low fuel pressure due to clogged filter


gamacdon
08-31-2008, 08:50 PM
What is the best way to empty all gas from the fuel cell?

Blue Streak 21
08-31-2008, 10:45 PM
Use something to move the pieces of foam to the side so that you can get a hose to the bottom of the fuel cell. I've used a sawed off broom handle or dowel. The hose will allow you to siphen the gas from the tank on to a gas can. You might have to elevate the car to keep the fuel cell above the gas can so you get all the gas out from the cell.
Jerry

Gatorac
09-01-2008, 09:18 PM
I disconnected the fuel line from the filter and ran one to my gas can. Then get power to the fuel pump and use it to pump the tank out.

gamacdon
09-02-2008, 01:56 PM
thanks guys, i am not much of a mechanic so any additonal suggestions or pointers are very welcome. I am starting tonight and i will let you know how it is going.
Greg
GTR0-0035

Blue Streak 21
09-02-2008, 10:32 PM
I disconnected the fuel line from the filter and ran one to my gas can. Then get power to the fuel pump and use it to pump the tank out.
Much better way to empty the fuel cell. Sure beats a mouthfull of gas!:cheers:
Jerry

gamacdon
09-05-2008, 10:08 PM
okay, gas is out, foam is out, filter in tank is clogged and will be removed. foam looks okay and will be put back as is. so what is next? External filter clogged? where is it? what is the device next to fuel pump? If it is not external filter, where is that located?

eric1h
09-05-2008, 11:24 PM
okay, gas is out, foam is out, filter in tank is clogged and will be removed. foam looks okay and will be put back as is. so what is next? External filter clogged? where is it? what is the device next to fuel pump? If it is not external filter, where is that located?

Thats the external filter

check out www.panozregistry.org under the parts database for the part number for it. I ordered mine online for $15 each, bought a few extras.

alfordvette
09-08-2008, 08:32 AM
Something you may want to consider when replacing/reinstalling the external fuel filter. I had to replace the fuel pump (w/ Weldon 600) because it was not pumping enough fuel at times (running lean as a result) and decided to best protect the pump, I had the external filter placed between the pump and the tank not after the pump as it had been. No issues since making the changes.

Regards.

AIMidwest27
09-08-2008, 07:34 PM
okay, gas is out, foam is out, filter in tank is clogged and will be removed. foam looks okay and will be put back as is. so what is next? External filter clogged? where is it? what is the device next to fuel pump? If it is not external filter, where is that located?

Do you positively how old that foam is? If you do not know, DO NOT put it back in the cell. If your filter was clogged, consider the foam bad and throw it away. If you put new foam in, your good to go for 4 years. In addition, I recommend taking the filter out of the cell and moving it outside the cell for easier changing.

Beware, even new foam is going to go through a "shedding" period to "clean itself up". Be prepared to change a filter after a few tanks of gas (depending on the micron size filter you use). I use a 100 micron filter (sumitt part number SUM-230112 (http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D230112&N=700+4294844943+400304+115&autoview=sku) before the fuel pump and a a 10 micron paper filter after the pump ( SUM-230111 (http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D230111&N=700+4294844943+400304+115&autoview=sku) ) and had to change the 10 micron filter 3 times after new foam (but I am a little paranoid after getting stranded on a race weekend due to old foam and plugged filters).

This is the second fuel cell that I have had this foam break down on - now I have learned my lesson. Foam goes to the trash every 4 years.

hooked8
09-09-2008, 10:22 AM
I agree STRONGLY that the foam is probably bad in your cell...even though it may look ok - what do you think was clogging up your filter?? WE have a history with several cars that have had gradual foam deterioration...if its more than 4-5 years old, call Fuel Safe and order new foam....may save you a motor.

gamacdon
09-09-2008, 09:44 PM
It is all back together, runs fine with 21 pounds of fuel pressure. Yes i will be replacing foam this winter even though i believe mine was done recently. Its cheap insurance. I replaced the fuel filter out side of the tank and really like the suggestion to put another filter before the pump. All suggestions were very helpful, thanks. my next project, dead battery. i am guessing alternator but i have no clue how to check. remember i am not a mechanic.
greg GTR0-0035

eric1h
09-09-2008, 10:01 PM
It is all back together, runs fine with 21 pounds of fuel pressure. Yes i will be replacing foam this winter even though i believe mine was done recently. Its cheap insurance. I replaced the fuel filter out side of the tank and really like the suggestion to put another filter before the pump. All suggestions were very helpful, thanks. my next project, dead battery. i am guessing alternator but i have no clue how to check. remember i am not a mechanic.
greg GTR0-0035


Testing the alternator is easy. remove the rear tire, start the car, and put a voltage meter on the battery, it should read @ 13.5v's or more, any less and the alternator is bad. If thats fine, its probably just a bad cell in the battery, take the battery out and bring it to an autozone or auto parts store and they can test it for free.

mhowington
09-12-2008, 03:44 PM
Testing the alternator is easy. remove the rear tire, start the car, and put a voltage meter on the battery, it should read @ 13.5v's or more, any less and the alternator is bad. If thats fine, its probably just a bad cell in the battery, take the battery out and bring it to an autozone or auto parts store and they can test it for free.

