BUMP ISSUE RESOLVED!!! READ ENDING POSTS FOR CONCLUSION.. IT WAS THE SPARK PLUGS!!!


Ok new trans installed runs better now but still have the bump...
Thanks Andrew1941 for bringing me the issue with the spark plugs and wires.

Gee told me sooner I could have saved 3 grand. LOL.. NO!! Just kidding van I feel is more reliable now with new trans....


OK Coil pack went out a while back and replaced with GPsoranson Advanced auto brand coil pack... I also changed the spark plugs with Autolight dp spark plugs and the wires with autolight premium spark plug wires. I think is something more like premium professional wires.. Any way I think there supposed to be the best in the Auto light series...

My question is.. Does anyone run these wires plugs and or coil pack.. Have any issues.. If I were to point to anything I feel it would be the bobo brand coil pack.. But if anyone had used the plugs and wires with no issues than please feel free to suggest something.. I don't mind replacing one or all of these to help with the issue.. So the bump maybe now a misfire of some sort.


So far I replaced the IMRC which I thought might help but did not.. Of course does not seem to lag as much when you gun it.. Also pulled the front plugs out today and they seem fine.. Thanks,Gary

I've forgotten, what model year and engine?

2001 3.8

Some history: Total miles? Has the upper intake been opened and cleaned ... new style bolts, etc? Has any attention been given to the MAF sensor? Other engine or tranny sensors? Has the camshaft sensor synchronizer been lubricated or replaced?

Yes all TSB updates New upper intake clam shell also ..108,000 miles egr ports were clean during the isolator bolts and port seal replacement.. MAS sensor has been cleaned. camshaft sensors is original...

I have the same brands plugs, wires, and coil pack as you mention.
They have been doing just fine for me.

I have the same brands plugs, wires, and coil pack as you mention.
They have been doing just fine for me.

Same here for me too... same GPSorenson Coil from AdvanceAuto, AutoLite Double Platinum Plugs and AutoLite Wire Set (black box) can't remember for sure if the premium wires come on the black box tho!

Did this 10 months ago while chasing a wild goose with a rought idle that turned out to be a crankcase pulley gone bad (linky) (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=885567)! I'm suire everyone remembers that one...LOL

Anyway everything is working good and solid todate. I would suggest for goodness sake to pull the Coil and inspect the casing for fractures in the plastic that could be leaking power to ground. Also on my van when I pulled the original Coil (which is still in good working order) there was a lot of rust around the metal frame that mates with the Coil brace support in the engine and I believe this could cause trouble as the Coil needs to be well grounded, altho mine didn't fail, it doesn't hurt to check.

Thanks for the info.. I think just for a cheap way to rule out something Is to go back through the ignition system.. Now I did break my coil pack clip but it was only the tab part that locks it.. So I taped it to keep it from pulling loose.. I really don't think that would be an issue.. Just seems to me I did not have this issue until I did my pan drop on the trans and cleaned the sludge from the bottom pan and replaced filter.. It may have been a few months before or after I changed the plugs and wires.. But now seeing the trans is new and all sensors are new on the trans, that rules out that part.. I would assume if the cam sensor is going bad after a while it would throw a code.???

Thanks for the info.. I think just for a cheap way to rule out something Is to go back through the ignition system.. Now I did break my coil pack clip but it was only the tab part that locks it.. So I taped it to keep it from pulling loose.. I really don't think that would be an issue.. Just seems to me I did not have this issue until I did my pan drop on the trans and cleaned the sludge from the bottom pan and replaced filter.. It may have been a few months before or after I changed the plugs and wires.. But now seeing the trans is new and all sensors are new on the trans, that rules out that part.. I would assume if the cam sensor is going bad after a while it would throw a code.???

Well Ed I see you did not get a code.. my eyes are burning.. That was a long thread..LOL. I will check the cam sensors. Or at least the ones I can see.. I did put a new belt on a while back and looked at one of them.. It looked ok.

Well its 68 degrees here today and between rain showers I have managed to change the front spark plugs.. I did notice my gap was not set right. one was 60 the other was 40 something. I lost my fold up wire gauge gap set. Went and got the disk type wire gauge because that's all I could find.. Don' ever use those solid disk gauges. They are not worth nothing.. used my wire gauge and compared it to my disk type gauge and it was way off.. Will see how or if it helped anything.. Need to get the back plugs done.. All in all those spark plugs are not old and looked fine but replaced anyway.

Well after front spark plugs were replaced. Noticed I still have the bump but not as bad.. Try to replace back ones tomorrow..

