2003 Mustang Cobra vs S2000

[BlkCamaroSS]

Don't forget about the TTA's either. Those were some impressive birds in their own right, and definately could roll with any fox bodied mustang...

[vortech]

when you mentioned about the mustang fad being from the past 5 years-----you made no mention about the 'modded stang' being in fad. You stated the 'mustang fad'. Its a play on words---but I am being very topic specific.

[MadZ]

sorry, I should have been a little more clear.

Yes, the TTA, forgot all about it. turbo V6=smoked fox body stang.

[MadZ]

Originally posted by 76_cobra
The tbi firebirds were early 80's which came with crossfire throttlebodies I know that the guy I saw race had a late 80's early 90's model firebird not early 80's I never said he had an early model he had the tpi, and those were his times. The long stroke and small bore of the 305 was what made it so slow it didn't build power quickly at all even if the early 90's ones had 50hp more the design of the engine was bad they lagged really bad off the line.

The TBI was standard all the way through the '92 models. They didn't stop making them when the TPI came out. My firebird was a '91 and it had TBI. TPI was an optional package from the factory. Are you saying your friend is running 18.xx times with a stock TPI 305 engine? There must be something seriously wrong with his car. I know 305's aren't the best engines around, but my TBI equiped bird was able to run a 16.4@83mph. Your friend's should be running low 15's at least. Unless he put the TPI intake on a non-H.O. 305 that was originally a TBI. confused yet?

[76_cobra]

That could have been the case I don't know all he told me was that it was a 305 tpi he kept bragging about how fast it'd be I bekieve it was an 88 firebird it was also an auto.

[NSX-R-SSJ20K]

that thing is tyte

any plans to modify the engine ?

Amuse does some good things or so i heard :o

[mechanic69]

Hey I think I have the whole topic covered and a good experienced opinion I own a 91 corvette with a 388ci small block putting out 475hp at the rear wheels, with my custom nitrous kit it puts out 575 1st stage and 745 second stage the car is ausome and fun and pretty reliable, but it is loud and it can break and when it does like any other vette it becomes expensive!!!! Now here's the interesting part my other car is an 03 cobra now isn't that interesting? it has a cold air intake and minor custom exhaust modifications on the dyno it has 365 rear wheel horsepower!! the car is incredible and it's totally reliable even on long out of state trips and it doesn't draw attention like tickets And best above all it beats a Z06 corvette hands down on power. The Z06 only puts out 325hp on the dyno with 600.00 cold air and 2000 dollar exhaust!!! Chevy's figures are a little off i think with the 405 rating I hate to admit it but the mustang cobra is a better all around purchase.
Especially when i only paid 29,988 for the mustang with 400 miles on it)) from the poor sap that couldn't afford the payments)). So buy the mustang and build the vette, that way youll have both for the cost it would be to bring the Z06 to the true 405hp rating chevy gives it. Good luck and happy driving to both GM and Ford

[-The Stig-]

Originally posted by mechanic69
The Z06 only puts out 325hp on the dyno with 600.00 cold air and 2000 dollar exhaust!!! Chevy's figures are a little off i think with the 405 rating

Was this something you saw first hand? Or read some place? Cause there is such a thing as Factory Freak cars and Factory Lemons...

I hightly doubt the Z06 only puts 325hp, they would a recall on the cars like Ford did with the 99? Cobras.
If you can show me proof of several Z06's making on average 325hp, some 80hp from the stock numbers... then i'll believe it.

[vortech]

most cars suffer from a 15% loss of power from the crank to the rear wheels------thats what a dyno run reflects. So he is right on the Z06 power numbers. Many Z06 power numbers reflect the same dyno figures. What a lot of you guys never equate----is that what makes the Z06----so fricken fast-------is its lack of weight compared to other cars. The Z06 numbers on the dyno are accurate. And don't give me this freak thing. Yea you are right-----cause DOHCs assembled at the Romeo Ford plant---tend to make more power than the Windsor Ford plant DOHCs---because they use different parts------but all Z06s are assembled at the same Chevy plant----so that variable goes right out the door. Trust me-----the Z06 wouldn't be so fast----if it had the Cobras 3650 weight. Everyone tends to think the Z06 is 405rwhp------and boy is that so wrong!

[mechanic69]

Sorry, i thought everyone knew factory hp ratings were at the flywheel.
The numbers are right on, and I've noticed the cobra's tend to transfer the power to the rear wheels better and with less loss. I own a vette, I'm not trying to down them I'm just saying GM isn't really trying to get the Z06 to where it should be

Hey Vortech, have you heard of any mods coming out for the 03 cobra?
Theres not much out there i can find. I'm kind of scared to just go experimenting with it. Any help would be appreciated thx.

[BlkCamaroSS]

With a 15% power loss in the drivetrain, the rwhp should be at 344-345, not 325 for a manual. GM automatics are supposed to have a 20% loss, which would give it 325hp...

