that are the same, from GM. I put wires to them

Here is what they look like plugged in.


The module works, but the plastic is a little melted. The plug (PT1183) is melted beyond repair. I showed the module to my friend Brian, and he said, "you can't use that, you have to buy a new one." He is so insistent I can't use it, he refused to offer anymore help or assist saying, "if you burn up, I'm not going to be responsible." (He is a nice guy, who has my best interest at hart, but his past record is, when he wants to help, he does, but if he doesn't want to, he makes any excuse, even ridicules ones you know are false, because he doesn't want to do something. Not that this is one, but in the past).

My reasoning;
1. The module inside is a electric board, with stuff soldiered to it. Because over the years, it got hot, the cheap plastic melted a little. This doesn't have anything to do with the mettle parts inside. I could paint it, doesn't effect inside. I could get some harsh sand paper and scratch the plastic so it looks very bad. Again, if the insides are good, it doesn't effect the electric parts. The fact the plastic is a little warped, doesn't mean the module is bad.

2. The plug has two mettle female receptors. If I use GM clips that are for the prongs inside the module, the electric doesn't know it's not the plug PT1183. They fit snugly in place.

3. If this was a big ignition wire, that's used all the time with lots of current, I'd probable not do this. When I was testing, I touched the wire while it was hot, I saw a slight current. No spark, or pop, just a little current about the size of a human hair.
Also, since I started looking into this a couple weeks a go, I've not had to use the defogger at all. We are talking about a few times a year, for what, 5 minutes before it goes off?

I figure until I can find a car with a good looking module and a plug, this will be OK. Who knows, I may not even need to use the defogger until next winter.

Here is what the project looks like completed.


I turned on the defogger for a few minutes and kept touching the module to see if it would get hot. The thing never got warm or anything.

Brian told me I was stupid to do this, that I don't value human life.

I wanted to ask the experts. Are my reasoning's OK. What am I missing? Is this job that I did the wrong thing to do? Is my life in danger?

I want to add something as I end. With Being not confident in myself, being a little down, when I got finished with this, sitting in the backseat looking at what I did, I felt sooooooo good! I could not believe how good this made me feel. I did this whole thing by myself, didn't have to pay a mechanic or get a friend to help. I followed through all the way to completion of the project.
This gives me a lot of confidence and is a very positive thing for me.

These clips I used are GM clips. Will this temporary job put me in danger?

Thank you for any feedback, and think you for all the help.

Chris.
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1998 Buick Park Avenue (best car GM ever made)
Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
152,000 - Motor R.I.P.
Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
New Balance 662
Trek 8000
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Old 01-08-2011, 08:52 PM   #11
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

I would recommend that you tape up farther on the connectors to make sure that they never touch. I would not make this a permanent fix though.
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Old 01-09-2011, 11:48 PM   #12
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

I've looked at rockauto for about 45 minutes, and can find everything but the module. How wold you find it? I search, looked, searched part number. How do you do it?

Chris.
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Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
152,000 - Motor R.I.P.
Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
New Balance 662
Trek 8000
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Old 01-10-2011, 07:46 PM   #13
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

Good job Chris! If the module is is working, why do you need another one? BTW, you're life is not in danger, the module & connectors would blow a fuse before they ever got hot enough to cause any damage, so you can tell Brian to kiss you're arss!
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Old 01-13-2011, 05:32 PM   #14
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

I wasn't going to buy a module, just was wondering what rockauto price was. I see it's all over the place.

I found out something. If I have the radio station on a weaker station, when I turn on the defroster, the station gets lots of static.

Wonder if it could be since the plug is missing, there's no insulation from one clip to the other?

Chris.
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Buick Lesabre 1997, 191,000
152,000 - Motor R.I.P.
Used 111,000 Motor, All New Gaskets
Used 102,000 Transmission - SOLD
New Balance 662
Trek 8000
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Old 01-13-2011, 08:39 PM   #15
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Re: Trouble Shooting Rear Defogger

RockAuto does not have every part, but you should get Part # PT1183! The Rear Defogger, Antenna, Module is Part # 25623688 & cost less than 50-bucks shipped to your door.

Here are a few choices on where to find the module:

http://www.rightnowautoparts.com/searchitem.epc (Search for Part @ 25623688)
http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results...umber=25623688
http://shopping.yahoo.com/747625577-...ol-module-kit/
http://www.gmpartsgiant.com/parts/gm...-25623688.html
http://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-256236.../dp/B000K00CCG
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