.... Just seems to me I did not have this issue until I did my pan drop on the trans and cleaned the sludge from the bottom pan and replaced filter.. . I would assume if the cam sensor is going bad after a while it would throw a code.???

Any chance the pan area now has a vacuum leak? Does that pan gasket require some RTV daubs? ... I can't remember.

Did you notice the condition of the crankshaft sensor and wiring? I doubt if the camshaft sensor is a problem since there is no code ... but have read of synchro's getting dry and "grabbing", sometimes causing erroneous signals ... that's why I drop some oil in occasionally.

Someone else mentioned the EGR system, in particular the DPFE sensor and signal hoses ... a very good area to look into I also think.

I do know the Crankshaft sensor is fine and wiring looks good.. I checked that out when changing the belt.. I have a new trans in it now. Just got it last week. Ford reman unit and all trans sensors are new.. So I guess i ruled that out.. I do a lot of things at one time or in a few weeks of each other or when I fine some new issue that comes up.. So I can't remember what put me to do the pan drop.. If it was the trans fluid leaking when hot or the bump..So I am trying to figure out if maybe I did not get the bump tell after my coil replacement.. It just tough to trace back.. Also costly to replace everything over again.. With no codes even harder.. I will look into the others you have mentioned. Thanks for the reply.. Gary

It was me who mentioned to check the DPFE; did you? The bad DPFE threw a code for me, but maybe your van is just about ready to throw the code? Easy enough to test it.

Also, check the rear plugs when they come out to look for any cracks in the ceramic. May not be an issue, but you never know. I think a crack would be a continuous rough idle, but maybe not?

Also, if you lift the hood at night in the dark (needs to be really dark), start th engine and look for any arcing around the coil pack and wires. If you see any blue arcs, thats your problem. You may also want to look around the engine for any arcs between other fram connections etc. Bad grounds can be a real nuissance because they can be intermitent and who the hell knows where the bad conenction is! Blue arcs tend to give it away.

It was me who mentioned to check the DPFE; did you? The bad DPFE threw a code for me, but maybe your van is just about ready to throw the code? Easy enough to test it.

Also, check the rear plugs when they come out to look for any cracks in the ceramic. May not be an issue, but you never know. I think a crack would be a continuous rough idle, but maybe not?

Also, if you lift the hood at night in the dark (needs to be really dark), start th engine and look for any arcing around the coil pack and wires. If you see any blue arcs, thats your problem. You may also want to look around the engine for any arcs between other fram connections etc. Bad grounds can be a real nuissance because they can be intermitent and who the hell knows where the bad conenction is! Blue arcs tend to give it away.

Funny you mentioned check for arcs... I did that last night when I was out working on the van and cleaning the yard.. I started the van and looked for things like that... I even went a step further and started grabing the wires.. Some cars can run with lose of voltage from the plug wires and some can't. So I starting to feel around the coil area and the wires to see if i got a jolt. I was thinking I would get a jump shock from the coil so I started very slowly in on it until I was able to touch it and got nothing.. Kinda lead me to believe if the coil is not strong. I thought for sure I get a little bite from the connections to the spark plugs.. Heck in the past on other cars that had HEI ignitions I hated to set the timing on them. Go and turn the distributor and get popped.. usually meant I had to change the cap.. I ll look at the other stuff.. Getting ready to leave tomorrow for Florida. Taking my Kids to Disney for Christmas.. Thanks,Gary

That was a good test for finding leakage on spark cables ... perhaps a bit brazen or crazy ... but good. The fact that you didn't feel a jolt is due the superior two-wall insulation on todays spark cables ... and a wee, wee bit is due to having two spark plugs in series hookup.

That was a good test for finding leakage on spark cables ... perhaps a bit brazen or crazy ... but good. The fact that you didn't feel a jolt is due the superior two-wall insulation on todays spark cables ... and a wee, wee bit is due to having two spark plugs in series hookup.


Well When something is aggravating me and I can't seem to pin point it. I just sort of went for it. To be honest I have been popped so many times it does not seem to bother me.. Heck Got zapped by 220 in my house once and I am still here.. Turned off the wrong breaker by mistake. I will say that one I don't want to be hit with again.. My whole body ached for days.. But really it was getting dark and I did not see signs of arching so I started to just feel around the wires and then headed to the coil.. Yes I still was a bit hesitant. But once my mind was made up I just went in there and started grabbing quickly around the coil.. Then once I felt nothing I kinda just held my hand down on it for a few seconds.. Not recommended of course but sort of self idiot test for me.. Got my conclusion out of it.. They say Ben Franklin flew a kite with a key in a lighting storm.. He was braver than me... I guess.. LOL

Not familiar with the bump issue. Whats that?