Where are you located? There is actually an easier way to empty the tank, without burning up the fuel pump (should have about a 4 second burst). PM me and I can give you the details (technical).

Basically, start the car and check the gauges (just make sure the fuel pressure is stable), look on the fuel rail for a vacuum line, pull the vacuum off and the pressure should drop to 40/41 or so. If it does NOT drop to around there, you most likely have a leaking fuel injector. check, electrically, your fuel pump, the amperage. if that is good, then you are right it probably is the filter. try first to remove and run compressed air through it. If for some reason there is an issue with the fuel pump itself, it may have suffered from debris inside of the actual pump.

Drop me a line: mhowington@wbmotorsports.com if you have any questions and of course I can give you more detail.

eric1h
09-12-2008, 07:45 PM
is 21 pounds normal? thats what mine runs at idle, but somewhere i remember someone saying it was supposed to be up @ 30psi.

mhowington
09-13-2008, 12:47 AM
is 21 pounds normal? thats what mine runs at idle, but somewhere i remember someone saying it was supposed to be up @ 30psi.

21 seems to be awfully low and no its not normal. Uh, when would you like for me to pick it up? :)

Jim woodruff
09-13-2008, 09:31 AM
21 seems to be awfully low and no its not normal. Uh, when would you like for me to pick it up? :)

Go to www.fordfuelinjection.com (http://www.fordfuelinjection.com)
Click on FPR valve
It will explain what your fuel pressue should be under all engine loads. see the chart on page two.

jmimac351
09-13-2008, 11:24 PM
fyi... At the track today I was watching my pressure. The pressure varied from around 27psi at idle to mid / upper 30's at closer to zero vacuum. And as I recall from my '92 mustang when it was in stock form, 21psi is definitely too low.

AIMidwest27
09-14-2008, 10:09 AM
fyi... At the track today I was watching my pressure. The pressure varied from around 27psi at idle to mid / upper 30's at closer to zero vacuum. And as I recall from my '92 mustang when it was in stock form, 21psi is definitely too low.

If this were my car, I would PARK IT until I found the source of low FP problems. Start at the cell and work through every component ending at having the fuel injectors cleaned ( I still believe that fuel cell foam break down has contaminated your entire system, and you need to fix the cause or symptoms, like low FP, will return).

Unmetered air can enter the engine through a vacuum leak, a dirty airflow sensor that is not reading airflow accurately, an EGR valve is not closing and is leaking exhaust into the intake manifold, an EGR valve that is allowing too much flow (because the EGR differential pressure sensor that monitors EGR flow is faulty and is under-reporting EGR flow).

Check Codes in the computer - look for P0171 and P0174 (lean condition). A lean fuel condition may exist if the engine is sucking in too much air and/or the fuel system is not delivering enough fuel. If bad enough, a lean fuel condition may cause lean misfire, a rough idle, hesitation or stumble when accelerating, and/or poor engine performance.

Unmetered air can enter the engine through a vacuum leak, a dirty airflow sensor that is not reading airflow accurately, an EGR valve is not closing and is leaking exhaust into the intake manifold, an EGR valve that is allowing too much flow (because the EGR differential pressure sensor that monitors EGR flow is faulty and is under-reporting EGR flow).

Check for a dirty mass airflow (MAF) sensor.

Check for proper voltage at the Fuel Pump.

Check for kink's in the fuel line

Your FP should be 39-40 psi. I would panic if I saw 21 (lean !! )

jmimac351
09-14-2008, 07:15 PM
Hi Ted, I wasn't referring to my car with the 21psi thing. I was talking about the original poster. Thanks.

AIMidwest27
09-14-2008, 07:57 PM
Hi Ted, I wasn't referring to my car with the 21psi thing. I was talking about the original poster. Thanks.

Whoops ! My bad.

But we both (ALL ?) agree that 21 is begging for problems.

jmimac351
09-14-2008, 09:47 PM
Whoops ! My bad.

But we both (ALL ?) agree that 21 is begging for problems.

Absolutely. That's way off. I had some hesitation in my car at the track yesterday which is why I started eyeballing the pressure and listening to the pump. I'm going to swap out all of the foam whether that's the issue or not.

gamacdon
09-14-2008, 10:01 PM
I just ran two track days at blackhawk farms in south beloit illinois. fuel pressure at idle 26 pounds. car ran great. thanks to all for walking me through fuel cell foam change and filter change.
greg
GTR0-0035

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