I still think something is wrong with those numbers...

[mechanic69]

In response to the 15 percent thing it's just a rough guide not an exact figure. Some cars transfer the power better than others. The Z06 trying to balance itself in the 50 50 weight dept. transfers the power poorly. I'm being honest I'll try to attach a dyno sheet to show you on my next post. I just need to open the dyno program and print one of the cars out.
I'll dig up the best figure I have on one.

[Self]

Originally posted by mechanic69
Hey I think I have the whole topic covered and a good experienced opinion I own a 91 corvette with a 388ci small block putting out 475hp at the rear wheels, with my custom nitrous kit it puts out 575 1st stage and 745 second stage the car is ausome and fun and pretty reliable, but it is loud and it can break and when it does like any other vette it becomes expensive!!!! Now here's the interesting part my other car is an 03 cobra now isn't that interesting? it has a cold air intake and minor custom exhaust modifications on the dyno it has 365 rear wheel horsepower!! the car is incredible and it's totally reliable even on long out of state trips and it doesn't draw attention like tickets And best above all it beats a Z06 corvette hands down on power. The Z06 only puts out 325hp on the dyno with 600.00 cold air and 2000 dollar exhaust!!! Chevy's figures are a little off i think with the 405 rating I hate to admit it but the mustang cobra is a better all around purchase.
Especially when i only paid 29,988 for the mustang with 400 miles on it)) from the poor sap that couldn't afford the payments)). So buy the mustang and build the vette, that way youll have both for the cost it would be to bring the Z06 to the true 405hp rating chevy gives it. Good luck and happy driving to both GM and Ford

I think you have a lemon and you should sell it off now, hahah. Seriously though, my cousins LS1 Camaro dynoed at 309rwhp, and my best friend's LS1 Camaro dynoed at 304rwhp, and my father's C5 Corvette dynoed at 327rwhp. Those are just a few...I've seen more than one Z06 dyno at over 350rwhp. We all know GMs hp figures are off...But they're LOW, not high. So you definitely have a one-off car it sounds like. Nothing to be done about it though, I suppose. Also, more info on your nitrous system? Wet? Fogger? What size fuel jets are you running? Also, what size injectors? I was having problems with leaning out up top, but with my "fragile" motor I can't afford to have ANY fuel problems so I upgraded my injectors very quickly. What kind of times do you pull with that?

[-The Stig-]

Originally posted by vortech
most cars suffer from a 15% loss of power from the crank to the rear wheels------thats what a dyno run reflects. So he is right on the Z06 power numbers. Many Z06 power numbers reflect the same dyno figures. What a lot of you guys never equate----is that what makes the Z06----so fricken fast-------is its lack of weight compared to other cars. The Z06 numbers on the dyno are accurate. And don't give me this freak thing. Yea you are right-----cause DOHCs assembled at the Romeo Ford plant---tend to make more power than the Windsor Ford plant DOHCs---because they use different parts------but all Z06s are assembled at the same Chevy plant----so that variable goes right out the door. Trust me-----the Z06 wouldn't be so fast----if it had the Cobras 3650 weight. Everyone tends to think the Z06 is 405rwhp------and boy is that so wrong!

Ok, so you think the Z06 is only fast cause it weighs 3116lbs? Now a Camaro SS with its 330hp LS1, runs a 13.7 in the 1/4 mile with its 3400+lbs butt... I doubt the Z06 with minus the 300 odd pounds will run almost a full second faster (12.8).

Apparently you believe the GM motors are underrated. If the LS1 is making 330hp, with a 15% loss through the T56 would be near 280rwhp. Now lets look at my friend BlkCamaroSS, in his sig his more or less stock LS1 SS is making over 300rwhp (307 to be exact). Now, with a 12% increase in power thats about 350hp at the crank give or take...(353 to be exact). Hardly overrated I'd say.

Ok with that said... explain to me how the Z06 with just 325rwhp thats 25 more rwhp according to BlkCamaroSS's car and minus 300lbs from the SS stats... that the Z06 still runs its high 12 second pass down the 1/4. It takes more than just 25rwhp to bust down a full second...

And, 50/50 weight distribution is as good as it gets. The best anybody can get period... it'll always give you the best of both worlds under hard acceleration/decceleration and when you hit the twisties. But we know that...

I just want some clear proof that the Z06 is as bad as you say it is... cause apparently the rest of the world disagree's... and frankly I dont blame them.

Proof please, all I ask...

Ok... End Rant..

[Neutrino]

i agree with redneck on this one. the zo6 got to have more than 325 to the crank. they are amazing machines and not even that expnsive only about 10k more than the cobra which imo is more than worth it for what you get.


also IMO the 350 small blocks like ls1 or ls6 are among the best engines out there the only egine i would take over it is the 345 hemi wich is more expensive.