Not familiar with the bump issue. Whats that?
Well Its when you are driving and at or around 1200 rpms it bumps. Almost like the trans is not going into gear right or a misfire.It only happens for a split second and sometimes 2 0r 3 in a row. I thought mine was the trans. Did for a year and I went ahead and replaced my not so reliable trans. The problem with the new trans is still there so I don't think its that.. Just got in from Florida and it bumped from time to time. Still trying to figure it out. I think I may go ahead and replace the coil pack on it to see if it helps. I do notice the problem occurs more when the engine is hot and been running a while. Like after 20 min.. I think I will pull the cowl off and inspect the back wires to make sure they are not near the exhaust manifold. Also noticed my fuel millage has dropped. The last trip i took it was getting about 25-27 mpg on hwy. That was about a year ago. Since then because of trans issues I was afraid to venture more than 60 miles from home.. So With new trans took it on 1000 mile or so round trip and got 18.5 mpg going there and 19.1 on the way back.. Driving the same I always drive. Around 80 mph..Today traffic was moving well and at some points was able to get up around 85-90 with swift traffic flow and still got 19.1. Going there traffic was a little slower and only got up to around 80-85 mph.. Millage was worse.. So go figure.

I realize that with your new transmission, you'd think that this was not transmission related. However, your symptoms sound a lot like the ones that I had when my TCC solenoid was dropping out. According to the rebuild shop, different models of the Windstar have solenoids that operate on different control voltages. My Windstar required a low voltage solenoid, but the transmission rebuild had a high voltage one. After they'd work on it, the bump would go away for a while (probably because the wiring harness to the transmission had been disconnected, wiping any oxidation from the contacts for a lower resistance). After a few weeks the bumps would start occuring infrequently at first and gradully increase in occurance to once every couple of miles. It also seemed to be OK for the first 20 minutes and got worse after the engine warmed.

One way that I learned to distinguish these from misfires was that the RPM would go up during the bumps since the torque converter clutch was not engaged for a moment.

I sound a bit like a broken record, but you really should check out the DPFE sensor. Thing is, the PCM doesn't use the EGR system until the engine is up to temperature (among other things) and if the sensor is stuck giving a fixed reading, then the valve will open only a certain amount when the PCM turns the system on (which could be anything). The problem of too much or too little EGR will be present at the same RPM everytime since the valve is not moving because of the sensor. This is what I experienced when mine failed and it was always causing the bump at 1800 RPM on a slight incline under light load. As the problem got worse, the bumps became more frequent; however, the frequency could and probably was more related to spark plug issues I had, so I guess I can't really say for sure which came first; the chicken (DPFE) or the egg (spark plugs).

I keep bringing it up because it is an easy quick thing to test and if it is the problem, it couldn't be an easier repair to do.

I sound a bit like a broken record, but you really should check out the DPFE sensor. Thing is, the PCM doesn't use the EGR system until the engine is up to temperature (among other things) and if the sensor is stuck giving a fixed reading, then the valve will open only a certain amount when the PCM turns the system on (which could be anything). The problem of too much or too little EGR will be present at the same RPM everytime since the valve is not moving because of the sensor. This is what I experienced when mine failed and it was always causing the bump at 1800 RPM on a slight incline under light load. As the problem got worse, the bumps became more frequent; however, the frequency could and probably was more related to spark plug issues I had, so I guess I can't really say for sure which came first; the chicken (DPFE) or the egg (spark plugs).

I keep bringing it up because it is an easy quick thing to test and if it is the problem, it couldn't be an easier repair to do.


Yes that is one of my checks.. But the funny thing is I just changed one on a Ford F150 but i can't seem to locate it on the Windstar.. I have a 2001.. I think i found it but not for sure if it is it.. The book does not show one on a 2001 but the one they do show is off another year and mine is not in the same place..It should have 2 lines running to it right.? Thanks,gary

Pulled and clean the EGR valve found the DPFE. MY Volt meter not working but pulled it and checked to see if lines were clogged. They were ok. I see if that helped. If not may replace coil and DPFE. Sensor.

Well I noticed the green hose going to my EGR is really loose.. Tried to clean it but still loose... So I replaced the elbow with some clear tight fitting hose to see if there is a change.. So far no bump.. But I have not went very far yet..So not sure if the EGR is the issue.I did pull and clean the EGR also but it was not bad at all really.. Seen worse with codes of course but also seen worse with no codes on a car. So still checking things.. Attack one at a time I guess.. Still thinking it some sort of miss fire..

A loose control hose could have been the problem ... you may be bump free!

A loose control hose could have been the problem ... you may be bump free!

