94 geo metro 1.0L 3cyl timing marks


Eddiejla
09-22-2009, 03:36 AM
Just thought i would share this being that i could not find anywhere on this forum that was specific for a 94 geo metro 3cyl 1.0 Liter....

Timing marks!!!! Please correct me if i'm wrong. The 94 geo metro Haynes manual is the biggest pc of crap. Nothing is correct when working on a 94 Geo Metro pictures completely different and instructions are for another car...

I set my timing mark at 60a 5 degrees btdc and it works great!!!

It dosent set on the "V" mark on the top cover frame it sets 5 clicks to the right..

all the other post that i read tell you to align all the marks up with the marks. """"NOT FOR THIS GEO METRO 94 1.0L 3 CYL"""" THE TOP MARK SITS FIVE TEETH OVER I GUESS THATS WHAT THEY MEAN WHEN THEY SAY 5 DEGREES OVER...ONLY THE BOTTOM MARK ALIGNS WITH THE MARK...

I tried all the other ways and my car would not work! if anyone is more familiar with this please let me know if i did it correctly. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I think i finally got it! my car is running better than ever!

i Hope i was pretty clear and helpful, but if you guys have any questions i would be more than glad to answer them.

91Caprice9c1
09-22-2009, 05:24 AM
When we say 5's we're referring to base ignition timing with the diagnostic connector shorted to prevent PCM intervention. It doesn't mean we should re-index the crank pulley.

That being said, I ran my metro around 9's base timing without pinging, after a rebuild, and it ran stoutly. It could also be that you have the incorrect crank pulley. What I would do when unsure, is line up the crank's timing pulley to the oil pump and the cam sprocket to the vavle cover, then mark the crank pulley at 0's with the timing cover installed.

Glad your metro's running strong! Just keep an ear out for detonation.

-Matt

atjunkie
09-22-2009, 10:02 AM
Some cam cogs will go on more than 1 way. Possably it's been taken off. Mine only went one way, all lined up right.

Crvett69
09-22-2009, 01:36 PM
correct mark to line up timing belt is to use the 60C mark lined up with the valve cover and bottom gear lined up with mark on the oil pump. they use the same gear on the 4 cyl metro and thats what the 60A mark is for. make sure the pin on camshaft is straight down when the 60C mark is straight up if you have removed gear and reinstalled it

Eddiejla
09-22-2009, 05:10 PM
Hum I've never removed the crack pulley.

I tried to set on the V mark on top valve cover but it wants to roll five teeth over. All i did was replace the water pump but when i went to assemble everything i realized that the marks were not aligned.

I pulled out the manual and then got really confused. Is it possible someone might have taken the pulley of and not put it on correctly??? I swear my is running better than before! not sure why

I'm just scared that i might mess up the engine.. I believe it only had 2 marks on the pulley a 60a 80c there was a dot on the 60a mark.

My wife drove the car to work today. I should have taken pictures before i put it back together..

Is there a easy way to make sure for certain if it's put together correctly?

Crvett69
09-22-2009, 05:13 PM
use the 80c mark, looks like 60c in my book but it might be 80c, its a bad picture

Eddiejla
09-22-2009, 05:18 PM
Regardless of what marks i use they never set on the V mark on the top valve cover.

I'll probably take it apart again just to make sure. Does anyone know if this will ruin my engine????

Johnny Mullet
09-22-2009, 10:10 PM
This should clear a lot of that up................
http://geometroforum.com/topic/2232748/

http://i404.photobucket.com/albums/pp123/BadBent/10l3cylinderg10timingsj4.jpg

91 ragtop
09-23-2009, 12:09 AM
Regardless of what marks i use they never set on the V mark on the top valve cover.

I'll probably take it apart again just to make sure. Does anyone know if this will ruin my engine????
The way the spring pressure is on the cam it pulls to one of three positions on the cam. You have to rotate the cam to where it lines up with the mark on the valve cover and then slide the belt on and tighten the tensioner. After doing this , turn the engine over by hand a couple times to see if it is still lined up right.

atjunkie
09-23-2009, 12:30 AM
Could the belt be the wrong lenght?

Eddiejla
09-23-2009, 10:36 AM
First of all i want to thank everyone for all their help!!!!!

OK in order to set on the marks i'm going to have someone help me. The pulley seems to be spring loaded so keeps turning over off the "V" mark. I will have one of my friends hold it on the "v" with a wrench wile i get the belt on.

In the mean wile i have my car running like this. Does anyone know if this will ruin my engine?????

My car seems to get better compression like this. It pics up speed so much better. It picks up 60mph fast before it was running kinda slugish

I wont have time to take this apart until Friday or Saturday. I'm concerned that my wife will crack the engine because of the timing marks.


""""DOES ANYONE KNOW IF THE ENGINE WILL GET RUINED"""""?????????????

91Caprice9c1
09-24-2009, 05:07 AM
Having your marks misaligned slightly in and of itself will not ruin the engine.

What you basically did was advance the cam ~5's and if you didn't adjust the distributor, then you advanced ignition timing ~5's as well.

This does two things of mechanical significance: 1) Closes the intake valves sooner which acts to give the engine more torque at low to mid range engine speeds and 2) ignites the spark plug sooner. Item 1 is great for grunt in the lower spectrum of your RPM range, but is at the expense of power up top at higher engine speeds. As for item 2, there's a lot to be said about ignition timing (which ought to ignite the mixture at such a point as to generate maximum cylinder pressure in a sweet spot somewhere soon after TDC (typically falling between 15 and 20's ATDC - depending on combustion chamber design and air/fuel mixture which, together, determine burn rate) in order to maximize mechanical advantage against the crankshaft) but generally speaking, more advance is good until pre-detonation (pinging), which needs to be avoided like the plague because detonation can and will destroy an engine - and may do so in short order.

So, all that being said; if you notice the car running better (to your liking), and you don't hear pinging under heavy load, and you are willing to sacrifice high-rpm torque production, then there's really no reason for you to line things up at all.

0.02

-Matt

91 ragtop
09-27-2009, 11:08 PM
I don't think he is talking about 5 degrees. He said that it lines up 5 clicks off center which I think he means 5 teeth on the sprockit which would be about 45 degrees advanced or retarded depending on which side of center he goes to.

91Caprice9c1
09-27-2009, 11:19 PM
Ragtop, I re-read the original post. I agree. Thank you.

5 clicks, wow. That would be a lot of advance. 5 peaks would be about 45, if you counted peaks and valleys though, it would be ~22 - which is still insane. I'm confused.

Eddie, I think it's definitely worth disassembling and investigating as the others have said. Get some pictures while you're in there.

-Matt

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