Well I hope so... Not sure how it would come into play.. i did notice my rough idle that i had every now and then is gone..In other words even on short trips at a light it would run a little rough until i hit the gas and clear up. On my short trips the last few times I drove it had not showed up yet..So maybe related. I did clean the IAC last month to help this problem but it did not work.. So I was thinking it may be related to a misfire. But so far ok.. If it does I will be glad.. Was going to shell out money on a coil..

Well still got the bump...

Have you pulled the Coil out for a closer inspection yet? I would do that first, before buying a new one!

Have you pulled the Coil out for a closer inspection yet? I would do that first, before buying a new one!
No Not yet. But i did put my hand on it to see if I would get popped.. Crazy stupid I know but it was a quick check to see if anything was getting out besides through the wires.. Got nothing.. I need to pull cowl off before and inspect.. Coil,wires and plugs are about a little over a year old now. Bump about the same time as well.. Trans is ruled out. EGR as well I think.. DPFE has not been yet.. Volt meter I have is bad..I'm still thinking coil and wires and rear plugs may be issue.. I forgot I changed the front before my trip and forgot about the rear plugs.. So they will be done soon.. Will keep posted

Bump issue resolved.. If you are running app 765 you are running wrong plugs in the Auto light Double platinum Brand.. You need the APP 105 plugs.. There are more threads. Meaning that plug goes in deeper.. The other ones have only 5 threads.. The 105 has 10 threads.. Bump is now gone... :grinyes:

Wow, that's interesting. I have a set of APP765 plugs in the garage waiting to be installed. I've always used Motorcraft plugs, but thought I would try the Autolite plugs since I use those in all my other cars successfully.

I saw this on the autolite website: http://www.autolite.com/pdf/Half_FullThread.pdf
This suggests the thread difference is by design.

I totally believe changing plugs fixed your problem, but I'm not ready to conclude these plugs don't work based on one data-point. I say this because given just one data-point, you can extrapolate in any direction.

So the question is: is anyone using APP765's successfully?

Wow.. You Bring up a good point with the web site explanation.. Funny thing about all this.. Every time I buy a part I always compare it to the one I am replacing.. So my thinking is I saw the same the first time or I did not check. I may have made sure they were the same size but did not check the thread count. Or I did. Who knows.. The thing is I replaced the fronts and got no change so I assumed my back plugs were ok.. I just decided to change the rear plugs to go ahead and rule those out. I pulled my coil and checked it and it was fine.. So I put the plugs in and drove it yesterday and nothing happen. So today i went ahead and did the long drive test and nothing happened. So I figured it had to be the plugs.. They were replaced a year or 2 ago. Makes me wonder to if anyone else is running the APP 765 with success or are most running the APP 105.. Then again did Auto light put that out to cover there behinds.. LOL Sure seemed like it went in a couple of turns deeper to me.LOL I wish I kept my motorcraft plugs.

Congrats on locating the issue.

I did so many things all at once too and it was difficult to determine why the bump went away, DPFE, plugs, wires, who knows? I did install Motorcraft plugs, but I had a cracked one that came out so she was running rough before. In my case the bump was the DPFE sensor.

WOW... Sweet deal, I'm really happy for you Gary. Glad you got it working better now and I hope the new plugs was all the money you had to spend to get it fixed!

I would need to check my plugs to see which ones I'm running, I don't have any engine idle or drivability issues.

You know after all this it would be nice to know if someone had the same issue with the APP 765.. The site that Kelvin put up above makes me wonder why Autolight had to explain it to begin with.. The APP 105 yes is the same plug in its right.. But I think it sets deeper in head from what they claim.. It seem it would have to.. Just wish I kept my stock Motorcraft plugs. That would solve my theory.. I just will say this. I have put wrong plugs in and had the piston top out on them before in a car once. Can't remember what make it was but I got lucky it just flatten the electrodes and not break off or damage the piston. So I know you can put too long of a plug in.. Just glad the thing did not start up.

All in all Today on the way home I saw my gas millage go up. Its now a steady 17 mpgs in the city. Also drove 33 miles to next Town last night and saw 22mpg's in the rain.. That same trip had drop to 18 -19 mpg's.. Also my Trip to Florida on the new trans only got 20mpgs average.. Not sure if it was the New trans or my dang plugs.. Or both.. But I have notice it does not bog down like it did right before the bump , No.. I did not replace the coil or plug wires. Just the plugs.. Although I may have held off on the new trans if I had changed my plugs first. LOL.. But then again I would have rented a van to go to Florida.LOL. Now I just know my vans reliable.. However I did notice the darn front main seal is starting to leak a little. Not bad though.. It has over 100,00 miles.. So that's to be expected..